EV Digest 5938
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Engine swap for removal labor
by Matt Evans <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Battery charging
by Storm Connors <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Why lie? (was: CE on TV)
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Why lie? (was: CE on TV)
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Electric assisted bicycle
by Ryan Bohm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Engine swap for removal labor
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Why lie? (was: CE on TV)
by Mike Phillips <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) RE: Electric assisted bicycle
by "Sweeney, John P" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Why lie? (was: CE on TV)
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
10) Re: Why lie? (was: CE on TV)
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
11) emeter power supply
by mike golub <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Engine swap for removal labor
by mike golub <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: EV RALLY/NEW YARIS CONVERSION
by MARK DUTKO <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Bringing electric cars into the country as a kit???
by mike golub <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Karmann Ghia vs Porsche 914
by "Mark E. Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Battery charging
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Battery charging
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Ranger doner
by Ralph <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) RE: emeter power supply
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) RE: Ranger doner
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: emeter power supply
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) RE: Hot motor and a couple other newbie questions
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Nedra Record Setting
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
24) NEDRA Chosen for Motorsport of the Month by Hot Rod Magazine
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Battery charging
by Storm Connors <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Ranger doner
by "Michael" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Local salvage yards are asking about 650 for a used 4.0l V6 for a ~1998
ranger(car-part.com). That is good for about 10 hours labor. I am not
sure what the book labor hours is to remove an engine from a ranger but
I would thing it would be 5 or 6 hours. So the trade seems fairly
reasonable on both sides if you take into account the hassle you are
saving yourself and work the mechanic will need to do in order to sell
the motor.
But.... The mechanic needs to want the motor or needs to want to put the
effort into selling it. I don't think the local shop owners I know would
go for it.
My Opinion
Matt
Steve Kobb wrote:
I had AN idea... but I'm a newbie, so I don't know if it's a GOOD idea. Perhaps
the EVDL can give me some insight.
Here's the concept:
What if go to a neighborhood mechanic or engine re-builder and make him this
offer: I will go out and buy a running, decent, not-too-old Ford Ranger...
...and then GIVE him for FREE the entire engine and all associated ICE
hardware, IF...
...he does the labor to remove all that stuff from the vehicle. In other words,
he gets an engine; I get his time.
The attraction to me, of course, is that it would get me to a completed
conversion much faster than if I removed the equipment myself.
Now here's my question to you: If this IS a good idea, who is it good FOR? Both
me and the mechanic? Or just him? Or just me?
Let's say that it's just good for him. That would mean that I'm giving away something MUCH more valuable than what he's giving me.
Or maybe it's the reverse. I just don't know.
Your comments are welcome.
Steve Kobb
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Just when you think you've made a decisiom... I
decided on a 144v pack for the Samurai. Then I
contemplated charging. I have two military surplus
chargers that will each go to 150v. To charge to
177.6v I could use the two of them in series. Or split
the pack and charge each 72v string separately.
Perhaps the chargers would have to be on separate 110v
circuits as well.
Since there is no way I can carry these chargers
around with me, I've been planning on building a "bad
boy" charger for opportunity charging. To charge the
144v pack would seem to require a transformer. How
high a voltage pack can I charge from 110v? (without
transformer)
It is beginning to look like dropping back to 120v
might be a better option.
I could get a new charger, but the features that are
included for the $1k-2k cost seem more needed for SLA
than flooded batteries.
storm
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Maybe Bill....
he has a few faster runs in his pocket..
And the slips to prove it.
Be a gentelmen here Bill or you will start a flame war...
It's not up to you to Judge what you have no clue on.
MADMAN
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Dube" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 6:49 AM
Subject: Why lie? (was: CE on TV)
> It's a Cinderella story, fantastic national TV coverage, and a
> top-notch accomplishment of winning against all the gas cars with an
> electric. Why lie about the top speed and cheapen the accomplishment?
> It undermines the credibility of everything else you say.
>
> You know you have never gone "over 150 miles per hour". Why
> lie about it on national TV?
>
> Bill Dube'
>
> At 12:45 PM 9/28/2006, you wrote:
> >here is a link to the feature done on Dennis and his CE
> >
> >http://kuat.org/arizonaillustrated/details.cfm?ID=192
> >
> >Congratulations Dennis and good luck at the finals!
> >
> >Rush
> >Tucson AZ
> >www.ironandwood.org
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Bill Dube
You need to formally apologize To Dennis Berube for Calling him, a List
memeber, a Lier, in a Public format.
This is totally unprofessional and it is not to be taken lightly or
tolerated.
It is you who are mistaken.
This sour Grapes efforts on your part, should stay out of the public
limelight..
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Dube" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 6:49 AM
Subject: Why lie? (was: CE on TV)
> It's a Cinderella story, fantastic national TV coverage, and a
> top-notch accomplishment of winning against all the gas cars with an
> electric. Why lie about the top speed and cheapen the accomplishment?
> It undermines the credibility of everything else you say.
>
> You know you have never gone "over 150 miles per hour". Why
> lie about it on national TV?
>
> Bill Dube'
>
> At 12:45 PM 9/28/2006, you wrote:
> >here is a link to the feature done on Dennis and his CE
> >
> >http://kuat.org/arizonaillustrated/details.cfm?ID=192
> >
> >Congratulations Dennis and good luck at the finals!
> >
> >Rush
> >Tucson AZ
> >www.ironandwood.org
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi everyone,
I had a voicemail from a lady wanted to electrify her bicycle. If any
of you know of people doing this type of project, or would be willing to
help her, let me know. I'll call the lady back and relay the information.
-Ryan
--
- EV Source <http://www.evsource.com> -
Professional grade electric vehicle parts and resources
E-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Toll-free: 1-877-215-6781
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I just take it apart myself. I took a whole Aspire apart in a day and a
half. I sold all the parts for more than the donor car. So I paid nothing
for the car & made some money to boot. I did have parts from two cars. The
wrecked one & the Ice parts from the Aspire.. I now know why junk yards do
so well. It did take a lot of time to sell all the parts. I'm still
selling them. Lawrence Rhodes.........
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Kobb" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 7:09 AM
Subject: Engine swap for removal labor
> I had AN idea... but I'm a newbie, so I don't know if it's a GOOD idea.
Perhaps the EVDL can give me some insight.
>
> Here's the concept:
>
> What if go to a neighborhood mechanic or engine re-builder and make him
this offer: I will go out and buy a running, decent, not-too-old Ford
Ranger...
>
> ...and then GIVE him for FREE the entire engine and all associated ICE
hardware, IF...
>
> ...he does the labor to remove all that stuff from the vehicle. In other
words, he gets an engine; I get his time.
>
> The attraction to me, of course, is that it would get me to a completed
conversion much faster than if I removed the equipment myself.
>
> Now here's my question to you: If this IS a good idea, who is it good FOR?
Both me and the mechanic? Or just him? Or just me?
>
> Let's say that it's just good for him. That would mean that I'm giving
away something MUCH more valuable than what he's giving me.
>
> Or maybe it's the reverse. I just don't know.
>
> Your comments are welcome.
>
> Steve Kobb
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Really good point Rich. But honestly you are about the last person that
should be pointing it out.
Mike
--- Rich Rudman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Bill Dube
>
> You need to formally apologize To Dennis Berube for Calling him, a
> List
> memeber, a Lier, in a Public format.
>
> This is totally unprofessional and it is not to be taken lightly or
> tolerated.
>
> It is you who are mistaken.
> This sour Grapes efforts on your part, should stay out of the public
> limelight..
>
> Rich Rudman
> Manzanita Micro
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bill Dube" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 6:49 AM
> Subject: Why lie? (was: CE on TV)
>
>
> > It's a Cinderella story, fantastic national TV coverage, and a
> > top-notch accomplishment of winning against all the gas cars with
> an
> > electric. Why lie about the top speed and cheapen the
> accomplishment?
> > It undermines the credibility of everything else you say.
> >
> > You know you have never gone "over 150 miles per hour".
> Why
> > lie about it on national TV?
> >
> > Bill Dube'
> >
> > At 12:45 PM 9/28/2006, you wrote:
> > >here is a link to the feature done on Dennis and his CE
> > >
> > >http://kuat.org/arizonaillustrated/details.cfm?ID=192
> > >
> > >Congratulations Dennis and good luck at the finals!
> > >
> > >Rush
> > >Tucson AZ
> > >www.ironandwood.org
> >
>
>
Here's to the crazy ones.
The misfits.
The rebels.
The troublemakers.
The round pegs in the square holes.
The ones who see things differently
The ones that change the world!!
www.RotorDesign.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Where is she located? Installing hub motor kits is really simple a 1 to
2 hour project.
Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Ryan Bohm
Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 8:37 AM
To: EV List
Subject: Electric assisted bicycle
Hi everyone,
I had a voicemail from a lady wanted to electrify her bicycle. If any
of you know of people doing this type of project, or would be willing to
help her, let me know. I'll call the lady back and relay the
information.
-Ryan
--
- EV Source <http://www.evsource.com> -
Professional grade electric vehicle parts and resources
E-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Toll-free: 1-877-215-6781
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In a message dated 9/29/2006 7:26:32 AM Pacific Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> Subj: Re: Why lie? (was: CE on TV)
> Date:9/29/2006 7:26:32 AM Pacific Standard Time
> From:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Reply-to:[email protected]
> To:[email protected]
> Received from Internet:
>
>
>
> In a message dated 9/29/2006 7:05:33 AM Pacific Standard Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> >Subj: Why lie? (was: CE on TV)
> >Date:9/29/2006 7:05:33 AM Pacific Standard Time
> >From:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >Reply-to:[email protected]
> >To:[email protected]
> >Received from Internet:
> >
> >
> >
> >It's a Cinderella story, fantastic national TV coverage, and a
> >top-notch accomplishment of winning against all the gas cars with an
> >electric. Why lie about the top speed and cheapen the accomplishment?
> >It undermines the credibility of everything else you say.
> >
> > You know you have never gone "over 150 miles per hour". Why
> >lie about it on national TV?
> >
> >Bill Dube'
> >
> >At 12:45 PM 9/28/2006, you wrote:
> >>here is a link to the feature done on Dennis and his CE
> >>
> >>http://kuat.org/arizonaillustrated/details.cfm?ID=192
> >>
> >>Congratulations Dennis and good luck at the finals!
> >>
> >>Rush
> >>Tucson AZ
> >>www.ironandwood.org
> >
> Bill I have 5 timeslips of 149mph +,. and 1 152.7 slip.Can I fax them to
> you?
> Dennis
I have faxed 7 timeslips to Rich Rudman,Bill look at the timeslip where I
raced the killacycle at speedworld I still have it.It is 8mph over my posted
nedra record of 137. Dennis with just a little more in my
pocket.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
For those intrested I will bring 23(and still searching) timeslips over
147mph and 1 over 150mph to the division 7 et finals in Bakersfield for your
viewing.Hope to see some list members there oct 13 to the 15th.
Dennis
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
which dc-dc power supplies are isolated enough to
power the emeter?
I was wondering if I hooked up an iota dc charger to
my 120vdc pack to charge my 12volt accessory battery,
and then ran an inverter to 120vac and then used a
wall-box to go to 12vdc...would there be any isolation
there?
Since I own all those components all ready...I
wouldn't have to purchase a $150 dc-dc power supply...
but your ideas are welcome.
thanks!
Michael Golub
86 toyota
fairbanks
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Actually taking the engine out is the easy part of the
conversion. Just look at this way...you don't have to
reinstall it, and get it running again.
And you can buy an engine hoist for under $200 at
sam's or other auto parts places.
--- Lawrence Rhodes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> I just take it apart myself. I took a whole Aspire
> apart in a day and a
> half. I sold all the parts for more than the donor
> car. So I paid nothing
> for the car & made some money to boot. I did have
> parts from two cars. The
> wrecked one & the Ice parts from the Aspire.. I now
> know why junk yards do
> so well. It did take a lot of time to sell all the
> parts. I'm still
> selling them. Lawrence Rhodes.........
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steve Kobb" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 7:09 AM
> Subject: Engine swap for removal labor
>
>
> > I had AN idea... but I'm a newbie, so I don't know
> if it's a GOOD idea.
> Perhaps the EVDL can give me some insight.
> >
> > Here's the concept:
> >
> > What if go to a neighborhood mechanic or engine
> re-builder and make him
> this offer: I will go out and buy a running, decent,
> not-too-old Ford
> Ranger...
> >
> > ...and then GIVE him for FREE the entire engine
> and all associated ICE
> hardware, IF...
> >
> > ...he does the labor to remove all that stuff from
> the vehicle. In other
> words, he gets an engine; I get his time.
> >
> > The attraction to me, of course, is that it would
> get me to a completed
> conversion much faster than if I removed the
> equipment myself.
> >
> > Now here's my question to you: If this IS a good
> idea, who is it good FOR?
> Both me and the mechanic? Or just him? Or just me?
> >
> > Let's say that it's just good for him. That would
> mean that I'm giving
> away something MUCH more valuable than what he's
> giving me.
> >
> > Or maybe it's the reverse. I just don't know.
> >
> > Your comments are welcome.
> >
> > Steve Kobb
> >
>
>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Yes- I will be there early on.
On Sep 28, 2006, at 11:09 PM, Cor van de Water wrote:
Hi Mark,
Are you coming to the Palo Alto EV show this saturday?
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of MARK DUTKO
Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 9:47 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: EV RALLY/NEW YARIS CONVERSION
I'll put you on the short list- Just picked it up this evening- long
drive back to SF from LA ....
On Sep 28, 2006, at 9:12 AM, John G. Lussmyer wrote:
----- Original Message ----- From: "MARK DUTKO" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
I purchased an 07' Toyota Yaris to be converted and will be
seeking advice here on the list in the months to come.
This is a brand new
car with about 100 miles, anyone know a good place to sell a new
1500cc motor? It's a 5-speed, three
Hmm, that might make a good generator if all the emissions and
exhaust systems are kept with it....
Tempting.
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream.... http://
www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
What about just buying some of the parts?
The charger?
The controller?
The motor?
--- Lawrence Rhodes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> I know that Xebra has it's controller installed in
> the USA. That may make it qualify for Made in USA
> status. It is then also a kit. If the car was sent
> here without a controller that might work but if it
> is an AC drive it could be expensive. I think the
> two parts concept sounds good. Lawrence.......
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Ailian Chong
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Cc: Lawrence Rhodes ; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 1:36 PM
> Subject: First Electric Vehicle
>
>
> Hi Stephen, Larry, etc.:
> So more on the China EVs. We're looking into how
> to bring one EV back directly as a kit car. Do you
> have any contacts or knowledge on this issue? I
> know some folks out there have such experience under
> their belt bringing back a foreign car, but usually
> through the dealer/manufacturer.
>
> I did read on one website that a person coming
> back from abroad can bring ONE vehicle into the USA
> without any problem, with free duty up to $400. I
> saw something about Kit Cars qualifying for free
> rate of duty under custom laws as classification
> 9503.30.00, but I can't believe that would apply for
> higher volume importation.
>
> The website www.NHTSA.dot.gov/cars/rules/import is
> enlightening but not directly appllcable to kit
> cars. There's also the clean air website
> (www.epa.gov/oms/imports/kitcar.htm) that warns
> against circumventing the clean air rules by
> importing vehicles in parts (which really shouldn't
> be a problem for EVs and clean air, but more of a
> problem for complying with DOT requirements). And,
> of course, California will have its own
> restrictions.
>
> Ben says Zap imports their vehicles from China so
> if we know how they do it, it should be similar.
> CommterCars emailed me back and said that their kit
> cars come in two main parts, and the end user just
> installs shock absorbers, brake lines, and connect
> 10 wires.
>
> Let the information flow.
> Oy-Lene Chong
>
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Get your email and more, right on the new
> Yahoo.com
>
>
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
I was curious do the Ghia & 914 use the same adapter? Which do you think
would make a better conversion? Lighter? Aero?
Thanks,
Mark
---------------------------------
All-new Yahoo! Mail - Fire up a more powerful email and get things done faster.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
When people say "144V" pack, they mean this as the _nominal_ voltage:
Twelve 12-volt batteries, or 24 6-volt batteries. The actual charging
voltage will be somewhat higher. If you're charging at 2.35V / cell,
that means 14.35 per 12V battery, meaning 172.2V.
For AC voltages, 120V refers to the RMS (root-mean-square) voltage of
the associated sine wave. The actual peak-to-peak value of an AC signal
is 120V * 1.414, which gives 170VDC when rectified. In practice, I've
seen as much as 180VDC, as 120V isn't always 120V.
You'll need to boost a Bad Boy for 144V. See this page:
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/tech/
Storm Connors wrote:
Just when you think you've made a decisiom... I
decided on a 144v pack for the Samurai. Then I
contemplated charging. I have two military surplus
chargers that will each go to 150v. To charge to
177.6v I could use the two of them in series. Or split
the pack and charge each 72v string separately.
Perhaps the chargers would have to be on separate 110v
circuits as well.
Since there is no way I can carry these chargers
around with me, I've been planning on building a "bad
boy" charger for opportunity charging. To charge the
144v pack would seem to require a transformer. How
high a voltage pack can I charge from 110v? (without
transformer)
It is beginning to look like dropping back to 120v
might be a better option.
I could get a new charger, but the features that are
included for the $1k-2k cost seem more needed for SLA
than flooded batteries.
storm
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Storm,
Try this as a test.
Plug in the charger to the same 120 volt receptacle so the chargers will be
on the same AC phase.
Then connect the DC outputs, negative of one charger to the positive of the
other. This leaves you with two remaining dc outputs pos and neg.
Read the voltage across these leads and adjust charger output from 168 v
(finishing charge) to 180 v (balk charge) to 185 (equalization charge).
You may not get a DC output reading until you connect it to a 144 battery
pack.
Make sure that the current and voltage knob is turn all the way down, and
power switch is off. Connect the two DC pos and neg. leads across the 144
battery and plug in the charger.
Next, turn on the charge power switch.
And than turn up the voltage to about 180 volts, and then finally turn on
the ampere to about 16 amps, which should be the maximum ampere on a 120 vac
20 amp recepticle.
If that works, then you could also use 240 vac to the input of two 120 vac
transformers (the ones in each charger and connect the transformers in
series.
Make sure that the neutral (white wire) may be use as a ground wire which
was normal way back then. If the chargers does not have a ground wire (ac
green wire) than replace the cord with a 3 wire No. AWG 12 for 20 amp on 120
volts, or 4 wire No. AWG 12 for 20 amp on 240 volts.
The extra neutral wire (in the 4 wire cable for 240 volts), can be use for
some 120 volt AC circuits in the charger as required.
It is very normal for us in our electrical work, to connect up transformers
in series, parallel, or series parallel, which is call a WYE, DELTA, or Open
DELTA circuits.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Storm Connors" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "List EV" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 9:00 AM
Subject: Battery charging
> Just when you think you've made a decisiom... I
> decided on a 144v pack for the Samurai. Then I
> contemplated charging. I have two military surplus
> chargers that will each go to 150v. To charge to
> 177.6v I could use the two of them in series. Or split
> the pack and charge each 72v string separately.
> Perhaps the chargers would have to be on separate 110v
> circuits as well.
>
> Since there is no way I can carry these chargers
> around with me, I've been planning on building a "bad
> boy" charger for opportunity charging. To charge the
> 144v pack would seem to require a transformer. How
> high a voltage pack can I charge from 110v? (without
> transformer)
>
> It is beginning to look like dropping back to 120v
> might be a better option.
>
> I could get a new charger, but the features that are
> included for the $1k-2k cost seem more needed for SLA
> than flooded batteries.
>
> storm
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Years ago I had a Toyota pickup. I found it got better mileage with the gate
down. It was really apparent. This would not be the first time that I've busted
the "Mythbusters" on the myths they create...
-Ralph
On Thu, 28 Sep 2006 23:16:39 -0700
Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This is getting silly.
>
> I can see the effect of the air bubble in the bed when I
> drive at freeway speeds and dry leaves are staying in the bed
> because of the calm air above them, occasionally blowing a few
> out of the bed.
> Put the tailgate down and it changes quite a bit.
>
> But don't believe anyone's advice, experience or measurements,
> so decide on a good way to measure this effect (Amps draw?)
> and make two runs at the same place and speed, one with the
> gate up and one down. See for your self.
> You sound an awful lot as the "not invented here" syndrome,
> so I suggest that you ask yourself why it is that you
> dismiss other people's info and experience this way.
>
> Regards,
>
> Cor van de Water
> Systems Architect
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
> Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
> Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Joseph H. Strubhar
> Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 9:39 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: Ranger doner
>
>
> So I take it you believe everything the government says, or pays someone
> else to say?
>
> Joseph H. Strubhar
>
> E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Web: www.gremcoinc.com
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Death to All Spammers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 10:28 PM
> Subject: Re: Ranger doner
>
>
> > > I don't doubt it. The aero drag is actually a difference of air
> > > pressure on the front and back. Most people tend to only think the
> > > increase in pressure in the front is significant, but the decrease in
> > > pressure in back is often quite significant. The large, flat area
> > > behind the cab is a problem. With the gate up, there's less of a
> > > pressure drop behind the cab because the air doesn't have to turn
> > > suddenly in its path.
> > >
> >
> > There are actual government test that prove you should leave the
> > tailgate up - too lazy to look for them right now, but *someone* got
> > paid to prove this! Once you hear the reason for it, it does make
> > logical sense, bt you have to look at the vehicle as a whole, not just
> > the tailgate as a single part of it.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.12.9/458 - Release Date: 9/27/2006
> >
> >
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Michael,
See if you have an old power brick from a laptop.
That is often a switching power supply accepting
110 to 240V AC with DC output around 15V
Even a 110V only switcher could work very well, as
your pack is 120V DC and 110V AC can easily reach 190V peak
while the lower side should allow it to run from 120V DC
and much lower (in practice I have seen a 110V switcher
run on 36V DC!)
Let me know if you like me to look at one of my 12V bricks,
I can send it to you for $5
It is simple to test if it is a switcher and has no
transformer (which will NOT work directly from yrou pack
my measuring the DC resistance between the 110V pins.
If you measure two diode drop and ramping up resistance
(from the cap charging) then you are good to go.
Success,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of mike golub
Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 10:33 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: emeter power supply
which dc-dc power supplies are isolated enough to
power the emeter?
I was wondering if I hooked up an iota dc charger to
my 120vdc pack to charge my 12volt accessory battery,
and then ran an inverter to 120vac and then used a
wall-box to go to 12vdc...would there be any isolation
there?
Since I own all those components all ready...I
wouldn't have to purchase a $150 dc-dc power supply...
but your ideas are welcome.
thanks!
Michael Golub
86 toyota
fairbanks
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Apparently results differ.
Again: the only way to conclude this with certainty is
to do the measurement for your vehicle of choice, as
different models may have different Aero characteristics.
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Ralph
Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 10:34 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Ranger doner
Years ago I had a Toyota pickup. I found it got better mileage with the gate
down. It was really apparent. This would not be the first time that I've
busted the "Mythbusters" on the myths they create...
-Ralph
On Thu, 28 Sep 2006 23:16:39 -0700
Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> This is getting silly.
>
> I can see the effect of the air bubble in the bed when I
> drive at freeway speeds and dry leaves are staying in the bed
> because of the calm air above them, occasionally blowing a few
> out of the bed.
> Put the tailgate down and it changes quite a bit.
>
> But don't believe anyone's advice, experience or measurements,
> so decide on a good way to measure this effect (Amps draw?)
> and make two runs at the same place and speed, one with the
> gate up and one down. See for your self.
> You sound an awful lot as the "not invented here" syndrome,
> so I suggest that you ask yourself why it is that you
> dismiss other people's info and experience this way.
>
> Regards,
>
> Cor van de Water
> Systems Architect
> Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
> Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
> Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Joseph H. Strubhar
> Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 9:39 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: Ranger doner
>
>
> So I take it you believe everything the government says, or pays someone
> else to say?
>
> Joseph H. Strubhar
>
> E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Web: www.gremcoinc.com
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Death to All Spammers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 10:28 PM
> Subject: Re: Ranger doner
>
>
> > > I don't doubt it. The aero drag is actually a difference of air
> > > pressure on the front and back. Most people tend to only think the
> > > increase in pressure in the front is significant, but the decrease in
> > > pressure in back is often quite significant. The large, flat area
> > > behind the cab is a problem. With the gate up, there's less of a
> > > pressure drop behind the cab because the air doesn't have to turn
> > > suddenly in its path.
> > >
> >
> > There are actual government test that prove you should leave the
> > tailgate up - too lazy to look for them right now, but *someone* got
> > paid to prove this! Once you hear the reason for it, it does make
> > logical sense, bt you have to look at the vehicle as a whole, not just
> > the tailgate as a single part of it.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.12.9/458 - Release Date:
9/27/2006
> >
> >
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
No, Look at the diagrams in your E-meter diagrams. You should isolated the
on board 12 volt battery circuits from the E-meter.
If you do not, than the negative of the 12 volt battery is connected to the
negative of the battery pack, which would be connected to the frame of the
EV by the 12 volt negative grounding system.
The E-meter has a optional module which In my case for a Link-10, is a DC-DC
converter No. DC2410 you can get from www.evparts.com.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "mike golub" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 11:32 AM
Subject: emeter power supply
> which dc-dc power supplies are isolated enough to
> power the emeter?
>
> I was wondering if I hooked up an iota dc charger to
> my 120vdc pack to charge my 12volt accessory battery,
> and then ran an inverter to 120vac and then used a
> wall-box to go to 12vdc...would there be any isolation
> there?
>
> Since I own all those components all ready...I
> wouldn't have to purchase a $150 dc-dc power supply...
>
> but your ideas are welcome.
>
> thanks!
>
> Michael Golub
> 86 toyota
> fairbanks
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Erik Bigelow wrote:
> I've had my EV running for a week today and am having a blast
> showing it off
Congratulations!
> My motor seems hot, really hot, after my 7 mile ride home
> from work. It's moderately hilly, but not bad, with no speed
> limits above 45. I've kept the motor around 3-4k RPM except
> on takeoffs from a stoplight, and when I get home it's too
> hot to hold my hand on for more than a few seconds.
I've got a similar commute and a lighter car, also running an 8" ADC.
My motor is also pretty warm at either end of my commute (though on the
homeward leg I do a mile or so at 45-50mph followed by a decent hill
climb at lower speed), so I think this is pretty normal. I'm also in
Vancouver, BC which I expect is a bit cooler than TX, so it wouldn't
surprise me at all if your motor was a bit hotter than mine even if
everything is normal.
The ADC 8" has an internal fan (you can see the blades through the
openings at the end that connects to the tranny), so as long as the
openings there and at the comm end are unobstructed and don't run the
motor at low RPM for long periods it should keep itself cool.
> While I have the motor out is there any other good
> preventative maintenence to do? New motor bearings?
> Turn the comm? New brushes? To my knowledge the motor
> is about 10 years old and I'm not sure what was done before.
Calendar age means little; the motor may be 10years old and have only
100hrs of operation on it.
By all means, if you pull the motor to address the vibration issue check
the brushes/comm and spin the motor (without the flywheel) on 6 or 12V
to see if there is any vibration so suggest the bearings need replacing.
Bearings are not particularly expensive, but there is little point to
tearing the motor apart to replace them if they are fine. You might
want to pick up a comm stone to clean up the comm and ensure the brushes
are seated well, but otherwise "ain't broke, don't fix it" seems to
apply. ;^>
If you decide to hold off on pulling the motor, you can still stone the
comm in the meantime provided you can access the comm end of the motor
with it in the car.
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I would like again to suggest to nedra that any record runs be backed up the
same day with a like run as per nhra rules.Any 1 timeslip can be a mistake as
I have a timeslip with a 314mph #...... Dennis
Berube
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
We at NEDRA have been approached by Hot Rod Magazines associate editor
Christopher Campbell. They want to do a short piece on NEDRA as the
Motorsport of the Month in their January '07 issue. It will be in the
recurring section titled "Gearhead Life" where they do a brief highlight on
interesting ways to get out there and race. If anyone has some great shots
of drag racing, burnouts, or under the hood that are of 300 dpi plus quality
could they please get them to me. They are particularly interested in a shot
of the "Maniac Mazda" launching. Does anyone out there have a good shot? It
is hard to take pictures when you are driving :-) I'm sure you will get
credit for your photo if they decide to use it.
Roderick Wilde
NEDRA Marketing Director
--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.407 / Virus Database: 268.12.9/458 - Release Date: 9/27/2006
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks. Any special thoughts on using a dumb charger?
(I was not referring to me.) :)
--- Roland Wiench <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hello Storm,
>
> Try this as a test.
>
> Plug in the charger to the same 120 volt receptacle
> so the chargers will be
> on the same AC phase.
>
> Then connect the DC outputs, negative of one charger
> to the positive of the
> other. This leaves you with two remaining dc outputs
> pos and neg.
>
> Read the voltage across these leads and adjust
> charger output from 168 v
> (finishing charge) to 180 v (balk charge) to 185
> (equalization charge).
>
> You may not get a DC output reading until you
> connect it to a 144 battery
> pack.
>
> Make sure that the current and voltage knob is turn
> all the way down, and
> power switch is off. Connect the two DC pos and
> neg. leads across the 144
> battery and plug in the charger.
>
> Next, turn on the charge power switch.
>
> And than turn up the voltage to about 180 volts, and
> then finally turn on
> the ampere to about 16 amps, which should be the
> maximum ampere on a 120 vac
> 20 amp recepticle.
>
>
> If that works, then you could also use 240 vac to
> the input of two 120 vac
> transformers (the ones in each charger and connect
> the transformers in
> series.
>
> Make sure that the neutral (white wire) may be use
> as a ground wire which
> was normal way back then. If the chargers does not
> have a ground wire (ac
> green wire) than replace the cord with a 3 wire No.
> AWG 12 for 20 amp on 120
> volts, or 4 wire No. AWG 12 for 20 amp on 240 volts.
>
> The extra neutral wire (in the 4 wire cable for 240
> volts), can be use for
> some 120 volt AC circuits in the charger as
> required.
>
> It is very normal for us in our electrical work, to
> connect up transformers
> in series, parallel, or series parallel, which is
> call a WYE, DELTA, or Open
> DELTA circuits.
>
> Roland
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Storm Connors" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "List EV" <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 9:00 AM
> Subject: Battery charging
>
>
> > Just when you think you've made a decisiom... I
> > decided on a 144v pack for the Samurai. Then I
> > contemplated charging. I have two military surplus
> > chargers that will each go to 150v. To charge to
> > 177.6v I could use the two of them in series. Or
> split
> > the pack and charge each 72v string separately.
> > Perhaps the chargers would have to be on separate
> 110v
> > circuits as well.
> >
> > Since there is no way I can carry these chargers
> > around with me, I've been planning on building a
> "bad
> > boy" charger for opportunity charging. To charge
> the
> > 144v pack would seem to require a transformer. How
> > high a voltage pack can I charge from 110v?
> (without
> > transformer)
> >
> > It is beginning to look like dropping back to 120v
> > might be a better option.
> >
> > I could get a new charger, but the features that
> are
> > included for the $1k-2k cost seem more needed for
> SLA
> > than flooded batteries.
> >
> > storm
> >
> >
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well... it's not only the gov't, but also private testing (college kids).
<g> Ford says to leave the tailgate up and on, for safety.
Actually, best mileage comes w/ the tailgate *OFF*, or the box covered w/
a flush fit hard cover.
> So I take it you believe everything the government says, or pays someone
> else to say?
>
> Joseph H. Strubhar
>
> E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Web: www.gremcoinc.com
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Death to All Spammers" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 10:28 PM
> Subject: Re: Ranger doner
>
>
>> > I don't doubt it. The aero drag is actually a difference of air
>> > pressure on the front and back. Most people tend to only think the
>> > increase in pressure in the front is significant, but the decrease in
>> > pressure in back is often quite significant. The large, flat area
>> > behind the cab is a problem. With the gate up, there's less of a
>> > pressure drop behind the cab because the air doesn't have to turn
>> > suddenly in its path.
>> >
>>
>> There are actual government test that prove you should leave the
>> tailgate up - too lazy to look for them right now, but *someone* got
>> paid to prove this! Once you hear the reason for it, it does make
>> logical sense, bt you have to look at the vehicle as a whole, not just
>> the tailgate as a single part of it.
--- End Message ---
