EV Digest 5356
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Monster Garage Video
by "Michaela Merz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Multi charger.
by Joel Hacker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: 8" ADC
by "Ryan Stotts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Red Fiero was Re: Orb Carnage....
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) MG Run data.
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Charging Dead Flat AGMs
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Multi charger. (Dennis Berube)
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: 300zx for sale
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Multi charger.
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: MG Run data.
by Ken Trough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Motor upgrade/overhaul continues
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Monster Garage Video
by "Dave Davidson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) a few newby questions
by "Dale Curren" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) RE: Charging Dead Flat AGMs
by "David Sharpe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: a few newby questions
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) RE: Chevy Luv burnouts?
by "Pestka, Dennis J" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: MG Run data.
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
18) Maximising torque for racing
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Is a 200 mph Electric Cup Car possible ?
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
20) Re: dc-dc question
by Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: a few newby questions
by Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Motor upgrade/overhaul continues
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: a few newby questions; now Brush position
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: a few newby questions
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Mazda conversion advice
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: MG Run data, late comments
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
I would advise anybody to be careful about sharing copyrighted videos in
any form. Always remember that this list is archived all over the net.
Just my two cents.
mm.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Just to comment on the individual charger idea...
Over the last couple years, POL (Point of Load) voltage
converters have become very popular in EE designs
(especially -48V telco) for the mere purpose of having
one large dumb centralized power supply, and then
having multiple innexpensive (as silicon gets more
and more affordable) voltage regulators at each of
the individual loads (imagine one POL regulator per
card in a 16 slot card cage if you will).
Now, this is obviously not a CC/CV pre-programmed
charging curve, I do see some merit (and it might
just be 6 in one hand, and a half dozzen in the other)
in some instances where money might be saved and a
better/tighter battery charging/equalization might
be the result of mimicking the design (obviously
with more intellegence added than just a buck/boost
voltage regulator).
Chris Brune wrote:
Well you asked for it.... Currently about 3900 miles on an AGM pack of
Orbitals. 144V system with 12 Soneil 5 amp chargers. No failures of the
chargers. This is the 2nd battery pack using these chargers, the first was
Optimas.
The easy to see LEDs on the chargers are a good indicator that they are
working properly. It would be better if the chargers communicated with a
display node though.
I do feel that Soneil does not use an ideal charge algrorithm. I have
recently modified mine to do a CC/CV charge algrorithm. I feel this gives
me a better indication of when the batteries are actually charged.
I kind of like the idea of having individual chargers fed with a DC voltage.
This would eliminate some of the larger bulkier parts of a typical switching
power supply. A single separate unit could take care of the AC to DC
conversion. For example one could route 48V around to each of the
individual battery chargers.
Regards,
Chris Brune
Tigard, OR
Now I am sure somebody is going to tell me they have thousands of miles on
a
AGM pack with modular chargers. There is only one that I know of.. John
Bryan??? You still out there??
But... this sure is the exception to the rule.
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee Hart wrote:
> The racers will have much better data than I will. I try *not* to break
> things! :-)
Things would be more fun if you were hell bent on extracting maximum
performance don't you think?
Your first mission is to set up a video camera and film gratuitous
amounts of turning your tires into smoke for us. Your second mission
is to make your car be faster then John Waylands White Zombie...
We'll work on your third mission when you get to it...
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Twin 8 and a Zilla2k at 336 volts.
Or back to a single Kostove and 336 volts.
I am planing on ...making it do Wheelies...
I am not sure it will ever be a Wayland level Racer... but it's gonna put on
a Darn good show.
Joe had had it almost on 2 wheels in a power slide... the front end gets
light ever with 9 Orbs up there... Putting 21 Orbs in the back might do
wheelies just sitting in the shop.
This may allow for front end lift without needing to have transmission
busting torque at all times.
It's pretty quick even with 800 amps of 264 volts.
Fast but not record setting fast...
It's got about 50 miles on it this year and about 2000 back in the late 90s
to about 2002 when I shorted the motor under load.
I will run it in this year's Kingston Grand old Forth.
It may make it to Route 66. But I am not commiting it yet.
Also plastic don't rust as fast as Goldie....
Madman
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ryan Stotts" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 9:16 PM
Subject: Red Fiero was Re: Orb Carnage....
> > Man there are some good shot of Goldie being very bad on the MG Show...
I
> > need to yard the dead lead out of her and get some fresh Smoke....
>
> What are your plans for the Red Fiero?
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have had this document since the Monster Garage Challenge at the Bakers field
drag strip in Dec 05'
The show has aired...
here is the run data.
4:08 pm 30/DEC/2005
The MG Car is #245
Ron's Hemi GTX is Car # 244
car# R/T 60 330 1/8 mph 1000 1/4
mph clock time
244 tt .323 2.315 6.056 9.134 79.95 11.818 14.085
99.07 4:13
245 TT .927 2.428 6.940 10.872 60.69 14.460 17.601
71.00
244 TT .132 2.136 5.897 8.828 84.28 11.399 13.900
86.65 4:53
245 TT .580 2.653 6.915 10.069 77.94 12.833 15.257
90.09
244 TT .098 2.267 5.873 8.879 82.65 11.428 13.546
106.59 4:59
245 TT .020 2.335 6.270 9.392 77.94 12.138 14.533
93.33
The first 3 runs were DNF for the MG car.
run 1 was a tranny issuse
run 2 was blown breakers
And I forget what run 3 was.. but it was like blown breakers... again.
the last 2 runs had fire coming out of the front motor. And had to be
exstinguished...
Dry powder was every where.
In the morning we had about 3 runs up and down the West Coast Chopper access
Road. This was all done without any charging at all.
The batteries were charged the day before... and it was thier 2nd charge cycle
after coming out of the Shipping boxes.
The math on the batteries was 3 amp hours 32 Pack in series for a 96 amphour
pack at 336 volts.
That's 30 Kwhr available. In Goldie that would be a 120 mile pack.
V is for voltage Web site has ALL of my personal Digital snap shots. I handed
Ken Trough my personal CD last night at the SEVA MG show meeting.
There will be shot of sutff never aired. I expect a LOT of E-mail...
Ken has stories Audio Taped that really tell some of the real story...
And yes the best shots of the whole shoot were never shown.
Madman
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Apr 10, 2006, at 8:10 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Slightly off topic I have had 1 hurt hawker in the Current
Eliminator
for a long time now and did receive a replacement for it.This weekend
I have
started to cycle this battery on the bench and on one of the cycles
the voltage
went to 6.75 under a 16 amp load.I did get a charger on the battery
within 3
minutes,did I hurt this battery?
My poor Optimas have suffered that quite a few times. With a short
range I've been known to approach 100% DOD more than once. In my
experience, if the battery voltage bounces back over 11.5 volts quickly
after the load is removed it will recharge and continue to live without
any short term issues. My Optimas have suffered long term capacity
loss, but they are about 7 years old and have seen a number of deep
cycles and much charging abuse.
Paul G.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Apr 5, 2006, at 3:42 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I have been using the 10 packx3 deltran charger for thousands of
hours.It is
offboard so I will also use it to balance the 26ah hawkers in my new
S10
Street/Drag truck.(the one that will run 10s by the third try)
What model of deltran charger are you using?
They have a nice (but slow) 10 bank charger that I'm tempted to try for
finish charging. I am installing hardware now that will let me know
when the first battery hits 15 volts. I could use that to switch
between a bulk charger and individual finish charging.
Paul "neon" G.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 10:21 PM 4/10/2006, bruce bogusz wrote:
steve clunn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I have a 300 zx ,
conversion with 25 golfcart batteries , 1k zilla , 9 " net
gain , power steering , power brakes . . The owner has moved and I have it
up for sale at www.grassrootsev.com . I'm looking for somebody to be
partners on this car while I keep it up for sale ( or buy it ) . It has
I just took a look at your sale adds there, and I'm wondering why
they aren't also listed on the EVTradin Post?
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanx. That is what I thought (due to e-mail client change my older
archives are hard to search right now.) I've got one of those with the
NAPA brand on it. Its a reduced feature version (two LEDs one bicolor,
not voltage adjustable.) It has proven quite tough and Optimas seem to
like the pulse finish charge. But 10 of them would be rather large and
heavy (hard place gracefully and weight is not the Buggy's 'thing'.)
Still...
All that is settled right now is that the Russco is coming out. That
charger without regs and a pack of Optimas have not been agreeable.
Paul "neon" G.
On Apr 8, 2006, at 7:34 PM, John Bryan wrote:
Hi Paul, I went with what was the most convenient for me at the
time.
Since I was a Zap bike kit dealer, I decided to go with their charger,
which I've been told was made by Cliplight. I was able to get a good
price on them in quantity. They have proved to be 100% reliable so far,
without a single failure. With my bike using one, I even have a spare
if
it were ever needed.
I think there's something that needs to be said about MTBF figures
on
electronics. It's that the time between failures tracks inversely to
operating temperature. These chargers were designed to run in a plastic
case without any active cooling. They are a conservative design, that
just
relies on their generous heat sinks, and a few holes where the heat
can rise
out of the case. When installing them in the car, I removed them from
their
cases and provided them with a very effective, active cooling system.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
V is for voltage Web site has ALL of my personal Digital snap shots.
I handed Ken Trough my personal CD last night at the SEVA MG show
meeting.
I am taking great care with the disc. I will be cleaning up the photos,
clearing them with Rich for publication, then I'll be posting the URL
where everyone can view them.
Ken has stories Audio Taped that really tell some of the real story...
Audio tape is so 80's. 8^)
I can't let such a challenge to my techno-geekhood go unchallenged. I
captured the interview directly onto a 4GB microdrive in my rugged
high-fidelity mobile M-Audio Microtrack 24-bit/96kHz professional
2-channel mobile digital recorder via two Shure BETA 58A mics.
http://tinyurl.com/9tlta
It doesn't have violet LEDs, but it is definitely ubergeek gear. Just
slightly better than audio tape. Even better than DAT actually. Just a
note for the audio geeks out there.
Anyway, I'll be editing this interview soon and will post the URL here
as soon as it is available.
-Ken Trough
V is for Voltage
http://visforvoltage.com
AIM/YM - ktrough
FAX/voice message - 206-339-VOLT (8658)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi All
Motor upgrade and overhaul continues, photos (as usual) at:
http://jcmassey.gallery.netspace.net.au/Daihatsu-pics-01 new ones start on
the third page.
This series of photos covers clean up of the brush timing adjustment
assembly, make and fit new brush holder mount insulators and assembly of
the brush gear. After this was done I put the rotor in and checked
clearances - I'm a little worried about the 1/8" or less between the edge
of the brush holders and the riser of the commutator. I think I'll need to
get that area coated with something - some kind of electrical varnish. The
back edge of the commutator will probably get the same treatment. The
commutator can be seen on the first page of photos.
I've since stripped the motor back down again and had the motor tube, field
poles and pole shims sandblasted and have primed the outside of the motor
tube and the field poles except the faces that go against the shims. I
don't know if I should leave them bare, or give them a light prime coat. I
don't want to upset the magnetic bond between the pole pieces and the tube.
Once the fields are in I'll coat the entire inside of the motor with
varnish or epoxy resin, so it shouldn't rust too much.
The fields are going to be rewound by another motor shop to the ones that
"ovehauled" my motor when I first got it - the first shop baked the fields
to dry them out and severely overheated them, plus have stuffed up several
jobs recently for my business.
The fields are currently 24 turns, and around 1/16"(sq) flat wire - 1" x
1/16" approx. The old windings had insulation paper between each turn, so
modern wire should be able to be significantly thicker and still fit, so
I'm asking them to see if they can get double the cross section, even if it
means reducing the turns to 20 or so. The field series/parallel switching
that I intend to implement will halve the field strength in parallel, and
probably break the gearbox in series.
As always, comments welcome (there is an "add comment" at each photo).
Regards
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The best thing is to just put it on a website for us to download. mpeg
works fine for me, just don't sacrifice resolution to get the size down (or
if you do, also have a full resolution version for those of us who want it.
Also, when I went to torrent, they want me to buy a subscription for even a
single download.
Dave
----Original Message Follows----
From: Ricky Suiter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Monster Garage Video
Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2006 20:21:20 -0700 (PDT)
I reconverted it, in Divx it's still 2.2gb! Of course this is a 704X480
pixel video at 29 frames/sec with 128kbps audio. I'll try and remove the
commercials later tonight and see what I can get it down to.
Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Don't trade it in this format
please. Convert to Divx or Xvid codec, in
a .avi wrapper. That will get you down to about 1/10th the size. Then
put it up as a torrent for distribution and everyone can pick it up in a
very short period of time.
Danny
Ricky Suiter wrote:
>So I converted the video from ATI's propriotary format to an mpg video. It
comes out to about 2.7gb. I'm sure if I went through and edited out the
commercials it would be a bit less, but still huge to easily send. I did not
quite get all of the end of the show, but I did get the last run in before
my recording automatically stopped. About all I didn't get was the guys
getting their tools. I'm trying to figure out how I can share this. It'd
probably be easiest if I just sent out DVD's so here's what I'm thinking. If
you want a copy send me a postage prepaid cd mailer with a blank disk in it
and I'll send it back to you with the episode on it. That way no money
changes hands and everything is cool.
>
> Contact me off list if anyone wants to do this.
>
>
>Later,
>Ricky
>02 Insight
>92 Saturn SC2 EV 144 Volt
>Glendale, AZ USA
>
>
---------------------------------
Blab-away for as little as 1ยข/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo!
Messenger with Voice.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I've been reading here a few months and I believe there are two basic types of
motor - serial and shunt. Which is better?
And brush advancing. Can/should this be done to any motor? Serial or shunt?
how much advance?
thanks
Dale Curren
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It is one cell (I have many more) I have a Variac to control power supply.
David
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lee Hart
Sent: Tuesday, 11 April 2006 11:48 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Charging Dead Flat AGMs
David Sharpe wrote:
> The cell ran at about 2V but when I attempted introducing a low voltage
> source, a variable 0-14V 20A power supply the cell volts "broke free" and
> went to O/C volts again requiring an increase of volts from the other
source
> in series with the light bulb to re-establish the cell.
Can you clarify exactly what you are doing here? I'm having trouble
understanding.
1. Are these truly individual 2v cells? I.e. NOT batteries, which
consist
of many cells in series?
2. Did you connect a 14v 20amp power supply to a single cell? If so,
that sounds WAY too high.
> I'll try longer times at low current and perhaps my old trick to
> remove shorts in NiCd cells -- a blast from a 10000uF cap charged
> to 50V.
That trick sometimes works with nicads, because they have a tendency to
short when reversed (i.e. forcing current to flow through a dead nicad).
However, it burns a hole in the separator between the plates. The cell
will thereafter be very likely to short again, and will have a much
higher self-discharge rate.
This trick doesn't work with lead-acids as a rule.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Dale, and all
At 05:27 AM 12/04/06 -0600, Dale Curren wrote:
I've been reading here a few months and I believe there are two basic types of
motor - serial and shunt. Which is better?
Two basic types of DC motor. Series and shunt, although there are
permutations such as compound (has both series windings and shunt windings)
and permanent magnet (which is like a shunt motor with full-on field all
the time), plus sep-ex (seperately excited) which is another permutation of
a shunt motor with different design characteristics.
Better? depends on what you want to do, Series is the most power for the
lowest cost for most people, permanent magnet is lower power applications
for most people. Seperately excited is for DC dynamic (regenerative)
braking or for controllers that have different characteristics (vehicles
with sep-ex systems tend to be allowed to "idle" when stopped).
AC motors are another ball game, so-called brushless DC, induction (most
common) and occasionally wound-rotor AC are usually available only in
sophisticated integrated packages from people with brainiac engineers. the
land of higher cost and smooth refinements, and 10-year warranties.
And brush advancing. Can/should this be done to any motor? Serial or shunt?
how much advance?
Brush advancing is to rotate the brushes from the neutral point (where they
sit as best for equal power both rotational directions) to a point where
the neutral point moves to under high forward power. Rich Rudman keeps
saying "10 degrees for street, 13 degrees for drag racing". Series motors
are happiest with the brush timing advanced. Seperately excited tends to
burn their brushes when braking if they have been advanced.
DC motors run more efficiently and hurt their brushes less when correctly
timed for their job.
Hope this helps
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I considered a Luv before I found my 65 Datsun.
It looked to be a good candidate for conversion.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I recall it was built by Isuzu.
I picked up a Haynes repair manual on it at a flea market.
If you end up finding one, let me know and I will send it to you.
Dennis
Elsberry, MO
-----Original Message-----
From: Ryan Stotts [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 11:34 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Chevy Luv burnouts?
DM3 wrote:
> Has anyone converted a 1979 chevy luv pu for drag racing?
I think it will work fine.
As far as I know, that particular model truck hasn't been converted yet:
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/chevrolet.html
Don't be afraid to be the first.
> was wondering how much of the stock drive train can be used.
For drag racing with good tires? None of it. The tranny, drive shaft, and
differential will fail if you have enough power from the motor and good
enough traction. If you never have good traction, then it might(should)
take it.
It's not a big deal though if the stock parts aren't up to it. Are you
going to run a transmission or direct drive? This way you can get a good
transmission or forgo the transmission. In either case, a custom drive
shaft will be needed. There are at least four companies that can fab you a
custom width differential(Ford 9"?) with correctly positioned spring mounts
that will bolt right in.
>Also, are the GE 9 inch motors too heavy for the amount of torque
they deliver?
Not really. It weighs what it weighs.
>Has anyone paired some up?
I think the monster garage car had two GE's coupled together. Dennis gets
good results with just one though(custom motor mods..)..
http://www.currenteliminator.net/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rich,
Run 4 may be our best indicator of what we could do with the right
setup.
The rear motor and zilla were along for the ride and had no power due
to the blown breaker box.
After run 3 in the heat of battle I only jumped around one side of the
box mistakingly thinking that the output side of the box was bridged as
well as the input. A 17.601 with 1/2 power without recharging after 3
warm up runs and 3 full runs isn't toooooooooo bad for a 5000lb car. I
wonder just how hard that poor front motor was working.
Shawn
-----Original Message-----
From: Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tue, 11 Apr 2006 23:01:03 -0700
Subject: MG Run data.
I have had this document since the Monster Garage Challenge at the
Bakers field
drag strip in Dec 05'
The show has aired...
here is the run data.
4:08 pm 30/DEC/2005
The MG Car is #245
Ron's Hemi GTX is Car # 244
car# R/T 60 330 1/8 mph 1000
1/4
mph clock time
244 tt .323 2.315 6.056 9.134 79.95 11.818
14.085
99.07 4:13
245 TT .927 2.428 6.940 10.872 60.69 14.460
17.601
71.00
244 TT .132 2.136 5.897 8.828 84.28 11.399
13.900
86.65 4:53
245 TT .580 2.653 6.915 10.069 77.94 12.833
15.257
90.09
244 TT .098 2.267 5.873 8.879 82.65 11.428
13.546
106.59 4:59
245 TT .020 2.335 6.270 9.392 77.94 12.138
14.533
93.33
The first 3 runs were DNF for the MG car.
run 1 was a tranny issuse
run 2 was blown breakers
And I forget what run 3 was.. but it was like blown breakers... again.
the last 2 runs had fire coming out of the front motor. And had to be
exstinguished...
Dry powder was every where.
In the morning we had about 3 runs up and down the West Coast Chopper
access
Road. This was all done without any charging at all.
The batteries were charged the day before... and it was thier 2nd
charge cycle
after coming out of the Shipping boxes.
The math on the batteries was 3 amp hours 32 Pack in series for a 96
amphour
pack at 336 volts.
That's 30 Kwhr available. In Goldie that would be a 120 mile pack.
V is for voltage Web site has ALL of my personal Digital snap shots. I
handed
Ken Trough my personal CD last night at the SEVA MG show meeting.
There will be shot of sutff never aired. I expect a LOT of E-mail...
Ken has stories Audio Taped that really tell some of the real story...
And yes the best shots of the whole shoot were never shown.
Madman
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
G'day all - especially drag racing fans
I had a thought re maximising torque. Drag race with a sepex motor, custom
controller.
Off the line, 100% field, ramp up the armature in current limit. Once the
armature drops out of current limit, start to back off the field to hold
the armature current in a 'window' a little below the current limit value.
That'd keep the motor pulling as hard as you could go, all the way down the
strip. A "deep pockets" job, I guess, but cheaper than silver-winding a
motor...
Yes? No? Get back in my box and don't blather about things I don't know about?
What do you all think?
Regards
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I need some input from the experts out there. What are the absolute
minimums it will take in the form of batteries, motors, controllers,
chargers, (all the essential EV stuff), to get a 3-4 year old Nextel
cup car chassis with all required onboard equipment to a peak speed of
200 + MPH and an average of 190 MPH for one lap at Daytona? I know it
can be done but what is the best way?
Shawn Lawless
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee, thanks for the reply. I was begining to think the question was a little
too newbie for the
list. I've been looking at the Vicor dc-dc's on ebay, but they never seem to
match the range I'm
looking for. Ultimately I'm shooting for 300 nicads as my traction pack
(regardless of all the
recent posts about the watering problems.)
Recently there were some Vicors that took 375 vdc input, but the output was
48vdc. Then I saw some
that accepted 48vdc and wanted to know if I could combine them. Basically use
one higer wattage
dc-dc to bring pack voltage down to a more common value and then use a couple
of dc-dcs to supply
power for a few different purposes. I was thinking of using a low wattage dc-dc
to supply 12 volts
just to the eMeter. I've heard of enough people frying their eMeters that I
wanted to try and
protect it. I'd have another dc-dc to supply higher voltage to power the
original car battery, may
13-14 volts. Anyway, crazy as it may sound I just wanted to know if I had the
option, thanks for
the confirmation.
On another note, I just (finally) received my (very nice) adapter plate and I'm
clear to proceed.
If anyone is considering a Porsche 944/924 conversion, I have an adapter plate
that looks good.
The vendor should be able to crank them out. I have a couple of house projects
to finish, but I
should be in EV build mode real soon. I may not have it together for Joliet or
Hagerstown this
year, but I'm on my way! Rich, when will those water cooled PFC-30s be
available?
Thanks for the help
Dave Cover
--- Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Dave Cover wrote:
> > Can I use a couple of DC-DC in series to drop voltage? In particular
> > I'm looking at the Vicor modules. Suppose I have one DC-DC that takes
> > 100 volts in and outputs 50 volts. Can I then run the 50 volts into
> > another DC-DC, say one that takes 50 volts in and outputs 25 volts?
> > Does this give me a 100 volt to 25 volt DC-DC?
>
> Sure. It's odd, but you can do it. I suppose you're doing it as an
> expedient solution, to use parts you've already got or can find cheap.
> --
> Ring the bells that still can ring
> Forget the perfect offering
> There is a crack in everything
> That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
> --
> Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Brush advancing is to rotate the brushes from the neutral point (where they
> sit as best for equal power both rotational directions) to a point where
> the neutral point moves to under high forward power. Rich Rudman keeps
> saying "10 degrees for street, 13 degrees for drag racing". Series motors
> are happiest with the brush timing advanced. Seperately excited tends to
> burn their brushes when braking if they have been advanced.
>
In spite of how much the topic of brush timing has been discussed, can somoene
just answer a
simple question? Does advancing the timing mean moving the brushes OPPOSITE to
the direction of
motor rotation or the SAME as the direction of motor rotation?
I know it's obvious to everyone else, but...
Thanks
Dave Cover
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey James
You definitely want to leave the back of the shoes bare where it sits against
the housing so don't paint, primer, or coat in any way 8^ )
As far as the 1/8" gap between the holders and the riser that's about standard
and should pose no problem that is unless you're planning on drag racing 8^ P
giving the riser and face a coating sure couldn't hurt though, that is as long
as it's class H and doesn't catch fire 8^ 0
As to reducing the turns from 24 to 20 with a thicker wire it should increase
your top end speed but lose a little torque. What voltage are you planning on
running? and are you planning on advancing the brush timing??
On an OT note when you cut the circle out of the Nomex for the bearing
journal, did you cut it CW or CCW, just curious as to how that worked down
under, lmao, hehe!!
Cya James
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Another away to answer that is that most cars (due to
the direction the crankshaft spins in) need to be
advanced. Hondas get retarded-- (or was it the
opposite?) It's detailed on the website (below).
peace,
--- Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> --- James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > Brush advancing is to rotate the brushes from the
> neutral point (where they
> > sit as best for equal power both rotational
> directions) to a point where
> > the neutral point moves to under high forward
> power. Rich Rudman keeps
> > saying "10 degrees for street, 13 degrees for drag
> racing". Series motors
> > are happiest with the brush timing advanced.
> Seperately excited tends to
> > burn their brushes when braking if they have been
> advanced.
> >
>
> In spite of how much the topic of brush timing has
> been discussed, can somoene just answer a
> simple question? Does advancing the timing mean
> moving the brushes OPPOSITE to the direction of
> motor rotation or the SAME as the direction of motor
> rotation?
>
> I know it's obvious to everyone else, but...
>
> Thanks
>
> Dave Cover
>
>
'92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V (video or DVD available)!
www.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel?
Are you saving any gas for your kids?
__________________________________________________
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Dave
First off a brush is in nuetral when it alligns in the middle of the pole
shoe magnetics. If you're looking at the drive end of your motor (shaft end)
take the pole shoe bolt heads and line them up as you look toward the brushes.
You should find that those bolt heads are in line with where the brushes hit
the commutator. Again looking from the drive end and your motor needs to run
CCWDE then you would rotate the comm plate CWDE (opposit of rotation) to
achieve advance. The brush hits the comm bar advance of nuetral. Like I
stated if the brushes are in line with your pole shoe bolt heads then the motor
is in nuetral and is the best easiest way for me to explain how to tell if ones
motor has been timed or not.
Hope this helps
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
--- James Massey wrote:
>
> Brush advancing is to rotate the brushes from the neutral point (where they
> sit as best for equal power both rotational directions) to a point where
> the neutral point moves to under high forward power. Rich Rudman keeps
> saying "10 degrees for street, 13 degrees for drag racing". Series motors
> are happiest with the brush timing advanced. Seperately excited tends to
> burn their brushes when braking if they have been advanced.
>
In spite of how much the topic of brush timing has been discussed, can somoene
just answer a
simple question? Does advancing the timing mean moving the brushes OPPOSITE to
the direction of
motor rotation or the SAME as the direction of motor rotation?
I know it's obvious to everyone else, but...
Thanks
Dave Cover
---------------------------------
Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates
starting at 1¢/min.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Brian Kardell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> First off, thanks for the help...
>
> To answer the questions that Bob asked below:
>
> 1) My MPV has a ton of 'trunk' space, plus it has a
> large third seat with
> more space than most cars behind.
Fair warning; if you don't divide the batteries in
roughly half between front and rear, good luck on safe
handling... (:-< So consider under the hood as well.
Build a cardboard box of the exact size of batts. you
intend to use (ie, 9.5" x 7.25" x 11", I think it
is... for USB 8V).
My mom had a
> caravan and I can honestly
> say that it has to have at least twice as much space
> in the rear. I noticed
> that someone on this site had actually converted an
> MPV, so I'm guessing
> that those two pieces of data are a fairly strong
> indicator that it is at
> least 'possible'. I'm not opposed to taking out the
> rear seat if necessary.
>
> 2) My MPV is an automatic, but I have read some
> articles about people
> converting a Geo Metro and they installed a manual
> transmision... Is that
> not a possibility?
Possibility, yes. Fun? Well, you'll need to change
out instrumentation components as well as the tranny
itself.
I'm not really sure what is
> involved there in terms of
> cost or effort - I would imagine that the effort is
> considerable, but the
> cost might not be too bad as we have a friend who
> has junkyard connections.
>
> 3) I am really confused by the question... I took a
> look at the specs for
> both of our (Bob's and my own) cars to try to figure
> out where those numbers
> are coming from, but I guess that I am missing
> something huge. My
> understanding is that GVWR is the total weight of
> the vehicle plus all of
> it's cargo, fluids and options.
no, it includes weight of people/gear as well. Look
on the door pillar.
The cargo capacity
> metrics that I am
> finding everywhere however is measured in cubic feet
> (volume) not weight.
> The curb weight of your civic appears to agree
> roughly with the number that
> you provided - is that what you mean? I'm not sure
> how it could be though
> since the definition of the second seems to roughly
> just be the same as GVWR
> only 'without anyone or anything being carried'. I
> would imagine that the
> weight of all of my ICE components are considerable!
> For example, the
> example vehicle's GWVR is rougly 3430 lbs, while
> mine is roughly 5185 lbs -
> but I have to imagine that my V6 + 4WD, etc (ICE
> components) is all
> considerably more weighty
Not by much, I bet. I pulled 485 lbs of ICE stuff
out, and I'd be surprised, knowing Japanese
engineering, if a small amount of additional block
translates into more than about 100 extra lbs.
than yours and would
> therefore shed weight
> quickly. Can anyone provide me any more direction
> on that? Perhaps a
> reference or something?
>
> Thanks again!
>
>
>
> On 4/11/06, Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> >
> > 1) Do you actually have enough places to stash
> > batteries in? (My Odyssey definitely does not,
> unless
> > I take out the rear (ie 3rd) seat permanently.
> > 2) Is it a stick? Most minivans, excepting Dodge
> > Caravans, are automatics.
> > 3) What _is_ the weight? Take GVWR and subtract
> > cargo capacity, and you should get it. Then see
> if
> > you can make 1/3 of the vehicle weight batteries.
> Ie,
> > my Civic was 2220 lbs, stripped of ICE components.
> > Now as an EV, it's 3330.
> > peace,
> >
> > --- Brian Kardell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > My family has owned a 1997 Mazda MPV for many
> > > years, but we blew the engine
> > > about a year ago and it has been sitting in our
> > > driveway ever since. We
> > > decided to look into converting it into an
> > > alternative energy vehicle rather
> > > than just buying a new engine or scrapping it.
> Our
> > > kids are homeschooled
> > > and we thought that it would be very educational
> all
> > > around, we would get to
> > > keep our beloved mini-van, save the planet from
> a
> > > little pollution and
> > > potentially wrestle ourselves from the soaring
> cost
> > > of petro-fuels. As we
> > > are newbies to this subject, we are sort of in
> the
> > > dark.
> > >
> > > We were (are) very interested in BioDiesel, but
> from
> > > the data that we've
> > > found, it seems that it is not possible to
> convert a
> > > gasoline powered car by
> > > simply installing a diesel engine - so
> apparently
> > > that is not an option with
> > > the MPV. Ethanol seems like a good option since
> the
> > > conversion looks fairly
> > > straightforward and cheap, but is really
> predicated
> > > on having a reliable,
> > > working engine. Since the MPV is old and heavy
> I am
> > > a little concerned
> > > about investing so much money to get it running
> well
> > > again. EV seems like a
> > > _great_ option in terms of being maintenable,
> but I
> > > am concerned that it is
> > > too heavy. Given the size of the vehicle,
> however,
> > > I am wondering how much
> > > of the weight is currently in hardware that we
> would
> > > be removing anyway.
> > >
> > > Can anyone give us some advice.
> > >
> > > Thanks!
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > '92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V (video or DVD
> available)!
> > www.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
> > ____
> > __/__|__\ __
> > =D-------/ - - \
> > 'O'-----'O'-'
> > Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe
> came out of the steering
> > wheel? Are you saving any gas for your kids?
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
> protection around
> > http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
> >
>
>
'92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V (video or DVD available)!
www.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel?
Are you saving any gas for your kids?
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2006 8:16 AM
Subject: Re: MG Run data.
( Snipabit)
> Ken has stories Audio Taped that really tell some of the real story...
>
> And yes the best shots of the whole shoot were never shown.
>
Hi EVerybody;
Chiming in a bit late on this one. Show aired at 8PM Eastern, got the
Vhs recorder setup. The cheepo DVD I have is too much of a pain in the ass
to record with. Microscopic size remote , zillion buttons, about 4 actually
DO something. need to put it under a microscope to figure out what they are
for. Hmmm... sorta like Monster Garage. I got a reasonable copy, but came
away with a feeling that I just had cotton candy for dinner!
Shawn and Rich, youse guyz were GREAT!It must have tried your endurance
to put up with the MG guyz. Who made all the cracks about EV's they could.
That they didn't catch a few Milwaukee batteries between the eyes! Best part
of the show was the T Zero ride, Rich's EV grin upon landing, Tom Gage's
shot. That shot sequence they couldn't demean, like they tried to in the
rest of the pogram.(program).And Shawn's comment that his Mom ran in NEDRA,
set the record. To Joe Sixpack, NEDRA comment went by too fast to be
noticed. Gees! they coulda put NEDRA'S Web link on the screen?
The car of choice was not exactly a good doner car, Gees! Maybe they
coulda used, say, a 62 Ford Falcon, a 2300 lb beast or a old Mustang, been
1000's of LBs lighter.Sigh! Too bad that Jim Husted at Hy Torque didn't go
over and" siamiese" those old GE's. Making fun of wood as an insulater?
Hell, the third rail RR's around here ALL use Cherry wood third rail beams
bolted to the non sprung part of the electric railway cars, for the 600-700
volt DC power rails. So that E cars can run in the rain, they are glyptoled
brick red, all the spring loaded 3rd rail paraphenalia is simply bolted to
the wood.They don't wear out. Hell, I changed enough of them in my Shop
Daze! They are damaged, mostly debris on the track, damaged or out ofline
rail, busts them up, rather have kindling wood rather than derailed train.
If they were attached to the sprung part of the car's running gear, you
would have pickup bounce when the car's suspension did it's thing! So I
think that Shawn's decision to go wood was a brilliant solution, but DRY
wood was the key!85 lbs for that little 2 by 4 frame was a dead givaway as
to the wood being mostly water! Like that pressure treated green stuff ya
buy for a deck, it is almost DRIPPING when you bring it home! Make a frame
out of that and it WILL weight 85 lbs!
But the usual, "NO TIME" thing, like in Gone Postal Pogram. The way EV's
are sorta presented as a tongue in cheek comedy thing. Monster Garage did a
great, I thought, show on Steam boats, cute open launches, and the fun race
scene. I'll bet anmong the Steamboat guyz that they think it was a good
show? Myles? Our resident steam boat guy?
I'll bet that the Milwaukee Car could have kicked Ron's hemi's ass, and
to be fair to have run the Zombie, then the Current Elininater. But as
pointed out elsewhere the MG car never got dialed in. Had Shawn an' Rich had
a day to play?? More, too much wheelslip! WHYTHEHELL didn't they do the
Wayland signitire Brake stand, for show, of course and to warm up the tires,
getting them nice and hot, sticky? They were getting TOO much wheelslip on
launch!Like an electric train in the rain!That car needed a designated
driver! You just don't dump all yur power on at once! Had Rich or Shawn
driven it?If I coulda choriographed things,:cut to BIG cloud of tire smoke.
White Zombie eases up to the Tree, next to Ron's Hemi. Zombie runs away off
the line leaving Ron going " Huh"? By then John or Tim is hundreds of feet
down the trak, game over! Then a little E rail, Dennis, drifts up to the
tree. He runs alone, against the Clock. Then they say this is the state of
the art of EV racing. Now THAT'S Entertainment!
Got me thinking, we COULD do a Do Over show with our Vid clips spliced
into the MG thing? Yeah, I'm preaching to the Choir here. But there have
been many a time I have brought John Bryan's great old Woodburn Vid's out
for local Joe Sixpack type folks, like plopping a TV VCR combo on top of the
Rabbit at local car shows, almost wore out the racing shots of Zombie and
others, Maniac Mazda beating gassers.Our newer vids show the progress made
in the last few years!
Bottom line, a 5000 lb, gees! That's a Zombie( unit of measurment) hevier
than my Rabbit, well, almost, it is pretty damn amazing that it went as fast
as it did. Thanks is due Milwaukee Tools for sponsoring the whole thing.
Didn't ya like the Milwaukee ad with the guy tightning the lug nuts on the
Mini? I thought it was great! BTW how far would the Checvy have gone as a
daily driver?? And had Rich been able to hook up his chargers to it. He DID
get a mini plug as they DID mention Mananzita Micro. RAH!
Shameless plug here. Milwaukee makes GREAT tools. Have a Sawz All, I
have voted it "Most Useful Tool On The Planet" many tines, and I bought it ,
busted, dead switch, for 10 bux , in a tag sale, years ago. Want a new
window in the house, draw lines, on the siding, and saw it out! Wanna thank
the Good Folks at Milwaukee for making it happen. Now if you could get
those battery's in a GP 27 size 12 volters? Who makes them for Milwaukee, or
they do them themselves? Would Tom Gage consider a few hundred of them for
the T Zero?? Are they REALLY a breakthrough in battery technology? I would
guess that a good part of the MG car's weight was/is batteries?So it MIGHT
have a useful range as a "grocery getter" EV?So many unanswered
questions.Sigh!
So it's all over for Monster Garage? Ugly vicious rumer that they are
all done? Before the White Zombie and Current Elininater story's could be
aired? Sheesh! Here are two wildly successful EV's and NO TV time. What
happened to the " Fair and Balanced" stuff?We can't have EV's shown in TOO
favorable a light.
OK I'll stop, before getting in to that!
My two cells worth!
Bob, Seeya at Joliet!
>
--- End Message ---
