EV Digest 5111
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: 12volt alternator or dc-dc convertor
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) re: 10hp clark Industrial truck motor 36-48 volt dc NOS Item number:
7581988119
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: 12volt alternator or dc-dc convertor
by mike golub <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: 12volt alternator or dc-dc convertor
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) AVCON schematics?
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: AVCON schematics?
by Ricky Suiter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) RE: 12volt alternator or dc-dc convertor
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) 30 min on 30min off charging
by mike golub <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Power Electronics Handbook
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: chevy astro conversion?
by lee parrish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Volksrabbit issues
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Evcort break upgrade
by Nick Austin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Evcort break upgrade
by "Paul Compton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: chevy astro conversion?Re: chevy astro conversion?
by "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Power Electronics Handbook
by Martin Klingensmith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Paralleling and Serialing Controllers
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) re: 10hp clark Industrial truck motor
by "M.G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: 30 min on 30min off charging
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) RE: 12volt alternator or dc-dc convertor
by "Bill Dennis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: 12volt alternator or dc-dc convertor
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: 12volt alternator or dc-dc convertor
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
22) 1978 Other Makes GM Item number: 4606547406
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
23) RE: Another NiCd run in my Sparrow
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: 2 motors & 2 controllers?(Re: Paralleling and Serialing)
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: chevy astro conversion?
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Contrabassoon & Electric vehicles. TV news story.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: 30 min on 30min off charging
by Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: Another NiCd run in my Sparrow
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
At 08:54 PM 20/01/06 -0800, Mike Golub wrote:
Which would draw more power from the batteries:
1- running a dc-dc converter
2- running the alternator off the tail shaft of 9" WarP motor
..small enough to fit directly on the tailshaft?
Hi Mike
The DC/DC is less power (more efficient).
Alternators need to rev up to deliver power, on an ICE they are typically
1.2x to 2.5x crank RPM.
Use an alternator if you want cheap, use a DC/DC if you want efficient and
keeping the voltage up at each stop.
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Darin
I'm sorry I thought I had replied to this. This will make a good smaller EV
drive motor. The biggest problem will be converting the shaft. I've replaced
those shafts with an ADC shaft after mod'ing it to fit. This is a series wound
motor and although it is smaller in diameter than the ADC8 it is longer and is
just shy of the 8's mass. It is wound with thicker wire to have the lower
voltage rating and draws higher current than the ADC8. If you can get past the
shaft issues it should push you to decent speeds. The other motor I replaced
the shaft for went into a rabbit and he said he got 60 MPH at 120 volt as I
remember.
Hope this helps
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
Darin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi all-
Newbie de-lurks again, continuing to climb the learning curve...
Can anyone tell me whether the motor(s) linked below would be suitable
for a budget Geo Metro conversion? I assumed so since one was mentioned
here on the list this week. (Then I decided I shouldn't assume anything
at this point in my EV education.) FYI I'm looking to build a
NEV/LSV-type vehicle.
Also, neither listing says what type it is (e.g. permanent magnet,
series, etc.) - any ideas?
thanks,
Darin
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7581988119
and /or
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7582716724
> On E-Bay. Starting at $100.
>
> Clark Industrial truck motor
> Never used
> part number 3/02 MLU4001 2751228
> 10 horse power
> 36/48 volt dc
> 200 amp
>
> It has the internal spline.
>
> Steve
>
>
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Photos
Got holiday prints? See all the ways to get quality prints in your hands ASAP.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
OK, but why do I need to charge my accessory battery
(w/ a DC-DC convertor) when I'm waiting for a traffic
light?
--- James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At 08:54 PM 20/01/06 -0800, Mike Golub wrote:
> >Which would draw more power from the batteries:
> >
> >1- running a dc-dc converter
> >2- running the alternator off the tail shaft of 9"
> WarP motor
> >
> >..small enough to fit directly on the tailshaft?
>
> Hi Mike
>
> The DC/DC is less power (more efficient).
>
> Alternators need to rev up to deliver power, on an
> ICE they are typically
> 1.2x to 2.5x crank RPM.
>
> Use an alternator if you want cheap, use a DC/DC if
> you want efficient and
> keeping the voltage up at each stop.
>
> James
>
>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello to All,
mike golub wrote:
OK, but why do I need to charge my accessory battery
(w/ a DC-DC convertor) when I'm waiting for a traffic
light?
So your headlights don't drop by as much as 3 volts (from 14.5V down to
a sagged 12V battery at 11.5V) and go yellow and dull, so your wipers
won't slow down and chatter as they struggle to sweep your windshield
free of water and or snow, so your heater-defroster blower won't slow
down and can continue to circulate ample amounts of air, so your
electric element rear window defogger will keep the window heated
properly, so the turn signals can continue to snap on and off smartly,
etc., etc.
Regular gas cars with alternators already suffer from this effect,
though not as severely because unlike an electric motor that stops
turning when the vehicle stops moving, the gas car's infernal combustion
engine has to idle (and waste fuel while it continues to pollute the
air), and so keeps the alternator spinning. Still, with the ICE spinning
slowly at idle, the now slower revving alternator can't keep the system
at 14.5V anymore, and as the system sags to 13.2V or so, the lights
still dim down, and the wipers still slow down, etc., etc.
With an EV, you can have a superior 12V system by using a DC-DC
converter that is unaffected by motor rpm and always keeps the lights
bright, the wipers moving swiftly, the air movement constant.....or, you
can use the alternator off the rear shaft of the electric motor and have
a miserable 12V system that uses more power and provides an up and down
12V system that's inferior to the already poor system of a gas car :-(
For me, any chance to make an EV out-perform a gas car, is always the
way to go.
See Ya.......John Wayland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Has anyone the schematics (or specs) of how an AVCON
charger port is connected and what the order of the
voltages and communication is to get juice once a
car is plugged in?
THanks,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If you order a vehicle inlet ask for the one with the pilot emulator built in.
This is the one with the 10 foot cord. The only wires that come out of this are
red, black and green.... hot hot and ground. This makes things very easy. I
hooked a 14-50 outlet to the end of mine so I have an adapter for now until I
can figure out where to put the inlet on my car.
Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Has anyone the schematics (or specs) of how an AVCON
charger port is connected and what the order of the
voltages and communication is to get juice once a
car is plugged in?
THanks,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
Later,
Ricky
02 Insight
92 Saturn SC2 EV 144 Volt
Glendale, AZ USA
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Photos
Got holiday prints? See all the ways to get quality prints in your hands ASAP.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mike,
Think of this:
You drive somewhere at night, cold and wet outside so you
not only have the headlights going but also the defogging,
wipers and what-not.
Then you find yourself stuck in a queue waiting for a
traffic light, and another one and again, then the railway
crossing closes in your face.
Before it re-opens you slowly see your headlights getting
dimmer and dimmer, the wipers stop mid-window and you see
the traffic light after the railway turning red again....
You want to get stuck on a railroad crossing (or any other
roadway crossing) because you were too cheap to install a
DC/DC converter and your 12V battery died?
Look at what Toyota did with the Prius. They could have
installed an alternator - the engine normally does not
shut off for more than a few minutes.
Why then did they add a 100A 12V inverter to the motor
controller? Guess?
Success with your conversion,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of mike golub
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 10:11 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: 12volt alternator or dc-dc convertor
OK, but why do I need to charge my accessory battery
(w/ a DC-DC convertor) when I'm waiting for a traffic
light?
--- James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At 08:54 PM 20/01/06 -0800, Mike Golub wrote:
> >Which would draw more power from the batteries:
> >
> >1- running a dc-dc converter
> >2- running the alternator off the tail shaft of 9"
> WarP motor
> >
> >..small enough to fit directly on the tailshaft?
>
> Hi Mike
>
> The DC/DC is less power (more efficient).
>
> Alternators need to rev up to deliver power, on an
> ICE they are typically
> 1.2x to 2.5x crank RPM.
>
> Use an alternator if you want cheap, use a DC/DC if
> you want efficient and
> keeping the voltage up at each stop.
>
> James
>
>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello again,
All the parking spaces at the University of Alaska
Fairbanks have an 120 volt AC outlet.
However, there's a catch. It is setup with a 30 minute
on, and a 30 minute off cycle.
1- Is this a problem with some of the chargers?
On Fort Wainwright, and Eielson AFB they have outlets
as well and they just stay on.
2- The boxes that have a two 2-gang outlets...is there
a way to figure out if there's both a black wire going
to one, and red to the other (without opening the box)
so I could get 220volts by using both outlets?
Thanks in advance!
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Those of you with broadband, a subscription to GigaNews and/or a lot
of patience might want to take a look at
alt.binaries.e-book.technical. There are a ton of good books
currently available. Of particular interest to this group is "Power
Electronics Handbook", Editor-in-Chief - MUHAMMAD H. RASHID.
This almost 900 page tome covers all aspects of power electronics. Of
particular interest is the design of both AC and DC motor controllers
with an emphasis on Spice modeling. The math gets pretty heavy at
times but the book is still readable even if your calculus skills
aren't up there. About a 40mb download.
This is a fairly new post, in the last week, so it might be on servers
other than Giganews, even those with short retention times.
I've spent several hours on this book tonight and can see that many
more will be required!
John
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.-Ralph Waldo Emerson
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks to Mike and Danny for their responses!
You got me thinking outside the box now...as gas is
still gas is still smog, etc...
I reckon in the time it takes us to complete the
conversion, i can do a little leg work and see if i
can't create some kind of EV support group here on the
island. It seems there would be enough interested
people scattered about that if we all installed 240v
plugs, then no one would have to be too concerned
about range. The grid is already in place, why not
use it? I envision something like (here's the plug,
leave a few bucks in the jar, have a great day!)...and
while we're waiting on the charge we can sit around an
talk EVgeek with each other and work on our rigs.
:o))
mahalo for the inspiration...Lee
> > Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 20:15:43 -0800 (PST)
> From: mike golub <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: chevy astro conversion?
> To: [email protected]
>
> genset examples:
>
> http://www.grassrootsev.com/hybrids.htm
>
> You need to do the math on the solar panels. They
> aren't worth installing on the vehicle.
>
> --- lee parrish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 22:34:38 -0600
> From: Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: chevy astro conversion?
>
> The question is more of whether this is productive.
> It's using gasoline
> again and if it doesn't do it as efficiently and
> cleanly as the original
> engine then one must ask what was the point. Even
> the best 4 strokes-
> and the Honda EU series is the best- have no
> computerized emission
> controls and no catalytic converter, making them far
> dirtier than a car
> engine per hp-hr.
>
> I know the idea is that the EV can still spend most
> of its time running
> of a charge that came from grid power and the
> gasoline is only there to
> make the EV handle these rare instances making the
> overall EV idea more
> viable. I'm not sure if I see it though. It won't
> allow you to make
> long trips anyways since a generator would need to
> be extremely large to
> keep a vehicle on the highway continuously. It's
> only for a scenario
> where you'd do short legs with extended resting
> periods with no grid
> power available.
>
> A generator running a charger has a lot of issues.
> One, the generator
> must have substantial margins as far as I understand
> due to power factor
> issues. Second unless you have a programmable
> charger then the charger
> can't be configured to take the max power the
> generator is capable of.
>
> So me bringing up these problems does lead
> somewhere. I was thinking
> about an inverter generator like the EU2000i, it's a
> plastic case,
> electrically isolated, and has a modified sine wave
> output- basically a
> square wave with a bit of dead time as far as I
> know. In this case it
> would seem a FAR better idea to simply rectify the
> output back into a DC
> rail (or take apart the generator and tap the
> original DC rail) and just
> run it as a nonisolated buck/boost DC/DC converter.
> The generator
> should be isolated itself so there wouldn't be a
> need to isolate the
> converter. This would not only bring the power
> factor back to 1 but the
> current draw becomes constant. A BB is more
> efficient and these types
> of inductors are relatively cheap to build. Such a
> charger designed
> specifically for this type of generator could be
> made to tweak the
> current so it could maximize the possible draw off
> the generator without
> overloading it.
>
> Danny
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 17 Jan 2006 at 0:40, Paul G. wrote:
> Most of the
> older Rabbit books refer to some early Rabbits not having a motor mount
> (I have yet to see a Rabbit without one - except my conversion.)
Some 1975 Rabbits did not have a front engine mount. I believe the dealers
had a retrofit for those cars, but I might be remembering incorrectly. In
any case you're pretty unlikely to find any of those cars still on the road
over 30 years later. In a way that's too bad; they were much smaller and
lighter than the later Rabbits and Golfs (Golves? ;-). I think my '76
weighed around 1800 lb.
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Want to unsubscribe, stop the EV list mail while you're on vacation,
or switch to digest mode? See how: http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not reach me.
To send a private message, please use evadm at drmm period net.
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello,
Does anybody know if a 4 caliper brake upgrade, or a rear drum to disc
conversion kit is available for a 1993 Evcort?
This car was originally a 1993 Ford Escort hatchback.
Thanks!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Does anybody know if a 4 caliper brake upgrade, or a rear drum to disc
conversion kit is available for a 1993 Evcort?
Why would you want one? If you're after more braking torque on the rear
wheels then this is the wrong way to go, only if you're experiencing
overheating brakes at the rear does the disk conversion make sense. There's
a bolt on vented disk/caliper solution at the front, Madman has them on his
Fiesta.
Paul Compton
www.sciroccoev.co.uk
www.morini-mania.co.uk
www.compton.vispa.com/the_named
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ok so it's definitely not a low speed conversion.
Over 35mph, air resistance will make your car consume a lot's of energy so
you have to carry arround twice more batteries to achieve same range at
"little" higher speed.
cordialement,
Philippe
Et si le pot d'échappement sortait au centre du volant ?
quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
----- Original Message -----
From: "lee parrish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2006 3:11 AM
Subject: Re: chevy astro conversion?Re: chevy astro conversion?
> Thanks for the reminder Philippe....
>
> To answer you question, the minimum speed on this
> stretch is 40mph, with a max of 55mph.
>
> I meant to mention that.
>
> I have seen slow moving vehicles on the road here, and
> have been one myself. The "Spirit of Aloha"
> necessitates pulling off to the side if a line forms
> behind you, to let the line pass, otherwise driving
> the minimum speed is not problem.
>
> -Lee
>
>
> You can go far on a flat road at low speed
> inexpensively on lead acid
> batteries, what is the required speed ?
>
> cordialement,
> Philippe
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It's not on my news server :-(
If you want to send it to me, perhaps we could start a torrent or I could
just mirror it on one of my servers?
On 1/21/06, Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Those of you with broadband, a subscription to GigaNews and/or a lot
> of patience might want to take a look at
> alt.binaries.e-book.technical. There are a ton of good books
> currently available. Of particular interest to this group is "Power
> Electronics Handbook", Editor-in-Chief - MUHAMMAD H. RASHID.
>
> This almost 900 page tome covers all aspects of power electronics. Of
> particular interest is the design of both AC and DC motor controllers
> with an emphasis on Spice modeling. The math gets pretty heavy at
> times but the book is still readable even if your calculus skills
> aren't up there. About a 40mb download.
>
> This is a fairly new post, in the last week, so it might be on servers
> other than Giganews, even those with short retention times.
>
> I've spent several hours on this book tonight and can see that many
> more will be required!
>
> John
> ---
> John De Armond
> See my website for my current email address
> http://www.johngsbbq.com
> Cleveland, Occupied TN
> A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.-Ralph Waldo
> Emerson
>
>
--
Martin Klingensmith
wwia.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ok I see what you're trying to do, but it won't work.
When put a capacitor across a switch it can prevent the switch from arcing
by providing a temporary short circuit around the switch. As the
capacitor charges up the voltage across the switch gradually increases
until it reaches the open circuit voltage.
This gives the switch enough time to open before it sees full voltage.
Ignoring the cost of purchasing enough low ESR capacitors to do what you
want without 'sploding, let's look at the problems.
The goal is to keep the voltage across the controller from rising above
the FET's save working voltage. This means that it has to be big enough
to bypass current aroung the FET until the FET closes again, right? But
the purpose of the FET opening is to STOP current from flowing (from the
batteries into the motor), and our capacitor is defeating this.
So instead of having the motor see:
120v / 0v / 120v / 0v
it sees:
120v / 80v / 120v / 80v
See the problem?
Plus there is another problem besides not having any speed besides full
throttle, what happens when you want to stop?
The FET opens and STAYS open. The Capacitor charges up until the FET sees
full pack voltage and goes BANG (actually it probably goes bang sometime
before full voltage).
Nice try, but no cigar.
Keep it up though, some of the best inventions started out as wild ideas.
> Something I would like to visit in more detail is the capacitor
> thing.
>
> I see how if you have two switches in series, and have one open and
> one closed, just one of the switches sees all the voltage. If the
> switch isn't rated for all that voltage, bang or smoke or something
> bad.
>
> What if each switch has a large capacitor across it? It seems the
> capacitor would work hard to keep the voltage the same, so the switch
> would not suddenly see full voltage. If you are switching fast
> enough, and your capacitor time constant is slow enough, might you
> then get away with two switches (i.e. controllers) in series?
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I think this is a pump motor. Notice only two wire connections. Be sure
the rotation is correct for your transmission.
Mike G.
At 09:53 PM 20/01/06 -0500, Darin wrote:
Can anyone tell me whether the motor(s) linked below would be
suitable for a budget Geo Metro
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7581988119
and /or
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7582716724
Hi Darin
The first one is listed capable of 200A, the second of 500A, so the
second would be better. both of them would need work to get it to the
stage of being ready to install. Being internal splined motors, there
is no shaft sticking out. Best way around this it to have a new drive
end plate made that places a new bearing where the fan sat. The motor
would need an external blower (advisable to have one even if the fan
stays in). By making the new end plate from a big enough piece of
plate, the plate becomes the adaptor to the bell housing as well.
Holes are needed through the plate to behind the flywheel to let the
blower air out.
All these preparations take time, so pick up one of these motors, and
get a gearbox from your choice of vehicle, and spend the next 12
months getting the modifications made, collecting things like DC/DC
converter when one turns up and learning the things needed to do the
conversion.
As long as you are going for a small car, either would do a budget
vehicle.
But advice is only worth what you pay. Ask Jim Husted to be sure.
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Hello again,
> All the parking spaces at the University of Alaska
> Fairbanks have an 120 volt AC outlet.
>
> However, there's a catch. It is setup with a 30 minute
> on, and a 30 minute off cycle.
>
> 1- Is this a problem with some of the chargers?
It could be, depends on the charger.
>
> 2- The boxes that have a two 2-gang outlets...is there
> a way to figure out if there's both a black wire going
> to one, and red to the other (without opening the box)
yeah, use a voltmeter
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If you're using a DC-DC converter, which is acting like an alternator to
charge the battery, it sounds like you just need an SLI battery, right,
since it's not usually going to get pulled down very far in DOD?
I've also heard of some people using a deep cycle battery instead of an SLI.
If you use a deep cycle with lots of amp hours, would that tend to work
without a DC-DC?
Thanks.
Bill Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Cor van de Water
Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2006 12:24 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: 12volt alternator or dc-dc convertor
Mike,
Think of this:
You drive somewhere at night, cold and wet outside so you
not only have the headlights going but also the defogging,
wipers and what-not.
Then you find yourself stuck in a queue waiting for a
traffic light, and another one and again, then the railway
crossing closes in your face.
Before it re-opens you slowly see your headlights getting
dimmer and dimmer, the wipers stop mid-window and you see
the traffic light after the railway turning red again....
You want to get stuck on a railroad crossing (or any other
roadway crossing) because you were too cheap to install a
DC/DC converter and your 12V battery died?
Look at what Toyota did with the Prius. They could have
installed an alternator - the engine normally does not
shut off for more than a few minutes.
Why then did they add a 100A 12V inverter to the motor
controller? Guess?
Success with your conversion,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of mike golub
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 10:11 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: 12volt alternator or dc-dc convertor
OK, but why do I need to charge my accessory battery
(w/ a DC-DC convertor) when I'm waiting for a traffic
light?
--- James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At 08:54 PM 20/01/06 -0800, Mike Golub wrote:
> >Which would draw more power from the batteries:
> >
> >1- running a dc-dc converter
> >2- running the alternator off the tail shaft of 9"
> WarP motor
> >
> >..small enough to fit directly on the tailshaft?
>
> Hi Mike
>
> The DC/DC is less power (more efficient).
>
> Alternators need to rev up to deliver power, on an
> ICE they are typically
> 1.2x to 2.5x crank RPM.
>
> Use an alternator if you want cheap, use a DC/DC if
> you want efficient and
> keeping the voltage up at each stop.
>
> James
>
>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Mike,
The size of the dc-dc converter depends on how much equipment you want to run
at the same time in your EV. For my EV which was built in 1976, there was a
choice of either a very large dc-dc-dc-ac converter-inverter that could run off
the 100 volts of batteries, or a rotating alternator-inverter that can put out
a combination of 13.5 to 16 volts DC at 145 amps and at the same time put out
7000 watts at 120 VAC 60 hz.
They chose the rotating converter, because the package was a lot smaller than
the other one and could run of 200 volts of DC. The dc-dc-dc-ac unit is about
2 cubic feet in size and was over $2000.00
Today, I rather used a dc-dc unit, but these unit would have to run six fans
that draw about 5 amps each, three heating systems that is 17 amps off the
dc-ac unit, and four electric motors from 5 to 20 amps to run the A/C, power
steering, vacuum pump, and the water pump for the heating system.
This is 87 amps alone. If I turn all my instrument lights, console indicators,
head lights, alarm systems, and power assist systems, than I'm way over 100
amps.
I cannot find a converter that will do what my alternator-inverter will do and
it would take a major conversion to switch over every thing. Would have to
make the car bigger to get everything in.
One thing that my rotating inverter does, is that its slows the EV down coming
down a long hill with glare ice on it which I have to come down every day. It
slows the EV down like compression braking of a ICE. I turn on as much load as
I can for this effect. Without it, and if I try to used the brakes, the EV
would coast faster increasing the speed. One time, I just touch the brakes,
and the car slide sideways all the way down the hill.
So if I can find a DC-DC converter and a DC-AC inverter that can run all the
existing units, plus give me compression like braking, and is small enough to
fit into the EV, then I would used one.
Note: Dynamic or Regen Braking causes too much braking action, which causes the
car the slide also.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: mike golub<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 9:54 PM
Subject: 12volt alternator or dc-dc convertor
Which would draw more power from the batteries:
1- running a dc-dc converter
2- running the alternator off the tail shaft of 9" War
P motor
maybe there's smaller alternators that are more
efficient...small enough to fit directly on the
tailshaft?
thanks
Mike Golub
Fairbanks Alaska
1986 Toyota PU 4AWD
120v DC
Curtis 1209b upgraded to 120v
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com<http://mail.yahoo.com/>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In a message dated 1/21/06 6:30:32 AM Pacific Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< If you're using a DC-DC converter, which is acting like an alternator to
charge the battery, it sounds like you just need an SLI battery, right,
since it's not usually going to get pulled down very far in DOD?
I've also heard of some people using a deep cycle battery instead of an SLI.
If you use a deep cycle with lots of amp hours, would that tend to work
without a DC-DC?
Thanks.
Bill Dennis
>>
In my S10 pro street truck I will be using a 14 volt battery,thats a hawker
pc925 with 2 hawker cyclones(cyclones in parallel).This 14v battery will be
chargeg as the main pack is charged.
Dennis Berube
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This is a 1978 Electric Van on E-Bay that I saw this morning. Current bid
$11.00. Reserve not met.
Steve
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 06:32 PM 1/20/2006, damon henry wrote:
Yeah that is pretty tight and sounds like a recipe for some serious
headaches as it means that you will always have to get a perfect
charge and have no unexpected energy use. I don't suppose there is
any chance of squeezing in a couple more cells...
Well, by doing some major work, and making life much more awkward, I
might be able to fit another 36V worth of NiCd into the Sparrow. The
problem is I am already at my controller limit, so using these extra
would be difficult. I'd probably have to setup a DC-DC to run off
them, and charge the main pack, and finding a DC-DC that can do
[EMAIL PROTECTED] and put out [EMAIL PROTECTED] seems like it would be difficult.
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You would use a belt and pully system. Or chain. Two motors would fit
above or to the side of the transmission. Their outputs would be in line
with the input shaft of the transmission. An easy solution to two motors.
The motor area could then be used for batteries. LR......
----- Original Message -----
From: "mike golub" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 5:23 PM
Subject: 2 motors & 2 controllers?(Re: Paralleling and Serialing)
How do you set up a car to do that?
If one motor was on the rear wheels, and another motor
was on the front wheels on a 4wd car, what technique
is used so one set of wheels doesn't rotate faster
than the other?
Has anyone have more information on this?
Maybe you could get a Geo Metro and add another motor
on the rearend?
--- Lawrence Rhodes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
Two controllers in parallel can't be done. However
what will work is two
controllers and two motors. If you want a 144 vdc
controller/motor combo on
the cheap then use two L91's and two Altrax 72v
controllers. . Cheaper
better faster........144 is always divided by two.
LR>........
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Dymaxion" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 11:11 PM
Subject: Paralleling and Serialing Controllers
>I can hear the chorus of "Bad idea" already! Has
anyone actually
> tried paralleling 2 controllers for more current,
or putting 2
> controllers in series to handle more voltage?
>
> My thoughts are paralleling might work if they had
equal current, and
> big enough capacitors that either controller could
take full current.
>
> Similarly, it seems if you had big enough
capacitors neither
> controller's transistors would see full voltage.
>
> My thoughts were motivated by seeing Curtis sepex
controllers. They
> seem to have lots of nice features, and are pretty
cheap. 80 Volts
> and 600 Amps is a bit wimpy, though! Might they
survive being put in
> series? Would it help to parallel them with some
big capacitors?
>
> Thanks in advance for the education.
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The Astro's also had a 2.5 4 banger. Probably where the high miles came
from. LR......
----- Original Message -----
From: "lee parrish" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 7:12 PM
Subject: Re: chevy astro conversion?
In a message dated 1/19/06 7:02:10 PM Pacific Standard
Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
What originally sold us on the Astro/Safari was
meeting a contractor at the lumber yard one day, who
always carried about a ton of tools in the back of his
Safari, and with his V6 got a steady 21mpg. And that
was with unmodified, stock set up.
-Lee
<< The orginal 1985 Astrovan got 28mpg. About what
the other mini vans
of
the
time got. It is a light rearwheel drive van. It has
a load capacity
of
about 1500 pounds. I couldn't find the curb weight
but it should be
around
3000 pounds. LR>.............
----- Original Message ----- >>
*A pipefitter friend of mine drove one of these astros
for over 200000
miles
with a 1500lb welder in the cargo area,even back an
forth to Alaska,I
considered one for a conversion before the s10. D
Berube
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Just get an old SCR controller. That is the noise you hear on the clip.
They make a sort of musical sound. LR........
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave Cover" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 8:39 PM
Subject: Re: Contrabassoon & Electric vehicles. TV news story.
LR
Excellent clip! I hope I get the opportunity to do the same when I get my
car going. It all helps
promote the cause.
I noticed a little background "music" while you were driving your van
around. It sounded a little
like your controller/motor noise being synthesized by everything that
happened to the clip
between KNTV and my PC. Or maybe it was just my PC. Somewhat reminiscent
of a fifties scifi movie.
Kind of a spacey futuristic synthesized twinkling white noise. A nice but
odd touch, I wonder if
there's a way to make my car do the same?
Dave Cover
--- Lawrence Rhodes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
http://kntv.feedroom.com/index.jsp?auto_band=x&rf=sv&fr_story=1e4da9dabd6c36eb4faae9003bcdb440284a7a4e
Lawrence Rhodes
Bassoon/Contrabassoon
Reedmaker
Book 4/5 doubler
Electric Vehicle & Solar Power Advocate
415-821-3519
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Peter wrote -
>> 2- The boxes that have a two 2-gang outlets...is there
>> a way to figure out if there's both a black wire going
>> to one, and red to the other (without opening the box)
>
> yeah, use a voltmeter
Can you explain how to do this?
Thanks
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
John G. Lussmyer wrote:
> I might be able to fit another 36V worth of NiCd into the Sparrow.
> The problem is I am already at my controller limit, so using these
> extra would be difficult. I'd probably have to setup a DC-DC to run
> off them, and charge the main pack, and finding a DC-DC that can do
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] and put out [EMAIL PROTECTED] seems like it would be
> difficult.
How about using my Battery Balancer or an equivalent setup? It monitors
individual cells or groups of cells, and uses a single DC/DC to transfer
as much as 30 amps between them (limited by the 30a relays I used).
Here's how it would help. With a pure series string, your range is
limited by the weakest cell. If you monitor individual cells, you know
which cell it is; but all you can do is quit driving when it goes dead.
But if you can *charge* the weakest cell, or at least carry part of its
load with power from the pack as a whole, you can "prop it up" so it is
no longer the weakest link. Now your range is limited by the *average*
capacity of the cells, not the lowest.
If there is (say) a +/-20% variation in capacity between cells, then
this gives you 20% more range.
Another advantage of this approach is that you can have extra batteries
or charging sources that aren't the same voltage as the pack. For
example, I have twelve 12v batteries in my EV; 11 propulsion and 1
accessory battery. The Balancer monitors and transfers power between all
of them. The Balancer serves as the DC/DC converter, and the energy in
the accessory battery tracks that of the pack as a whole.
--
Lee Hart
--- End Message ---
