EV Digest 5381
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) RE: Battery & Charging conference
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) RE: Knee Point - Does anyone understand this?
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Volkswagen CWDE or CCWDE rotation motor?
by [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Brad Baylor)
4) Re: EV Grin Coming Back
by Stefan Peters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Pack cooling/heating conduit
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Otmar's motor speed sensor - where to buy?
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Avcon issues
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
8) Breaking in new batteries
by Calvin King <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Regen. with a controller
by "jmygann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Some problems to solve
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Looking for a GEM Utility - Bay Area, CA
by "J Mac" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Volkswagen CWDE or CCWDE rotation motor?
by Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: longest range?Short Stories.
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
by "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Volkswagen CWDE or CCWDE rotation motor?
by [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Brad Baylor)
16) Re: Otmar's motor speed sensor - where to buy?
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
18) RE: Pack cooling/heating conduit
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: longest range?
by "steve clunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Otmar's motor speed sensor - where to buy?
by Otmar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: GE 9 inch motor for EV
by Bill & Nancy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Half-way there....
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) RE: Dead e-meter
by "Garret Maki" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: Otmar's motor speed sensor - where to buy?
by Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- Begin Message ---
Mike Phillips [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I attended a webcast of a similar nature. I was most hopeful
> about Lithium Manganese. Any word on that at your conference?
No. Gold Peak did a presentation on their GP1865L260 LiCoNiO2 cells
(the notable feature of which is energy density comparable to LiSO2
primary cells), but I don't recall hearing anything about Lithium
Manganese in any of the presenations.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Dale Curren [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> The following is a quote from my controller manual.
> It has a setting that is not clear to me.
> This is controlling a shunt motor. What does it mean by "START" ?
> Does it mean that field weakening starts to gradually kick in
> at some point? Or, as the next sentence implies, at some
> point all FW is fully in effect? It seems contradictory to me.
Field current is generally controlled as a function of armature current,
so, yes, the field "weakening" starts to kick in gradually and ramps
until it is fully "in".
I think "weakening" may be the confusing thing here. If you just think
of it as the field current ramping up as armature current ramps up, it
might seem clearer.
It sounds like you have a GE controller, and I'm not familiar with their
configuration options, but the general behaviour is that there is some
minimum field current value that must always be provided to the motor.
Lowering this minimum field current can raise the motor RPM and vehicle
top speed, but if you go below the motor manufacturer's recommended
limit you may destroy the motor with arcing. As armature current
increases, the field current remains constant at this minimum value
until the armature current exceeds some threshold (determined by the
parameter you are configuring). As the armature current continues to
increase beyond this point, the field current also increases, according
to whatever map or ramp rates your controller allows you to program.
Eventually the field current reaches some maximum level, and remains at
that level no matter how much higher the armature current climbs.
Hope this helps,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I can't seem to find this answer online. I'm trying to figure out
which version of the Warp I should buy- timed for clockwise, or for
counter-clockwise rotation. It'll be for a '87 VW Jetta that had the
1.8L engine. The battery is long dead and I can't turn over the engine
to figure it out. And I want to be sure to get the right one.
Brad in Tampa
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Nick Viera wrote:
Hi Bob,
You wrote:
I figure that if it is strong enough to lube Zombies' gears, It would
handle Rabbit gears, just fine? Amzoil? Purple something?It was about
8 bux a quart, but maybe ya get what you pay for?
Maybe you're thinking of Royal Purple? They make a really good line of
synthetic gear oils. Expensive; yes... but I like it! When I replaced
the 80W90 gear oil in my Jeep's differentials with Royal Purple it did
make a notable difference in efficiency (mainly because this was
during the winter, and the 80W90 was thick as hell)
Slightly OT question: Which allows better efficiency, Royal Purple or
Red Line?
I know that Red Line has tested to resist brakedown at a much higher
temp (good for severe racing), but which is "slipperier"? A couple of
Honda performance related forums brought up that any tiny manual
transmission leaks become very apparent when switching to Red Line, so
maybe it will allow for higher efficiency?
Anyone have test data or personal experience?
~ Peanut Gallery ~
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Mon, 17 Apr 2006 09:47:04 -0700 (PDT), Fortunat Mueller
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>but note, corrugated plastic is flammable.
>
>I didn't think that would be a problem in an EV (what
>burns in an EV?), but it was. When my controller
>failed earlier this year, the pressure inside the
>controller was enough to make it spit the plastic end
>cap (opposite the terminals). This cap landed on my
>Coroplast belly pan and was hot enough to ignite it.
>
>I didn't notice until a friendly passerby hollered out
>his car window, 'your car is on fire'.
There's a version of this stuff with a thin aluminum cladding. I
believe that it is called Alumaclad, though I'm not sure since I
haven't bought any in several years. This is also a sign making
material and is available from the same suppliers.
John
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.-Ralph Waldo Emerson
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I too want to use the aux shaft later, for Air Conditioning Does anyone
know if the GM crank sensors work with the zilla? I know we would have
to make a new sheet metal reluctor to get 4/rev instead of the stock 7
pulses/rev.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
My Ranger has been sitting all day with the yellow warning light and no charge!
I tried 4 different Avcon controllers, and every one says "the EV is not
connected", although one did clunk its contactor, then say it was connected for
zero seconds. I've cleaned the input's pins, but don't know what else to do --
ideas?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Steve Clunn wrote: Keep an eye on your volt meter , a e meter is
good so you can see the ah .
I am keeping an eye on my amp meter and continue keeping it under a
100 amps even on acceleration (most of the time).
Then volt meter is a different matter. I connected the meters as the
original schematic showed. (I am using the original meters.) I
don't know what is suppose to do, but what happens is when I
accelerate, the 'percent of charge' meter drops dramatically and when
I remove my foot from the accelerator it returns to 100%. Is this
what it is suppose to do?
Still Working in Confusion,
Calvin King
'81 Jet Electrica
108 volts (18 - 6 volt Workaholic [USB])
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If I have a Alltrax 7245 and a DC shunt motor can I use a diode to get
regeneration back to the battery pack ?? 48 volts
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks, that is what I thought. I remember talking to you earlier, but
forgot to write down what I needed. I think with the MK2b and the ole
#92 pfc, the rapisd cycling also causes the regs to heat up fast, trip
the timer early and chronically undercharge the pack. I think that is
why I had turned sw4 off before and let the timer restart a few times.
http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_1/chpt_8/9.html
I have always know it as a kelvin connection, (Maybe the same guy?)
Does anyone make a co-extruded wire with the sense wires and the current
wires in the same insulation?
I think I want to mount all the regs up front in a water tight but
cooled box. or maybe I should just put the darn batteries in a box and
solve 2 problems at once! front batteries get cold faster than rear pack.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
LR et al,
Am out of town til next week.
Can post answers to all questions when I return (don't have all the info
with me now).
Thanks!
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Looking for a GEM Utility - Bay Area, CA
Date: Sat, 15 Apr 2006 10:32:01 -0700
You might be better off designing a vehicle to meet your range & weight
needs. Sounds heavy. Calculate distance needed to travel. How much will
the freezer unit weight? HOw will you keep it cold. You need to calculate
this. A propane freezer might be needed along with the electric truck you
will use. The NEV might work but you really need to figure things out
first. Let us know what you are up to with the weight of the freezer and
we might be better able to help you. LR.......
----- Original Message ----- From: "J Mac" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, April 14, 2006 9:48 PM
Subject: Re: Looking for a GEM Utility - Bay Area, CA
I need a long bed utility for my business.
I sell ice cream, so the freezer would go on the back & we'd double up the
batteries to extend range & give it more power.
Suggestions .. thoughts .. ideas are welcome!
Thanks,
Mac
From: bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: evlist <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Looking for a GEM Utility - Bay Area, CA
Date: Fri, 14 Apr 2006 10:52:19 -0700 (PDT)
[IMHO: why?]
nevs discussion group has nevs for sale on it
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/NEVs/
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 05:01 PM 4/17/2006, you wrote:
I can't seem to find this answer online. I'm trying to figure out
which version of the Warp I should buy- timed for clockwise, or for
counter-clockwise rotation. It'll be for a '87 VW Jetta that had the
1.8L engine. The battery is long dead and I can't turn over the engine
to figure it out. And I want to be sure to get the right one.
CCW. This is the default setting.
Mike Brown
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Electro Automotive" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 12:43 PM
Subject: Re: longest range?
> At 07:55 AM 4/17/2006, you wrote:
> >What is the longest range everyone has gotten on their ev? If you've
gotten
> >over 60, definitely let me know.
> >
> >Thanks, Alan
>
Hi Alan
OK, ya asked. I did 102 smiles, or Slow Miles in my 120 volt T 145
powered Rabbit two summers ago when that set of T 145's were in their prime.
I made a run up to Hartford, to meet an old Army buddy in town a nite. Drove
to his Motel, stayed about an hour, charging at a found 120 volt outlet.
Turned the variac down to 10 amps, so as not to blow it. We went out to a
nice Italian place a few miles away. Gees! Another outlet, on their wall,
just dripping with juice so plugged it in, for dinner. WE went in for
dinner, too. About an hour, then home again, dropping John off at the Motel,
and rolling on, headed for home. Ah! Down hill, north to south! Trying to
stay around 100 amps @ 50-55 or so, hogging the right lane. Got home, with
about 70 miles, Oh lets go for MORE!!! I drove arond my slocal roads, til
the Odermeter rolled over 100, then up the driveway on about 90 volts. Was
quite pleased with tyhe T 145's!
Fast forward to today, out driving around lightly on my new set of T
145's trying to brake them in lightly, mo squeeling out or 400 amp launches,
I stayed well below 200 AMPS not MPH<g>!Car just wafts along, and this is
BEFORE I get the front end aligned! I put it back together after a new wheel
bearing, new wrack-n-pinion gearbox, new lower ball joints and shocks. I
must be close as car seems to handle alright, and I KNOW I'm drawing less
amps than before!Oh yeah, a rebuilt Axle shaft, too. I THOUGHT it was
getting noisy, outer seal was shot, so it had been lapping in or OUT as the
case probably was. You find all these surp[rises when you are under the car
doing OTHER stuff. Well, it's an old shitbox of a car, so you expect this
sort of stuff. Using the car an an EV, I believe, puts more strain on the
running gear, A Diseasel Rabbit would NEVER take off in second, willingly,
that is.
Other trips WITHOUT a charge, I have done about 70 miles, a RT to New
Haven a few times , but having gone shopping so car didn't just run til it
dropped. I TOWED a dead Audi 4000 to Old Saybrook, omn a rope when I just
GAVE it to a carpenter guy I had helping me. it had, I THINK slipped a tooth
or two on the timing belt. It would almost start, and stutter along, like it
was on one cylinder. I HATE working on greasy old gas rigs. I said, " Get it
OUT of my Life" So he sed he'd take it. Gees! That was easy, sometimes you
can give things away, but that isn't always easy.We figured that it would
cost about 50 bux to tow it 24 miles to Old Saybrook, so I got out my trusty
nylon towrope and hooked up the Rabbit. I figured it would be faster and
easier just to tow down the freeway at 55-60mph, and be done with it. Car
HAD tags, and was street legal. In CT yuo arent supposed to even TOW a non
tagged car, like if there is no engine or car won't run, you can STILL get a
ticket. The local cops bag people everyday, for towing an unregistered cars.
I never understood their reasoning, as you arent "Driving" it, but
transporting it. It can't go on it's own.So ya need a trailer. A Tow Dolly?
Maybe I don't know. No cops around, the local's don't "do" the freeway, so
we were home free. Electrics tow just fine. Hell, electric locomotives are
fine movers too. Same principle.I'm SURE towing with a rope is illegal,
too?" But I'm just rescuing my friend" I was ready to tell the cop that
might have pulled me over.
New Haven has a famous Quiniapac Bridge, a minument of poor freeway
planning, built in the 50's with the stupid left lane "on" ramps on blind
curves. We natives are USED to it, and like a pothole that has been in a
road for YEARS we work around it.Seems like alota vehicles sorta die there
and plug a lane. Can you say Instand Mega traffic jam, of biblical
proportions. Hate to see that happen and I have often pulled right up to the
dead car, IF the bumpers match, yell at the guy" I'll push ya over to East
Haven, drop off at Gas station row, gotta get you outta here!!" They get an
EV grin, too, as you don't want to be stranded up there!!Ah, the mighty DC
torque, you get 'em rolling 25-30quickly, with emergency flashers on,
dignity intact, you get out of harms way. You should see the expressions of
surprise when they see they have been pushed around by an electric car.
Better than an EV Grin, almost. Especially if the guyz car is shot and he
calls a wrecker to collect it tomorrow and ya give him a ride home. One
thing that isn't really a surprise ,if ya PUSH hard with the Rabbit the
energy absorbing bumper pushes 'IN' all the way! You have to "recock "it
when ya get home, like chain the car to a tree and pull it back out. Such a
simple thing. Why don't they do that nowadaze? Hell, my Prius doesn't EVen
HAVE a bumper! Just the fony balony plastic thing, I'm sure would shatter if
it got hit?And cost a zillion bux to replace? A nice thing about trux, they
usually have decent bumpers.Something to attach a trailer hitch to. The
Prius? not much to bolt to.Your miliage would sure go to Hell, if you towed
a 3100lb EV with it<g>!I HAVE towed the dead Rabbit home a few times with
the Prius, It didn't seem to care.
So, as they say; YMMV and how soft a foot on the "Go" pedal, but there
should be a buncha others thast have done 60 plus miles.Step up to the
plate!
My two miles worth.
Bob
> One of our customers got 126 miles in a rally in a 120V Porsche 914.
>
> Shari Prange
> Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
> http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It would be tricky to make Li-Ion batteries withstand the current
surge of a by-pass contactor. Unless you went with a different
control system, (like twin Zilla's or something) Li-Ion batteries
might be a problem for the CE. In general, you must load Li-Ion cells
within carefully prescribed limits.
The 18650 laptop cells that folks have suggested could overheat
internally if you draw too much current for more than just an
instant. Once these laptop cells get too hot, it is like lighting the
fuse on a road flare.
One of the duties of a typical Li-Ion BMS is to protect the
cells from too much current during discharge. I can't imagine how you
could make that work with a by-pass contactor type system. Perhaps it
can be done, but it would not be simple, that is for sure.
Bill Dube'
At 03:39 PM 4/17/2006, you wrote:
In a message dated 4/17/06 2:22:05 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
Date: 4/17/06 2:22:05 PM Pacific Daylight Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rich Rudman)
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Just what makes you think you are so Special Dennis???
The rest of us have to make our own BMS...
Why not you???
Those little modular chargers are in effect a prettey Good BMS. So you
already have what you need for Lead.
The Lion stuff needs a BMS or a LOT of little chargers.. Heck a stack of
those Z28 Lions and 6 chargers.. and well Looky here..
You too can play with Lions...
That should be simple enough for you.
It might take you more than 15 minutes to Bilk charge....I expect..
Madman
\----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 1:44 PM
Subject: Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
. Dennis Berube >>
> ***To much work and money for me to just rebreak my own record.At this
point
> I should not be paying for batteries or the bms. D.Berube >>
**Rich I am not special and I have my own bulk and bms for lead which I paid
for.The CE has been very sucessful both on the track and on the trade show
circuit and I think it still has the all out record,so if a litho
co.wants me to
rebreak the old record they can supply the goods.Now if you or someone else
takes that measly 8 second record I will spend my own money again to
rebreak the
record... Dennis
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>CCW. This is the default setting.
Thanks for the info!
Brad in Tampa
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Jeff,
I have ask Otmar about using the GM crank sensor, The type that went on the
front of the damper wheel. He said the magnets are too far space apart.
You must maintain a space ratio of not more than 3 to 1, meaning if a magnet
is 1/2 wide, the space to the next magnet cannot be more than 1.5 inch.
I also ask Otmar to look at the MSD tachometer drivers that also mounted to
the damper wheel, and again he said that this would not work with that large
diameter.
You could move the magnets in a smaller circle and make sure you do not go
over the 3 to 1 ratio of spacing.
I noted that you are driving you're A/C off the pilot shaft of the motor. I
also doing that, but I'am using another electric clutch off the pilot shaft
of the motor, so I can disconnect all my accessories from the motor.
My A/C, a Inverter Alternator that provides duel 12 V DC and 120 VAC 60 Hz
at the same time, power steering, and a vacuum pump. When my motor is under
power, the pilot shaft is disconnected from the accessory drive and a 180
volt Honeywell motor drives the accessories.
I have the option by selecting different modes of operation by using a bank
of control switches, when the motor is not under power, a micro switch in
the accelerator control turns on the electric clutch on the pilot shaft and
turns off the Honeywell motor. This allows a mechanical REGEN which allows
to run the accessories with no power from the batteries.
In this country, Montana, this is a safety item, when coasting down a long
icy hill. This mechanical REGEN has the same feel as compression braking of
a engine.
The sensor pick up has to be a non-latching type where it is normally on.
It only opens up when the negative of the magnet go across the magnet face.
To test the unit I made, I install a short length of the same size shaft in
to the split collar I made and spin the disk in a drill press or lathe.
Position the pick up sensor, apply 12 volts to the red and black wire and
record the continuity of the green or blue to black. You will see the
pulses at the lower speeds on a DMM or a scope at higher speeds.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Shanab" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 8:23 PM
Subject: Re: Otmar's motor speed sensor - where to buy?
> I too want to use the aux shaft later, for Air Conditioning Does anyone
> know if the GM crank sensors work with the zilla? I know we would have
> to make a new sheet metal reluctor to get 4/rev instead of the stock 7
> pulses/rev.
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In a message dated 4/17/06 8:42:49 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
Date: 4/17/06 8:42:49 PM Pacific Daylight Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
It would be tricky to make Li-Ion batteries withstand the current
surge of a by-pass contactor. Unless you went with a different
control system, (like twin Zilla's or something) Li-Ion batteries
might be a problem for the CE. In general, you must load Li-Ion cells
within carefully prescribed limits.
The 18650 laptop cells that folks have suggested could overheat
internally if you draw too much current for more than just an
instant. Once these laptop cells get too hot, it is like lighting the
fuse on a road flare.
One of the duties of a typical Li-Ion BMS is to protect the
cells from too much current during discharge. I can't imagine how you
could make that work with a by-pass contactor type system. Perhaps it
can be done, but it would not be simple, that is for sure.
Bill Dube' >>
*******BILL And ALL,THERE ARE NO, REPEAT (NO) BY PASS CONTACTORS on the
Current Eliminator and there has NEVER been bypass contactors on the CE...With
the
exception of field bypass.She ran 8.801 with 900 battery amps and 28 Inspira
batteries in series. Its the motor work Bill!!! Dennis Berube with 4000+
safe qt.mi. runs
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Not sure that you'd want metal clad
flammable stuff to separate batteries....
You just added an ignition source!
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Neon John
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 6:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Pack cooling/heating conduit
On Mon, 17 Apr 2006 09:47:04 -0700 (PDT), Fortunat Mueller
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>but note, corrugated plastic is flammable.
>
>I didn't think that would be a problem in an EV (what
>burns in an EV?), but it was. When my controller
>failed earlier this year, the pressure inside the
>controller was enough to make it spit the plastic end
>cap (opposite the terminals). This cap landed on my
>Coroplast belly pan and was hot enough to ignite it.
>
>I didn't notice until a friendly passerby hollered out
>his car window, 'your car is on fire'.
There's a version of this stuff with a thin aluminum cladding. I
believe that it is called Alumaclad, though I'm not sure since I
haven't bought any in several years. This is also a sign making
material and is available from the same suppliers.
John
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.-Ralph Waldo Emerson
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I drove my Mazda pu 100 miles to get in the 100 mile on a charge club in
http://www.grassrootsev.com/100club.htm it has 40 golf cart batteries .
steve clunn
----- Original Message -----
From: "Alan Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 10:55 AM
Subject: longest range?
What is the longest range everyone has gotten on their ev? If you've
gotten
over 60, definitely let me know.
Thanks, Alan
--
// Quotes from yours truly -------------------------
"You don't forget, you just don't remember."
"Maturity resides in the mind."
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It would be tricky to make Li-Ion batteries withstand the current
surge of a by-pass contactor. Unless you went with a different
control system, (like twin Zilla's or something) Li-Ion batteries
might be a problem for the CE. In general, you must load Li-Ion
cells within carefully prescribed limits.
The 18650 laptop cells that folks have suggested could overheat
internally if you draw too much current for more than just an
instant. Once these laptop cells get too hot, it is like lighting
the fuse on a road flare.
One of the duties of a typical Li-Ion BMS is to protect the
cells from too much current during discharge. I can't imagine how
you could make that work with a by-pass contactor type system.
Perhaps it can be done, but it would not be simple, that is for sure.
Bill,
From what you write it looks like you are under the impression that
the Current Eliminator uses a bypass contactor. I'm pretty sure it
does not. I've heard it doesn't use anywhere near the 2000 Amps that
the Zilla can put out to pull those times.
I suspect that the MG batteries would be pretty impressive in the
Current Eliminator, but as Dennis says, what's the use when you are
limited by a 7.5 second chassis?
--
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com/
The Zilla factory has moved to Corvallis Oregon.
Now accepting resumes. Please see:
http://www.cafeelectric.com/jobs.html
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Hello All,
There's been a bit of talk about the speed sensor the Hairball likes
to see, and some of it has been described in a way that is particular
to one situation, so I figure it's time I lay down the core data so
you all can determine what might work for you.
1) A speed sensor is not required to run the Zilla controller, but it
is highly recommended. It is required in order to use the over-speed
cutoff as well as the "stall detect" which protects your motor
commutator from people who try to "hill hold" with the motor.
2) The 2171 Hall effect sensor that I sell works quite well, but it
does not fit well for everyone. Pictures that clarify the
installation requirements are online in this directory:
http://cafeelectric.com/products/pics/Zoloxpics/
If you mount it like that then it should work well and you can ignore
the rest of this message.
3) The speed sensor input to the Hairball requires four pulses per
revolution. The Hairball pulls the sensor line up to 12V with a 2.61K
ohm resistor and the sensor pulls it low. It normally does this when
the magnet is in front of the sensor.
4) I stock have a stand alone hall effect sensor with loose magnets.
This is a experimental setup that can be made to work in situations
where the end of the motor shaft is not accessible. Picture of the
sensor here:
http://cafeelectric.com/images/HallSensor.jpg
This is the one that Roland is using, and I've not heard how well
it's working and I don't know if he has checked to insure it doesn't
drop out at very high RPM. But this is good for those who do not shy
away from making a ring of magnets and testing the system. If someone
else wants to try to fabricate around this system I do have sensors
and magnets in stock. Be aware though that I consider it experimental
since I have not checked the limits of such a system myself yet.
5) For those people who are not using the 2171S stock sensor and want
to make something else work this is the important timing information:
Since the signal needs to be filtered to remove noise from the
wiring, it is designed to work up to 12,000 RPM at 50% duty cycle.
You sharp onces have probably already figured out that you can drop
either the high or low duty cycle to 25% if you only need 6000 RPM.
But leave yourself at least a couple thousand RPM over your expected
max RPM for security.
Hopefully this covers most of the questions and makes it clear why
normal low duty cycle CDI pickups will not drive the input at higher
RPM.
Have fun!
--
-Otmar-
http://www.CafeElectric.com/
The Zilla factory has moved to Corvallis Oregon.
Now accepting resumes. Please see:
http://www.cafeelectric.com/jobs.html
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--- Begin Message ---
Thanks for the feedback on the GE motor. I haven't seen much mention of
them on the list, so thought I'd ask. It's at Jim Husted's for repair
and upgrade and will eventually be put in the Bradley GTE.
The car arrived Saturday, and I have started to work on it and search
for parts.
Bill
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Gee Bill maybe Dennis doesn't need to use bypass...
Or anything other than the Zilla and a few hundred Battery amps to bracket
race with.???
Oh and Excuse me For doing a Lion EV using 2 1800 amp GZillas, and no
bypassing...
And we defeated the internal current limits inside the V28 packs.
We only used 3600 amps of the 4200 that coulda been used.
Gee no road flares... no saftey, No breakers... Nuthing... We just flamed
out two 11.7 inch motors.. No battery damage.
If Dennis had 1/2 this pack we would be in the 7s before the Route 66 Event.
What's your excuse???
Madman
----- Original Message -----
From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 8:34 PM
Subject: Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
> It would be tricky to make Li-Ion batteries withstand the current
> surge of a by-pass contactor. Unless you went with a different
> control system, (like twin Zilla's or something) Li-Ion batteries
> might be a problem for the CE. In general, you must load Li-Ion cells
> within carefully prescribed limits.
>
> The 18650 laptop cells that folks have suggested could overheat
> internally if you draw too much current for more than just an
> instant. Once these laptop cells get too hot, it is like lighting the
> fuse on a road flare.
>
> One of the duties of a typical Li-Ion BMS is to protect the
> cells from too much current during discharge. I can't imagine how you
> could make that work with a by-pass contactor type system. Perhaps it
> can be done, but it would not be simple, that is for sure.
>
> Bill Dube'
>
>
> At 03:39 PM 4/17/2006, you wrote:
> >In a message dated 4/17/06 2:22:05 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
> >[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> >
> ><< Subj: Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
> > Date: 4/17/06 2:22:05 PM Pacific Daylight Time
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rich Rudman)
> > Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Reply-to: [email protected]
> > To: [email protected]
> >
> > Just what makes you think you are so Special Dennis???
> > The rest of us have to make our own BMS...
> > Why not you???
> >
> > Those little modular chargers are in effect a prettey Good BMS. So you
> > already have what you need for Lead.
> >
> > The Lion stuff needs a BMS or a LOT of little chargers.. Heck a stack
of
> > those Z28 Lions and 6 chargers.. and well Looky here..
> > You too can play with Lions...
> > That should be simple enough for you.
> > It might take you more than 15 minutes to Bilk charge....I expect..
> >
> > Madman
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > \----- Original Message -----
> > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: <[email protected]>
> > Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 1:44 PM
> > Subject: Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
> > . Dennis Berube >>
> > > ***To much work and money for me to just rebreak my own record.At
this
> > point
> > > I should not be paying for batteries or the bms. D.Berube >>
> >**Rich I am not special and I have my own bulk and bms for lead which I
paid
> >for.The CE has been very sucessful both on the track and on the trade
show
> >circuit and I think it still has the all out record,so if a litho
> >co.wants me to
> >rebreak the old record they can supply the goods.Now if you or someone
else
> >takes that measly 8 second record I will spend my own money again to
> >rebreak the
> >record... Dennis
>
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--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, April 17, 2006 9:22 PM
Subject: Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
> Bill Dube' >>
> *******BILL And ALL,THERE ARE NO, REPEAT (NO) BY PASS CONTACTORS on the
> Current Eliminator and there has NEVER been bypass contactors on the
CE...With the
> exception of field bypass.She ran 8.801 with 900 battery amps and 28
Inspira
> batteries in series. Its the motor work Bill!!! Dennis Berube with
4000+
> safe qt.mi. runs
>
Frankly we used 4 times the power Dennis used to Go 8.801, and were probably
getting close to if not exceding what Jim Ludiker and Ken Koch were using
on thier dragester.
Since.. we had the same two motors, and the same two controllers.. and
Lions.
Our rough guess was that the MG car was well ober 5000lbs.. and had a 3800
rpm Stall, This basicly robbed our launch, and even at that we had wheel
spin out beyond 200 Ft.
Yea a light chassis.. and a well done motor... and you don't need much real
power to get the JOB done.
I concur it's the Motors Stupid!!!
Madman
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--- Begin Message ---
I had lots of help
Or more correctly Jon Zick had LOTs of my help as well as everybody on the
team took thier stint stuffing plastic connectors and spacers and wires and
6-32 screws... and tossing copper Long Swords...
Madman
----- Original Message -----
From: "Christopher Zach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
>
> It's just dull as dirt. Rich, I have no idea how you interconnected all
> those Lithium batteries.
>
> Chris
>
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Xantrex charges $80/ hr for repair. They told me they can fix most
things in that one hour time frame. $80 min. charge.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mark Farver
Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2006 10:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Dead e-meter
I think I killed my Emeter.
To its credit, I did something stupid, and I probably deserve it. The
MR2 lacks good places to mount the emeter where the front panel buttons
are accessible. I've had the emeter unattractively ty-wrapped to the
top of the left dash pod as a stop gap for too long. So I gutted the
stock instrment cluster, and replaced the useless guages with a piece of
lexan for mounting the emeter on. Since the cluster will not allow me
to reach the front panel buttons I soldered one wire to each button and
carried them out of the case. A little testing showed that each button's
opposite side is common with the negative input terminal. So in theory
by grounding each wire to the emeter's ground (not the 12v frame ground)
I would be able to use remote buttons. The cruise control stalk has two
that might be ideal..
To make a long story short, I think one of the leads came in contact
with the chassis while I was hooking it up and now the emeter lights up
for a second and goes blank. The emeter makes a high pitched noise,
which leads my to suspect a power supply problem, but I measure +5v at
pins 1 and 2 of the connector leading to the display board. (and I
think I remember it always being noisy)
Can someone suggest something to test? Or should I give up?
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I have the long shaft motor and I just got my speed sensor. (Thanks Ryan!) At
this point I don't
have any plans to use the shaft but don't want to rule it out. Now, the sensor
housing is very
nice, but I was wondering if it could be modified so the shaft sticks through
it so the end of the
shaft was still usable for a pulley, etc? It would save me the trouble of
making an extension to
mount the sensor on the end of the shaft. I see two problems with this, but
they may not be too
bad.
First, the end of the sensor housing would have to be opened up, but it doesn't
LOOK like it would
be a problem. It's look like it's just a thin cap that can be easily drilled.
Second, you'd have to replace the magnet ring with one that fits between the
shaft and the sensor
housing. If there was a way to attach some small neodynium (sp?) magnets to the
shaft, wouldn't
they work? Maybe drill some small indents into the shaft and epoxy the magnets
in?
Dave Cover
--- Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2006 19:23:19 -0700
> From: Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: Otmar's motor speed sensor - where to buy?
>
> I too want to use the aux shaft later, for Air Conditioning Does anyone
> know if the GM crank sensors work with the zilla? I know we would have
> to make a new sheet metal reluctor to get 4/rev instead of the stock 7
> pulses/rev.
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In a message dated 4/17/06 10:36:11 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Re: Current Eliminator News/no hi power batts.this year
Date: 4/17/06 10:36:11 PM Pacific Daylight Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rich Rudman)
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Gee Bill maybe Dennis doesn't need to use bypass...
Or anything other than the Zilla and a few hundred Battery amps to bracket
race with.???****Bracket race zilla setup Lo batt volt limit 210 Battery amps
500
Oh and Excuse me For doing a Lion EV using 2 1800 amp GZillas, and no
bypassing...
And we defeated the internal current limits inside the V28 packs.
We only used 3600 amps of the 4200 that coulda been used.
Gee no road flares... no saftey, No breakers... Nuthing... We just flamed
out two 11.7 inch motors.. No battery damage.
If Dennis had 1/2 this pack we would be in the 7s before the Route 66 Event.
What's your excuse???
Madman >>
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