EV Digest 5062
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: I want to build a PWM DC motor controller
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Interpoles was Reversing a Siamese motor
by Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Geo Metro EV on a budget
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Japanese Electric Racer
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Geo Metro EV on a budget
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Fw: Geo Metro EV on a budget
by "torich1" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Matt's 240SX Electric in the top 15!
by "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Geo Metro EV on a budget
by jerry halstead <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: I want to build a PWM DC motor controller
by Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Otmars new home
by Stefan Peters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Modular controller idea (Was: Re: I want to build a PWM DC motor
controller)
by Stefan Peters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) RE: EV Gatherings, was Re: Otmars new home
by M Bianchi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) "This New Car" Radio Show on Sunday
by M Bianchi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Is it bad to spin backwards?
by "Mark Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) 3 Electrics now in Top 15
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Interpoles was Reversing a Siamese motor
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) RE: Matt's 240SX Electric in the top 15!
by "Matthew D. Graham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: I want to build a PWM DC motor controller
by "Stefan T. Peters" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Fw: Geo Metro EV on a budget
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
The other thing that comes to mind is that motor insulation is more
stressed not only as a factor of voltage but also frequency. Actually,
more specifically, high dv/dt rates in frequent transistions.
So if a motor needs 66 volts and you have a 120v pack, the conventional
PWM controller varies between 120V and 0V. A BattPack could in theory
leave 5 batteries connected at all times and switch the 6th one on and
off via PWM. So the insulation only sees voltage vary from 60V to 72V
which is less stressful. However people don't seem to be mentioning
frequent problems with insulation failure so this might not be a
practical issue.
Resistance appears greater with PWM. Say the load requires an average
voltage of half the pack voltage at 50 amps average current and thus we
use a 50% duty cycle. So the batteries put out basically 100 amps half
the time, whereas a single pack would deliver 50 amps all the time.
So consider a 10 milliohms total resistance in some interconnects. In
the PWM case we lose 100 watts (I^2*R) during the "on" period, since
it's a 50% duty, that's 50W average. But delivering the same 50 amps
constant is only 25W average loss. The one caveat here though is that
the losses in additional interconnects, MOSFET rds-on, and diode drops
in the specified BattPack schematic appears far larger than any gains
from reducing the PWM peak-to-peak difference. Relying on those diodes
to bypass 5 batteries would cost around 250W, not even considering
MOSFET rds-on.
Danny
Cor van de Water wrote:
The opposite can also be used:
if your motor cannot withstand more than 170V but you
want to have a high voltage to allow battery sag on the
input of the controller, but your motor should never
see this battery voltage to avoid flashover, then all you
need is to program the controller (Zilla or other) with
the maximum >Average< motor voltage and connect an
inductor in series with a capacitor to the output of the
controller, with the motor across the capacitor.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 1/5/06, Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> One that strikes me as reasonably retrofittable involved adding an extra pair
> of small "pilot" brushes at the leading and trailing edges of a main brush.
> Basically, these are just tiny brushes, touching the commutator bar that is
> just about to reach the main brush. If the brushes are properly positioned,
> the voltage between the pilot brushes should be zero.
In the old motor book I have, it describes a way to set the timing
manually, using a volt-meter connected to the graphite cores of a pair
of pencils, which are then applied to the commutator of the running
motor in the position you mentioned.
> The pilot brushes were connected to a little low-voltage PM motor. This motor
> drove a screw thread to move the main brushholder. If the pilot voltage was
> positive, the little motor ran one way, retarding the brushholder. If the
> pilot voltage is negative, the little motor ran the opposite direction, to
> advance the brushholder. Thus, it automatically positioned the brushholder
> for minimum voltage.
Now that's clever, automating the process :)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
From: "Tom Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
This situation looks hopeless to me. Joe Sixpack doesn't like to pay
$3.00 for gasoline and wants to covert his Metro to an EV for less than
$1000. His advisor lives 500 miles away. Lee Hart is asking the rest
of us what to do.
Parts and know how for a good Metro conversion are available but at
many times $1000.
A beginner not familiar with EVs or the conversion
process can't successfully build an EV with second hand and second rate
parts.
You can get the high end kit from KTA or ElectroAutomotive. God Bless you
if you have the money. That doesn't mean it's not possible to do a budget
EV.
An irony is that if one can't afford $3.00 gasoline, one probably can't
afford
to do a conversion either. In most of the US, gasoline is now much less
than
$3.00 per gallon. I bought a tankful in Silverdale, Washington yesterday
for
$1.959 per gallon.
A year ago before the crisis gas was a dollar a gallon so you just paid
double by my count. Don't forget that building an EV is mostly bolting
things together and keeping the plus from the minus. It's the motors job to
put them together. Lawrence Rhodes..
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Hart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 12:37 PM
Subject: Geo Metro EV on a budget
My family has always tolerated my EVs as a harmless eccentricity. "Fine
for a
nut like him, but I don't want no weirdo car."
Well, the times they are a-changin'. Over Christmas, one of my relatives
said
"I got a dead 1994 Geo Metro in the garage. I'm sick and tired of $3
gasoline
and wars and ICE stuff that breaks that I can't fix. How do I convert it
into
an EV?"
I gave him an outline of what was required, figuring that would scare him
off.
I gave him some websites to look at, prices for the parts, and the amount
of
work it would take to see if he was serious.
He called back today. He looked at the websites, but is a high-school
dropout
and considers anything that smacks of reading as torture. He's your
classic
Joe Sixpack; he doesn't mind spending time on it but wants to keep the
budget
under $1000.
He lives 20 miles from work, and can probably charge there. He asked the
guys
that maintain the forklifts, and they thought it was a great idea;
something
they'd always wanted to try. They gave him a 48v traction motor. He knows
my
first EV was a low-budget special that used a dozen golf cart batteries,
24v
aircraft generator, contactor controller, and homemade charger; so he's
out
to do something like that.
Unfortunately, he lives 500 miles away in southwestern Michigan, so I'll
have
to assist by remote control. Can we come up with the parts and design so
he
(or anyone else for that matter) can throw together a quick-and-simple EV
conversion that a beginner can build and get working?
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That's pretty amazing and ironic, 2 'Zilla' 1k
controls
in a Japanese race car! Keep up the good work Otmar!
Rod
Thanks Rod,
I was pleasantly surprised to see them there. They make me proud!
And yes Jim Husted, I do wish they had ordered one of them with a
reversed cover, it may have looked better. They were bought through a
dealer, but I could give directions for reversing the cover if they
are listening....
--
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com/
The Zilla factory has moved to Corvallis Oregon.
Now accepting resumes. Please see:
http://www.cafeelectric.com/jobs.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
An Altrax 300 amp controller is 500 dollars. Batteries are 700. Adapter
plate is 600. Motor free. DC/DC not needed if you use an 80 dollar Trojan
12v Deep cycle. Meters and wiring lets say 200 dollars. This would make a
low cost low performing but reliable and useable EV. Around 2000 dollars if
you had a free motor. This is realistic on a budget. I'll ask Bill what his
bill was. Minus the 3k he paid for the Glider with 8inch motor of course.
Bill could you respond to the list on the cost of your ev minus the VW with
the motor? Thanks....
Lawrence Rhodes
Bassoon/Contrabassoon
Reedmaker
Book 4/5 doubler
Electric Vehicle & Solar Power Advocate
415-821-3519
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well he could start with the adapter plate here..$145
http://www.e-volks.com/catalog.0.html.0.html
And he can buy the motor here for 179$
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?UID=2005121701433549&item=6-936&catname=electric
I am sure a controller can be had for $300 OR MAYBE A LOT LESS...
Thats $625 add 6 heavy dudy 12 volt batterys for about $360 and you are
almost there with some help from you guys ..sounds possiable to me....$1000
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 12:32 AM
Subject: Re: Geo Metro EV on a budget
Tell him you know a guy that would like to run biodiesel that wants a late
model Mercedes diesel for a $1000.00. Tell him what Father Time always
says: You can sh*t in one hand and wish in the other and see which one
fills up first. OK, I'll lighten up here :-) Tell him if he's really
interested in EVs find out the true cost by going to the EV Classifieds. I
always recommend people start with a used one rather than building. It
usually is less than the cost of the parts. There is a direct link from
www.evalbum.com. Then suggest an alternative like starting small with an
electric bike or scooter for local travel. Full size EVs are not practical
right now for people on limited incomes.
Roderick Wilde
EV Parts, Inc.
www.evparts.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Shay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 3:15 PM
Subject: Re: Geo Metro EV on a budget
This situation looks hopeless to me. Joe Sixpack doesn't like to pay
$3.00 for gasoline and wants to covert his Metro to an EV for less than
$1000. His advisor lives 500 miles away. Lee Hart is asking the rest
of us what to do.
Parts and know how for a good Metro conversion are available but at
many times $1000. A beginner not familiar with EVs or the conversion
process can't successfully build an EV with second hand and second rate
parts.
An irony is that if one can't afford $3.00 gasoline, one probably can't
afford
to do a conversion either. In most of the US, gasoline is now much less
than
$3.00 per gallon. I bought a tankful in Silverdale, Washington yesterday
for
$1.959 per gallon.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lee Hart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 12:37 PM
Subject: Geo Metro EV on a budget
My family has always tolerated my EVs as a harmless eccentricity. "Fine
for a
nut like him, but I don't want no weirdo car."
Well, the times they are a-changin'. Over Christmas, one of my relatives
said
"I got a dead 1994 Geo Metro in the garage. I'm sick and tired of $3
gasoline
and wars and ICE stuff that breaks that I can't fix. How do I convert it
into
an EV?"
I gave him an outline of what was required, figuring that would scare
him off.
I gave him some websites to look at, prices for the parts, and the
amount of
work it would take to see if he was serious.
He called back today. He looked at the websites, but is a high-school
dropout
and considers anything that smacks of reading as torture. He's your
classic
Joe Sixpack; he doesn't mind spending time on it but wants to keep the
budget
under $1000.
He lives 20 miles from work, and can probably charge there. He asked the
guys
that maintain the forklifts, and they thought it was a great idea;
something
they'd always wanted to try. They gave him a 48v traction motor. He
knows my
first EV was a low-budget special that used a dozen golf cart batteries,
24v
aircraft generator, contactor controller, and homemade charger; so he's
out
to do something like that.
Unfortunately, he lives 500 miles away in southwestern Michigan, so I'll
have
to assist by remote control. Can we come up with the parts and design so
he
(or anyone else for that matter) can throw together a quick-and-simple
EV
conversion that a beginner can build and get working?
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--
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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You are right thanks.
keep all the good job, rEVolution still have a chance to come from USA
finaly instead of China, massive people EVinformation is just what we need
:^)
cordialement,
Philippe
Et si le pot d'échappement sortait au centre du volant ?
quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
----- Original Message -----
From: "Cor van de Water" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 10:35 AM
Subject: RE: Matt's 240SX Electric in the top 15!
> Philippe,
>
> I noticed that in the "Top 50" the car is still listed as
> "Datsun 1200"
> Only on the front page is the "Electric" addition.
>
> Cor van de Water
> Systems Architect
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
> Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-501-641-8576
> Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Philippe Borges
> Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 12:47 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: Matt's 240SX Electric in the top 15!
>
>
> Is there a problem ?
>
> The white zombie "Datsun 1200 electric" became "Datsun 1200"
>
> cordialement,
> Philippe
>
> Et si le pot d'échappement sortait au centre du volant ?
> quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
> http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
> Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
> http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 4:49 AM
> Subject: Re: Matt's 240SX Electric in the top 15!
>
>
> > Actually John, when someone gets in the top spot they will still need to
> > keep the votes coming to stay there. The reason the electrics are moving
> up
> > so fast is the rate at which the votes are coming in. The gas cars are
not
> > getting many new votes. Heck, I just asked my friends in Croatia to
start
> > voting as well.
> >
> > Roderick Wilde
> > "Suck Amps EV Racing"
> > www.suckamps.com
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "John Wayland" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: <[email protected]>
> > Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 7:34 PM
> > Subject: Matt's 240SX Electric in the top 15!
> >
> >
> > > Hell to All,
> > >
> > > Matt's car is now in the top 15, currently at #13 to be exact. How
cool
> is
> > > that...two EVs featured in the opening page Top 15 for all to see each
> > > time they check out the most popular vehicles for the month! Maniac
> Mazda
> > > got a late start, but it's already just 50 votes shy of overtaking the
> #15
> > > car. By mid-tomorrow, we'll have three, count 'em, three EVs in the
top
> > > 15!! This has just 'got to' be raising more than a few eyebrows!
> > >
> > > Thanks everyone for continuing to vote. Even after we get one of the
EVs
> > > in the #1 spot, we can't let up and let an EV get nudged out of its
> chance
> > > to be the featured Time Slip car of the month by thinking we've got it
> > > made, relaxing the voting, and having the 2nd place guy come up with
> last
> > > minute votes to slip back past us, so please, continue to vote until
> we've
> > > actually secured the spot.
> > >
> > > See Ya.......John Wayland
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > > Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.13/221 - Release Date:
> 1/4/2006
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this outgoing message.
> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.13/221 - Release Date:
1/4/2006
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.evconvert.com/article/yugo-greg
Greg converted his Yugo for $800. He bought pretty much everything
from Ebay and did his own machining work.
-Jerry
http://www.evconvert.com/
On Jan 6, 2006, at 3:29 AM, torich1 wrote:
Well he could start with the adapter plate here..$145
http://www.e-volks.com/catalog.0.html.0.html
And he can buy the motor here for 179$
http://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?
UID=2005121701433549&item=6-936&catname=electric
I am sure a controller can be had for $300 OR MAYBE A LOT LESS...
Thats $625 add 6 heavy dudy 12 volt batterys for about $360 and
you are almost there with some help from you guys ..sounds
possiable to me....$1000
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 12/29/05, Philippe Borges <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi Philippe,
> Is suppose initial comment was because MC68HC05 is intel 8051 core based
> which is the most used in the industry, followed now by...ATMEL
Actually, HC05 is not based on 8051. It's core is based on the old
6809 processor, in turn descended from the venerable 6800, both of
which were widely used in early home computers. For that reason a lot
of people "know" the architecture and instruction set and find it easy
to use.
For some reason the HC05 has always been a popular choice for simple
motor control applications, probably due to the early availability of
the right features at a low price.
For the hobbyist though, we tend to use what is easy to adapt to a
variety of purposes, has cheap development and programming abilities,
and is available in TH rather than exclusively SMD (the main reason I
have up using motorola stuff). ATMEL it is then :)
Best regards
Evan
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Doug Weathers wrote:
On Jan 5, 2006, at 11:35 AM, Lee Hart wrote:
That's how I feel about this EV list. Without it, we'd be a bunch of
isolated
nuts tinkering in our garages.
And with it, we're a bunch of isolated nuts typing on keyboards? :)
--
Touche... And OUCH!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Doug Weathers wrote:
Stefan,
Thanks for taking the time to answer, and for working on this project
in the first place!
NP, I hope to use it on my EV if it's works well enough.
There might be merit in "policy-based discharge", as in policy-based
routing. For example, you want to discharge the lithiums or floodies
first, unless the current draw is such that they might be damaged, in
which case you want to use the AGMs. Letting the AGMs get drawn down
first means you can't climb hills or pass trucks if you need to, so
you discharge them last.
Oooo, I like that idea. Way to think like a router!
Why charge them in a string? That's what causes all the headaches.
(Am I being ignorant here?)
That is my personal opinion. But I am trying to get this as universally
acceptable without messing up the basic idea.
The most ambitious idea is: install a small 12V isolated switching
regulator/converter on each battery and parallel them together on a
"Aux Power Bus".
There you go, although I don't see why you need the regulators. The
Aux Power Bus is what I was going to suggest, not only for 12V power
for the car while moving, but also for charging the batteries while
stopped. (I would call it the Low Voltage Bus, and the one that the
traction motor is on is called the High Voltage Bus.)
I just didn't want to play hopscotch with the electrons around the
MOSFETs. But if someone with good electronics knowledge thinks it would
work, I would be tempted to give it a try.
Charging is a bit more tricky. There's a beefy line-voltage-to-14.5V
power supply with no brains to speak of, which outputs to the LV bus.
The LV bus will have the same voltage to each battery, so the Power
Module will need to PWM the voltage down to whatever the battery needs
at each part of the charge profile. If the power supply can't provide
the amps required/desired for all the batteries at the same time, just
switch some of them off of the LV bus and charge them later. If a
battery needs more than 14.5V, then I'm not sure what to do.
Hmm... I think you need a bit fancy Power Modules then I'm building.
Mine are ~$40-$70 each: a PIC12F675, an optional set of high-gain Op
Amps, an optional 500A shunt, 4bit octal tri-state line buffer, couple
of caps and resistors, 4 IPS Smart MOSFET switches, 4 600V 35A/200A
power diodes, and a Sharp high-speed optoisolator. That's about it.
OK then, how about regen? I'm not at all clear on how it would work
with the Power Modules, so I don't have a suggestion there.
Tricky one. I would say that's currently over my head as well.
However, you could add a Power Module or two whose job was to switch a
resistor into the HV bus instead of a battery. This would provide a
way to dissipate braking energy if the batteries are full, or if regen
is not practical.
That would be a matter of the Subnet Switch. Just add another string
with just a bunch of carbons, and you have non-regenerative braking :)
As Danny said, not necessarily. If the system only looks at voltage
to determine SoC, it will happily discharge old batteries with only
half their capacity as quickly as it discharges brand new batteries.
The good news is, who cares? No worries about damaging a battery.
Just switch it out when it's done and stop using it, and continue
driving on the rest of the pack.
That's my thought. Who cares? Use 'em when you got 'em seems to be the
philosophy of the algorithm. When the battery is low, it will stop using
it automagically. You could add historical SOC calcs to the Power Module
(it has on-board EEPROM), which would weigh the rating it reports to the
Speed Controller, if you wanted to wear the whole pack down gradually.
Me, I'd just rather replace the individual battery when told to by the
Speed Controller. It's safe to do that with this setup, it's one of it's
strengths I'd say. Kinda spreads the cost of a pack replacement over
time. Plus you know you are using the batteries their full lifespan
(which of course are different from battery to battery).
Thanks for the encouragement and suggestions!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Thu, January 5, 2006 1:35 pm, Lee Hart said:
> At some point, I hope we can start having an EV "convention", where
> ordinary people can get together. Something like the EAA
> (Experimental Aircraft Association) "fly in" in Oshkosh WI every year,
> where home aircraft builders get together to show off, trade parts,
> run training seminars, etc.
There is no need to begin from a standing start.
There are several existing events where it would be easy to establish a "birds
of a feather" sub-event. The Tour de Sol comes to mind, and I see the EAA
Chapters Conference and High Voltage Nationals mentioned. The trick is to get
someone to say "I'm going to do it!", contact the event organizers and get
started.
Tour de Sol
Northeast Sustainable Energy Association
413 774-6051
The advantages of starting with an existing event should be obvious, and having
smaller several regional events increase the likelihood for success, IMHO.
For example the Tour de Sol offers an Autocross that is a fine test of driver
AND machine and is always popular. Last year we had talks on hybrids and
coming technology. I am certain talks on "How I built my own" and "We supply
parts and plans" would be welcomed. (The talks are usually available ad-hoc
next to the car, but it takes a bit of forethought to plan a formal, time
limited, focused presentation. "How I did it" handouts are also very useful.)
Get a few speakers on technical topics (get Mike Brown and Shari Prange if you
can) some parts suppliers with display, and some finished projects offering
Ride-n-Drives should attract the doers and the wannabes.
Repeating the exercise every year is how it builds to a national event.
--
Mike Bianchi
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Posted for Steve D'Agostino
*This New Car***
*Promoting clean, mean driving machines***
*Hybrids: What are they? And are they all they're cracked up to be?*
Starting January 8 at 10 p.m. (Eastern), WICN/90.5 FM in Worcester, MA, the
NPR affiliate serving Central New England, presents *"This New Car: Clean, Mean
Driving Machines,"* a 13-week special edition of */The Business Beat/.* "This
New Car" is a roundtable discussion on hybrid and alternative-fuel vehicles and
is sponsored exclusively by Westboro Toyota <http://www.westborotoyota.com> on
Route 9 in Westboro, MA. To hear a 4-minute, MP3-format audio clip of the
January 8 show, "Pros and cons of hybrid vehicles," *CLICK HERE*.
<http://www.BestRateOfClimb/TNC.htm>
*Steve D'Agostino*, host of /The Business Beat/ on WICN since 1995 and
principal of Best Rate Of Climb <http://www.bestrateofclimb.com> in Worcester,
MA, moderates an expert panel featuring:
* *Jim Dunn* of the NASA Center for Technology Commercialization
<http://www.CTC.org> in Westboro, MA.
* *Gilles Labelle* of Westboro Toyota's Hybrid Center of
Massachusetts <http://www.hybridcenterma.com> in Westboro, MA.
* *Craig Van Batenburg* of the Automotive Career Development Center
<http://www.auto-careers.org> in Worcester, MA.
To learn more about Jim, Gilles and Craig, *CLICK HERE*.
<http://www.WICN.org/programs/thisnewcar.htm>
As /Business Week/ reported last May, fuel-efficient hybrid engines are about
to join moon roofs and side air bags on the list of options for buyers of Camry
sedans. Toyota announced last May that it will spend $10 million outfitting
its plant in Georgetown, Kentucky, to make gas-electric versions of the Camry,
America's best-selling car for the past three years. Japan's top carmaker
planned to start churning out the first of 48,000 hybrid Camry models a year by
late 2006. It will be the first hybrid made in the U.S. by a Japanese auto
manufacturer.
Prius, Toyota's most popular hybrid, is made in Japan. Toyota began selling
its Prius in North America in 2000 and the car is now the best-selling hybrid
in the U.S. By the end of last November, Toyota had sold 99,000 Prius cars in
2005 in the U.S., more than double the 47,700 sold over the same period in 2004
in this country. Some analysts predict that U.S. sales of hybrids will double
to 200,000 in 2006 and grow to 500,000 a year by 2010.
/The Wall Street Journal/ reported this week that while domestic automakers
project a flat year for 2006, Toyota predicts growth in the U.S. auto market.
Toyota expects to increase U.S. sales by 5% in 2006 on top of a 10% increase
for 2005. Toyota's U.S. market share was 13.7% in December 2005 compared with
12.2% in December 2004. Toyota is preparing to open more North American
factories as it shoots for a 15% share of the U.S. market. * Coming up on
"This New Car:"*
* *January 15:* Pros and cons of alternative-fuel vehicles
* *January 22:* Pros and cons of hydrogen-combustion vehicles
* *January 29:* Pros and cons of fuel-cell vehicles
* *February 5:* Pros and cons of electric and plug-in vehicles
* *February 12:* New-technology vehicles
* *February 19:* What makes a hybrid a hybrid?
* *February 26:* Saving fuel with computers
* *March 5: *Can Detroit be hybrid-ized?
* *March 12:* What is a "green" vehicle and do average consumers
really care?
* *March 19:* Can "green" vehicles save the planet?
* *March 26:* Are the state and federal governments doing enough to
promote and support "green" vehicles?
* *April 2:* Does everyone need to own a vehicle?
To hear last month's /Business Beat/ shows, in MP3 format, hit this link, _WICN
Archive_ <http://www.wicn.org/programs/archive.htm>, and scroll down to the
/Business Beat/ section. You can load the audio on iPods or other portable MP3
players. You can open MP3 podcasts with iTunes <http://www.apple.com/itunes/>,
Musicmatch Jukebox <http://www.musicmatch.com>, Real Player
<http://www.real.com>, WinAmp <http://www.winamp.com> and Windows Media Player
<http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/mp10/>.
Steven Jones-D'Agostino
Principal
Best Rate Of Climb
508.791.0459 office
508.930.8675 cell
508.757.2566 fax
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.BestRateOfClimb.com
--
Mike Bianchi
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The Warfield guy here who runs the motor shop said I would burn up brushes
if I ran backwards (pushing up on the brushes). The brushes are angled for
a clockwise direction he told me and forward motion should be in the
downward angled direction of the brushes he said. (This was also the guy
who said the motor will "Splode" at 2X voltage). Anyway the machine shop is
having fits & caniptions going off the geared end but I don't want to
constantly be replacing brushes or damage the commutator though. Do you
know anone who consistently runs a motor in reverse and hasn't any problems?
Thanks, Mark
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Husted" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 9:52 PM
Subject: Re: Is it bad to spin backwards?
> Hey Mark
>
> Angled brushes are used by a veriety of manufatuerers. GE and
Prestolite are the two most noted. They angle the attack to increase the
footprint of the brush without having to pay for a larger brush. Now I
don't know whether there is any differance with being over-volted, but if it
has 4 terminals it is designed to run in both directions. As far as the
bevel do you mean the curve on the brush where it hits the comm? If so, yes
having as much of the brush touching the comm is what you want and is why it
has that curve. I believe you will have no issue running the motor the
direction you require.
> Hope this helps
> Cya
> Jim Husted
> Hi-Torque Electric
>
> Mark Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi, it's me again. I'm getting my motor shaft machined to adapt with a
slip yoke drive shaft to the differential for direct drive on a Cushman. The
shaft end they have to attach to will make the motor spin in reverse or
pushing the brushes up. The other motor end has a beveled gear on it which
the machine shop said they couldn't attach to. The desired direction I was
told by Warfield was to go in the pointed downward direction of the brushes.
I thought my Cummuta-Car spun in reverse, but can't remember now and I think
Hondas do also.
>
> Are the brushes on a DC series wound motor beveled to increase surface
area or for direction? Any motor guru's know or had experience with
operating long term in reverse?
> Is there an easy way to reverse the brush assembly if I need to?
>
> Thanks, Mark
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
What a treat to wake up to this morning. The "Maniac Mazda" just became
number 15. There are now 3 electrics in the top 15. This is an amazing
accomplishment for "a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens" of the
EV community. The quoted part is from a quote of Margaret Mead's hanging on
my wall by my computer.
Roderick Wilde
"Suck Amps EV Racing"
www.suckamps.com
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.14/222 - Release Date: 1/5/2006
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Fri, 6 Jan 2006 10:02:59 +0000, Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>On 1/5/06, Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> One that strikes me as reasonably retrofittable involved adding an extra pair
>> of small "pilot" brushes at the leading and trailing edges of a main brush.
>> Basically, these are just tiny brushes, touching the commutator bar that is
>> just about to reach the main brush. If the brushes are properly positioned,
>> the voltage between the pilot brushes should be zero.
>
>In the old motor book I have, it describes a way to set the timing
>manually, using a volt-meter connected to the graphite cores of a pair
>of pencils, which are then applied to the commutator of the running
>motor in the position you mentioned.
My old WWII era Coyne Electrical encyclopedia shows a photo or two of
very large motors with "commutation brushes" that function like this.
There is a meter mounted on the brush stand that indicates zero volts
between the main brush and commutation brush.
>
>> The pilot brushes were connected to a little low-voltage PM motor. This motor
>> drove a screw thread to move the main brushholder. If the pilot voltage was
>> positive, the little motor ran one way, retarding the brushholder. If the
>> pilot voltage is negative, the little motor ran the opposite direction, to
>> advance the brushholder. Thus, it automatically positioned the brushholder
>> for minimum voltage.
>
>Now that's clever, automating the process :)
I think this would be more complex than it looks. The zero point will
move with the brushes so there is a high potential for instability.
The mechanism would have to be very fast to catch the sparking early.
I could see a simpler system potentially working fairly well. This
system would measure the DC current and use a lookup table of current
vs brush position. Perhaps even include a feedforward element from
the throttle pot that would get the brushes moving before the current
actually peaked.
Personally, I'd rather put my efforts into fitting an interpole, even
a small one. Fully automatic and no moving parts or electronics.
John
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.-Ralph Waldo Emerson
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Everybody,
Thanks for all the support and the votes for our EVs at dragtimes.com! For
personal reasons, I was thrilled to be able to post a respectable record
there after my run last month. Thanks to John, though, for recognizing the
potential of that website for raising public awareness of the current state
of high performance EVs.
I had noticed the behavior with the "Electric" not showing on some of the
pages. In particular, the Car Type field was being displayed on the Top 15,
New Additions and the individual pages, but not on the Top 100. After
enduring much of John Wayland's good-spirited hand waving and frustration in
Oregon for not boldly stating "Electric" on my dragtimes record, I assured
him that I did, in fact, already do that!
Well, all of John's gesturing at the Dairy Queen (please don't take me back
there, guys!) wasn't for naught. I emailed the site owner, Brooks, and he's
on the job of updating the Top 100 list to include the car type field. It
also turns out that Brooks is a local guy, right down here in Pembroke
Pines, FL. I told him we'd love to see him at Battery Beach Burnout, so
we'll see if he makes it out there. Lowell Simmons and I are hoping to get
some extra track time before the big race, so we might be out there next
weekend as well.
Matt Graham
300V "Joule Injected" Nissan
http://www.jouleinjected.com
Hobe Sound, FL
-----Original Message-----
From: Cor van de Water [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 4:35 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Matt's 240SX Electric in the top 15!
Philippe,
I noticed that in the "Top 50" the car is still listed as "Datsun 1200"
Only on the front page is the "Electric" addition.
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-501-641-8576
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Philippe Borges
Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 12:47 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Matt's 240SX Electric in the top 15!
Is there a problem ?
The white zombie "Datsun 1200 electric" became "Datsun 1200"
cordialement,
Philippe
Et si le pot d'échappement sortait au centre du volant ?
quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
----- Original Message -----
From: "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 4:49 AM
Subject: Re: Matt's 240SX Electric in the top 15!
> Actually John, when someone gets in the top spot they will still need to
> keep the votes coming to stay there. The reason the electrics are moving
up
> so fast is the rate at which the votes are coming in. The gas cars are not
> getting many new votes. Heck, I just asked my friends in Croatia to start
> voting as well.
>
> Roderick Wilde
> "Suck Amps EV Racing"
> www.suckamps.com
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "John Wayland" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 7:34 PM
> Subject: Matt's 240SX Electric in the top 15!
>
>
> > Hell to All,
> >
> > Matt's car is now in the top 15, currently at #13 to be exact. How cool
is
> > that...two EVs featured in the opening page Top 15 for all to see each
> > time they check out the most popular vehicles for the month! Maniac
Mazda
> > got a late start, but it's already just 50 votes shy of overtaking the
#15
> > car. By mid-tomorrow, we'll have three, count 'em, three EVs in the top
> > 15!! This has just 'got to' be raising more than a few eyebrows!
> >
> > Thanks everyone for continuing to vote. Even after we get one of the EVs
> > in the #1 spot, we can't let up and let an EV get nudged out of its
chance
> > to be the featured Time Slip car of the month by thinking we've got it
> > made, relaxing the voting, and having the 2nd place guy come up with
last
> > minute votes to slip back past us, so please, continue to vote until
we've
> > actually secured the spot.
> >
> > See Ya.......John Wayland
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.13/221 - Release Date:
1/4/2006
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.13/221 - Release Date: 1/4/2006
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Cor van de Water wrote:
Formula to determine Delta V on a capacitor: I x t = V x C
(Current times Time equals Voltage times Capacitance)
An example:
I = 100A
t = 50 us (0.00005 s = 5 x 10^-5)
Now if we want to keep the voltage-swing on the capacitor under 10V
how large a capacitor do we need? (Ignore series resistance for now)
Enter the known values in the formula we get:
100 x 5 x 10^-5 = 10 x C
5 x 10^-3 = 10 x C
5 x 10^-4 = C
C = 500 uF.
That makes 500A at 1 hundredth of a second = 0.5F. I can get a hold of
those fine, then my question is back to the original one: How much would
it help to decrease the spurious load on the bats, and hopefully
increase the life?
If you go to the low frequencies you suggest, the capacitors become
extremely bulky to supply so much current for that "long" and also
you will have very annoying hums and whistles in audible frequencies.
That is the reason Otmar chose the TV line flyback frequency: it is
so often around us that most people have a hearing "notch" at this
frequency, in addition to it being almost above the audible band
of frequencies. No whines and whistles.
Is it just the motor that is "singing"? BTW, that TV flyback frequency
has always bugged the bejeezus out of me. That supersonic whistling that
TVs make whenever they are on, right? I bought an LCD monitor & TV as
soon as I could because of that...
The suggested rate of the PAM is 100 - 1000Hz. I know the 1000Hz would
be quite an annoying hum. Do you think the lower frequency would be a
better starting point? Most people working in large building have
10-100Hz vibrations around them constantly. That doesn't seem to bug
very many.
--
Stefan T. Peters
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill & Nancy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, January 06, 2006 10:01 AM
Subject: Re: Geo Metro EV on a budget
Built variac charger with new 20 amp variac, about $150. (replaced
recently with a zivan ng-1charger), battery pack, 12 us 125's approx.
$800, 450 amp alltrax controller, $500 (from Cloud Electric) used dc to dc
converter $125, 25 foot of welding cable (for front batteries) approx. $75
and probably a couple hundred in misc. The vw was already set up with
battery boxes, fuses, contactor and circuit breaker. I still need to
install battery hold downs. (to be done soon)
Bill
Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
An Altrax 300 amp controller is 500 dollars. Batteries are 700. Adapter
plate is 600. Motor free. DC/DC not needed if you use an 80 dollar
Trojan 12v Deep cycle. Meters and wiring lets say 200 dollars. This
would make a low cost low performing but reliable and useable EV. Around
2000 dollars if you had a free motor. This is realistic on a budget.
I'll ask Bill what his bill was. Minus the 3k he paid for the Glider
with 8inch motor of course. Bill could you respond to the list on the
cost of your ev minus the VW with the motor? Thanks....
Lawrence Rhodes
Bassoon/Contrabassoon
Reedmaker
Book 4/5 doubler
Electric Vehicle & Solar Power Advocate
415-821-3519
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
