EV Digest 4883
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: 3-4 Seconds Behind 'best of class gas cars'?
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Zilla standby current
by Ryan Bohm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) ANSI keyway to tranny shaft converter
by kluge <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Zilla standby current
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Still wondering about the Zilla HEPI input...
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) RE: ANSI keyway to tranny shaft converter
by "Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: ANSI keyway to tranny shaft converter
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Geo Metro series hybrid/solar project
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: OT: Is this nonsense?
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Geo Metro series hybrid/solar project
by Chris Martens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Prius pack on eBay
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: ANSI keyway to tranny shaft converter
by Chris Martens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Prius pack on eBay
by Ralph Merwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Indian summer in MD
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) Re: OT: Is this nonsense?
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Performance cars, speed+ acceleration
by "John Westlund" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: It's an Electric Thing, you wouldn't understand....
by Jon Glauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) 220/240 Volt Kill-A-Watt Meter
by Mike Chancey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Global EV map is growing
by Jim Coate <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) RE: 220/240 Volt Kill-A-Watt Meter
by "Dean Thompson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) RE: 220/240 Volt Kill-A-Watt Meter
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: OT: Is this nonsense?
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: It's an Electric Thing, you wouldn't understand....
by John David <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Still wondering about the Zilla HEPI input...
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: OT: Is this nonsense?
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Help reviewing wikipedia Conversion Article.
by Lightning Ryan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: 220/240 Volt Kill-A-Watt Meter
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: 220/240 Volt Kill-A-Watt Meter
by Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) Potential source for heavy duty motors
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) 1997 Chevy S10 For Sale with tons of EV parts
by Cwarman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
31) RE: Modifying an E-tek motor
by "Myles Twete" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
32) newbie
by Stan Helton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
33) Re: 220/240 Volt Kill-A-Watt Meter
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Sounds like what you're saying is that WZ is well above the "hump" in
the bell curve -- only the most excessively modified gas vehicles can
beat it, and that if you compare on a cost/performance basis, that
you're getting pretty good bang for the buck.
John Wayland wrote:
Hello to All,
*snip*
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi EVeryone,
Does anyone know the Zilla "standby" current? That is, how
> much current is drawn through the hairball pin #2 (SLI +14V In)?
The figure 20ma rings a (vague) bell. I'll double-check later
on unless someone else pipes up.
Correction: just measured it as 68ma.
Cheers,
Claudio
I'm glad to see this jives with the published value in my Zilla FAQ:
http://www.evsource.com/faqs/zillas/current_draw.php
Everyone beat me to the draw on answering the post though. I ran for
quite a while with the key input and +14V SLI wired together. Startup
time was slightly higher, but it worked. Apparently, Otmar weeded out a
bug that was causing occaisonal memory corruption problems with things
wired this way.
-Ryan
--
- EV Source <http://www.evsource.com> -
Selling names like Zilla, PFC Chargers, WarP, and PowerCheq
All at the best prices available!
E-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Toll-free: 1-877-215-6781
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Chris - what size are the shafts you're working with (diameter)?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Sounds like something that should be incorporated into the Zilla Manual,
*cough*Otmar*cough* =)
Ryan Bohm wrote:
Hi EVeryone,
Does anyone know the Zilla "standby" current? That is, how
> much current is drawn through the hairball pin #2 (SLI +14V In)?
The figure 20ma rings a (vague) bell. I'll double-check later on
unless someone else pipes up.
Correction: just measured it as 68ma.
Cheers,
Claudio
I'm glad to see this jives with the published value in my Zilla FAQ:
http://www.evsource.com/faqs/zillas/current_draw.php
Everyone beat me to the draw on answering the post though. I ran for
quite a while with the key input and +14V SLI wired together. Startup
time was slightly higher, but it worked. Apparently, Otmar weeded out
a bug that was causing occaisonal memory corruption problems with
things wired this way.
-Ryan
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I can't seem to find a satisfactory answer to this question:
Is the Zilla HEPI input compatible with the twist-grip hall effect
throttles? These throttles appear to take +5 V and output a voltage
porportional to the throtttle position, simulating a potentiometer.
See:
http://www.users.bigpond.com/solarbbq/throttle/throttle%20how%20they%20work.htm
Standard Zilla setup is Curtis style -- that is, to use the
potentiometer as a rheostat (2 wires).
Only inkling I get from the manual is that the HEPI inputs are (were?)
called "Aux Pot +" and "Aux Pot -", which tends to imply a rheostat-like
function, though the manual mentions that 4 wires are connected to the
hairball, not the two implied by the pinout chart in the manual.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You don't want ANY misalignment when you are dealing in hundreds of foot
pounds of torque anyways. If you are worried about alignment issues then
maybe your option is to use a U joint modified to fit your motor on one end.
I bet Borgeson U joints could make one for you. Have you checked into the
clutchless setups offered by Electromotive?
-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Martens [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, November 04, 2005 12:58 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: ANSI keyway to tranny shaft converter
Hey Jody, those converters will fit onto a car tranny, but I think they only
adapt to the type of motor sold on that website. They also are solid so
they
don't have any tolerance for misalignment, and they are pricey - ~$300.
http://www.mcmaster.com/ has some good couplings, but they are ANSI keyway
on
both ends.
So then, what do people usually use in a clutchless setup? - ANSI keyway
motor
to splined shaft tranny.
Chris
--- "Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Metric Mind has shaft converters that you might be able to get to work in
> your application:
>
> http://www.metricmind.com/index1.htm
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Nov 4, 2005, at 9:58 AM, Chris Martens wrote:
So then, what do people usually use in a clutchless setup? - ANSI
keyway motor
to splined shaft tranny.
I chose a to make a spline adapter. With the VW I could use the input
to mainshaft coupler/ reverse gear from a VW Bus. A local machine shop
turned it down to 1.125 inch, like the motor shaft, and cut a 1/4 inch
keyway into it (not through it.)
The motor shaft and the spline adapter go into either end of a Ruland
shaft coupler <http://www.ruland.com/clc.html>. I'm using the
CLC-18-18-F coupler on that page. It hasn't given me any trouble in 6
years.
Paul "neon" G.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>> You'd be far better off build a parallel hybrid (either electric motor,
>> or
>> gas motor, or both, can drive the wheels), this way you maintain you
>> current top speed, and improve your acceleration AND improve your
>> efficiency. Possibly toping off at 25% or better.
>> Not to mention that the B&S will produce about 100 times as much
>> pollution
>> as the metro engine.
>> Final problem, 5hp is NOWHERE near enough power.
> -- I'm not so sure it will be as inefficient as you say. I'm using a
> simple
> charging design. I'm also using Optima batteries, which have almost no
> resistance or charging losses.
Whoever told you Optima's have almost no resistance lied, or you
missunderstood. They have low resistance, but they still have resistance.
Anyway, it's not about resistance.
When you discharge a 12V PbA battery (even an Optima) it produces LESS
than 12V. In fact the battery is considered "empty" when it reached 10.5V
(Quite a bit less than 12V)
In order to charge it for cyclic use, in a reasonable amount of time, you
will need to charge it at MORE than 13.8V. In fact it finishes charging
at around 14.4-15.5V.
Now if you are paying attention, you'll notice that it take MUCH more
voltage (up to 50% more) to charge the battery than you get out when you
discharge it.
Finally, to fully charge an Optima battery you have to put in approx 110%
of the amp hours you took out.
When you multiply the extra amp hours by the extra voltage you'll find
that I was being generous when I said that the batteries would be 75%
efficient.
>
> The real key is modifying the B&S to fuel injection, and running it at
> (nearly)full throttle. What your calculations didn't take into account is
> the
> higher efficiency of gas motors that aren't throttled.
The 35% figure assumed full open throttle and was probably a bit on the
generous side. As I recall the maximum theoretical efficiency of a gas
engine is about 40%.
The other thing
> you don't
> account for is because the batteries are being continually trickle charged
> by the
> motor, and to a lesser extent from the solar, I don't need a big rack.
??? what does that have to do with anything?
Efficiency does care about the size of your rack.
> I'm
> trying to get away with 3, running a 24V motor at 36V. The batteries are
> acting
> more like large capacitors. I stripped the Geo down to the bone, and
> don't have
> to add much weight in batteries. It's more of a golf cart then a car.
Ok so yu won't get much range either. Batteries act like batteries no
matter how many you have. If you keep them between 60-80% charged you can
avoid some of the efficiency losses from finish charge, but then the
batteries will die within a couple months.
>> FWIW, the similar system you probably read about was in Mother Earth
>> News
>> right? Mother Earth printed that article without verifying it, they
>> tried
> -- Actually, no. I read about this when I was a teenager(20 years ago)
> and
> wanted to do it then. The problem at that time was that lead acid
> batteries lost
> a lot of power when charging, and solar panels didn't generate much
> amperage.
> Those are the only two items I put real money into on this project to
> overcome
> those problems.
20 years ago was about the time the mother earth article came out.
Actually it was about 25 years ago IIRC.
Solar panels still don't produce much amperage, and PbA batteries still
loose a lot of energy when charging at any reasonable rate. Then again,
every other battery technology is worse...
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The energy released by a bonfire is hundreds of times that of the energy
from the match that started it.
Ditto for the internal cumbustion engine and the "sparc".
Hmm produces "valuable chemicals"? Hmm water perhaps?
> If not, I'd like one for my EV please :)
>
> "The energy released from this process is hundreds of times in excess
> of the energy required to start it. The primary fuel is hydrogen gas,
> which can be created inexpensively via electrolysis from water.
> Energy is released as heat and may be converted to electricity using
> known methods. The process is scalable from small, hand-held units to
> large, fire-box replacements in large central power stations.
>
> BlackLight's experimental results are published in over 65
> peer-reviewed publications and have been replicated by many
> independent groups. Reports by leading independent researchers claim
> that the state of the art BlackLight Process reactors are ready for
> development and commercialization."
>
> http://www.blacklightpower.com/
>
> Hmm. Doesn't seem to be the usual Tilley/Zero Point Energy rubbish.
> But I'm not a physicist and can't tell if the description of how it
> works is plausible. Anyone?
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Now if you are paying attention, you'll notice that it take MUCH more
> voltage (up to 50% more) to charge the battery than you get out when you
> discharge it.
> Finally, to fully charge an Optima battery you have to put in approx 110%
> of the amp hours you took out.
> When you multiply the extra amp hours by the extra voltage you'll find
> that I was being generous when I said that the batteries would be 75%
> efficient.
-- I won't totally discharging or charging the batteries, so I shouldn't suffer
so much. Your right though, how the batteries hold up might be a different
matter. I'm hopping having the trickle charge from the solar panels will keep
the voltage up in the batteries even when partially discharged, extending their
life. I know there will still be losses, but less then in other battery
configurations. When the car is running, the energy generated will be mostly
used by the motor, bypassing the batteries all together.
> The 35% figure assumed full open throttle and was probably a bit on the
> generous side. As I recall the maximum theoretical efficiency of a gas
> engine is about 40%.
-- Yup, a pretty big waste of energy. Which is why the gains are so large if
you
can increase that number by even a few percent. I don't know what percentage of
the fuel an automotive engine normally converts into energy, I seem to remember
around 10% in regular driving conditions. If I could up that by even 5%, then
the whole system gets a 50% gain over a conventional drivetrain (minus the
losses
you mentioned, of course). In the end, I still think I'll get a good bit better
mpg then a prius (albeit a slower vehicle).
> > the batteries are being continually trickle charged by the
> > motor, and to a lesser extent from the solar, I don't need a big rack.
> ??? what does that have to do with anything?
--It won't increase the efficiency any, but I'll spend a lot less power dragging
a fat rack of batteries around town. Weight reduction in a small car like a geo
can make a big difference. You can effect your quarter mile time by just
stripping the carpet out of the car.
> 20 years ago was about the time the mother earth article came out.
> Actually it was about 25 years ago IIRC.
> Solar panels still don't produce much amperage, and PbA batteries still
> loose a lot of energy when charging at any reasonable rate. Then again,
> every other battery technology is worse...
--Hey! Don't bust my rose-colored bubble. You may be right and it'll never
work, but I can't pass up a chance to drive a home built contraption that gets
better mpg than any production car.
Chris
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
OhNoJoe wrote:
I was wondering when we would see this. <snip> and stuck them in their
EV kit.
At 11:52 AM 4/11/05 -0500, Chris wrote:
I have.
I bought a Prius pack to test the batteries and see <snip>
locations. My guess is they watch the batteries for dv, then do a slow
overcharge once the first one hits it to bring the rest up to spec.
I seem to recall reading somewhere that the reason for the use of NiMH in
the 'hybrid' vehicles is that no other battery chemistry can put up with
being used between 30% and 70% SOC, i.e. that Toyota NEVER brings the pack
to full charge or full discharge. This seems to work for them, since the
battery warranty is somewhere in the order (IIRC) 100,000 miles/160,000km.
You will also want more than one string. Charging multiple strings of
these is not going to work
I have encountered someone on the 'net with a small 2-seater sports car of
some type (probably a kit car) who got hold of 5 of these packs for his/her
EV pack. But the vehicle description left me wondering if they were going
to have a lot of trouble once they tried to use the vehicle.
Anyone got a link for that vehicle?
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- kluge <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Chris - what size are the shafts you're working with (diameter)?
The motor has a 5/8 inch shaft that is 3/4 inch long. The tranny has a 3/4 inch
shaft (w/splines).
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
James Massey writes:
>
>
> I have encountered someone on the 'net with a small 2-seater sports car of
> some type (probably a kit car) who got hold of 5 of these packs for his/her
> EV pack. But the vehicle description left me wondering if they were going
> to have a lot of trouble once they tried to use the vehicle.
>
> Anyone got a link for that vehicle?
http://www.electric7.com/
Ralph
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
All,
Just talked to Darin Gilbert. He is headed our way from Detroit
Piranha in hand.
OJ-2 is ready to go on the trailer. Can't say the same for the
regulator rack.
A last minute wiring error took out most of the gates. We have spares
but no time to fix the boards before tomorrow.
So it's back to the future tomorrow charging "REAL" Bad Boy style. We
did get 50 good launches and 12-15 charge cycles in during the last few
days so the bats should be pretty close. Have no idea what to expect.
Parking lot launch practice is all we had time for. We haven't been
over 50 mph. The UPS guy next door gets nervous when your closing in
going much faster.
Should be a good chance tomorrow to really see what we have to work
with for January in Florida.
By the way, brand new driver tomorrow as well. 0 time in the left seat.
Should be interesting.
Shawn
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
They're saying the hydrogen free radical atoms are transformed into some
"new" atomic form of shrunken hydrogen. While the potential for new,
interesting, and probably extremely dangerous chemicals made with what
is virtually a new element is fascinating, there's no verifiable
evidence that such a thing was ever created.
Danny
Peter VanDerWal wrote:
The energy released by a bonfire is hundreds of times that of the energy
from the match that started it.
Ditto for the internal cumbustion engine and the "sparc".
Hmm produces "valuable chemicals"? Hmm water perhaps?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Alain St-Yves wrote:
>Could you remenber me some of the best links where we
>have registered speed or acceleration of the winners
>EV and ICE cars.
Read this topic:
http://www.peakoil.com/fortopic8987.html
Videos, referenced stats, photos of races, you name it, this
topic has it. (Note: White Zombie and Blue Meanie are
outdated in this topic. Zombie is pulling 12.1-12.2 second
1/4 miles now, and Meanie has a little bit more range)
Also, check John Wayland's site,
http://www.plasmaboyracing.com for videos of the White
Zombie smoking a Corvette and also a turbocharged DSM.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Sweet!! I've always liked thoes cars, I'd like to own one some day (gas
or electric.. electric would be better of course)! Do you have the
ability to post pictures of your progress? I'd love to see how that
works out for you.
-Jon Glauser
------
"You can tell the ideas of a nation by its advertisement." - Douglas
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi folks,
I have been playing with a handy little meter I picked up on eBay few
months back. They have been mentioned on the list before, I
think. It is called a Kill-A-Watt. There is picture of one on the web at:
http://www.supermediastore.com/kilwateldet1.html?WT.mc_id=AdWordsKillaWattkillawatt&WT.srch=1
(no that isn't who I bought it from, so this is not an endorsement of
that retailer.)
Now, my question, which should probably be for our European or
Australian members. Have you seen a similar product in your area
that can handle 220/240? If so, and it would accept 60 cycle AC,
then it sure would be nice for those using 220/240 volt chargers,
providing the current isn't too high. Yes, adapters would be needed,
but that isn't a show stopper.
Anyone seen one? Or maybe a 240 capable one in the US?
Thanks,
Mike Chancey,
'88 Civic EV
'95 Solectria Force
Kansas City, Missouri
EV List Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com
My Electric Car at: http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda
Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org
Join the EV List at: http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html
In medio stat virtus - Virtue is in the moderate, not the extreme
position. (Horace)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Oh... google maps is the problem.
I tried a new Mac with OSX/Firefox and it is indeed spiffy.
But not much good to those of us who own older machines with OS9,
Netscape, etc. Bummer.
Ken Trough wrote:
The Frappr software uses Google maps and some code to add the pointers
and page formatting. The software is tested in IE6 and Firefox1.0.7 in
windows. Works under Firefox on the Mac. No Safari or IE function on the
Mac so far.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mike Chancey wrote:
>Now, my question, which should probably be for our European or
>Australian members. Have you seen a similar product in your area
>that can handle 220/240? If so, and it would accept 60 cycle AC,
>then it sure would be nice for those using 220/240 volt chargers,
>providing the current isn't too high. Yes, adapters would be needed,
>but that isn't a show stopper.
Well, here in Australia I have seen these:
<http://shops.bizarsoftware.com.au/ATAShop/catalogue/category16/category93>
The Sparometer is a German product, I think.
An Australian electronics magazine (Silicon Chip) published a design, which
is available as a kit:
<http://www.dse.com.au/cgi-bin/dse.storefront/436c2db907372e0a273fc0a87f9c06
bf/Product/View/K7217>
I'd say the kit could be modified fairly easily to work in the US.
Hope that's useful!
Dean
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mike,
This looks like the EKM265 (Energy Cost Meter, in German) that I
have, actually I have two - one I reversed the input and output
to measure the power I was delivering to, instead of taking from
the grid with my solar inverter.
Being a 2650 Watt device, I could just handle my 2500W inverter.
Apparently it has a SW bug because once a month or so it froze up
and stopped counting, then I needed to unplug/plug it and it did
continue. Due to the non-volatile memory did it not lose the
amount and cost of the kWh that was measured.
Running it at 60 Hz will screw up the kWh as there are 50 x 3600
cycles in an hour in Europe and 60 x 3600 cycles in the US.
Setting the kWh cost at 5/6 the kWh rate will display the
proper cost per timelapse again.
Since everything is based on sinus-integration, there should be
no difference in Watts, Volts and Amps for 50 or 60 Hz.
There may be much other devices around, I was very happy with
these:
http://www.geocities.com/cor_van_de_water/solar/ekm265.jpg
Regards,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3673 eFAX: +31-84-717-9972
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-501-641-8576
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Mike Chancey
Sent: Friday, November 04, 2005 6:33 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: 220/240 Volt Kill-A-Watt Meter
Hi folks,
I have been playing with a handy little meter I picked up on eBay few
months back. They have been mentioned on the list before, I
think. It is called a Kill-A-Watt. There is picture of one on the web at:
http://www.supermediastore.com/kilwateldet1.html?WT.mc_id=AdWordsKillaWattki
llawatt&WT.srch=1
(no that isn't who I bought it from, so this is not an endorsement of
that retailer.)
Now, my question, which should probably be for our European or
Australian members. Have you seen a similar product in your area
that can handle 220/240? If so, and it would accept 60 cycle AC,
then it sure would be nice for those using 220/240 volt chargers,
providing the current isn't too high. Yes, adapters would be needed,
but that isn't a show stopper.
Anyone seen one? Or maybe a 240 capable one in the US?
Thanks,
Mike Chancey,
'88 Civic EV
'95 Solectria Force
Kansas City, Missouri
EV List Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com
My Electric Car at: http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda
Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org
Join the EV List at: http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html
In medio stat virtus - Virtue is in the moderate, not the extreme
position. (Horace)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
From the web site: http://www.blacklightpower.com/
"The energy released from this process is hundreds of times in excess
of the energy required to start it. The primary fuel is hydrogen gas,
which can be created inexpensively via electrolysis from water.
Energy is released as heat and may be converted to electricity using
known methods. The process is scalable from small, hand-held units to
large, fire-box replacements in large central power stations.
BlackLight's experimental results are published in over 65
peer-reviewed publications and have been replicated by many
independent groups. Reports by leading independent researchers claim
that the state of the art BlackLight Process reactors are ready for
development and commercialization."
What they haven't talked about is if the energy released is more than
the energy required to get hydrogen from electrolysis. "Unburning" and
burning hydrogen is a net zero idea. Hydrogen simply becomes a energy
storage medium, much like the mix of lead, lead oxide, and sulfuric
acid that many of us use to store energy in our EVs :-)
My BS detector is going off.
Paul "neon" G.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jon,
As soon as I actually start working on it I'm going to start a site and post
everything I do. I can't wait to get started.
John David
maxmpg.org <http://maxmpg.org>
On 11/4/05, Jon Glauser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Sweet!! I've always liked thoes cars, I'd like to own one some day (gas
> or electric.. electric would be better of course)! Do you have the
> ability to post pictures of your progress? I'd love to see how that
> works out for you.
>
> -Jon Glauser
>
> ------
> "You can tell the ideas of a nation by its advertisement." - Douglas
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I can't seem to find a satisfactory answer to this question:
Is the Zilla HEPI input compatible with the twist-grip hall effect
throttles? These throttles appear to take +5 V and output a voltage
porportional to the throtttle position, simulating a potentiometer.
See:
http://www.users.bigpond.com/solarbbq/throttle/throttle%20how%20they%20work.htm
Standard Zilla setup is Curtis style -- that is, to use the
potentiometer as a rheostat (2 wires).
Only inkling I get from the manual is that the HEPI inputs are
(were?) called "Aux Pot +" and "Aux Pot -", which tends to imply a
rheostat-like function, though the manual mentions that 4 wires are
connected to the hairball, not the two implied by the pinout chart
in the manual.
No, the Zilla Hepi will not work with that.
For reliable security reasons (being able to detect opens and shorts
in the connections safely) the Zilla HEPI uses two hall inputs that
are offset from each other. It actually uses six wires, two of which
are ground that connect on two different terminals.
Sorry for not relying earlier, I've been missing much of the EV list lately.
--
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Home of the Zilla.
http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
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> What they haven't talked about is if the energy released is more than
> the energy required to get hydrogen from electrolysis.
Yeah, they are were very careful to tap dance around that point, which
makes me posistive that it is not (of course I thought that before I went
to the site.)
It seems to me that if you remove all the BS, all they are talking about
is burning hyrdrogen. Whether or not they actually change the molecular
structure or not, I don't know, but basically it seems to me that
basically they are just claiming to "burn" a non-renewable resource
(granted an extreemly abundant one).
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
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If anyone is interested, have a peak at this section of the
wikipedia EV conversion article, there are some new diagrams.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_vehicle_conversion#Startup_circuit
Click on the image for further details, make corrections
directly of reply here and I'll pass them allong.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:WPEVStartRun.png
L8r
Ryan
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You might run into some wiring problems, considering that 220V in Europe
(and most of the rest of the world) is single phase, not two phase like it
is in the states.
> Hi folks,
>
> I have been playing with a handy little meter I picked up on eBay few
> months back. They have been mentioned on the list before, I
> think. It is called a Kill-A-Watt. There is picture of one on the web
> at:
>
> http://www.supermediastore.com/kilwateldet1.html?WT.mc_id=AdWordsKillaWattkillawatt&WT.srch=1
>
> (no that isn't who I bought it from, so this is not an endorsement of
> that retailer.)
>
> Now, my question, which should probably be for our European or
> Australian members. Have you seen a similar product in your area
> that can handle 220/240? If so, and it would accept 60 cycle AC,
> then it sure would be nice for those using 220/240 volt chargers,
> providing the current isn't too high. Yes, adapters would be needed,
> but that isn't a show stopper.
>
> Anyone seen one? Or maybe a 240 capable one in the US?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Mike Chancey,
> '88 Civic EV
> '95 Solectria Force
> Kansas City, Missouri
> EV List Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com
> My Electric Car at: http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda
> Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org
> Join the EV List at: http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html
>
> In medio stat virtus - Virtue is in the moderate, not the extreme
> position. (Horace)
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mike,
I have a Kill-a-watt and have used it extensively to see what my air compressor
really draws, what drills draw and to log refrig usage, to compare compact
fluorescents and incandescent.
But http://www.ccontrolsys.com/products/pulse_output.html makes a Watt Node,
which is a little more complicated. You have to install it, split-core current
transformers have to be installed over the incoming 120 v legs. I was planning
to use one and install it in a box that plugs in to a welding outlet that I
have already in my shop to monitor the 220 power I use in my ev.
Another approach is to install an actual meter.
http://www.hialeahmeter.com/siphwame.html has meters that you can use. I was
thinking of using one of these also, mounted on a portable panel so I could
plug it in where necessary. This approach is a lot cheaper than the Watt Node.
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Chancey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Friday, November 04, 2005 7:33 PM
Subject: 220/240 Volt Kill-A-Watt Meter
> Hi folks,
>
> I have been playing with a handy little meter I picked up on eBay few
> months back. They have been mentioned on the list before, I
> think. It is called a Kill-A-Watt. There is picture of one on the web at:
>
> http://www.supermediastore.com/kilwateldet1.html?WT.mc_id=AdWordsKillaWattkillawatt&WT.srch=1
>
> (no that isn't who I bought it from, so this is not an endorsement of
> that retailer.)
>
> Now, my question, which should probably be for our European or
> Australian members. Have you seen a similar product in your area
> that can handle 220/240? If so, and it would accept 60 cycle AC,
> then it sure would be nice for those using 220/240 volt chargers,
> providing the current isn't too high. Yes, adapters would be needed,
> but that isn't a show stopper.
>
> Anyone seen one? Or maybe a 240 capable one in the US?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Mike Chancey,
> '88 Civic EV
> '95 Solectria Force
> Kansas City, Missouri
> EV List Photo Album at: http://evalbum.com
> My Electric Car at: http://www.geocities.com/electric_honda
> Mid-America EAA chapter at: http://maeaa.org
> Join the EV List at: http://www.madkatz.com/ev/evlist.html
>
> In medio stat virtus - Virtue is in the moderate, not the extreme
> position. (Horace)
>
>
>
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I was looking on ebay and was wondering if servo motors from big cnc's
would be a good source for heavy duty motors.
item # 7558428122 caught my eye
being a servo, we know it is balanced
seeing 6000rpm on the name-plate assures it has a good commutator
440V tells me it has good insulation
so the main question is about the torque avail and the current it can
take, it seems to be not using much of it's commbar area at all.
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Hello everyone,
Im regretfully writing to you all today as im having to put up my 1997
Chevy S10 on the selling block. My wife has been pushing me for ahwhile
for a new home and we have finally decided to take the plunge and build
one. To raise funds right now, im going to have to sell my truck/parts
so if anyone is in New England area and interested please email me at
[EMAIL PROTECTED] Ill explain below everything that might help..
I have the 1997 Chevy S10 which has been stripped down and cleaned of
all the ICE parts and everything that wasnt needed.
I have a Vacuum Pump for the brakes, Zilla 1k Controller, Warp 9 Motor
and Transmission Adapater, Clutch Kit, 500amp Main Breaker, Motor Mount,
All the battery Cables, Ends, Boots, Heat Shrink, Markers for the entire
Job, I have the installation Manual, a DSL-55 Dc/Dc converter.
I have the motor and transmission and clutch kit etc installed inside
the truck but its never been used. And all the other parts are Brand new
never installed.
Its a sad day for me, but I really need the funds to help with the new
house. If you know anyone who could use this truck and to finish her up
please forward this along. If your interested in the entire project
please email me and we can then talk via phone.
I will continue to follow this thread and this group of people and hope
to jump back in , in a couple years with both feet first.
Let me know if your interested. In what i have listed above i have about
$6200 invested including the truck which is in great great shape. I
will sell the entire unit for $5k and will help deliver to you or help
meet you in the lower portion of maine if your from out of state. Im
approx 4 hours from the bottom of the state of maine.
Let me know
Cwarman
.
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Regarding ETEK efficiency it was stated:
> Simple mods to allow it to survive higher RPMS will
> have no effect on efficiency.
Well let's see:
* power loss is primarily due to heat, which is R*I^2 loss.
* power delivered is torque times speed (Pm = T * w )
First order, for a given current and once equilibrium is established, the
torque and power loss remains constant, regardless of RPM. This means that
the greater the speed or voltage available (or tolerable), the more the
efficiency increases for the ETEK. The ETEK motor curves support this by
showing efficiency at peak power increasing with motor voltage and RPM.
>From a simplified model view,
eff = Pout/Pin
Pout = T * w ~ Kt * Im * w
Pin = Vm * Im ~ (Kb*w + Im*R)* Im
Kt = Kb
eff ~ (Kt*w)/(Kb*w+Im*Rm)
= 1/(1+Im*Rm/(Kt*w))
= 1/(1+Ki/w) ; Ki = Im*Rm/Kb ~ constant for given Im, Rm, Kb
= w/(w+Ki)
==> 1 as w increases!
Again, that's first order and doesn't include magnetic core, windage and
other losses.
So it is indeed arguably correct that simple changes in strength to allow
the ETEK's rotor to handle higher voltage and higher continuous speed WILL
increase the efficiency. It's not a linear equation, but unless you've
modeled the other losses, it's hard to argue that increasing the speed will
not increase the efficiency.
-Myles Twete, Portland, Or.
(cruising 6knots with 5.4kw (150amps, 36v) ETEK power)
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Hi Everyone,
I am a newbie to this list and EVs in general. I am determined to own one by
this time next year. I am interested in purchasing or building a pickup truck
conversion. IS there a place in the east SF Bay area that does conversions?
My neighbor is really handy with cars and will help me with the conversion. He
builds race cars, so I am sure he has everything we need. To get the ICE out
anyway...
Here's a question... My commute is about 20 miles each way. There is a
significant hill going out, and I need highway speed. Am I going to be able to
use this for commuting with lead acid batteries? I understand that there are
batteries out there that will increase range, but are probably cost
prohibitive. I am hoping to do this in the $10,000-12,000 range.
I haven't seen any info on the web about adding a solar panel to increase
range, etc. Is the weight trade-off too much? My truck will get lots of sun
while I am sitting at work, so I thought it could give me enough juice to get
back home.
Stan
---------------------------------
Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.
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On 5 Nov 2005 at 2:58, Peter VanDerWal wrote:
> You might run into some wiring problems, considering that 220V in Europe
> (and most of the rest of the world) is single phase, not two phase like it is
> in the states.
As I understand it, and mind you I'm NOT a EE, US 240 volt household power
is not two-phase. However, it is derived from a transformer that's center-
tapped for 120 volts.
The difference in configuration, which may or may not be significant in this
case, is that in the states the center tap is grounded; in Europe there's no
center tap and one side of the 240 is grounded. Theoretically this could
have some safety implications. Practically speaking, I've used a few 240
volt overseas appliances here with no ill effects that I've observed. You
do have to watch out for the difference in frequency, though.
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
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