EV Digest 6080
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: considering conversion cars
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: 2X Alltrax = Curtis ?
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: prescaler saying 72.2volts
by "steve clunn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: EV pusher Trailer
by "Mark McCurdy" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Considering Conversion Cars
by "Mark E. Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) RE: I can build your controller, off topic
by "Michael Trefry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: 2X Alltrax = Curtis ?
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) RE: prescaler saying 72.2volts
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9)
by "Don Cameron" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) SOC from battery voltage
by JS <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Car And Driver at PIR...
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
12) Re: 2X Alltrax = Curtis ?
by Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) TATA Motors of India to make US$2,000 People's Car
by Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Hollow EV Horror TRICK AND TREAT
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) ceramic fin repair
by mike golub <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: SOC from battery voltage
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) RE: 2X Alltrax = Curtis ?
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) RE: prescaler saying 72.2volts
by "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) RE: EV pusher Trailer
by "Lawrence Lile" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) RE: Electronic Circuit Design and Simulation Software
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) EV's on Snow Tires
by MIKE WILLMON <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: 2X Alltrax = Curtis ?
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: CURRENT ELIMINATOR DRAGSTER News
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
24) RE: I can build your controller, off topic
by Rocketjosh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: ceramic fin repair
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Internal spline shaft forklift motors
by john bart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: EV's on Snow Tires
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: Car And Driver at PIR...
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) Re: 2X Alltrax = Curtis ?
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) Re: Disabling Civic Power Steering Attn: Jim Schinnerer
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Geo Metros are popular, but I believe that is the exact same car as the
Swift.
> I am looking at either the Fiat Uno or the Suzuki Swift as conversion
> cars.
> They have similar frontal area (1.58m x 1.35m vs 1.55m x 1.42m)
> and weight (887kg vs. 845kg).
> Does any one have any recommendations for better cheap/common cars
> for conversion?
>
>
> Jeremy Rutman
> Technion Physics Dep't
> Haifa 32000
> Israel
> 972 4 8293669
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well, I do have a spare Curtis controller, that I just may try this with.
I'll have to see what kind of time I have this winter to fiddle. I probably
won't be going to a full 96 volts however, as I do not want that many
batteries on my bike, but with BB600 cells, I can pick just about any
voltage I want to. I currently have 45 cells on the bike, so I would be
experimenting with something between 46 and 80 cells.
I don't want to try this with my Alltrax. I like it too much to take a
chance with it, and Lee specifically had a Curtis in mind when he put this
together.
damon
From: Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: 2X Alltrax = Curtis ?
Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2006 09:44:54 -0600
Dale Curren wrote:
Could you please post that diagram again for us newbies?
All I did was tell Google to search for "Lee Hart EV Curtis Controller" and
the first "hit" was it:
Ev Archive for January 2002: On Tue, Jan 29 2002, Lee Hart wrote:
If I really felt inclined to do this (and had a controller I was
willing to sacrifice to the gods of experimentation :-) I would
try something like this: View with fixed width font:
___________________________________
| | _|_
__|__ + | / \ armature
___ 48v / S1b \___/
| - | _______ | series
|____/_____|____________| | |_ motor
| S2 | |B+ | _|
| __|__ + | | _| field
/ S1a ___ 48v | M-|_____|
| | - | |
|__________|____________|B- | Controller
|_______|
With S2 open, and S1a and S1b closed, you have two 48v batteries in
parallel driving a 48v controller and series motor in a completely
normal fashion. The controller adjusts effective motor voltage from
0-48v.
With S1a and S1b open, and S2 closed, the two 48v batteries are wired in
series for 96v. But the controller still only sees 48v between its B+
and B- terminals. The controller still adjusts the effective voltage at
M- from 0-48v. But since the top connection to the motor is 48v higher,
the motor sees 48-96v.
Thus you have two ranges; 0-48v, and 48-96v. Note that the controller's
current limit won't work in the 96v range. That's because even if the
controller is fully off, the motor is still connected to the upper 48v
battery through the controller's freewheel diode (between M- and B+).
Thus, you must not use the 96v range unless motor current is below the
controller's current limit.
In operation, you accelerate at 48v until the controller comes out of
current limit, release the throttle, switch to 96v, then re-apply the
throttle. If you're in the 96v range and start climbing a hill, you must
switch back to the 48v range before the motor current rises above the
controller's current limit.
Another quirk of this circuit is that the batteries are unequally
discharged in the 96v position; the upper battery always carries motor
current, while the lower one carries motor current x controller % duty
cycle. But the batteries will re-balance during the time spent in the
48v position.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
_________________________________________________________________
Try the next generation of search with Windows Live Search today!
http://imagine-windowslive.com/minisites/searchlaunch/?locale=en-us&source=hmtagline
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
off the top of my head I'd say no stop , somthings wrong ... but mybe your
meter ( dmm? ) uses less current than e meter v sence and that is why your
getting a hi voltage . We don't know so before hooking it to the whole pack
, start out at 48 volts , you should see 4.8 v on the e meter I believe. I
would think that in the prescaler they would have a ziner diode to keep the
voltage under 50 at all times but maybe not , anyway , don't forget to have
all grounds hooked up first . \
steve clunn
----- Original Message -----
From: "mike golub" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 6:25 AM
Subject: prescaler saying 72.2volts
I'm about to reconnect my emeter, and the prescaler
reading through a volt meter is saying 72.2 volts. Is
that OK?
I'm running a 120volt system, and the batteries were
on a charger. I'm using the 900086 0-500v prescaler.
thanks
____________________________________________________________________________________
Access over 1 million songs - Yahoo! Music Unlimited
(http://music.yahoo.com/unlimited)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
in a word
weight
To push an ICE, it would have to have a lot of batteries, which means a lot
of weight, which means a lot of wasted gas towing it on the freeway and hard
to handle since it weighs soo much
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence Lile" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 8:34 AM
Subject: EV pusher Trailer
You see EV'ers building ICE pusher trailers to extend their range. What
about the other way around? You take a rear end and differential, hack
on a motor batteries and controller, and hitch it up to whatever car you
want.
I know the idea has been discussed here - has anyone done it?
You'd have to add a control module in the cab, but the mods to the car
would be minimal.
There would be some safety measures needed at the trailer: A remote
disconnect that can be actuated from the cab electrically, a fail-safe
controller that would de-energize the electric motor in case of a failed
cable. Maybe de-energize the motor on application of towing vehicle
brakes.
Adding a second foot-feed to operate the trailer might not be easy in
some cars. A hand operated throttle seems tricky. Possibly arrange it
to disconnect the EV motor if the brakes are applied?
In the full blown EV, if you exceed your range, you are in for the
hassle of a tow or a night long charging cycle at the side of the road
with some buddy's ICE and an inverter. But with an EV pusher, if you
run out of juice you just shut it off and tow it home.
The idea is to achieve more electric percentage than a conventional
hybrid, say 75% of your motor power at highway speeds, without buying a
donor vehicle or going through the more difficult process of converting
a donor vehicle. Gets you 75% of the way to the goal, and when you want
to visit the relatives in Tumwater, you can just unhitch the EV trailer
and away you go.
Lawrence Lile
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
I just bought a Porsche 914 1974' and I have to install a frame since it
folded in half due to age/rust and poor design. Apparently this vehicle never
came with a frame so one has to be installed; I got from reinforcement
specialties and a MIG welder from Northern Tool. (Harbor Frieght has a cheaper
one but looks cheaper :-)
the VW adapter bolted up with the bug singlelywheel (the Porsche has 5 bolts
Cheers,
Mark
From: "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: considering conversion cars Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2006 08:03:06
-0500 Plain Text Attachment [ Scan and Save to Computer | Save to Yahoo!
Briefcase ]
How about a Toyota Echo? Low Cd, (.29), low weight (2050) and it's easy
and cheap to upgrade the suspension with Scion xB components ( people upgrade
the Xb a lot, so there are used XB parts cheap on Ebay) phil >From:
Jeremy Rutman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Reply-To: [email protected] >To:
[email protected] >Subject: considering conversion cars >Date: Mon, 30 Oct
2006 10:30:14 +0200 > >I am looking at either the Fiat Uno or the Suzuki
Swift as conversion cars. >They have similar frontal area (1.58m x 1.35m vs
1.55m x 1.42m) >and weight (887kg vs. 845kg). >Does any one have any
recommendations for better cheap/common cars for >conversion? > > >Jeremy
Rutman >Technion Physics Dep't >Haifa 32000 >Israel >972 4 8293669 >
---------------------------------
Get your email and see which of your friends are online - Right on the new
Yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Eventually, (when the world has gone electric) there will be no hobbyists,
other than the EV "tuner" for which there will always be a marketplace for
someone like Otmar and Rich. And so disconnect from the EV owner and
manufacturer will have to come, it's difficult to be personal with a few
million customers.
The more we resist this, the longer it will take for the EV revolution. I
say the faster we can get to mass production, the better. It's better for
the world overall.
The issue today is availability. While Otmar and Rich might make the best
products available for the EV today, the fact is that the products are just
not available (in a timely manner). Demand is beginning to overwhelm supply.
And as EV conversions become more and more popular, there is no way they'll
be able to keep up with demand with hand built products, no matter how many
guys they hire and train to put these things together. I actually can't
speak about Rich's charger, I don't know what the availability is on that,
but I'm willing to bet that the more popular it becomes the more difficult a
time he'll have keeping up with demand.
The end goal (for many here, if not all) is freedom from oil, right? We'll
never get there if we are soley dependant on individual component makers.
I say go for it. But try to make sure you're dealing with a fairly ethical
manufacturer, Chinese or not. Nobody wants to be using something made by a
kid chained to table for 18 hours a day.
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of David Roden (Akron OH USA)
Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 2:05 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: I can build your controller, off topic
I rather regret that I brought this up. The thread was on topic, but it's
now
wandered off into discussions of sweatshop conditions in China, which was
not my intention at all. While I can't deny that I have a personal concern
about this, I didn't bring it up because it's not appropriate for the list -
it's off
topic and carries too many political overtones.
I was trying to express a concern - I think a valid one, but others may
disagree - for the future of small manufacturers closely connected with the
EV hobby community. Rich and Otmar are examples here but I'm sure there
are others in Europe and other places. These are people who, thank
goodness, listen to EV hobbyists and supply what they ask for. (I know, I
know, I've groused about certain elements of Rich's PFC charger design - but
I have to say that he asked the list what they wanted, and he built it, for
which is say "bravo.")
I worry that cheap, mass-produced, disposable knockoffs from cheap-labor
centers will disconnect the hobbyist community from the people who make
their components.
BTW, it's not just China, though they are a highly developed presence in
these matters. I'm also thinking of several other cheap-labor nations
including India, Thailand, and (lately) Vietnam.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
BINGO. We have a winner. If Damon does this on his motorcycle I'd like to
be there with my video camera for the first test run. LR.........
> Why couldn't you have it so that at full throttle a contactor made that
> connected the entire 144 volt pack directly to the motor? Then you
> could have the 72 volt side for low throttle driving but for high speed
> driving the controller wouldn't be in the circuit.
>
> Jody
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
mike golub wrote:
> I'm about to reconnect my emeter, and the prescaler
> reading through a volt meter is saying 72.2 volts. Is
> that OK?
> I'm running a 120volt system, and the batteries were
> on a charger. I'm using the 900086 0-500v prescaler.
Disconnect the prescaler input from the traction pack, then connect the
prescaler output to the E-Meter, and only then reconnect the prescaler
input to the batteries.
The prescaler relies on the input impedance of the E-Meter to load its
output, and the E-Meter is only spec'd to accept (survive) voltages up
to 50V on the battery voltage input. For the least risk of damage to
your meter, you should always disconnect the battery from the prescaler
input before conecting or disconnecting the meter from the prescaler
output. (Note, "disconnecting" the battery from the prescaler input
might be as simple as opening your main breaker, or emergency
disconnect.)
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
query ev
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I am using a Curtis 1231c with 16 Trojan T-105 for a 96 volt system.
I try to keep current below 300Amps, and probably average about 100 Amps.
Can the State-Of-Charge be determined from battery voltage when under load?
What is a minimum 'safe' voltage under load?
John in Sylmar, CA
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Anybody know about Car and Driver's Ted West's visit to PIR, NEDRA and his run
in the Zombie?
When is the story scheduled to hit the stands?
Ken
________________________________________________________________________
Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security
tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free
AOL Mail and more.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
A Curtis controller is a chopper drive, at least that is what people
have said here, which is one reason it has inferior performance to the
Zilla, which uses a buck converter to multiply current.
The diagram below is the same as Lee gave, but I have removed the upper
48v, so this is a normal setup. How can current flow through D1? The
voltage returning from the the motor must go above 48v. D1 is there to
clamp any voltage spike back to the battery.
There must be something missing from these diagrams, because it just
doesn't match what is being said as far as I can see.
This is the last I will post on this subject.
____________________________
| _|_
| / \ armature
| \___/
| _________ | series
+48V ________|_____ | |_ motor
| B+| _|_ | _|
| | D1 /_\ | _| field
|+ | |___|_____|
bat | |_| |M-
- | -||_ Q1 |
| | | | |
|0V__________|_____| | Controller
B-|_________|
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://biz.yahoo.com/ibd/061025/newamer.html?.v=1
Maybe someone can look into importing them to the US and convert them to
electric.
At least India is a Democracy.
Jack
BTW, I own shares in TTM
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have got my electrac set up to drive itself and to pull a skelton
holding a hersey bar down my long rocky driveway tommorow night.With co2 fire
exes and firecrackers the neighbor kids will remember this for a while! Dennis
Kilowatt
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mikeak/284026259/
I drilled that hole into the heater, and followed with
a screw and some jb weld.
I used two heaters today. I set them up so the air had
to pas through both. The middle speed was hotter than
the fastest speed. Got 130F degrees on the defroster.
Need to get my emeter going again so I can see how
much battery power this is using up.
--- "Joseph H. Strubhar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> How about a flag terminal, one that crimps on the
> wire at a 90 degree angle
> to the tab?
>
> Joseph H. Strubhar
>
> E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> Web: www.gremcoinc.com
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Dave Cover" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Friday, October 27, 2006 3:42 PM
> Subject: Re: brrr cold zero F today
>
>
> > --- mike golub <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > I installed my heater today. It was 0 degrees F
> when I
> > > left the garage this morning.
> > > One of the pins broke off that Mr.Holmes black
> box
> > > "ceramic" element.
> >
> > I'm installing ceramic heaters too and I have a
> problem that relates to
> what you described. In
> > both the elements I bought the wires are directed
> straight away from the
> top. I need them to come
> > off at a 90 degree angle, basically parallel to
> the airflow through the
> heater. But I can't bend
> > the tabs and the metal the wires need to connect
> to appears to be
> aluminum. How do I solder or
> > bond copper wire to aluminum? Mike, do you have an
> easy way to reattach
> the wire that broke off?
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Dave Cover
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > No virus found in this incoming message.
> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> > Version: 7.1.408 / Virus Database: 268.13.17/505 -
> Release Date:
> 10/27/2006
> >
> >
>
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
Want to start your own business? Learn how on Yahoo! Small Business
(http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello John,
The minimum safe under load is prefer to be at 5 volts per 6 volt battery.
My GE traction meter which has a minimum load indicators design by GE, is
red line between 5 and 5.33 volts. Has caution indicators between 5.33 and
5.66 volts.
The 5 volts per battery would be about 80 volts on your battery pack.
I cannot tell what the S.0.C. would be by just looking at the volt meter
under load. At about 99% S.O.C., I can drop the voltage from 6.8 to 5 volts
at 600 amps or at 80% S.O.C. can drop the voltage from 6.25 to 5 at 600
amps.
Now, if I discharge the batteries to less than 50% S.O.C. which is about 6
volts, I no longer can pull 600 amps, the ampere will surge to about 500
amps and then to about 300 amps. So this can be a indication of S.O.C. if
you know your battery maximum ampere.
Lets say a battery is a 600 amp battery, and you can only pull 300 amps from
it, would this mean you are at 50% S.0.C.? You could, by just letting up on
the load and see where the voltage comes to. Mine at the 300 amp maximum
load was at the 6 volt no load which is 50% S.O.C.
You would have to run a voltage and ampere graph of your battery at
different voltages at no load and ampere at max load. Compare the voltages
to a Specific Gravity to voltage charge specification sheet that is at
Trojan.com and this may give you a indication.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "JS" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 1:41 PM
Subject: SOC from battery voltage
> I am using a Curtis 1231c with 16 Trojan T-105 for a 96 volt system.
> I try to keep current below 300Amps, and probably average about 100 Amps.
>
> Can the State-Of-Charge be determined from battery voltage when under
> load?
> What is a minimum 'safe' voltage under load?
>
> John in Sylmar, CA
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jack Murray wrote:
> A Curtis controller is a chopper drive, at least that is
> what people have said here, which is one reason it has
> inferior performance to the Zilla, which uses a buck
> converter to multiply current.
The Curtis is a buck converter also.
> The diagram below is the same as Lee gave, but I have removed
> the upper 48v, so this is a normal setup. How can current
> flow through D1? The voltage returning from the the motor
> must go above 48v. D1 is there to clamp any voltage spike
> back to the battery.
>
> There must be something missing from these diagrams, because it just
> doesn't match what is being said as far as I can see.
The motor (field) is inductive, so when the FET turns off the current
which is flowing through the motor from B+ to M- cannot stop
immediately. The voltage across the motor (inductor) can, however,
change immediately, and so changes to whatever is necessary to force the
current to continue flowing. The current then flows through the (now
forward biased) D1 and back to B+.
Hope this helps,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
(Sorry if this is a duplicate; haven't seen the original show up yet...)
mike golub wrote:
> I'm about to reconnect my emeter, and the prescaler
> reading through a volt meter is saying 72.2 volts. Is
> that OK?
> I'm running a 120volt system, and the batteries were
> on a charger. I'm using the 900086 0-500v prescaler.
Disconnect the prescaler input from the traction pack, then connect the
prescaler output to the E-Meter, and only then reconnect the prescaler
input to the batteries.
The prescaler relies on the input impedance of the E-Meter to load its
output, and the E-Meter is only spec'd to accept (survive) voltages up
to 50V on the battery voltage input. For the least risk of damage to
your meter, you should always disconnect the battery from the prescaler
input before conecting or disconnecting the meter from the prescaler
output. (Note, "disconnecting" the battery from the prescaler input
might be as simple as opening your main breaker, or emergency
disconnect.)
Cheers,
Roger.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Despite one fellow's skepticism about weight, I think this idea has some
merit. Yeah, the vehicle weighs a lot, but that is not a showstopper.
It's got two motors to get it going! I've pulled trailers that weigh
800# or more, it isn't difficult. At highway speeds, on relatively
level ground, weight isn't a huge factor, compared to stopping and
starting. I'm trying to think through the details of connecting
everything together.
Lawrence Lile, P.E
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lawrence Lile
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 8:35 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: EV pusher Trailer
You see EV'ers building ICE pusher trailers to extend their range. What
about the other way around? You take a rear end and differential, hack
on a motor batteries and controller, and hitch it up to whatever car you
want.
I know the idea has been discussed here - has anyone done it?
You'd have to add a control module in the cab, but the mods to the car
would be minimal.
There would be some safety measures needed at the trailer: A remote
disconnect that can be actuated from the cab electrically, a fail-safe
controller that would de-energize the electric motor in case of a failed
cable. Maybe de-energize the motor on application of towing vehicle
brakes.
Adding a second foot-feed to operate the trailer might not be easy in
some cars. A hand operated throttle seems tricky. Possibly arrange it
to disconnect the EV motor if the brakes are applied?
In the full blown EV, if you exceed your range, you are in for the
hassle of a tow or a night long charging cycle at the side of the road
with some buddy's ICE and an inverter. But with an EV pusher, if you
run out of juice you just shut it off and tow it home.
The idea is to achieve more electric percentage than a conventional
hybrid, say 75% of your motor power at highway speeds, without buying a
donor vehicle or going through the more difficult process of converting
a donor vehicle. Gets you 75% of the way to the goal, and when you want
to visit the relatives in Tumwater, you can just unhitch the EV trailer
and away you go.
Lawrence Lile
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Or just go here and get a free version,
http://www.linear.com/company/software.jsp
I use it for many analog designs at work.
Does a nice job for the money ;-)
Rod
W8RNH
--- "Dewey, Jody R ATC COMNAVAIRLANT, N422G5G"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> You can get a student version of Electronics
> workbench or Circuitmaker
> for about $65. Just go to any college bookstore.
> If you aren't a
> student you can give money TO a student and get them
> to buy it for you.
> The software is limited in what it can do but for
> most people it is very
> capable for experimenting.
>
>
> Jody
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Chet Fields
> Sent: Friday, October 27, 2006 15:04
> To: EV List
> Subject: Electronic Circuit Design and Simulation
> Software
>
> Hello all,
>
> All this discussion about building your own
> controllers and chargers,
> etc. has me wanting to try and build something
> myself even if it is for
> nothing more than to have more appreciation for
> those that are really
> doing it.
>
> I was hoping I could get some recommendations on
> relatively inexpensive
> (not completely professional) yet decent (feature
> rich and easy to use)
> circuit design and simulation software. I have done
> a little searching
> and found some free and shareware stuff and other
> demo software.
> However, the shareware stuff is just too complicated
> to compile and
> setup and the software for the demo versions is a
> little expensive. I
> would like something like the Electronic Workbench
> from a company in
> Canada but maybe not so feature rich. I'd be willing
> to pay up to about
> $100.
>
> I'm not really interested (at least not yet) in PCB
> layout and such.
> Just CAD and perhaps a little simulation and
> testing.
>
> Regards,
> Chet
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
> protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
For two weeks I've had my truck scheduled to get new snow tires installed.
Wouldn't you know it the day I was to go in and get them changed we had almost
a foot of snow. Boy what fun with the old bald tires. Anyway, I had put on
those Bridgestone Blizzaks DMZ3's. I was skeptical that they would have
acceptable performance on the hard packed snow on the streets. I'm plesantly
surprised at their grip. They seem link they are going to do extremely well.
Has anyone alse used these studless snow tires? The extra weight of the
batteries in the back of my truck, as well as the 4WD, makes it handle like a
dream in the snow. And although the armstrong power steering is OK on the
pavement, its downright like having power steering on the snow.
Mike,
Anchorage, Ak.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Oct 30, 2006, at 4:21 PM, Jack Murray wrote:
A Curtis controller is a chopper drive, at least that is what people
have said here, which is one reason it has inferior performance to the
Zilla, which uses a buck converter to multiply current.
The diagram below is the same as Lee gave, but I have removed the
upper 48v, so this is a normal setup. How can current flow through
D1? The voltage returning from the the motor must go above 48v. D1
is there to clamp any voltage spike back to the battery.
When the battery is shut off by Q1 the motor current cannot return to
zero instantly. Current flows through D1 because the motor field is the
inductor in this buck converter. The key here is the field makes the
current continue to flow it in the same direction.
That takes me back to your first point. The Zilla and Curtis are both
buck converters. The Zilla is much more flexible and powerful, but the
basic idea is the same.
Paul "neon" G.
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--- Begin Message ---
The CE will race the last ADRA race of the year this Sat. at Speedworld in
witman az.Its for a thousand dollars.Starts at 9am.Then the following sat.at
speedworld a super pro race for a NHRA WALLY.Its NHRAs most coveted trophy!
Dennis Berube
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--- Begin Message ---
Thank you Michael,
I have visited our factory many times and spoken with some of the workers
(through a translator of course). Most of them travel from other parts of the
country to work in the factories of Dongguan. They have free room and board and
are have numerous breaks throughout the day. Most send the majority of their
earnings back to their families in the countryside.
I am VERY concerned with the well being of the people that work for us. I would
not be able to sleep at night knowing that I profit by the exploitation of
others.
My goal is to build a good, robust and available controller in order to make
building EVs easier for everyone. They will be designed by the experts here in
the states and built by the experts in China. In doing so, I hope that in the
long run, I have made this World a better place.
Josh
Michael Trefry <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Eventually, (when the world has gone
electric) there will be no hobbyists,
other than the EV "tuner" for which there will always be a marketplace for
someone like Otmar and Rich. And so disconnect from the EV owner and
manufacturer will have to come, it's difficult to be personal with a few
million customers.
The more we resist this, the longer it will take for the EV revolution. I
say the faster we can get to mass production, the better. It's better for
the world overall.
The issue today is availability. While Otmar and Rich might make the best
products available for the EV today, the fact is that the products are just
not available (in a timely manner). Demand is beginning to overwhelm supply.
And as EV conversions become more and more popular, there is no way they'll
be able to keep up with demand with hand built products, no matter how many
guys they hire and train to put these things together. I actually can't
speak about Rich's charger, I don't know what the availability is on that,
but I'm willing to bet that the more popular it becomes the more difficult a
time he'll have keeping up with demand.
The end goal (for many here, if not all) is freedom from oil, right? We'll
never get there if we are soley dependant on individual component makers.
I say go for it. But try to make sure you're dealing with a fairly ethical
manufacturer, Chinese or not. Nobody wants to be using something made by a
kid chained to table for 18 hours a day.
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of David Roden (Akron OH USA)
Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2006 2:05 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: I can build your controller, off topic
I rather regret that I brought this up. The thread was on topic, but it's
now
wandered off into discussions of sweatshop conditions in China, which was
not my intention at all. While I can't deny that I have a personal concern
about this, I didn't bring it up because it's not appropriate for the list -
it's off
topic and carries too many political overtones.
I was trying to express a concern - I think a valid one, but others may
disagree - for the future of small manufacturers closely connected with the
EV hobby community. Rich and Otmar are examples here but I'm sure there
are others in Europe and other places. These are people who, thank
goodness, listen to EV hobbyists and supply what they ask for. (I know, I
know, I've groused about certain elements of Rich's PFC charger design - but
I have to say that he asked the list what they wanted, and he built it, for
which is say "bravo.")
I worry that cheap, mass-produced, disposable knockoffs from cheap-labor
centers will disconnect the hobbyist community from the people who make
their components.
BTW, it's not just China, though they are a highly developed presence in
these matters. I'm also thinking of several other cheap-labor nations
including India, Thailand, and (lately) Vietnam.
---------------------------------
We have the perfect Group for you. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Oct 30, 2006, at 3:01 PM, mike golub wrote:
I drilled that hole into the heater, and followed with
a screw and some jb weld.
Warning, JB weld is somewhat conductive. Its a fine resistor but not
rated for the job.
I'm not quite sure what you are trying to do but I don't think JB weld
and a screw is a good way to hold a ceramic heater together. They are
generally made of aluminum and ceramic with a high temp plastic frame.
Aluminum makes for untrustworthy (unless done correctly) electrical
connections. Generally the tabs are soldered on to handle this.
Paul "neon" G.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Is there any reasonable way to make a internal spline shaft forklift motor
feasable for an ev conversion? My original idea was to find a splined shaft
that would fit into the motor and then somehow key the end of the shaft that
would stick out from the face of the motor, but im not really sure how to
secure the shaft into the motor permanetly. Any ideas?
---------------------------------
Check out the New Yahoo! Mail - Fire up a more powerful email and get things
done faster.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Mike,
I just install a new set of Pirelli Scorpion ATR's which replace my Dunlap
ATR's which I ran for 16 years.
It just snow for the first time, and the first 1/2 inch turn to ice. The
Pirelli's have a very sharp pattern that grip the ice like it was gear to it
with the rear air up to 65 lbs and fronts to 40 lbs for a preferred 5
percent deflection rate.
My sister has the Bridgestone Blizzaks on her car and she can walk right up
her steep drive way cover with ice, that is about a mile long going over a
mountain pass at her ranch. The big foot pickup at times could not make it
over the hill.
Roland
Great Falls, MT
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "MIKE WILLMON" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 11:41 AM
Subject: EV's on Snow Tires
> For two weeks I've had my truck scheduled to get new snow tires installed.
> Wouldn't you know it the day I was to go in and get them changed we had
> almost a foot of snow. Boy what fun with the old bald tires. Anyway, I had
> put on those Bridgestone Blizzaks DMZ3's. I was skeptical that they would
> have acceptable performance on the hard packed snow on the streets. I'm
> plesantly surprised at their grip. They seem link they are going to do
> extremely well. Has anyone alse used these studless snow tires? The
> extra weight of the batteries in the back of my truck, as well as the 4WD,
> makes it handle like a dream in the snow. And although the armstrong
> power steering is OK on the pavement, its downright like having power
> steering on the snow.
>
> Mike,
> Anchorage, Ak.
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello to All,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Anybody know about Car and Driver's Ted West's visit to PIR, NEDRA and his run
in the Zombie?
When is the story scheduled to hit the stands?
Ken
I haven't heard anything from Ted for a while and have no information to
pass on. During our last correspondence about a month ago, he told me
that since the electric drag racing story wasn't tied to any release or
debut of a new vehicle or anything like that, that the story might be
saved for an issue where it would fit in well. On the other hand, he
also told me it could run right away, too. It's all up to the magazine's
managing editor.
I did, just send Ted a note asking if he could give me a head's up if
he's heard something recently. Ted's been great about responding to my
emails, as I have been to his...we have shared several emails since his
visit here. When I get a response from him, I'll pass the word on to the
EVDL.
See Ya......John Wayland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In the same was that a capacitor resists a change in voltage, an
inductor resists changes in current. The field, poles, and cables have
inductance. So when the transistor turns off, the inductor will create
high voltages to maintain the current. D1 gives the current a path to
flow in and prevents high voltage from developing.
Danny
Jack Murray wrote:
A Curtis controller is a chopper drive, at least that is what people
have said here, which is one reason it has inferior performance to the
Zilla, which uses a buck converter to multiply current.
The diagram below is the same as Lee gave, but I have removed the
upper 48v, so this is a normal setup. How can current flow through
D1? The voltage returning from the the motor must go above 48v. D1
is there to clamp any voltage spike back to the battery.
There must be something missing from these diagrams, because it just
doesn't match what is being said as far as I can see.
This is the last I will post on this subject.
____________________________
| _|_
| / \ armature
| \___/
| _________ | series
+48V ________|_____ | |_ motor
| B+| _|_ | _|
| | D1 /_\ | _| field
|+ | |___|_____|
bat | |_| |M-
- | -||_ Q1 |
| | | | |
|0V__________|_____| | Controller
B-|_________|
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Your send says "Civic" power steering, while this says
"Capri".
If it's a Civic, gen 5, you can swap the rack from a
hatchback directly into a sedan. The sedan is power
assist, and the hatch is manual steering.
It's a bit involved, but the Honda shop manual tells
how to do it, and I'd say give it 2-3 hours for the
first time.
peace,
--- Christie Cooksey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
> I need to know if it's possible to disable the
> steering on a Capri (before I
> actually buy one as a donor car).
>
> And if Jim or anyone else can let me know what's
> involved I'd be eternally
> grateful.
>
> Cheers
> Christie :0)
>
>
Converting a gen. 5 Honda Civic? My $20 video/DVD
has my '92 sedan, as well as a del Sol and hatch too!
Learn more at:
www.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel?
Are you saving any gas for your kids?
____________________________________________________________________________________
Get your email and see which of your friends are online - Right on the New
Yahoo.com
(http://www.yahoo.com/preview)
--- End Message ---
