EV Digest 4895
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) RE: Zilla manual
by "Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Calling Mason Convey
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
3) RE: Digital Panel Meters Common Ground
by "Robert Chew" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Dune Buggy Weight - conversion
by "Mark Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Unusual question: OD of 2/0 cable?
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: mower update part 2
by "STEVE CLUNN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Ray LeMeur
by Ross Henderson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) "Zero" Mower Fuel Cell Update
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
9) RE: Zilla manual
by Aaron NMLUG-EV <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: mower update part 2 Comments
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: EV Confidential Update
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Honda Insight DC-DC converter on Ebay
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) RE: Honda Insight DC-DC converter on Ebay
by "Adams, Lynn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Current Sensor (was: Unusual question: OD of 2/0 cable?)
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) RE: Honda Insight DC-DC converter on Ebay
by Aaron NMLUG-EV <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: mower update part 2
by keith vansickle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: More Zip newbi question
by Carmen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Zilla manual/sparrow
by "STEVE CLUNN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) RE: adaptor plate
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Dune Buggy Weight - conversion
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: More Zip newbi question
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Current Sensor
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) RE: mower update part 2
by Hump <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Current Sensor
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Why not just put each chapter in PDF format? There are plenty of software
available to do it in pdf format and everyone has the ability to print them
exactly as shown on the screen.
-----Original Message-----
From: Otmar [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2005 3:41 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Zilla manual
At 9:41 PM +1100 11/10/05, Mark Fowler wrote:
>Hey Otmar,
>
>What would you think about putting a wiki-based manual on your site?
>That way, as bits of information come up about the Zilla you, or we,
>could update the relevant page.
>Then, every year or so you could compile the current info into the
>official printed manual.
I don't know. Maybe.
Can you point me toward a successful implementation of a wiki?
I've been invited to participate in a number of them but have not
once found one useful or user friendly. I'm beginning to wonder if
they are just a programmers toy. Granted I have not studied them, but
I am expecting something that a novice would find helpful for mining
information.
>I know that I have learned quite a bit more about what some of the
>counters in the DAQ thingies mean through emails from you - stuff that
>is only briefly touched on in the manual.
>
>There has been so much useful info about the Zilla appear on this list
>(the cooling discussion and the hall-effect discussion are just two
>recent examples). Having an easily updatable repository to jot down or
>update this info can only be a good thing.
One thing that I am planning is a FAQ. Relatively easy to do and very
useful. I've been storing away questions for that.
I can see how archiving things like the cooling discussion could be
handy, but it may not be the sort of thing I want to integrate into
my official materials lest someone think that the suggestions are
approved by Cafe Electric llc. I try to investigate things very well
before I present them in my public documents.
For example, my recent comment is embarrassingly vague:
At 7:04 PM -0800 11/9/05, Otmar wrote:
>Yes Eric,
>It's very similar to that, but I think the voltages are higher. My
>notes on it are not handy.
>
>At 2:28 PM -0800 11/8/05, Eric Poulsen wrote:
>Are there a "high-range" and "low-range" sensors, as described here
>(see page 4 for voltages)?
So when time comes to put that in the FAQ I may need to spend an hour
collecting and phrasing the information so that it is accurate. That
probably involves starting up the windblows box so I can review
comments in the code and digging up old testing notes. In the end
that adds up. Last time I updated the manual I think I spent a few
days work on it.
Now I think I'll get back to this big pile of paperwork that needs to
be completed before I can get back to working on the Zillas. That's
one thing I plan to delegate after my move to Oregon next month.
--
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com/ Home of the Zilla.
http://www.evcl.com/914 My electric 914
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Can you E mail me? Dennis
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Nick,
Wow 3mA, that's tiny, what brand and specs and where do you get them from.
Mine draws 60mA. Not much really. So I think I will go that method because I
really love digital panel meters, nice and accurate. By the way, anyone out
there got a good method of cutting square holes in aluminum sheet besides
drilling holes and hacking away the square.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Nick 'Sharkey' Moore
Sent: 11 November 2005 16:44
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Digital Panel Meters Common Ground
On 2005-11-10, John G. Lussmyer wrote:
>
> I'd just go with a cheap 5V regulator and power the meter from the
> battery being monitored.
Dang! That's what I was about to suggest. Specifically, the 78L05
or something like that. Depends, I suppose, on the current draw
of your meter. Not a lot, I imagine.
Or there are LCD two-wire meters out there which have a little regulator
in them already ... the one I was looking at for the bike drew, umm,
3mA tops?
-----sharks
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
I was curious who's done a dune buggy conversion (with doors/cover) and how
much do they weigh?
Is it easy to find brake etc parts for the old VW undercarraige?
What is the typical conversion recepe? A direct drive 7" or use tranny with an
8" 72 - 84V?
Thanks, Mark
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: Doug Weathers<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2005 10:30 PM
Subject: Re: Unusual question: OD of 2/0 cable?
Hi Eric,
I purchased orange 2/0 ultra-flexible welding cable from Airgas. I
just took some measurements with my digital calipers. The OD is
15.85mm. The diameter of the copper is approx. 11mm.
If you squeeze the cable, it will get smaller than 15mm. Squeezing the
caliper on it will bring it down to about 14.5mm.
You should be able to fit it in your sensor. It'll be tight, though.
You might need to trim some insulation as Cor suggests.
If you have to feed a length of it through the sensor, perhaps some
cable lube would help. Or you could set up a wringer and squish the
cable before feeding it through.
Other 2/0 cable may be thicker or thinner than mine. Cor seems to have
seen cable with less copper than what I ended up with.
Could you share some details of this sensor? Where can it be
purchased, what's the output like, will it work instead of a shunt,
etc.
Good luck,
Doug
On Nov 10, 2005, at 12:08 PM, Cor van de Water wrote:
> Eric,
>
> You should be fine.
> It depends on the thickness of insulator, quoted from memory
> the copper diameter is less than 9mm so you should be fine with
> all but the cables with more than 3mm rubber isolator
> (and even that could be cut off partially)
>
> Success,
>
> Cor van de Water
> Systems Architect
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Private:
http://www.cvandewater.com<http://www.cvandewater.com/>
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
> Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-501-641-8576
> Take your network further http://www.proxim.com<http://www.proxim.com/>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Eric Poulsen
> Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2005 12:05 PM
> To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
> Subject: Unusual question: OD of 2/0 cable?
>
>
> Can anyone give me a figure for the OD of 2/0 cable typically used for
> battery to controller interconnects?
>
> I have a closed-loop hall effect current sensor, and I'm wondering if a
> 2/0 cable will pass through, or do I need to use an non-insulted copper
> bar? The opening is rectangular, 20 x 15 mm (0.787" x 0.591"), so my
> small dimension is 15mm.
>
>
--
Doug Weathers
Bend, OR, USA
http://learn-something.blogsite.org<http://learn-something.blogsite.org/>
Hello Doug,
The cable links between each battery, can be a low voltage standard welding
cable, which the diameter is at 15 mm. Remember the voltage difference between
two batteries may be only 6 or 12 volts. A high voltage 12,470 volt transformer
has only 7 volts between windings, so a 15 volt rating enamel insulated wire
will work, but we take off this transformer with a 15,000 volt conductor
rating.
The main cable feeds from the battery, if below 300 volts can use the low
voltage cable size. It is prefer to use the 600 volt rated welding cable for
the feeders, where they have more insulation that may against a hard surface,
which can indent the cable to the copper. The 600 volt size can get over 20 mm.
Roland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pestka, Dennis J" <
Steve;
Being an Elec-Trak user, I really enjoy reading about your all electric
lawn
business.
From what I read your elec trak probable uses allot less power than mine ,
The two drive hydros pull 30 to 50 amps at 96v , and with the blades on I
run form 60 to 120 amps and at 80 amp it feels like the way it did with the
20 hp gas . What is interesting to me is that for years people have been
saying why don't you convert your lawn mower , I always said , its not
practical , and would be to heavy , wouldn't have enough run time and other
excuses. I really don't think I'll ever use my other gas mower now . Even on
the very big yards I have I know I can do them , I'll just recharge 1/2 way
through , and do the other stuff in the middle. I'm going to add more
batteries to the work truck , going with 40 , already got them , I'll also
be about to use the truck for some long distance trips , and I'm thinking of
setting up a dump charge , split my pack so I'll be dumping 20 golfers into
the 8 orbitals. What I'm finding out is that there is plenty of time for
recharging between yards while I do all the other stuff with just the pfc
50 , but having the dump charger would help where I have 3 or 4 yards all
together. .
I actually had the same idea a few years back, but never went anywhere
with
it.
I can't believe how much yard men make here , I have more work that I need
and when I get a call on a new yard , deep inside I say "not another one "
When I look at the yard , its got to be just right ,, . Then when I hear
what the last guy was charging , well I can't let this one go , not at that
price,. Can't get rid of all the old ladies who need me either , so the
whole thing is getting kind of crazy . Now I'm having so much fun driving
the electric mower , all the other yard men have raised there prices each
time the gas goes up , I just cut 10 to 15 dollars a day off my expenses ,
and I won't have to buy all those expensive lawn mower engine parts , like
air filters for $ 15 and engines for $1200 , . With around 70 yards my mower
gets 1 home owner year of ware every 3 or 4 days or 70 years every year.
Being able to turn it off with out having to crank up the gas motor each
time is another big pulse , starter motors cost about $150 .
Glad you did and I wish you much success.
I think you may have found a great niche.
When I did my first EV I though I had found something the world would want
cus it worked so good for me , I got the same feeling again but I know the
world a little better now , so I really don't expect to much,.
Hopefully sometime you could share your business plan, inventory of
equipment, financial results, etc..
It may encourage others to start something similar in their area.
I've talked about my business plan for Ev's before , I build them with my
own money from my lawn business , then let people drive them and pay me a
token $100 per month, I put them all up for sale on www.grassrootsev.com for
the price of the parts plus $20 per hour for my labor, which is about 1/3
what I make cutting grass.
Steve Clunn
" God , why are you having me mow all these yards instead of converting gas
cars to electric " " because the world it going to hell and I want it to
look good when it gets there. " " oh "
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Of course I have no way of knowing where you are or
what you are planning but if northern Michigan is not
too far out of the way a guy named Duanne Pretzer
built my 1991 Isuzu conversion and did a super job.
His email address is [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tell him
Ross from North Carolina sent you...
__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
All,
Had a very interesting meeting yesterday at Intelligent Energy in Long
Beach, CA. Among other more immediate projects, we discussed the
possibilities of integrating their hydrogen fuel cell system in a
special "Zero" mower. I got a first hand inspection of a 10K unit in
use on site. Very nice, very intriguing, VERY expensive, (at least
right now). Not sure the market is ready for a $50K electric lawn
mower. Stay tuned though, prices for smaller (1-2K) units for another
of our projects, have already seen a huge reduction in price in the
last year. Stack life has also greatly improved in the last few years.
In my opinion it is not the right answer for a production mower right
now, but may be feasible in the not so distant future.
Shawn Lawless
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Thu, 2005-11-10 at 22:33, Mark Fowler wrote:
> A successful wiki implementation? Wikipedia is the obvious one.
The software that Wikipedia uses is called MediaWiki.
It is relatively easy to install on a typical
LINUX-Apahce-MySQL type server.
We use it at http://www.nmosug.org
You could just try to use Wikipedia...
but sometimes it is good to have control of who has
accounts on MediaWiki to avoid spam.
--
Aaron Birenboim \ I have an inferiority complex,
Albuquerque, NM, USA \ but its not a very good one.
aaron at birenboim.com \
http://aaron.birenboim.com \
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "STEVE CLUNN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 8:58 AM
Subject: Re: mower update part 2
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Pestka, Dennis J" <
> > Steve;
> >
> > Being an Elec-Trak user, I really enjoy reading about your all electric
> > lawn
> > business.
> >From what I read your elec trak probable uses allot less power than mine
,
> The two drive hydros pull 30 to 50 amps at 96v , and with the blades on I
> run form 60 to 120 amps and at 80 amp it feels like the way it did with
the
> 20 hp gas . What is interesting to me is that for years people have been
> saying why don't you convert your lawn mower , I always said , its not
> practical , and would be to heavy , wouldn't have enough run time and
other
> excuses. I really don't think I'll ever use my other gas mower now . Even
on
> the very big yards I have I know I can do them , I'll just recharge 1/2
way
> through , and do the other stuff in the middle. I'm going to add more
> batteries to the work truck , going with 40 , already got them , I'll also
> be about to use the truck for some long distance trips , and I'm thinking
of
> setting up a dump charge , split my pack so I'll be dumping 20 golfers
into
> the 8 orbitals. What I'm finding out is that there is plenty of time for
> recharging between yards while I do all the other stuff with just the pfc
> 50 , but having the dump charger would help where I have 3 or 4 yards all
> together. .
>
> > I actually had the same idea a few years back, but never went anywhere
> > with
> > it.
> I can't believe how much yard men make here , I have more work that I need
> and when I get a call on a new yard , deep inside I say "not another one "
> When I look at the yard , its got to be just right ,, . Then when I hear
> what the last guy was charging , well I can't let this one go , not at
that
> price,. Can't get rid of all the old ladies who need me either , so the
> whole thing is getting kind of crazy . Now I'm having so much fun driving
> the electric mower , all the other yard men have raised there prices each
> time the gas goes up , I just cut 10 to 15 dollars a day off my expenses ,
> and I won't have to buy all those expensive lawn mower engine parts , like
> air filters for $ 15 and engines for $1200 , . With around 70 yards my
mower
> gets 1 home owner year of ware every 3 or 4 days or 70 years every year.
> Being able to turn it off with out having to crank up the gas motor each
> time is another big pulse , starter motors cost about $150 .
>
> > Glad you did and I wish you much success.
> > I think you may have found a great niche.
> >
> When I did my first EV I though I had found something the world would
want
> cus it worked so good for me , I got the same feeling again but I know the
> world a little better now , so I really don't expect to much,.
>
>
> > Hopefully sometime you could share your business plan, inventory of
> > equipment, financial results, etc..
> > It may encourage others to start something similar in their area.
> >
> I've talked about my business plan for Ev's before , I build them with my
> own money from my lawn business , then let people drive them and pay me a
> token $100 per month, I put them all up for sale on www.grassrootsev.com
for
> the price of the parts plus $20 per hour for my labor, which is about 1/3
> what I make cutting grass.
WHAT A DEAL! Sorry for shouting, but that sounds like the best deal on
the planet? Sigh! You arent overwhelmed with the conversion biz??Maybe ya
need a CT, NY branch office!?I may hafta come out of retirement and help ya
cut grass<g>!How many mowers can I tow with a Rabbit?
>
> Steve Clunn
> " God , why are you having me mow all these yards instead of converting
gas
> cars to electric " " because the world it going to hell and I want it to
> look good when it gets there. " " oh "
>
> Hi Steve;
What a heart warming story!Like Jerry Dycus, also in FLA, ya have a full
plate! Wonders you are doing for the Cause! I can see the new Electric Clunn
Mower rolling out some day, for EVerybody. This is a very important thing,
or nitch, for EV's and is very On Topic. A revived, modernized Elect Trac.
Oh ya can't call it THAT. Generous Electric couuld have issues. But in my
Perfect World would be a buncha 36 or 48 or maybe EVen 60 volt tracters,
batteries nestled in a moulded fiberglas or carbon fibre biodt, light, and
WHEEE! NO rust! Wash it down with a hose, INSIDE and out. Aboard an inverter
for a mobile power supply, lavish amounts of 120/240 for your power outrage
needs. Nice mower, snow plow/thrower, tiller or whatEVer you need. Maybe
nicad powered as the nicad 600's seem to do well in Electracs. Tracters like
to be heavey, so weight isn't an issue. But for a purpose built mower, it
could be built as lite as ya can, to carry more batteries. Steve would be
the design expert here.
OK out of Fantesy World here, my two Basket of clippings worth<g>!
Hey Jerry, just what ya need, another project!<g>!
>
Looking for Mower Update 3
Seeya
Bob
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 2:38 AM
Subject: Re: EV Confidential Update
> I just got a note from Chris Paine, the writer and director of EV
> Confidential www.evconfidential.com and he said that they did try to do
some
> filming at a NEDRA event but that it was cancelled due to wind. That was
our
> Las Vegas event. He did assure me that they would have a NEDRA link on
their
> website for the movie. This was great news for NEDRA. It would have been
> much sweeter if they could have filmed a "White Zombie" launch against a
big
> block Chevy with open headers having it being left like it was standing
> still. A guy has to dream, right.
>
> Roderick Wilde
> NEDRA President
> Hi Rod;
Is it too late to include Racing Stuff? Is the film a done deal? They
certainly welcome to all MY vid clips if they care to.The PIR and Woodburn
stuff would be fun on the BIG screen. Well, bigger screen, FEH! You go to
the damn miovies and are crammed into a auditorium not much bigger than a
Home theater setup, forced to listen to Ads and previews at EAR splitting
volume which sends ya groping for the remote to hit mute or better yet "
Fast Forward" Movies come to me, I rarely go out to them anymore.But an EV
one would be fun to see if anybody ELSE comes and audience reaction, like
seeing Farenheit 911 and Bowling for Columbine.
Seeya front an' center at the Pictur' Show?
Bob
>
>
> --
> Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.361 / Virus Database: 267.12.4/146 - Release Date: 10/21/2005
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In case anyone is interested:
*http://tinyurl.com/cuzmn*
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/HONDA-HYBRID-INSIGHT-144DC-TO-12-DC-MODULE_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ46098QQitemZ8012912023QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Watch out for the $45 shipping charge.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Eric Poulsen
Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 8:34 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Honda Insight DC-DC converter on Ebay
In case anyone is interested:
*http://tinyurl.com/cuzmn*
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/HONDA-HYBRID-INSIGHT-144DC-TO-12-DC-MODUL
E_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ46098QQitemZ8012912023QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD
VW
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Doug, thanks for the info.
The sensor I have is a LEM 400-S/SP8. I'm not sure what the SP8 portion
refers to -- might be purely related to mechanical mounting. The
datasheet is for the 400-S series.
These sensors appear to be specifically for AC/DC current measurement
for traction applications (EVs).
+/- 0-400A measurement, +/- 0-4VDC output porportional to current
Isolated
+/- 1000A measurable (though less accurate)
30000A overload
Requires +/-15VDC at 25mA (max)
Lem website: http://www.lemusa.com
HAL Product line: http://www.lemusa.com/product/industry/HAL
Datasheet: http://www.lem.com/inet/datashee.nsf/(Weblink)/60.62.48.000.4e
PDF entitled "Current Measurement in the Drive Unit of an Electric Vehicle":
http://www.lemauto.com/inet/auto/lemauto.nsf/5529db7bdfd774fbc1256a5e004922b9/6c63b66456fb7a75c1256d5800398bab/$FILE/ch98105e.pdf
I was going to use an op-amp to buffer and scale the signal to drive a
high-impedance automotive style meter movement (1000 Ohms, 10Vdc (yes
volts, not mA) full scale) directly.
I picked up two of them (in one auction) on Ebay for about $15.
Allegro also sells hall effect current sensors, but with lower bandwidth
and current:
http://www.allegromicro.com/hall/currentsensor.asp
The Allegro units are actually wired in series, but are still isolated.
Similar items can be found on Ebay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/VERIS-HAWKEYE-CURRENT-SENSOR-MODEL-720-20-TO-200-AMPS_W0QQitemZ7547099753QQcategoryZ25417QQssPageNameZWD1VQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Doug Weathers wrote:
Hi Eric,
I purchased orange 2/0 ultra-flexible welding cable from Airgas. I
just took some measurements with my digital calipers. The OD is
15.85mm. The diameter of the copper is approx. 11mm.
If you squeeze the cable, it will get smaller than 15mm. Squeezing
the caliper on it will bring it down to about 14.5mm.
You should be able to fit it in your sensor. It'll be tight, though.
You might need to trim some insulation as Cor suggests.
If you have to feed a length of it through the sensor, perhaps some
cable lube would help. Or you could set up a wringer and squish the
cable before feeding it through.
Other 2/0 cable may be thicker or thinner than mine. Cor seems to
have seen cable with less copper than what I ended up with.
Could you share some details of this sensor? Where can it be
purchased, what's the output like, will it work instead of a shunt, etc.
Good luck,
Doug
On Nov 10, 2005, at 12:08 PM, Cor van de Water wrote:
Eric,
You should be fine.
It depends on the thickness of insulator, quoted from memory
the copper diameter is less than 9mm so you should be fine with
all but the cables with more than 3mm rubber isolator
(and even that could be cut off partially)
Success,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-501-641-8576
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Eric Poulsen
Sent: Thursday, November 10, 2005 12:05 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Unusual question: OD of 2/0 cable?
Can anyone give me a figure for the OD of 2/0 cable typically used for
battery to controller interconnects?
I have a closed-loop hall effect current sensor, and I'm wondering if a
2/0 cable will pass through, or do I need to use an non-insulted copper
bar? The opening is rectangular, 20 x 15 mm (0.787" x 0.591"), so my
small dimension is 15mm.
--
Doug Weathers
Bend, OR, USA
http://learn-something.blogsite.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Fri, 2005-11-11 at 08:50, Adams, Lynn wrote:
> Watch out for the $45 shipping charge.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Eric Poulsen
> Sent: Friday, November 11, 2005 8:34 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Honda Insight DC-DC converter on Ebay
>
>
>
>
> In case anyone is interested:
>
> *http://tinyurl.com/cuzmn*
>
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/HONDA-HYBRID-INSIGHT-144DC-TO-12-DC-MODUL
> E_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ46098QQitemZ8012912023QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWD
> VW
Anybody know what current (power) this DC/DC is capable of?
Are there any other parts of an Insight that run from 144V?
I had no idea that the Insight was only 144v.... same as my car.
--
Aaron Birenboim \ I have an inferiority complex,
Albuquerque, NM, USA \ but its not a very good one.
aaron at birenboim.com \
http://aaron.birenboim.com \
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
hi'
just for me to get a perspective on how I might use an
electric in my park. I have 5 areas ranging from
2,000 sq ft to 15,000 sq ft. how much of the park
could I mow between charges? What do you estimate my
recharge time would be? We have a 100 amp 220v panel
that i can tie into directly. what mower would I
use/build. I presently have a woods 6225 with a 20 hp
kohler and a 72 in deck. I dont need to mow it all at
once though that is what I do with the woods. Info
apperciated
kEVs
--- STEVE CLUNN <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Pestka, Dennis J" <
> > Steve;
> >
> > Being an Elec-Trak user, I really enjoy reading
> about your all electric
> > lawn
> > business.
> >From what I read your elec trak probable uses allot
> less power than mine ,
> The two drive hydros pull 30 to 50 amps at 96v , and
> with the blades on I
> run form 60 to 120 amps and at 80 amp it feels like
> the way it did with the
> 20 hp gas . What is interesting to me is that for
> years people have been
> saying why don't you convert your lawn mower , I
> always said , its not
> practical , and would be to heavy , wouldn't have
> enough run time and other
> excuses. I really don't think I'll ever use my other
> gas mower now . Even on
> the very big yards I have I know I can do them ,
> I'll just recharge 1/2 way
> through , and do the other stuff in the middle. I'm
> going to add more
> batteries to the work truck , going with 40 ,
> already got them , I'll also
> be about to use the truck for some long distance
> trips , and I'm thinking of
> setting up a dump charge , split my pack so I'll be
> dumping 20 golfers into
> the 8 orbitals. What I'm finding out is that there
> is plenty of time for
> recharging between yards while I do all the other
> stuff with just the pfc
> 50 , but having the dump charger would help where I
> have 3 or 4 yards all
> together. .
>
> > I actually had the same idea a few years back, but
> never went anywhere
> > with
> > it.
> I can't believe how much yard men make here , I have
> more work that I need
> and when I get a call on a new yard , deep inside I
> say "not another one "
> When I look at the yard , its got to be just right
> ,, . Then when I hear
> what the last guy was charging , well I can't let
> this one go , not at that
> price,. Can't get rid of all the old ladies who need
> me either , so the
> whole thing is getting kind of crazy . Now I'm
> having so much fun driving
> the electric mower , all the other yard men have
> raised there prices each
> time the gas goes up , I just cut 10 to 15 dollars a
> day off my expenses ,
> and I won't have to buy all those expensive lawn
> mower engine parts , like
> air filters for $ 15 and engines for $1200 , . With
> around 70 yards my mower
> gets 1 home owner year of ware every 3 or 4 days or
> 70 years every year.
> Being able to turn it off with out having to crank
> up the gas motor each
> time is another big pulse , starter motors cost
> about $150 .
>
> > Glad you did and I wish you much success.
> > I think you may have found a great niche.
> >
> When I did my first EV I though I had found
> something the world would want
> cus it worked so good for me , I got the same
> feeling again but I know the
> world a little better now , so I really don't expect
> to much,.
>
>
> > Hopefully sometime you could share your business
> plan, inventory of
> > equipment, financial results, etc..
> > It may encourage others to start something similar
> in their area.
> >
> I've talked about my business plan for Ev's before ,
> I build them with my
> own money from my lawn business , then let people
> drive them and pay me a
> token $100 per month, I put them all up for sale on
> www.grassrootsev.com for
> the price of the parts plus $20 per hour for my
> labor, which is about 1/3
> what I make cutting grass.
>
> Steve Clunn
> " God , why are you having me mow all these yards
> instead of converting gas
> cars to electric " " because the world it going to
> hell and I want it to
> look good when it gets there. " " oh "
>
>
>
>
>
> >
>
>
__________________________________
Yahoo! FareChase: Search multiple travel sites in one click.
http://farechase.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I am very happy to have my EV, however, my current set up does not give me
much zip. It takes me a good min or so to get up to 50. Top speed is
55-60.
I'm not ready for this now but sometime in the future I'd like to get more
zip out of my EV. Do I need another engine different batteries or a
combination? I have a new battery pack 16 6 volts. I'm not sure of the
size of the engine that I have but I think it is a prestolite with a curtis
pmc controller.
Is it hard to put another engine in? It seems that there is not much to
take off or put on. The difficulty would be in getting one the right size
for the mounting (or make a new mounting) and it needs to fit the drive
shaft(?) etc...
I'ts such a small car (fiat 850 spider) that when I get a truck or a large
SUV behind me it almost seems that they'll run over me. I can't go fast
enough for them sometimes.
Any ideas.
Thanks,
Carmine in Sacramento
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi anybody or Otmar , I have somebody interested in a 1k 156v controller for
there sparrow , it had the Curtis in it before , would they want the hair
ball with the sparrow option and what is this .... I'll be working with them
on the phone , so I kind of should know .
----- Original Message ----- 11/10/05, Mark Fowler wrote:
What would you think about putting a wiki-based manual on your site?
That way, as bits of information come up about the Zilla you, or we,
could update the relevant page.
I'm thinking that Otmar and Rich must be very busy now , We the users should
be thinking of ways to not bother them with questions and answer as many
questions for them as we can . If there is somebody with a sparrow who has
replaced there controller with a zilla they could answer my question , Otmar
or somebody else will probable read their response and if its right ,they
doesn't have to do anything , and can keep making those controllers. Mark
if you set up the wike based manual , and I set up a web page and 100 others
do the same , and then expect Otmar to go to each one and spend time reading
them , adding to them , this is going to take more of his time .
So when time comes to put that in the FAQ I may need to spend an hour
collecting and phrasing the information so that it is accurate.
Or somebody on the list could do that , and when a question comes up they
could point to it .
That
probably involves starting up the windblows box so I can review comments
in the code and digging up old testing notes. In the end that adds up.
Last time I updated the manual I think I spent a few days work on it.
Yep , more time spent not making controllers or working on your own projects
,
Now I think I'll get back to this big pile of paperwork that needs to be
completed before I can get back to working on the Zillas.
Burn them , just take a match and burn those papers , ,,, or let the dog eat
them ,
Steve clunn
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Seth take a look at: http://www.grassrootsev.com/projects.htm There is a
picture of a home made adapter plate. Although a little rustic, it shows
what can be done with basic tools. Steve may also have a video of building
this.
There are two parts to the adapter: the plate and the shaft coupler.
For the type of metal? For the plate, most use 1/2" aluminum plate (light,
expensive, easy to work with). Some use heavier steel (harder to work with,
heavier but cheaper). For the coupler, it depends on what type of motor
and transmission. It also depends if you are keeping the clutch and or the
flywheel.
What tool to get first? Tougher question. Although I "sense" you want to
purchase a new machine tool (which is half the fun!), a lathe or milling
machine is not really required to make an adapter plate.
Sorry to say, this is somewhat "cart before the horse". It would be better
to hold off getting these big tools until you have your donor car and know
what motor you are putting in the vehicle. Establish the project and design
first, then determine the tools you need to build it.
good luck
Don
Victoria, BC, Canada
See the New Beetle EV Conversion Web Site at
www.cameronsoftware.com/ev/
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Seth Rothenberg
Sent: November 9, 2005 8:40 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: adaptor plate
I've been googling around, and didn't see the answer to this yet.
If I wanted to make my own adaptor plate, is there a likely source for the
scrap metal for it?
Something like an old flywheel?
Fuzzy logic: Since this is the Mother of all Projects (for this year :-), I
might as well grab the chance (excuse), and buy a 3-in-1 machine shop that
my friend sells commercially.
It's a compact machine that has a lathe, bench grinder, and milling machine
if I am not mistaken.
I haven't used these things since high school ;-)
Thanks.
Seth
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Nov 11, 2005, at 5:27 AM, Mark Hanson wrote:
I was curious who's done a dune buggy conversion (with doors/cover)
and how much do they weigh?
Is it easy to find brake etc parts for the old VW undercarraige?
What is the typical conversion recepe? A direct drive 7" or use
tranny with an 8" 72 - 84V?
I built one (no doors or cover.) As an ICE Buggy the weight was 1100
lb., now as an EV it weighs 1420 lb. There is no problem finding brake
parts for Beetles, but I would try to stick the the '58-'64 brakes or
the '68-'79 brakes. These are the most common and easy to get parts for
(there are a number of 1 year and 2 year only parts between those
systems.) I use the stock '64 brakes on mine, with the duel circuit
"universal replacement" VW master cylinder using a Rabbit reservoir,
instead of a single circuit "buggy" (actually '66 down Bus) master
cylinder.
Mine is 120 volts of Optimas, a Curtis 1221B, and a 7.25 inch
Prestolite MTC-4001. Using the transaxle is the only practical way to
use the stock rear suspension. I'm using a clutchless adapter made to
my specs by a local machine shop.
Paul "neon" G.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Something's wrong. In a tiny, light (and I think aerodynamic) car like
that, a 96 volt system won't be a neck snapper, but it should be reasonably
peppy.
How's your range?
First thing to check is how you're driving it. Unlike a gas car, a series
DC motor has peak torque at stall. If you need a lot of acceleration, you
should upshift when you feel the torque go flat. (Be aware that this kind
of acceleration is hard on batteries and motor.)
Also, even though the battery is new, you might have a weak module. Do a
load test on the pack if you have a dummy load. Another way is to jack up
the rear, chock the front wheels REALLY well. Partly set the handbrake,
then run at a constant speed such as 20mph indicated while someone measures
the voltage of each module. Any that are much lower than the others are
suspect.
Check for high resistance in connections by (carefully!) feeling cable ends
and the like after a drive. Any that are bad will get hot.
Also check for mechanical drag. Are your tires inflated to the max pressure
listed on the sidewall? Are the brakes releasing fully? Is the front end
toe set to zero or nearly so? With the power off and the car in neutral,
you should be able to push it with one hand. It should still push easily
even when in gear.
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Couldn't get that link to work, try:
HAL 400 datasheet
<http://www.lem.com/inet/datashee.nsf/6336010B2C9E62DAC1256647003DA224/67863C9DADDD7BA0C125702F00478EA9/$File/HAL%20400-S%20E.pdf>
So its base offset is +/- 1 amp, and a thermal drift of +/- 100mA per
deg C (same as K). Excellent for panel meter, not so great for
monitoring charge through current integration if long time periods are
involved. Actually if turned off when the EV is not being used, not too
bad for charge monitoring. The +/- 1 amp offset can be compensated by a
fixed calibration. Perhaps if calibrated across a temperature range
(microcontroller job) it could be more accurate, but whether the temp
drift profile and base offset remains consistent as it ages is speculation.
That's a sweet deal you got there- that's a pretty expensive pair of
parts you got for $15!
Danny
Eric Poulsen wrote:
Doug, thanks for the info.
The sensor I have is a LEM 400-S/SP8. I'm not sure what the SP8
portion refers to -- might be purely related to mechanical mounting.
The datasheet is for the 400-S series.
These sensors appear to be specifically for AC/DC current measurement
for traction applications (EVs).
+/- 0-400A measurement, +/- 0-4VDC output porportional to current
Isolated
+/- 1000A measurable (though less accurate)
30000A overload
Requires +/-15VDC at 25mA (max)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
How about mounting 20 golfers to the trailer and using it strictly for the
mower dump pack. Dedicate it to the mowers, or as a range extender when needed.
This keeps the truck lighter for when you're not using it for towing mowing.
Stay Charged!
Hump
Original Message -----------------------
batteries to the work truck , going with 40 , already got them , I'll also
be about to use the truck for some long distance trips , and I'm thinking of
setting up a dump charge , split my pack so I'll be dumping 20 golfers into
the 8 orbitals.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Danny Miller wrote:
Couldn't get that link to work, try:
HAL 400 datasheet
<http://www.lem.com/inet/datashee.nsf/6336010B2C9E62DAC1256647003DA224/67863C9DADDD7BA0C125702F00478EA9/$File/HAL%20400-S%20E.pdf>
So its base offset is +/- 1 amp, and a thermal drift of +/- 100mA per
deg C (same as K). Excellent for panel meter, not so great for
monitoring charge through current integration if long time periods are
involved. Actually if turned off when the EV is not being used, not
too bad for charge monitoring. The +/- 1 amp offset can be
compensated by a fixed calibration. Perhaps if calibrated across a
temperature range (microcontroller job) it could be more accurate, but
whether the temp drift profile and base offset remains consistent as
it ages is speculation.
I was more thinking of measuring the 10's and 100's of amps during use
-- something to drive the ampmeter on the dash. +/- 1 amp is nothing in
this sort of application.
That's a sweet deal you got there- that's a pretty expensive pair of
parts you got for $15!
I don't know what the actual list price is. They arrived new and
unused. :-)
Danny
Eric Poulsen wrote:
Doug, thanks for the info.
The sensor I have is a LEM 400-S/SP8. I'm not sure what the SP8
portion refers to -- might be purely related to mechanical mounting.
The datasheet is for the 400-S series.
These sensors appear to be specifically for AC/DC current measurement
for traction applications (EVs).
+/- 0-400A measurement, +/- 0-4VDC output porportional to current
Isolated
+/- 1000A measurable (though less accurate)
30000A overload
Requires +/-15VDC at 25mA (max)
--- End Message ---
