EV Digest 5765
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: NEDRA EVent in Alaska (was Re: EVs show at the Alaska Renewable ...)
by Chip Gribben <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Fiberglass box questions
by Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Fw: Two Electric cars for sale.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Car and Driver to be at NEDRA Nationals
by Chip Gribben <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: My ICE Costs
by "Ryan Plut" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: My ICE Costs
by "Death to All Spammers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: EV Range estimation...
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: EV Range estimation...
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) I'm having trouble getting hold of NEDRA
by "Michael T Kadie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Plug-in Prius (was: WKTEC in Winter Park, FL)
by "Charles Whalen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re:Backyard Blower Builds
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
12) Best Plasma Cutter?
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) RE: I'm having trouble getting hold of NEDRA
by Mike Willmon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Best Plasma Cutter?
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: EUROPOSITRON,Is this battery for real ?
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) RE: I'm having trouble getting hold of NEDRA
by Mike Willmon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: EUROPOSITRON,Is this battery for real ?
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Charging infrastructure
by Mike Swift <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Lithium Safety
by =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jukka_J=E4rvinen?= <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: EUROPOSITRON,Is this battery for real ?
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Netgain Warp 8" availability?
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Unsubscribe
by Richard Slatin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) S10 conversion
by "David A. Serafini" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Broken motor transportation from FL
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: As anybody heard of EUROPOSITRON
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
I second that.
Chip Gribben
NEDRA Power of DC
On Aug 17, 2006, at 1:15 AM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote:
From: "Dave Davidson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: August 16, 2006 7:54:03 PM EDT
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: NEDRA EVent in Alaska (was Re: EVs show at the Alaska
Renewable ...)
And Portland to Hagerstown, MD is only 2740, so you could also make
it to the Power of DC next summer. The east coast needs to see a
100 mph EV like White Zombie. Come a couple of days early or stay
a couple of days after and I'll take you out for some famous
Maryland steamed crabs.
Dave
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
okay, was gonna let it go, but the second time..
Lock Hughes wrote:
--- Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Dave, i've done a fair bit of fiberglass working making body parts,
but not structural stuff.
I'd assume that the glass is basically sealing off the wood,
and given you know wood, make the wood strong, and use
a thin layer should be sufficient.
Hang on a sec Jack! I have to bow to (build) experience every time,
but I do have some *use* experience. I have a sailboat built as a racer
(strong and light weight), built back in 1980. The hulls (yah, there're
two of `em) are a "sandwich" of GRP and foam. The core (closed-cell
foam) by itself is actually pretty floppy stuff. *All* the strength is
in the skin. Each hull is 20 feet long and roughly 1.5 foot in
diameter, and weighs 50lbs, just to give an idea of how light weight
the construction is.
I've got a sailboat too..and have made a surfboard also with foam core.
But for the application in question, the core is solid wood, the
fiberglass is providing no structual component to the design.
As someone else said, you could probably eliminate the fiberglass
completely, and just use epoxy itself to seal the wood, but the glass
would help the epoxy layer and isn't expensive.
And to answer the other question, would it be better to cover the wood
first, and then cut and assemble it, I would say it's best to assemble
it first and then glass/epoxy over it.
The resin holds it together, so it should be as thick as the glass
itself.
Don't think so! Hence my earlier reference in a call to Jerry to
quit his "vacuum bagging" for a minute. Very often these days a vacuum
bag process is used, specifically to get the resin content in the
matrix LOW by squeezing out excess resins. It's stronger and lighter
that way.
Not sure what you are disagreeing with here. Without the resin there is
no strength (or sealing in this case). What I said in response to the
question of thickness is that the resin should NOT INCREASE the
thickness of the glass, if it does, there is too much.
For resin, epoxy is more expensive but doesn't create bad
fumes, your wife and neighbors will appreciate using the epoxy, and
it doesn't shrink like the other stuff, so I'd use it.
Yes, more expensive, but not so much for a small job. (Boat) builders
will use poly `cause it's cheaper, but also `cause it's not as brittle
as epoxy, so has some give (again, the earlier reference to tall
structures built to sway in the wind, rather than snap.)
Wood fibre is *great* build material. Product development: millions
of years of swaying in the wind. Two key things: Dry the moisture
content of the wood down to about 10% before you seal it off, and,
definitely, absolutely, completely, seal it off to keep the moisture
out.
The Gougeon brothers literally "wrote the book" on wood-epoxy
construction, and money spent on a copy of their book would be money
well spent for anyone contemplating wood/plastic composite
construction.
http://www.gougeon.com/
Tks
Lock
Toronto
Hope that helps,
Jack
Dave Cover wrote:
I'm considering building some battery boxes out of fiberglass and
wood. I have no experience
working with fiberglass, but lot's with wood. The box will be about
14 inches wide and about 33
inches long. The box will be supported primarily from the top edge,
with one cross brace
underneath about 2/3 down it's lenght. I'll run some wooden slats
the long way down the box floor
for support. It will need to hold around 225 lbs of cells. Building
a box out of plywood is easy,
but it will suffer from road salt and electrolyte. Paint will help,
but that's a short term
solution. If I use fiberglass, it will not be affected by the
environment, but I don't know how to
make it strong enough by itself. So I'm looking to make a wooden
box and fiberglass it. Not an
original idea.
Here are my questions, all from a fiberglass newbie;
1. How many layers should I put down to to protect the wood?
2. Am i better off using 3/4" plywood and a thin glass skin or
thinner plywood and more glass?
2. How thick are the layers of applied fiberglass, (for planning
dimensions?) Is one layer 1/8th
of an inch, 2 layers 3/16ths?
3. How structural can the fiberglass be? If I build up a 1/4 inch
layer, is that stronger than the
wooden box?
4. What type of fiberglass should I use? I've seen Knytex, Volan
treated, etc.
5. What weight cloth? 8oz, double layer 4.4 oz?
6. What type of resin should I use to resist the NiCd electrolyte?
Sorry about the tenderfoot questions, any help is appreciated.
Thanks
Dave Cover
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: Dale Ice
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 8:50 PM
Subject: Re: Two Electric cars for sale.
Hi,
Only one car,the EXAR-1,is electric. Sorry for any mis-understanding.
The EXAR-1 was built by Frua,based on a BMW 600 series chassis,as I
understand it. Therefore,glass,brakes and such are BMW and easily availble.
This was a one-off car to attract investors. It was never registered in the
USA. It did work and was complete. If you do a Google search,you find plenty of
info and pics. Sometime ago,someone reworked the body to resemble a Porsche
924. It wasn't finished and much of the original body work is still there,under
the added on panels. The wiring and battery holders are still attached. Many of
the interior panels are there,in poor shape but good patterns.
I'll add an email from a German auto historian where you can get more info.
best regards,
Dale
707-882-2082
Thank you very much for your reply. I am a motor historian doing research
on the Italian designer and coachbuilder Pietro Frua (1913-1983). I try to
document the history of each single car which Frua buildt, including the
complete owner´s history. Some years ago I could obtain the Frua family archive
with Frua´s own photographs of the cars which he buildt. They include about 100
colour photographs of the Amectran EXAR-1.
I would like to get some information on your car and hope that you can
answer the following questions:
- What is the chassis number of the EXAR-1. I have seen the attached photo
at eBay, but I cannot read the full number.
- What are your plans with the car? Do you want to keep and restore it? Or
do you want to sell it. In both cases I could perhaps help you.
- Could you please send me some actual photos of the car showing it at your
location?
- Which former owners do you know? What is the name and city of the seller?
Thank you very much for any help which you can provide to my research.
With kind regards,
Registro Pietro Frua
Stefan Dierkes
Eichendorffstr. 57
71665 Vaihingen an der Enz
Germany
Phone/Fax +49 174 3178115
E-Mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.pietro-frua.de
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I agree! This is spectacular news. "Car and Driver" Wow!
Maybe Ted will get some real "air time" with the Zombie like the
journalist from the Oregonian. Can't wait to hear all about it and
see the article in Car and Driver. I know John is pumped up about it
but I suspect Ted is even more pumped up about the opportunity to
experience the mystical powers of the Zombie himself.
So this race is shaping up to be one you don't want to miss.
Jim did a great job with the motor he donated to the NEDRA Power of
DC race in June. So it should be exciting for folks to see two of
them on display and an opportunity to win one and the Siamese 8 in
action at the track.
Have fun at the Late Night Nationals gang!
Chip Gribben
NEDRA Webmaster
http://www.nedra.com
On Aug 17, 2006, at 1:15 AM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote:
From: Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: August 16, 2006 8:48:08 PM EDT
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Car and Driver to be at NEDRA Nationals
Roderick Wilde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Well John Wayland has spun his magic once again and talked Car
and Driver
into coming to the NEDRA Nationals. They will be filming both days
as well
as coming to the breakfast so it sounds like it could be a very in
depth
article about the electric drag racing movement. The writer is none
other
than contributing Editor Ted West who just did the article in this
months
Car and Driver on the four million dollar, one of a kind, Ferrari.
Hey EVeryone
What awesome news. John worked hard getting this, I know, and I
also know he pushed hard for them to cover the event and not just
his car! This is yet another example of how EV racing is promoting
that today are driving electrics! Now this is very unlike John
being the selfish glory hog that he is, to share like this. Here
is an opportunity to show off your pride and joy whether it'd be a
racer or a daily as there will be a huge crowd of folks to
educate! In fact there may be more surprises, opps. One I can
announce is that I'm building a small 6" motor for the event, Roy's
deciding how to best to offer it but like chip did might offer it
as a raffle. There will be a pair of motors being shown as well
that are shipping to a list member after going to the RPM show 8^)
To top it all off, believe it or not my biggest EV event was last
year at Woodburn with 6 racers and the same for the fans! The
turnout for Joliet was awesome and I made a lot of new friends but
alas no racing. Now's the time, any that might have been on the
fence concerning coming needs to jump on down and make the effort
to attend this event. Here's the chance to be part of a car and
driver article!
Here's hoping to see you.
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Doug,
OK, I will. I did download the spreadsheet and have been playing with it. I
also downloaded Uve's spreadsheet. I don't plan on starting construction
until winter of 2008. Between now and then I'll pay down some debt, hunt
for and purchase a doner car, and plan, plan, plan, and plan some more.
(after all, isn't that half the fun?)
Ryan G. Plut
"Common sense is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it" - G.
Bernard Shaw
----- Original Message -----
From: "Doug Weathers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 10:00 PM
Subject: Re: My ICE Costs
On Aug 16, 2006, at 10:09 PM, Ryan Plut wrote:
Metricminds prices for AC Siemens all say "inquire" for the price. They
DO list MES, and others though. They list a BRUSA for $15K! So are
Siemens prices similar to MES?
Why not send an email to Victor and ask him?
I think I remember you said you didn't want to bother him, but the way I
look at it, if he didn't want to be bothered, he'd just post the prices on
his website.
When I started on my conversion, I not only asked him for his price list,
I also took him up on his offer to run some numbers for me. I think he's
since created an Excel spreadsheet you can download and run the numbers
yourself, but back then he did it for you. I found it a big help.
(Thanks, Victor!)
I ended up not buying anything from his company, but I don't feel bad. He
offered the service to me, and took the time to send me a custom quote,
with the understanding that I might choose not to buy anything from him.
And the way he's got it set up, you're certainly not going to buy anything
from him if you don't know what it costs, so you'll HAVE to bother him to
get the price list.
I'm pretty sure Victor will not hate you for asking for his price list.
--
Doug Weathers
Las Cruces, NM, USA
http://learn-something.blogsite.org/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> > Why do you need this high of voltage?
> >
>
> As I understand it, V*A=W, so for a given wattage motor higher V
equals
> lower amps.
> Lower amps means all the wiring and connectors can be smaller.
> Lower amps means less resistance means less losses to waste heat.
> smaller *usually* means less expensive when it comes to wires and
> connectors.
> True?
Sure, but how much total kw to need? You can get 15hp out of a 25lb PM
motor at 48V, which is equal to the performance of a 30hp ICE.
> Metricminds prices for AC Siemens all say "inquire" for the price.
They DO
> list MES, and others though. They list a BRUSA for $15K! So are Siemens
> prices similar to MES?
>
Well, if the $3-4K motors are out of your price range, you may be
right. Maybe you should list your budget and performance envelope
before we answer anything else.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hmm, that's a rather complicated way to estimate range, but
(interestingly) it appears to be fairly accurate.
At least assuming that you are using Flooded Lead Acid batteries and don't
discharge them below 50% DOD.
> I was reading an article about how to estimate range for an EV last night
> (and
> now I can't find the article).
>
> It had a calculation something like Range = Voltage * .57 * Ah/200
>
> Does that look right to you all? I know that there are a few things that
> aren't accounted
> for in the equation, but as a general estimate, is this accurate?
>
> Thanks.
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE!
> http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well, if you are planning on using a single string of Optimat YTs, then
20-25 miles sounds about right.
If you want more range, thenyou'll either need more lead or a better
battery (NiMH, LiPol, Etc.)
> I'm trying to spec out my wishlist and what that calculation tells me if I
> used the Optima Yellow
> tops with a C20 rating of 55 and an ADC 9" motor at 144v my "range" would
> be:
> (144*.57*55)/200 = 22.572 miles.
>
> If that is correct then I wouldn't even make it to work. Much less back.
> I'd need batteries
> with at least 165 Ah C20 rating to make it round trip.
>
> For what it's worth.
>
>>
>>On Wed, August 16, 2006 12:27 pm, Joe Plumer wrote:
>> > I was reading an article about how to estimate range for an EV last
>>night
>> > (and
>> > now I can't find the article).
>> >
>> > It had a calculation something like Range = Voltage * .57 * Ah/200
>>
>>This statement appears to be:
>>
>>"Range with 57% depth of discharge (DOD) at a running rate of 200Ah/mile"
>>
>>A better stated version of this equation would be something like this:
>>
>>N = Number of cells
>>A = Ah [EMAIL PROTECTED], per cell
>>V = Nominal voltage per cell
>>E = Total consumption, in Ah/mile (~200)
>>D = Desired DOD (~.50 = 50%)
>>
>>Range in miles = (N * A * V * D) / E
>>
>>But, you really should be including the peukert effect (search the
>>archives & wikipedia) in this sort of calculation, as well as a better
>>esmitation of efficency.
>>
>>In the mean time, I've been using something similar as a very crude range
>>estimation. Bigger cars/trucks will run up to and beyond 250Ah/mile, and
>>smaller more efficient cars have been quoted at ~150Ah/mile. 57% DOD is
>>(I think) probably about what most people do, but "range" is a funny
>> word,
>>because people don't usually run their batteries all the way down to 0V.
>>:)
>>
>>There are many factors at play in the "total consumption" number,
>>including aerodynamics, transmission efficency, motor efficency,
>>controller efficency, tire & bearing rolling resistence, etc., that may
>>introduce fairly large variations in that number depending on your
>> vehicle
>>and setup, so be forewarned.
>>
>>Steve
>>
>>
>> >
>> >
>> > Does that look right to you all? I know that there are a few things
>>that
>> > aren't accounted for in the equation, but as a general estimate, is
>>this
>> > accurate?
>> >
>> > Thanks.
>> >
>> >
>> > _________________________________________________________________
>> > Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's
>>FREE!
>> > http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/
>> >
>> >
>> >
>>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Dont just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search!
> http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I sent my membership in a month ago, and a couple follow-up emails, but have
yet to get any response. I'm wondering if they are busy, or what. I had
hoped to make the nationals, but that is very unlikely now (backordered
parts), but I do want to race her as soon as I can.
Michael
eCobra - http://ssinc.us/kitcar/index.htm
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Monday, August 14, 2006 7:58 PM, Jude Anthony wrote:
David Roden wrote:
On 12 Aug 2006 at 4:24, Jude Anthony wrote:
Toyota's recent announcement of the plug-in Prius.
Has this been officially announced? Last I heard Toyota were still
repeating the old "no such plans" party line. I believe I heard
something about waiting for the right battery, but I might have been
dreaming.
Hugh and somebody else (Charles, I think?) said that Toyota announced a
plug-in Prius three weeks ago.
Of course, it could be vapor. Or rumor.
Jude
Yes, Toyota did announce about 4 weeks ago that it is developing a plug-in
hybrid. Here is one of the media reports on it:
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0720/p02s01-ussc.html
This was, finally, an official acknowledgement hinting at what high-level
sources within Toyota have been saying confidentially, off the record, for
many months (despite what had previously been steadfast party-line public
denials to the contrary), which is that Toyota has been actively working on
the development of a plug-in hybrid using lithium-ion batteries for several
years now. The next major model change to the Prius is planned to be a
plug-in, scheduled for the 2008 or 2009 model year, coming out 1 to 2 years
from now. These joint development efforts with Toyota's longtime exclusive
battery supplier, Panasonic EV Energy (now 60% owned by Toyota), took on
greater urgency and were intensified and accelerated a little over two years
ago when Toyota and Panasonic lost a NiMH battery patent infringement
lawsuit to Chevron/Cobasys, which prohibits Toyota and Panasonic from
producing and selling any automobiles with NiMH propulsion batteries greater
than 10Ah (i.e. basically anything greater than just the weak hybrids of
today that are 100% dependent on gasoline for their energy source) until
January 1, 2015, when the NiMH battery patents expire. Hence Toyota's
acceleration -- out of necessity -- of its gradual transition out of the
currently reigning (but severely legally restricted) NiMH battery technology
and into lithium-ion battery technology.
A good deal of credit for Toyota's reversal of their official public stance
and acknowledgement of their previously undisclosed development work on
plug-in hybrids goes to Plug In America (www.pluginamerica.com) for their
tireless advocacy, pressure, encouragement, lobbying, and cooperation in
working with Toyota (and many other key players and power-brokers), both
publicly and privately behind the scenes in their regular face-to-face
meetings with Toyota's senior executives.
Charles Whalen
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks Rod,
My idea was that since most of us don't go past 170 motor V, a 110V universal
motor could be put in line after the controller, and wind up and down along
with the motor. That would almost certainly use more power overall than the
internal fan, but might be a solution for boosted cooling on really high power
EVs. Add a relay to bring in low voltages for continuous cooling when the
controller drops out, and it could be all-around cool.
Jay
www.karmanneclectric.blogspot.com
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:04:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: backyard blower builds
To: [email protected]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
I'll see if I can get some flow/pressure data for the
blowers and pass that information on to the list.
Some are high flow, high RPM blowers, others are
higher pressure at lower flow. I suspect a high
flow/low pressure blower would be good for a setup
with minimal back pressure. These are also good for
blowing out brush dust if set up properly. A 120Vac
universal blower would work well for pack voltages up
to 180Vdc.
At lower pack voltages you'll still get reasonable air
flow (this type of motor will still run down to very
low DC voltages, you'll just get less performance.)
A 240Vac universal motor will work up to 320Vdc packs.
I'll see what I can round up and let you know.
Rod
--- Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Is your company interested in reclaiming some of
> that storage space for a reasonable price?
>
> Rush
> Tucson AZ
> www.ironandwood.org
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Rod Hower" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> > In fact, I think we have several thousand just
> sitting
> > around in the storage room :-)
> > Rod
> >
>
>
________________________________________________________________________
Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video search, pictures, email and IM.
All on demand. Always Free.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I need to do about 6 meters worth of cuts on 1/4 inch steel, for my
motor adaptor and a roll bar. On past things I've tried several
methods, and they all take alot of time. I think it is high time to
get a plasma cutter, for this and other future projects.
Any recommendations on a good brand to get? I don't anticipate
needing to cut thicker than 1/4 inch steel. Many thanks.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Michael,
What do you figure your selling price would be once you've produced a few? Do
you think it would easy enough to offer the choice
of the TranswarP11 or dual 9's? What does the DE shaft look like that mates to
the shorty tailshaft?
Mike,
Anchorage, Ak.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Michael T Kadie
> Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 10:10 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: I'm having trouble getting hold of NEDRA
>
>
> I sent my membership in a month ago, and a couple follow-up emails, but have
> yet to get any response. I'm wondering if they are busy, or what. I had
> hoped to make the nationals, but that is very unlikely now (backordered
> parts), but I do want to race her as soon as I can.
>
> Michael
> eCobra - http://ssinc.us/kitcar/index.htm
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Get one that fits a cheap CNC plasma cutter table. Those things can do
totally amazing things and they're not astronomically expensive. Even
if you don't intend to get a CNC table now, think about what you might
want in the future.
Danny
David Dymaxion wrote:
I need to do about 6 meters worth of cuts on 1/4 inch steel, for my
motor adaptor and a roll bar. On past things I've tried several
methods, and they all take alot of time. I think it is high time to
get a plasma cutter, for this and other future projects.
Any recommendations on a good brand to get? I don't anticipate
needing to cut thicker than 1/4 inch steel. Many thanks.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Oh I misread, they DO say their cargo ship battery is rechargeable 3000
times. Then they'll recycle the aluminum (which is what Iceland does!).
On the search for "aluminum battery" there is some tech buzz about the
high power density of an aluminum-air battery for cell phones/laptops.
It will be non-rechargeable, but some think the power density may be
impressive enough to make some people want to buy one. For example, if
you could get me an 8-hr battery for my laptop on an intercontinental
flight with no onboard power outlets, I might go for that.
Just to be clear, I still think the chance that these guys have a
rechargeable, practical aluminum battery is "unlikely", even with the
additional info on them. Skeptical.
Danny
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Sorry, that was not related to your posted topic, but I would guess by just
posting you'll have an answer pretty quick. :-)
Mike,
Anchorage, Ak.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Mike Willmon
> Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 11:23 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: RE: I'm having trouble getting hold of NEDRA
>
>
> Michael,
> What do you figure your selling price would be once you've produced a few?
> Do you think it would easy enough to offer
> the choice
> of the TranswarP11 or dual 9's? What does the DE shaft look like that mates
> to the shorty tailshaft?
>
> Mike,
> Anchorage, Ak.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Behalf Of Michael T Kadie
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 10:10 PM
> > To: [email protected]
> > Subject: I'm having trouble getting hold of NEDRA
> >
> >
> > I sent my membership in a month ago, and a couple follow-up emails, but have
> > yet to get any response. I'm wondering if they are busy, or what. I had
> > hoped to make the nationals, but that is very unlikely now (backordered
> > parts), but I do want to race her as soon as I can.
> >
> > Michael
> > eCobra - http://ssinc.us/kitcar/index.htm
> >
> >
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Whoops, sent the last message accidentally without finishing the links I
meant to include.
Peswiki has more useful info:
http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Europositron_Rechargeable_Aluminum_Batteries
They did get some kind of award:
http://zpenergy.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1236
<http://zpenergy.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1236>
Here's another of their plans. They want to use aluminum batteries to
power cargo ships:
http://zpenergy.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=717
<http://zpenergy.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=717>
In that plan, they don't plan to recharge it. Just recycle the sludge
produced.
These guys are from Iceland. Iceland has ENORMOUS amounts of geothermal
power, they have the cheapest electricity in the world. Aluminum
refining is all about electricity costs so consequently they do an
enormous amount of aluminum refining there. Well, it's not surprising
that a guy who lives on a 500 acre apple orchard wants to come up with
new uses for apples.
Danny
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Out here in Silicon Valley a number of companies have installed EV
charging stations, or allow employes to use receptacles mounted on
parking lot lamp poles for charging their EVs. Retail stores,
(CostCo, Fry's Electronics, etc), have installed EV charging stations
for the public relations value. Electricity delivered has cost the
companies far less than the cost of installing the receptacles. For
most places I would forget about metering it would take five or six
years to pay back the cost of installing a coin operated metering
system to make people pay for the electricity delivered.
Vandalism is a problem if the charging station has a cable coming
out of it like the inductive systems GM had on their EV1 stations.
In California we have at least 4 common interfaces for the charging
stations. Two inductive systems we call the large paddle and small
paddle for the few cars left from the EV mandate days, and three
conductive systems one using the "Avcon" connector custom made for
electric cars which is the state "approved" connector. Most common
in the U.S. are what is called a NEMA 14-50 rated at 240 volts and 50
amps sometimes called a dryer plug, and the ubiquitous NEMA 6-15, 120
volt 15 amp receptacle found throughout the U.S. You are lucky in
the UK to not have the low 120 volt receptacles.
As far a charger etiquette we find that getting our charging
stations "ICEed" (Internal Combustion Engine vehicle parked in the
charger slot) making it impossible to get to the charger is a much
bigger problem.
On Aug 15, 2006, at 11:21 AM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote:
From: nikki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: August 15, 2006 7:44:35 AM PDT
To: [email protected]
Subject: Charging infrastructure
Hi there everyone,
I would be very interested to hear how different places handle
charing infrastructure. I'm in the process of arranging a
presentation in Bristol, UK to encourage the creation of public
charging points.
The concerns that I've heard voiced so far:
How to deal with Vandalism
How to deal with charging (if charging is levied for power)
Charger Etiquette. (for multiple EVS fighting over one point)
I've seen how things work in the states, but would be interested to
see other points of view on these "concerns" that corporations have
against EV charging points.
Regards
Nikki.
Mike Swift
Some say we must tax corporations more. What they do not understand
is that corporations do not pay taxes. One of our govenments
conditions for a companies exsistance is thay collect the taxes from
their customers and pass them to the government.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I wonder when they will start using a real BMS in there `??? Circuits
they are using now are ... well.. I let the picture tell the rest.
-JJ
Dave Cover kirjoitti:
Actually Nick, there is a more recent issue going on here. Dell is recalling
about 4.1 million
batteries worldwide, 2.7 in the US. This is now, not back in 2004. Here's a
link;
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060815/tc_nm/dell_batteries_dc_13
--- Nick Austin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
On Tue, Aug 15, 2006 at 09:47:14AM -0700, Electro Automotive wrote:
At 08:49 PM 8/14/2006, you wrote:
<..snip..>
I believe older litium ion cells had more of an issue than the newer
versions. How many RECENT fires ?
How about the millions of notebooks Dell is currently recalling for this
issue?
The Dell recall you are referring to is for AC adapters, not batteries or
laptops.
http://www.engadget.com/2004/10/09/dell-recalls-a-million-laptop-ac-adapters/
https://www.delladapterprogram.com/Main.aspx
The Dell recall of 27000 batteries in 2000 might be more interesting for this
discussion.
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/recalls/dell.html
Here is a Dell exploding in June 2006. It's unclear if this was caused by the
batteries, but that seems most likely.
http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=32550
Thanks!
--
Jukka Järvinen
R&D Director
Oy Finnish Electric Vehicle Technologies Ltd
Teollisuuskatu 24 A3
11100 RIIHIMÄKI
FINLAND
VAT ID: FI18534078
jukka.jarvinen(a_t)fevt.com
mobile +358-440-735705
phone +358-19-735705
fax +358-19-735785
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Oh hey Wikipedia has a good entry, with the big flag:
"The Europositron technology is very controversial, no information for
verification or replication has been provided, the patent applications
discuss a platinum catalyst without describing its intended action,
observers report the technololgists involved don't seem to be familiar
with battery chemistry, and several people are skeptical of the
company's financial plans and the fact that they have not produced a
public prototype even after filing patent applications. See the
discussion page for more information."
The "Discussion" tab is well worth checking out. It has the previously
forwarded "I can bet 10000 dollars that this is a hoax but not one
single dollar on Europositron" text in full for example.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminium_battery
Danny
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Eric Poulsen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 11:27 PM
Subject: Re: Netgain Warp 8" availability?
> Bob,
>
> Cool. I'm still saving my pennies (my wife insists we fritter our money
> away on housing, food, and health care), so when I'm ready, I'll give
> you a buzz. I'm almost there -- a few more months.
>
> -- Eric
> Hi Eric;
Yeah! I hear you. The Worker's paradise doesn't leave much frivilous
left over!
Seeya
Bob
> Bob Rice wrote:
>
> > Hi Eric;
> >
> > Yeah! We can still get them at Warfield/ Netgain. How many would ya
> >like?They run about 1500 buxFOB Frankfort Ill. I can check on the
immediate
> >avalibility if you like. Remember Motors are selling like hotcakes in
Jan.
> >nowadaze! A wonderful amount of interest in EV stuff.Oatmar is
overwhelmed,
> >too.Motors are on a production run basis, and immediate availability can
be
> >iffy.
> >
> > Ok I just got off the fone with the Netgain guyz.: The Impulse 8's we
> >have in stock. Streight 8's are on order, no promise as to a del.
date.These
> >are nice as to being a tad shorter than a stock one, for space challanged
> >applications.
> >
> > As they say a t Wally*Mart' How can I help"
> >
> > Seeya?
> >
> > Bob, If yur in CA or Or I can bring it west for ya, save shipping!!
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Eric Poulsen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: <[email protected]>
> >Sent: Monday, August 14, 2006 5:24 PM
> >Subject: Netgain Warp 8" availability?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>Seems the only place selling the Netgain Warp 8" these days is the
> >>much-avoided "Electric Vehicles USA." I know EV Source carries Netgain,
> >>but only 9" (and a 9/8 hybrid) and up. I've put in inquiry to them via
> >>their website.
> >>
> >>Anyone have a source?
> >>
> >>--Eric
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Please unsubscribe me
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
To all EV gray beards:
I am planning to converting a Chevy S10 for daily commuter use in the
Chicago area. Don't need a hot rod but being able to do at least 70 mph on
the local freeways is a must (75 mph is better as it seems to be the default
speed limit) . A bit of acceleration on the ramps is necessary too. I am
considering using the Solectra AC direct drive system with the reversed
rear axle but would like some help from someone with real world experience
with this. Will this give adequate performance to be "Safe in Chicago" or
should I use a system that retains the original transmission? I am not hard
over either way in the AC vs DC war. Just want something that works in the
real world. Any comments on this would be appreciated.
Thanks from a newbee
David [EMAIL PROTECTED]
"fossil fuel free by 2010"
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This was posted on the Elec-Trak list.
Perhaps Jerry could take your motor home
and Bob Rice could pick it up on the way to
Woodburn?
Hi all will be taking a trip to Fla this weekend,
going down I-75 Sat/Sun
anyone need something brought backup from the south to
NW Ohio..or anything your getting rid of that I can
talk you out of I can stop by an do coffee on
Tuesday/Wed..road # 419-203-6458 or email..thanks
Jerry NW Ohio
Jerry's email is jerry38 - at - alltel.net
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Thanks Rod,
> My idea was that since most of us don't go past 170
> motor V, a 110V universal motor could be put in line
> after the controller, and wind up and down along
> with the motor. That would almost certainly use
> more power overall than the internal fan, but might
> be a solution for boosted cooling on really high
> power EVs. Add a relay to bring in low voltages for
> continuous cooling when the controller drops out,
> and it could be all-around cool.
> Jay
> www.karmanneclectric.blogspot.com
>
>
> Message-ID:
>
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Wed, 16 Aug 2006 18:04:00 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: backyard blower builds
> To: [email protected]
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
>
> I'll see if I can get some flow/pressure data for
> the
> blowers and pass that information on to the list.
> Some are high flow, high RPM blowers, others are
> higher pressure at lower flow. I suspect a high
> flow/low pressure blower would be good for a setup
> with minimal back pressure. These are also good for
> blowing out brush dust if set up properly. A 120Vac
> universal blower would work well for pack voltages
> up
> to 180Vdc.
> At lower pack voltages you'll still get reasonable
> air
> flow (this type of motor will still run down to very
> low DC voltages, you'll just get less performance.)
> A 240Vac universal motor will work up to 320Vdc
> packs.
> I'll see what I can round up and let you know.
> Rod
>
> --- Rush <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > Is your company interested in reclaiming some of
> > that storage space for a reasonable price?
> >
> > Rush
> > Tucson AZ
> > www.ironandwood.org
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Rod Hower" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >
> > > In fact, I think we have several thousand just
> > sitting
> > > around in the storage room :-)
> > > Rod
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
>
________________________________________________________________________
> Check out AOL.com today. Breaking news, video
> search, pictures, email and IM. All on demand.
> Always Free.
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Let us not forget the other half of the equation, A larger capacity
battery is not always the magic solution, you still have to charge it.
It is the usage per mile that we need to work on in some conversions. I
sort of run into this with my 300zx charging with 110V on the pfc. for
some reason the effiency is like 450 wh/mile. Besides limiting my range
if we take the 16 miles or so I drive, I have to put 7.2kwh into the
pack at night. that is 144kwh/month. That is also pulling 6.5 amps for
10 hours on average. But if I got 250 wh/mile that would only be
4kwh,80kwh/month,6 hours. It is also right at the 20% soc meaning my
batteries will see cycle life sooner.
While a lighter pack will help, we live here on the flats and 450wh/mile
seems terrible.
This weekend I will look into these areas
Why is the comm dark brown not light brown, timing?
Do any of the brakes drag?
Get a spot IR temp gauge, go for a drive and find the heat, (heat
= waste in this case)
there is this clunk, during acceleration, could I be lifting the
rear of the tranny up, binding the driveline?
What is my tire deflection, perhaps I need new tires that can
handle more than 44psi. This boat weights 4050 with driver and junk.
--- End Message ---
