EV Digest 5646
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: HD Rabbit springs - where to buy?
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: who's reviving the electric car?an' Stuff.
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: unknown motor, questions for the Gurus
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: HD Rabbit springs - where to buy? not Radiater Springs?
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Aero shaft drive idea.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: OT re:WKTEC GM's Reply/Blog
by "Death to All Spammers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: OT re:WKTEC GM's Reply/Blog
by "Adrian DeLeon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Better range with low seat height
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: who's reviving the electric car?an' Stuff.
by "Death to All Spammers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: EV digest 5644
by "Adrian DeLeon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: who's reviving the electric car?
by "Adrian DeLeon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Zombie's New DC-DC, Chris Paine to Ride in White Zombie
by "Rush" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: unknown motor, questions for the Gurus
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Overheating Controller
by Jimmy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Jacking up the rear of a VoltsRabbit (WAS Re: creaky rear
struts in VoltsRabbit - slightly O.T.)
by Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: unknown motor, questions for the Gurus
by Matthew Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: unknown motor, questions for the Gurus
by Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: unknown motor, questions for the Gurus
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: unknown motor, questions for the Gurus
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Aero shaft drive idea.
by Nick Austin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: unknown motor, questions for the Gurus
by Matthew Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Aero shaft drive idea.
by Doug Weathers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Aero shaft drive idea.
by Doug Weathers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: HD Rabbit springs - where to buy? not Radiater Springs?
by "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Overheating Controller
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Aero shaft drive idea.
by "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Rev Gadget Nimh D Cell Pack
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: who's reviving the electric car?an' Stuff.
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) Re: Aero shaft drive idea.
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) Re: Rev Gadget Nimh D Cell Pack
by "Edward Ang" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
On Jul 11, 2006, at 3:16 PM, Adrian DeLeon wrote:
Any leads on where I can get stiffer springs for my '87 Cabriolet
(rabbit
convertible)? All I can find are autocross lowering springs. Would
something from one of the VW vans or pickups fit? I'm currently at 1400
lbs front and 1850 pounds rear!
The VW Pickup ones fit up front, but won't likely raise the front to
your taste (I replaced them in the VW Pickup I built after adding 7
golf cart batteries to the front.)
There are some fine VW A2 offerings (second generation Jetta, and
Golf.) I settled on 1992 (I think) Jetta GLI with automatic and AC
front springs. The ride height was slightly lower than a stock Rabbit
GTi. Part of the Pickup's rear battery weight was also on the front
tires; the front must have weighed around 1600 lb. This may work for
you.
The rear suspension of the VW Pickup is unlike any other VW, so I can't
help you there.
Paul G.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 9:28 AM
Subject: Re: who's reviving the electric car?
> The general public perception amazes and frustrates me. As I discus the
situation with our environment and electric vehicles with people, who
believe they are informed, I am reminded of two "jokes".
>
> Regarding global warming:
> A man accidentally falls off the top of the Empire State Building. As he
is falling and passes the 20th floor, he shrugs his shoulders and says, "Oh
well, so far so good".
>
> Regarding Electric Vehicles:
> The year is 1897 and you are walking along a city street. Up ahead you
witness two men in a heated discussion as they are looking over a new
Stanley Steamer automobile. As you approach, you hear one gentleman say,
"Ok, Ok, yes I understand how the boiler makes steam and the pressure goes
into this cylinder and pushes a piston that is connected to the wheels with
this rod thing. I understand how that makes the wheels go around". With a
puzzled frown and scratching his head, he continues, "But, as I look this
thing over, I still can't figure out where you hitch up the horses!"
>
> Ken
> Hi Ken an' EVerybody;
Reminds me of back in the 80's ,1800's ,when Electric Street Railways
were starting up, replacing, most of the time, already perfected horses,
Potential investors being of doubt IF the electricity could actually keep up
with a running car? Of course it can't ! Us EV guyz solved this problem with
bringing the electric aboard in batteries!
my too trolleys worth
Bob
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Tue, 11 Jul 2006 1:01 AM
> Subject: Re: who's reviving the electric car?
>
> More Stuff. Keep smilin'!
> >
> > If EVs just had the PR and marketing muscle behind them that
conventional
> > vehicles do. Dream on! ;-)
>
> Maybe that's what is needed - to create a Foundation
> for PR for EV's. Maybe some of those famous (rich:-) actors
> who were in the movie could give some seed money.
>
Wasn't that the Big reason Jay Leno couldn't get a EV-1? He woulda
givin General Murders millions of bux worth of free publicity?
> (Put an ad on during the Super Bowl :-)
Now THAT would have helped? I guess some people actually WATCH the silly
thing. Best part is the ads, anyhow!
>
> I have a colleague who says EV's aren't there yet,
> and can't work for him. He has a 25 mile commute.
> I pointed out that it's well within range of
> the RAV4EV...and he said, he sees one on the way
> to work. Then he said, what about sitting in traffic?
> and I said, an ICE gets 0 MPG in traffic, an EV
> uses even less Wh/mile in traffic.
> Yeah I used to keep up with those fast guyz in wall-to-wall traffic on the
Q Bridge. Anybody from the Least Coast knows that one!The 'Vette would
runble ahead 100 feet or so, and I would glide that same distance on 20-30
amps. Keeping my window shut so I could hear my Victrola record tapes!
> Um, are people lying to themselves,
> and not very good liars, or just suckers to
> believe the lies?
> Lying, Ha Ha? A political way of life<g>! Bridgeport CT home of PT
Barnum, " A sucker born every minute" Just down the rode a piece from New
Haven!
> (and, the Administrator of our company/facility said
> he would get me an outlet when I need it)
>
> Or just haul off and WIRE yourself one! Make it such a professional job
that they THINK it was put in for something important! I lettered the box;
"Pressure Washer" Looks good in a RR shop area<g>!Thought of "Flux
Crapaciter Charge Outlet" EVen RR people woulda seen through THAT one!
> Note, a PR campaign is not a silly idea. Remember,
> Firefox supporters raised enough money for a full (2-page)
> spread in a major newspaper.
All it takes is money. You read the New York Times? The " All the News
that Fit's , we Print" guyz and some of the nutty causes that actually BUY
FULL page ads. I would rather put the cost of a Page ad toward a startup EV
outfit.
But, if you are an old fart like me, Remember the first VW's that graced
our shores, back in the early 50's? They sold more cars than they could
build, WITHOUT any ads, for years, before those classic ads came out.
Remember; " Lemon!"" We also make a Funny Looking Car" Somebody actually
STOLE one!" "If it breaks down in Paducah" I hear ya grinning and chuckling
here. Fast Forward to nowaDAZE. General Murders didn't have to spend a dime
to ad the EV-1 It woulda sold itself! The AD money COULDA been put toward an
EV-2-3-4 and on. Maybe EVen a 4 see ter? So you could haul the brats to
school, soccer, all the enchanting places THEY Hafta go, EVery day . The
secret would be take orders, accept cash or check, DELIVER the damn car
fast, to a Saturn dealer near you. HAVE a few nice and juicy ones, sitting
around, outside,the front of the showroom,Demo's!! Showing the black tire
marks in the parking lot. Snapshots inside of people, coming back in
uncontrollable EV Grins! Hang those shots up inside! Think; Cheap ad budget.
Offer the car up as a one month lease to the doubting Thomases. And IF they
buy, ya give them the lease money back or roll it intio a payment or two.
Hell, people love to do car payments!And here is a car that would outlive
the payments. That is IF Rust-o-Matic isn't included. I'm sure it isn't
rocket science to make the godamn rocker panels and fender wells rust proof?
Like galvanizing them? Or making the thing out of carbon fiber or Fiberglas.
Never had a fiberglas boat rust out! Got a 40 year old Sunfish sailboat out
back, good as the day it was built, in Waterbury, Corrupticut, no less ,sez
so! No rust holes, be drafty as hell @ 600 mph! and streaks on airliners,
aluminum doesn't rust much ether.
My two ads worth.
Bob
> ________________________________________________________________________
> Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and
IM. All on demand. Always, almost Free.I GUESS?
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Matthew
I'm not familiar with that Leeson. All the ones I've done have been small 4
to 5 inchers rated at 24 to 36 volts. If it's anything like the ones I've seen
I doubt it will work for a motorcycle motor. Even if it drove it I believe
you'd toast it post haste. How big is this motor? I'm just wondering if it's
the same size just wound for the higher voltage. The info that it's rated as
intermittent in duty cycle on this motor is important. There are bigger pump
motors rated at 3 or 5 minutes and work fine for you guys. You guys don't load
the motor down like the lift does in that time so you're good. On this motor
(I am just guessing here) the holders and comm are not going to be able to
withstand the current of a full sized conversion.
But then again a scooter at 75 to 140 volts would be interesting, lmao. Send
a pic to me if you want, be fun for me to take a look, see how big or small it
is. If you go this route you and Deafscooter can have drag races, hehe. BTW
that data tag does leave a little open to speculation now doesn't it, lol.
Sorry I'm not more help.
Cya
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
Matthew Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I got a Leeson motor from work. The website doesn't seem to have
any info on it. I want to make an EVmotorcycle. Will this do it? Or,
just a scooter. Time for class. How do I figure HP? Max RPM?
what does FR, F.F, type, INS etc. mean? It spools up real nice and
quiet on 24 volts. It has brushes.
Leeson DC perminant magnet
Model - CM34D20NZ1C
volts - 75-140
rpm - VAR \
amps - VAR > Varies depending on amps and votages used?
H.P - VAR /
FR. - 34
amb - 40 degrees celcius
F.F - 1.38
type - DN
thermal protection HO1A
INS - H3
duty - INT
Matt Milliron
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/702
My daughter named it, "Pikachu". It's yellow and black,
electric and contains Japanese parts, so I went with it.
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 8:56 PM
Subject: Re: HD Rabbit springs - where to buy?
>
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 3:16 PM, Adrian DeLeon wrote:
>
> > Any leads on where I can get stiffer springs for my '87 Cabriolet
> > (rabbit
> > convertible)? All I can find are autocross lowering springs. Would
> > something from one of the VW vans or pickups fit? I'm currently at 1400
> > lbs front and 1850 pounds rear!
Hi Adrian;
Google" Coil Spring Specialties" It'll take ya right there. Tell them
how much EXTRA weight you are adding to the Rabbbit.I did, and the spring
they sent me were great, and not very expensive, too.You can talk to them,
tell them what ya had in mind.
Where getting Sprung was a pleasure.
Bob
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I just had an idea I'd like to run by the list. A shaft drive takes up room
typically where the batteries normally go. A loss of battery storage. Why
not flip the shaft sending it out the back behind the rear wheel. Make a
trailing cone to house it and the supporting structure. You would get aero
advantage and more batteries where you need them. Lawrence Rhodes
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> But not having a BMS doesn't make an EV less effiicient, just less
economical to operate. I take the point of this thread as refuting the
GM claims suggesting FCV's being the wave of the future.
>
Those that use flooded batteries don't really need a BMS, and the OEM
RAV4 and Ranger EVs already have one. Add to that a handfull of
self-starting experimenters, LeeHartologists, and Rudmanites, and
there are certainly more than a few road-going EVs with some level of BMS.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Wed, 12 Jul 2006 17:48:11 -0700, "Mike Phillips"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Do you guys know of a reliable web source about the energy it takes to
make hydrogen?
Here's a good scientific type of paper -
http://www.modenergy.com/BEVs%20vs%20FCVs%20EavesEaves%20120603.pdf
It makes a case for BEVs vs FCVs using (theoretical) 135 HP, 300 mile
range vehicles. Done by a university prof.
Adrian
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Got any specs on that? I can't find anything on the web. Lawrence
Rhodes...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jody Dewey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 3:51 PM
Subject: RE: Better range with low seat height
> Actually on CoolFuel Roadtrip the EV Chopper was getting 60 miles per
charge
> pretty regularly. I believe he was running 120V system with Etek motor.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Lawrence Rhodes
> Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2006 1:36 PM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Better range with low seat height
>
>
> To all who have tried to get good range on motorcycles at freeway speeds I
> think the chopper style bike has the most potential from an efficiency
> perspective. With a lower seat and feet forward you offer a better angle
to
> windward. I noticed a Honda Shadow 750 getting over 60mpg. This rivals
my
> 250cc Honda Helix. I know some of you don't agree with comparing MPG to
> range but it works for me and I am considering a Honda Shadow conversion
for
> my next bike. Lawrence Rhodes......
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Reminds me of back in the 80's ,1800's ,when Electric Street
Railways
> were starting up, replacing, most of the time, already perfected horses,
> Potential investors being of doubt IF the electricity could actually
keep up
> with a running car? Of course it can't ! Us EV guyz solved this
problem with
> bringing the electric aboard in batteries!
>
Horses would be "more perfect" if they didn't leave droppings - they
didn't have those poo-catching horse-butt-slings in the 1880's.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Wed, 12 Jul 2006 11:56:43 -0700, Mike Phillips" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
More is better obviously, but there are not enough active EV's using
what there is already. Some of the power units have a memory in them
that tracks useage. Some are still at Zero after 5 years.
Picture it a little differently. Only a small percentage of hotel users
actually use the wireless internet facilities, but hotel billboards
advertise "WiFi" or "Free WiFi" all over the place. I don't own a laptop,
but I know what WiFi is, and that I can get it at most hotels, Starbucks,
libraries, etc.
Now do the same for EVs. The KOA campground thing would be a great start -
imagine KOA billboards advertising "EV charging available". Even if no EVs
ever get charged at a KOA (aren't most of them in the middle of nowhere?),
the resulting EV exposure goes way up. Once the billboard is amended it's
free advertising. The beauty here is that no actual charging stations need
to be built!
Before I knew EVs existed I knew you could charge them at Costco (and a
few other random places in town) becaue of the charging station signs. I
always figured they were for random city vehicles or golf carts...
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
(sorry, I forgot to change the subject line last time)
On Wed, 12 Jul 2006 11:56:43 -0700, Mike Phillips" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
More is better obviously, but there are not enough active EV's using
what there is already. Some of the power units have a memory in them
that tracks useage. Some are still at Zero after 5 years.
Picture it a little differently. Only a small percentage of hotel users
actually use the wireless internet facilities, but hotel billboards
advertise "WiFi" or "Free WiFi" all over the place. I don't own a laptop,
but I know what WiFi is, and that I can get it at most hotels, Starbucks,
libraries, etc.
Now do the same for EVs. The KOA campground thing would be a great start -
imagine KOA billboards advertising "EV charging available". Even if no EVs
ever get charged at a KOA (aren't most of them in the middle of nowhere?),
the resulting EV exposure goes way up. Once the billboard is amended it's
free advertising. The beauty here is that no actual charging stations need
to be built!
Before I knew EVs existed I knew you could charge them at Costco (and a
few other random places in town) becaue of the charging station signs. I
always figured they were for random city vehicles or golf carts...
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
John,
Very nice, love the neatness and simple layout you have...
Rush
Tucson AZ
www.ironandwood.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Wayland" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, July 10, 2006 1:44 PM
Subject: Zombie's New DC-DC, Chris Paine to Ride in White Zombie
> Hello to All,
>
> Just a quick note to let everyone know pictures of Chris Brune's high
> voltage capable DC-DC converter, as installed in White Zombie, are up at
> the Plasma Boy Racing web page, listed as a sub album in the 'Photos'
> section, under 'White Zombie'. The DC-DC converter works very well.
> Thanks to Chris Brune for his support and help. Look for a more detailed
> report later this week, once I get the back in town and have a chance to
> do some nighttime driving.
>
> Speaking of nighttime driving....Chris Paine (Director, WKTEC) will be a
> passenger, as White Zombie will be on display at the Portland Premiere
> of 'Who Killed the Electric Car' Wednesday of this week at Portland's
> Hollywood Theater, and he's setting aside time for a Zombie demo
> ride....shoot be fun!
>
> See Ya....John Wayland
>
> http://www.plasmaboyracing.com
>
> Chris Brune wrote:
>
>>I hope someone who can make it on Friday can get some pictures of the
>>mounting location. John always does a clean and professional job of
>>mounting the electronics in his cars.
>>
>>If someone does get a picture please post somewhere. I didn't actually get
>>a chance to take any pictures of the outside of the unit. I took several of
>>the inside so I would remember what I did. ;-)
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
according to this link,
http://www.leeson.com/cgi-bin/fetchpdf.cgi?/literature/bulletins/pdf/1600/32-35_dimensions.pdf
a 34 frame is 1.4" in diameter.
This is kind of strange, since Ametek sizes frame size
for small motors as 1/16" times the number. For
example a 64 frame is a 4" diameter stator (implying a
34 frame is 2.125"). I guess it doesn't matter,
because a 2.125" or 1.4" diameter stator rated at the
voltages you listed will not come even close to
powering a scooter.
I have some 12Vdc and 24Vdc motors that have frame
sizes in the range from 40 to 60 that would work much
better.
Let me know if you are interested, I'll sell them at
surplus prices (like $25 including shipping) if I can
get a few more EV projects on the road :-)
Rod
P.S. I also have 1 HP treadmill PM motors rated at 90
Vdc that have efficiency numbers up to 88% (yep, I
tested them on a dyno). These would work nicely for
accessory EV stuff like power steering on an EV.
--- Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hey Matthew
>
> I'm not familiar with that Leeson. All the ones
> I've done have been small 4 to 5 inchers rated at 24
> to 36 volts. If it's anything like the ones I've
> seen I doubt it will work for a motorcycle motor.
> Even if it drove it I believe you'd toast it post
> haste. How big is this motor? I'm just wondering
> if it's the same size just wound for the higher
> voltage. The info that it's rated as intermittent
> in duty cycle on this motor is important. There are
> bigger pump motors rated at 3 or 5 minutes and work
> fine for you guys. You guys don't load the motor
> down like the lift does in that time so you're good.
> On this motor (I am just guessing here) the holders
> and comm are not going to be able to withstand the
> current of a full sized conversion.
>
> But then again a scooter at 75 to 140 volts would
> be interesting, lmao. Send a pic to me if you want,
> be fun for me to take a look, see how big or small
> it is. If you go this route you and Deafscooter can
> have drag races, hehe. BTW that data tag does leave
> a little open to speculation now doesn't it, lol.
> Sorry I'm not more help.
> Cya
> Jim Husted
> Hi-Torque Electric
>
> Matthew Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
> I got a Leeson motor from work. The website doesn't
> seem to have
> any info on it. I want to make an EVmotorcycle. Will
> this do it? Or,
> just a scooter. Time for class. How do I figure HP?
> Max RPM?
> what does FR, F.F, type, INS etc. mean? It spools up
> real nice and
> quiet on 24 volts. It has brushes.
>
> Leeson DC perminant magnet
> Model - CM34D20NZ1C
> volts - 75-140
> rpm - VAR \
> amps - VAR > Varies depending on amps and votages
> used?
> H.P - VAR /
> FR. - 34
> amb - 40 degrees celcius
> F.F - 1.38
> type - DN
> thermal protection HO1A
> INS - H3
> duty - INT
>
>
>
>
>
> Matt Milliron
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/702
> My daughter named it, "Pikachu". It's yellow and
> black,
> electric and contains Japanese parts, so I went with
> it.
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail
> Beta.
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You may want to have the controller checked out. The TO-220 diodes are
all in parallel and I have seen where a couple drop out and as a result
overload the remaining ones - leading to the slow hot death of the
controller as the remaining diodes fall like dominos.
If that isn't the problem, I have seen (back when high current controllers
were scarce) where the ends of the curtis controller are removed and
(filtered) air is blown directly through the controller. Some were potted
and even this can be removed with a lot of patience. Remember-removing
heat is the answer and sometimes the inside is a good option.
Jimmy
> Subject: Re: Overheating Controller
> Curtis Hollingshead wrote:
> > heatsink plate... is 9" X 13" X 1/8" thick Al... heatsink compound
> > between controller and plate... one fan blowing up through control
> > board at underside of heatsink plate, and two at ~45 degrees to the
> > controller on top of the control board... Typical controller temp
> > is 127 to 130F at the end of my evening commute...
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
My question in this posting has to do with how to safely jack up
the rear of a VoltsRabbit. When we had all the batteries out of
the car, we could jack it up on the middle angle iron of the rear
battery pack housing, using a piece of wood about the width of
the housing to spread out the stresses. No problem there. What
I cannot remember is whether we did this with batteries in the
car. My feeling is that it will be ok to do so since the battery
weight will be in that housing, so I really should not have any
additional stresses over the unloaded state for all that sheet
metal around the housing.
Yes, you can jack it up, fully loaded, on the battery rack
crossbar. I made a point of testing this when I designed it. It's
not a recommended jack point - the rear axle beam would be better.
Our prototype Voltsrabbit was used as a "class demo" car for many
years - it got taken apart and put back together more times than I
can count, so I had plenty of opportunity to examine how things were
holding up under daily driving. There were no signs of metal fatigue
in the area around the rear battery rack (or anywhere else).
Mike Brown
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Wed, 12 Jul 2006 18:22:47 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:
>Hey Matthew
>
> I'm not familiar with that Leeson. All the ones I've done have been small 4
> to 5 inchers rated at 24 to 36 volts. If it's anything like the ones I've
> seen I doubt it will work for a motorcycle motor.
> Even if it drove it I believe you'd toast it post haste. How big is this
> motor? I'm just wondering if it's the same size just wound for the higher
> voltage. The info that it's rated as intermittent in
> duty cycle on this motor is important. There are bigger pump motors rated at
> 3 or 5 minutes and work fine for you guys. You guys don't load the motor
> down like the lift does in that time so you're
> good. On this motor (I am just guessing here) the holders and comm are not
> going to be able to withstand the current of a full sized conversion.
> But then again a scooter at 75 to 140 volts would be interesting, lmao.
> Send a pic to me if you want, be fun for me to take a look, see how big or
> small it is. If you go this route you and Deafscooter
>can have drag races, hehe. BTW that data tag does leave a little open to
>speculation now doesn't it, lol.
> Jim Husted
> Hi-Torque Electric
>
It is 6 inches long, with a 3.25 inch diameter. It weighs about 8
lbs. It has two long bolts that go completely through the motor
lengthwise that hold everything together. The brush holders are 180
degrees apart and can be changed with a screwdriver. I will try to
get you a picture.
Two of these drive an x-ray unit that weighs about 1000 lbs. Getting
from one side of the hospital to the other can take 10 minutes.
Matt Milliron
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/702
My daughter named it, "Pikachu". It's yellow and black,
electric and contains Japanese parts, so I went with it.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> P.S. I also have 1 HP treadmill PM motors rated at 90
> Vdc that have efficiency numbers up to 88% (yep, I
> tested them on a dyno). These would work nicely for
> accessory EV stuff like power steering on an EV.
>
What would you use as a controller for a motor like this?
Dave Cover
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--- Begin Message ---
Controller? A contactor?
Maybe I need to throw together a high voltage low
current control :-)
This motor will operate over a wide range of DC
voltages much higher than 90VDC, but inrush current is
high. If there is any interest in an accessory motor
like this for alternate loads like power steering, AC
or whatever I will look into making a control.
Thanks,
Rod
--- Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> --- Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > P.S. I also have 1 HP treadmill PM motors rated at
> 90
> > Vdc that have efficiency numbers up to 88% (yep, I
> > tested them on a dyno). These would work nicely
> for
> > accessory EV stuff like power steering on an EV.
> >
>
> What would you use as a controller for a motor like
> this?
>
> Dave Cover
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Matthew Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>It is 6 inches long, with a 3.25 inch diameter and weighs about 8
>lbs.Two of these drive an x-ray unit that weighs about 1000 lbs. Getting
>from one side of the hospital to the other can take 10 minutes.
Well I'd say you could build a 500 lbs. bike with the same gear ratio that
would drive the hospital length in about ten minutes, lmao!!!hehehe.
Sorry I couldn't resist 8^ P
You know that first line taken out of context is kinda funny also.
Being it seems this motor has just two brushes as oppossed to 4 at 90 degrees
(if I read that right) lessens it's ability to commutate. At only 8 lbs it
really doesn't have the mass needed to push around anything big very fast. I
hate having to be the party pooper 8^ (
It is the best "what the heck do I do with it motor" I've seen all year
though 8^ )
Cya
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+
countries) for 2ยข/min or less.
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--- Begin Message ---
On Wed, Jul 12, 2006 at 06:43:35PM -0700, Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> I just had an idea I'd like to run by the list. A shaft drive takes up room
> typically where the batteries normally go. A loss of battery storage. Why
> not flip the shaft sending it out the back behind the rear wheel. Make a
> trailing cone to house it and the supporting structure. You would get aero
> advantage and more batteries where you need them. Lawrence Rhodes
It does seem like a good idea.
I think that Solectria might have done something similar with there S-10
conversions. I believe they even patented the idea.
Thanks!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Wed, 12 Jul 2006 19:07:20 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:
>according to this link,
>http://www.leeson.com/cgi-bin/fetchpdf.cgi?/literature/bulletins/pdf/1600/32-35_dimensions.pdf
>a 34 frame is 1.4" in diameter.
>This is kind of strange, since Ametek sizes frame size
>for small motors as 1/16" times the number. For
>example a 64 frame is a 4" diameter stator (implying a
>34 frame is 2.125"). I guess it doesn't matter,
>because a 2.125" or 1.4" diameter stator rated at the
>voltages you listed will not come even close to
>powering a scooter.
The DC SQUARE FLANGE MOUNT on page one, is the style I have.
It is 6.33 inches long, with a 3.38 inch diameter. Frame 34D
Matt Milliron
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/702
My daughter named it, "Pikachu". It's yellow and black,
electric and contains Japanese parts, so I went with it.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I believe that's how Solectria's S10 conversion was configured. They
flipped the driveshaft around so it was pointing backwards, shortened
it, and connected the motor (motors?) to it.
There's a PDF of Solectria's manual. On page 49 is a diagram that
shows the layout.
<http://evproduction.org/wiki/index.php?title=Solectria_References>
It all fits underneath the car - no need for the cone in this case.
There's another mention on Electro Automotive's website (bottom of the
page):
<http://www.electroauto.com/catalog/ackits.shtml>
And of course, if you're converting an aircooled Volkswagen, the shaft
already points rearwards :)
Anyway, *I* think it's a good idea, given that you shorten the
driveshaft first so you don't add many useless feet to the length of
your car.
On Jul 12, 2006, at 7:43 PM, Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
I just had an idea I'd like to run by the list. A shaft drive takes
up room
typically where the batteries normally go. A loss of battery storage.
Why
not flip the shaft sending it out the back behind the rear wheel.
Make a
trailing cone to house it and the supporting structure. You would get
aero
advantage and more batteries where you need them. Lawrence Rhodes
--
Doug Weathers
Las Cruces, NM, USA
<http://learn-something.blogsite.org/>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Replying to my own email.
On Jul 12, 2006, at 10:16 PM, Doug Weathers wrote:
I believe that's how Solectria's S10 conversion was configured. They
flipped the driveshaft around so it was pointing backwards, shortened
it, and connected the motor (motors?) to it.
There's a PDF of Solectria's manual. On page 49 is a diagram that
shows the layout.
<http://evproduction.org/wiki/index.php?title=Solectria_References>
And in the EV Album, there are pictures!
<http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/669>
<http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/608>
<http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/198>
--
Doug Weathers
Las Cruces, NM, USA
<http://learn-something.blogsite.org/>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Audi 4000 springs will pick up the car about an inch or so in the
back. Just a few dollars at the junk yard and they fit perfectly.
Bill Dube
At 07:43 PM 7/12/2006, you wrote:
----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 8:56 PM
Subject: Re: HD Rabbit springs - where to buy?
>
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 3:16 PM, Adrian DeLeon wrote:
>
> > Any leads on where I can get stiffer springs for my '87 Cabriolet
> > (rabbit
> > convertible)? All I can find are autocross lowering springs. Would
> > something from one of the VW vans or pickups fit? I'm currently at 1400
> > lbs front and 1850 pounds rear!
Hi Adrian;
Google" Coil Spring Specialties" It'll take ya right there. Tell them
how much EXTRA weight you are adding to the Rabbbit.I did, and the spring
they sent me were great, and not very expensive, too.You can talk to them,
tell them what ya had in mind.
Where getting Sprung was a pleasure.
Bob
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jeff Shanab wrote:
> Which way does the air blow on his heatsink? And is it significant?
> I have been told that blowing air onto heatsink moves more heat but
> allows for a more uneven cooling and consequently pulling air off a
> heatsink makes a more stable but slightly hotter source.
Ultimately, you have some amount of heat to remove (expressed in watts,
BTUs, etc.) To do this, you heat up something else (air, water, etc.)
and then "dump it" elsewhere.
The inlet (suction) side of a fan or blower is generally pulling air
from all directions more or less equally. The outlet (pressure) side
generally throws the air straight out. But the amount of air being moved
on both sides is (obviously) the same.
Whether you position your heatsink before or after the fan only matters
if your ductwork does not control the path that the air has to take.
Worst case example: Heatsink is a foot away from the fan, with no
ductwork at all. The fan *has* to blow air at the heatsink to get any
benefit. If you tried putting the heatsink a foot in front of the fan,
then almost all the air going into the fan inlet is coming from the
sides, and missing the heatsink entirely.
Best case example: Fan in the center of a pipe or equipment cabinet. The
heatsink can be anywhere in that pipe (inlet or outlet) and gets exactly
the same airflow.
So, people usually arrange the fan to blow directly onto the heatsink
when they have no ductwork to otherwise direct the airflow. It works,
but note that you are still wasting airflow; without ductwork, at least
some of your airflow is going to miss the heatsing.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
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--- Begin Message ---
The only thing I can think of is making sure the shaft turns in the correct
direction (of course) and that the brakes are oriented correctly. Are the
hypoid gears directional?
David C. Wilker Jr.
United States Air Force, Retired
----- Original Message -----
From: "Nick Austin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 8:18 PM
Subject: Re: Aero shaft drive idea.
On Wed, Jul 12, 2006 at 06:43:35PM -0700, Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
I just had an idea I'd like to run by the list. A shaft drive takes up
room
typically where the batteries normally go. A loss of battery storage.
Why
not flip the shaft sending it out the back behind the rear wheel. Make a
trailing cone to house it and the supporting structure. You would get
aero
advantage and more batteries where you need them. Lawrence Rhodes
It does seem like a good idea.
I think that Solectria might have done something similar with there S-10
conversions. I believe they even patented the idea.
Thanks!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I thought this would be a question of wider interest, so I'm asking
on the EVDL. The L.A. Weekly article said Gadget is doing a D cell
Nimh pack for a custom conversion he is doing. Does anyone know any
more details on this? How are the strings being kept in balance with
each other? How much would such a pack cost? What about max power and
resistance (if known)?
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Death to All Spammers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 9:49 PM
Subject: Re: who's reviving the electric car?an' Stuff.
> > Reminds me of back in the 80's ,1800's ,when Electric Street
> Railways
> > were starting up, replacing, most of the time, already perfected horses,
> > Potential investors being of doubt IF the electricity could actually
> keep up
> > with a running car? Of course it can't ! Us EV guyz solved this
> problem with
> > bringing the electric aboard in batteries!
> >
>
> Horses would be "more perfect" if they didn't leave droppings - they
> didn't have those poo-catching horse-butt-slings in the 1880's.
>
> Horses!? Phooey! EVen the newest ones don't have any emission controls,
and they leak, anywhere they feel like.
EV's, big inprovment, except you can't whistle and it will come to you
with it's wagon.
My two horse exhaust worth.
Bob
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 11:56 PM
Subject: Re: Aero shaft drive idea.
> The only thing I can think of is making sure the shaft turns in the
correct
> direction (of course) and that the brakes are oriented correctly. Are the
> hypoid gears directional?
>
> David C. Wilker Jr.
> United States Air Force, Retired
>
> Hi Dave an' EVerybody;
I'll throw this one in for ideas; The University of New Haven ran a small
truk, Chevy?In the Tour De Sol, using the rear end from an old VW bug. The
newer independent setup. They had lottsa room for batteries amodships, no
driveshaft, and the VW rear is used to the motor hanging out the back. Far
as I know, nobody ELSE has done this?Ya can hook up the linkage to shift
gears, too.
Seeya
Bob
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I know the news would get out one way or the other. Gadget is not supposed
to talk to a third party about this. But since it is out on the newspaper,
you should hear it from the first person -- AirLab.
The system is called the "GAIA I" (Green AirLab Intelligent Array I). We
have been working on this system for the past 1 1/2 years in secret. Since
we have filed the patent, we have started slowly to release more details.
You could visit our website (www.airlabcorp.com) for some details. But, we
are not ready to publish more details yet.
In short, each string (we called it module) has built-in charge controls,
cooling/heating, output enable contactor, Ah counter, temperature
monitoring, voltage monitoring, self-discharge counter, etc. We are able to
control charging and discharging for each module independently with our
sophisticated power management software. The modules also acts as
redundancies to each others, so the vehicle could still be driven even if a
module or 2 is completely off-line. Also, the system offers the ability to
increase or decrease the range without changing the system voltage.
There are many many more advantages that a conventional system does not
offer.
Here is the catch. We are currently only selling the system as a complete
system and only to OEM's. This is because it is no longer just bare
batteries. It is a complete power system with built-in protections. And,
it requires some integration to the vehicle. Most importantly, we really do
not have the resources to support individual end users at this point. We
would definitely want to support this community when the time is right.
I have been using the GAIA I system installed on our Sparrow for the past
few months. And, I will also start showing the system at various EAA
meetings in the SF Bay Area. The first being this coming Saturday 7/15 at
the Silicon Valley Chapter meeting in Palo Alto. The next is the East Bay
EAA meeting on 7/22 in Alameda.
On 7/12/06, David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I thought this would be a question of wider interest, so I'm asking
on the EVDL. The L.A. Weekly article said Gadget is doing a D cell
Nimh pack for a custom conversion he is doing. Does anyone know any
more details on this? How are the strings being kept in balance with
each other? How much would such a pack cost? What about max power and
resistance (if known)?
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--
Edward Ang
AirLab
--- End Message ---
