EV Digest 6609
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Advanced brushes
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
2) Re: Power terminals
by Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Power terminals
by Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Race Motor Specs (was RE: Siamese 8 field windings)
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Colorado EV'ers
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
6) Re: Advanced brushes
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Advanced brushes
by Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Colorado EV'ers
by DAVID BARWICK <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Powerwheels Accelerator
by Carl Clifford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Advanced brushes
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
11) RE: Powerwheels Accelerator
by "Patrick Andrews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) RE: May C&D Article on White Zombie (none yet in Redmond)
by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) RE: May C&D Article on White Zombie (none yet in Redmond)
by Tim Humphrey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Fluid Submerged Motor Cooling?
by Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) RE: Advanced brushes
by "Dale Ulan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Colorado EV'ers
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
17) RE: gensets was charging while driving question
by "Randy Burleson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Power terminals
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Battery interconnect sizeing
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Cheap Relay Recommendation
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) RE: Newbie melts a battery terminal
by "Grigg. John" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
In a message dated 3/29/07 4:19:52 AM Pacific Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Re: Advanced brushes
Date: 3/29/07 4:19:52 AM Pacific Standard Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jim Husted)
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Hey Tim
To be honest this is something that I'm not 100% on
myself but let me see if I can explain it as I see it.
The brushes sit on the comm which polorizes the
armature coils. These react with the field coils to
produce rotation. When the motor is being run under
OEM loads and voltages a nuetral setting alignes the
brushes with the field magnetics. As voltage
increases the field magnetics warp out of line. Now
the brushes are not lined up and arcing begins as
RPM's and voltage increase.
Although advancing the brushes brings the armature
coils back in line with the field coils for when it's
warped there is a trade off. Nuetral is better for
starting off, so if the brushes are advanced they are
"starting up" unlined but line up once the field's
magnetics warp over. This causes a drop in startup
torque and increase in current draw but increases
performance and reduces arcing and flashover as the
brushes become lined up with the warped coils.
This is why I'm so eager to get data on some of my
ajustable brush rings. Marko loves his set "way"
advanced while Jeff Shanab would prefer a little less.
In a perfect world I'd love to see a little servo
motor being able to time it kind of like an ICE engine
is timed on the fly.
*** I do have a servo motor on my brush rack in the Current Eliminator
Dragster and yes Jim the motor will put out a lot more torque when aligned
close to
neutral.In the CE its worth .4 seconds in the 1st 60 feet.I will show you the
setup if we ever meet. Dennis Berube
Alas, I've never seen it close up and in real time.
John and Tim tried to get me to climb into the hood
area while they race but I decided to pass on that
invite 8^P I do know that Otmar has some old video of
when he tortured some ADC motors but they're probably
still packed in some box from the move 8^(
Anyway I hope this helps. I'd actually love a "big
brains" view on this myself 8^)
Cya
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric >>
</HTML>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Peter,
Check out Waytek parts 47212,47210,47211,47213.
http://order.waytekwire.com/CGI-BIN/LANSAWEB?WEBEVENT+L0C2CB71801418600B55F022+M37+ENG
Jeff
Peter Gabrielsson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I need some help finding a suitable threaded bulkhead mounted power
terminal that can handle 100 amp continous, 300A for 10s. It should
also be sealed.
Essentially what I'm looking for is something like a motor terminal,
so if anyone know of a manufacturer who makes a suitable line of
terminals I'd be most grateful.
Thanks
--
www.electric-lemon.com
---------------------------------
Don't get soaked. Take a quick peek at the forecast
with theYahoo! Search weather shortcut.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Link is screwed up. Try
http://www.waytekwire.com/
and search for part numbers.
Jeff
Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Peter,
Check out Waytek parts 47212,47210,47211,47213.
http://order.waytekwire.com/CGI-BIN/LANSAWEB?WEBEVENT+L0C2CB71801418600B55F022+M37+ENG
Jeff
Peter Gabrielsson
wrote:
I need some help finding a suitable threaded bulkhead mounted power
terminal that can handle 100 amp continous, 300A for 10s. It should
also be sealed.
Essentially what I'm looking for is something like a motor terminal,
so if anyone know of a manufacturer who makes a suitable line of
terminals I'd be most grateful.
Thanks
--
www.electric-lemon.com
---------------------------------
Don't get soaked. Take a quick peek at the forecast
with theYahoo! Search weather shortcut.
---------------------------------
We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love
(and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Mike, all
--- Mike Willmon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Well well well, now look at this little pile of
> acorns, he he...
I like the little acorn analogy! It seems you guys
kind of see me as that little caveman squirrel on the
movie "Ice age" running all around all hyper and
spastic like 8^P Although I'm but 1/2 as amp'ed as I
was at 20 LMAO!
>
> > John Wayland wrote:
> >
> > (1) There's the little detail of the replacing
> the factory single runs
> > of 6 gauge brush interconnect wires, with dual 4
> gauge brush
> > interconnect leads that I insisted on for each
> brush (helps carry far
> > more amperage around to all the brushes).
>
> less I^2*R losses and less heat buildup are results?
The way I see it is you all don't use #4 cables to get
the juice to the motor, it's kind of a joke to use it
to get to the brushes!
> > (2) The little detail of hand-timed motor
> sections...perfected by Tim
> > and I with ammeters, voltmeters, and a mechanical
> tachometer.
>
> Is the trick here to balance amps through each while
> they are running in parallel? Or were you timing to
> get some amount of amps
> at a specific RPM?
>
> > (3) The little detail of eye-balling and using
> straight edges to
> > perfectly align the armature laminations and
> combars with one another.
>
> Did you do this when they were *twins* with the gear
> coupler too? If they were not perfectly aligned
> back then, would the hand
> timing in (2) above take care of the mis-alignment
> anyway?
>
> > (4) The little detail of trimming away the sharp
> brush rigging corners
> > I've seen start and sustain arcing in past racing
> motors.
>
> The idea being to decrease the corona effect which
> intensifies the electrostatic field around small
> protrusions and sharp edges?
> How about arcing on the brushes themselves? Does it
> mainly occur on the leading and trailing edges of a
> brush? ...or the side
> edges near the fore or aft end of the commutator
> bars. I would think that brush arcing would tend to
> occur or at least begin at
> the corner edges of a brush. If this is a problem
> at high voltages do you think putting a small radius
> on the corners and edges
> (not the leading and trailing edges though) would
> reduce that by any significant amount? Of course
> the brushes would eventually
> wear flat again, but I wonder if it would allow that
> few extra volts without blowing something up? Or is
> the light show the
> point?
I hate light shows, at least the plasma letting spring
vaporizing types 8^) What most don't know is the
really big and bright flashes are the thin springs
burning up. This is why I created the Nomex spring
guards on Killacycles motors (besides the tapered
holder ears). Like I told Bill, if we can keep the
arc to the main holder body and keep the springs
pushing on the brushes all is not lost if it flashes.
He might have to pull the CE plate and pull a buger
off the holder but he'd be able to get that next
needed pass to claim a record 8^) Melt a spring and
well you're done.
You'll want to keep all the brush material there to
pass all that current you'll be throwing at it. These
brushes align with two bars, no need to lessen that
design. Now if the holder were made of ceramic and
couldn't arc there, it would then arc to the brushes
being there is a gap that it could pass under. A
little bit of removal would not stop this. Unless you
could close that gap really tight to the comm.
> > (5) The little detail of insisting on glyptal-ing
> (fights against high
> > voltage arc-over) the interior of the brush end
> bells, the brush rigging
> > supports, the filed coils at possible arc jump-off
> points, and other
> > areas inside the motor that as a seasoned electric
> drag racer, I knew
> > to be arc-starting points.
>
> Can't argue with reason AND experience :-)
>
> > (6) The little detail of insisting on the center
> fan housing being
> > relieved of more metal to better transfer cooling
> air to both motor
> > sections.
>
> Is this something specific only to a siamese set up?
This is funny being John and I were just talking about
this recently. In as much as we payed great attention
to getting the lam's and bars as in-line as we could
(never hurts to error on the side of caution) I used
twin setups like Matt's, Otmars, and silver bullets
(3) motor setup as examples where other muliti motor
units are all but "not" aligned.
Being the Siamese motor is still "electricaly" two
seperate motors I doubt this has a huge impact.
With that said I wasn't about to argue and in fact
agreed with John that allignment was a good thing.
> > (7) The little detail of insisting that the motor
> shaft be machined into
> > the Spicer spec'ed splines to slide right into the
> Spicer 400 U-joint.
>
> Hey check it out. The TransWarp's are already
> coming this way. Good ideas don't take long to
> catch on. Now if only they had
> enough room to make the C.E. side a female of the
> same spline and then coupling two together would be
> a no brainer :-O Even with
> my uncalibrated eyeballs though I can see that would
> take a larger bearing to house the extra shaft
> material which would also
> increase the diameter of the commutator. Which I
> suppose is not a good thing at higher RPM?
You need to be able to press the armature onto the
shaft so there is no way you can make a comm end shaft
as big as you can make the output shaft, at least in
working with current designs. Even it the hole were
bigger, you could still get a bigger output than you
can a tail shaft.
>
> > (8) The little detail of keeping the exact turn
> count of those stock
> > fields to preserve the torque I knew my car needed
> to succeed as a
> > direct drive set up.
>
> Was this a point of contention? What, was Jim
> trying to short you a turn of copper on each coil?
> I know its getting pretty
> spendy these days. 1 turn oughtta be around $1
> worth of copper each, eh?
Actually I had my hands full with all of Johns "other"
requests 8^P In fact I have removed two wraps on an
8" field housing for another racer who has yet to try
it. Less torque but a higher rev up at X current is
the thought. As for me I'm just doing what I'm told.
It would be an awesome test to be able to pop in an
exact replacement with a modded field into WZ just to
see where and what changed. Likewise it'd be nice to
pop in a Siamese9 into WZ to see the end results.
Both John and Bill have stated that they don't want to
move up into a larger diametered motor(s) in fear the
higher startup inertia would be detrimental.
> > (9) The little detail of the co-designing with
> Marko Mongillo, those
> > beefy (and very much needed) center mounted
> external motor-bracing cross
> > member steel support brackets.
>
> Are these the ones that cover one of the field pole
> shoe bolts that you have a screw countersunk into
> the housing under? Could
> you not have just opened up a hole in the mount that
> would be big enough to get a socket into and retain
> the regular hex head
> bolt. After all, that would also allow you to shave
> off a few ounces of metal ;-P
I didn't countersink Johns pole shoe bolts (I beleive
that's what you're talking about?) He's talking about
the mounting flange the motor is mounted to the car by
which I had nothing to do with, and yes Marko (and
John) did an awesome job with 8^)
>
> > Now you know why serious EV drag racers all use a
> Zilla! No one, and I
> > mean 'no one' makes a stouter, more reliable
> controller.
>
> He's got total *control* of that operation, he he
> ;-) so does that make Ot a *control* freak? In the
> words of Jim, LMAO.
>
> > Jim's workmanship is quite simply, the best I've
> ever
> > seen. But I'll take some of the credit my way for
> arguing my points into
> > Jim's former 'low speed whir-around-the-warehouse
> forklift world only'
> > electric motor brain, to where he now understands
> the huge difference
> > between 36 volts at 500 amps vs hundreds of volts
> at 2000 amps, the
> > difference between neutral timing and advanced
> timing, and the
> > difference between continuous ratings and a drag
> racer's 'overload
> > ratings'! Along the way, we've become cherished
> friends, and that's
> > worth more than all the tweaked copper in the
> world.
>
> Here here. But besides those minor points you
> stated above though, Jim's motors are still a work
> of art ;-P he he
I try 8^) EVen in the lift world I've always tried to
build what looks and performs like or better than a
new motor. Here it's enjoyed, in the lift world it's
barely noticed 8^( Unless it's for someone like John
who digs a pretty motor 8^) If nothing else it's fun
to do a motor for someone who loves a nice motor as I
do.
> > I warned Jim, that by hooking up with me, he'd be
> dragged into the
> > 'spooky region of fringe lunacy' (sorry, Ted) that
> is the world of 'The
> > Ampheads'...life for him has and never will, be
> the same :-(
>
> For us either now that he's here ;-P
> Look what you've done to me, Both Of You!! ::-))
As hoestly as I can state this I had no idea the damn
rabbit hole was this deep! I did the Siamese motor as
a personal challenge and as something that was way
funner than the slow ass EV forklift motors I had done
for the last 1/4 of a century 8^) Yep John told me
but I just figuered he was some Oregon Greenie full of
mostly hot air, I had no idea there was a whole herd
of you amp heads 8^)
As I have so humbley stated I am but the brawn here.
I'm just the guy who can "craft" all those what if
ideas that have rolled around inside the sick and
twisted minds of the racers for a long time.
Again I'd like to stress my thanks to those who have
trusted me with their motors as I move along this
motor EVolutionary path. Without that trust and faith
I'd have much less color in my life, although I'm
thinking the ulcer situation might be a tad better off
8^)
Cya
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
____________________________________________________________________________________
Need Mail bonding?
Go to the Yahoo! Mail Q&A for great tips from Yahoo! Answers users.
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--- Begin Message ---
Hello!
I live right next door in Highlands Ranch and I have been a members of the
local EV club which is now part of the Electric Auto Association organization
at the national level. The name of the club is the DEVC Denver Electric
Vehicle Council and which has been in continuous operation since 1974.
Most meetings are in the Denver/Boulder area and we have one about every
month on an irregular schedule. You just missed the last meeting on solar power
in agriculture was a tour of Longs Gardens a working commercial farm in North
Boulder that uses solar PV panes to power tools like an electric riding lawn
mower (Elec Trak), normal walk behind electric mower, and a walk behind
field plow. The general meeting included discussion of advanced battery
progress
over the past 6 months.
You will find information about joining ($15 per year) at
_http://www.devc.info/join.html_ (http://www.devc.info/join.html)
More information about my EV here _http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/748_
(http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/748) and here
_http://electricmotorcycles.net/modules/xcgal/index.php?cat=10009_
(http://electricmotorcycles.net/modules/xcgal/index.php?cat=10009)
Send me an email off list to introduce yourself, provide some contact
information and I'll make sure that you get an invite to the next meeting at no
cost or obligation.
I have been active in the club for the past 5 years and ride my EV
frequently, so look at the pictures and wave next time you see me on the road.
Mike Bachand
Denver Electric Vehicle Council (DEVC) - Colorado Chapter of the EAA
1994 Kawasaki Ninja EV
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED])
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Dennis
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> In a perfect world I'd love to see a little servo
> motor being able to time it kind of like an ICE
> engine
> is timed on the fly.
> *** I do have a servo motor on my brush rack in the
> Current Eliminator
> Dragster and yes Jim the motor will put out a lot
> more torque when aligned close to
> neutral.In the CE its worth .4 seconds in the 1st 60
> feet.I will show you the
> setup if we ever meet. Dennis Berube
Love the input! I'd also love to take you up on that
offer. I know you've got insight into making some
nice motor mods and would love to talk shop with you
anytime! If nothing else I hope my efforts and
passion is looked at as something that helps bond and
reunite the comrodery and unity that was once "what"
it was all about.
Like I am so quick to point out it is by standing on
the shoulders of great men that I am able to do what
little I've been able to achieve.
In pay it forward attitude I'm as open as I can be and
do my best to pass on what I've learned to all who are
intrested 8^)
I look forward to holding you to your word 8^P
Now we need to see if we can talk you into coming up
for the Wayland invitaional where people could get to
see John, Bill, (not to leave out all the other Amp
Heads) and you racing side by side. For me this is my
ultimate goal of a community united where fast times
and good friends are at hand and the only sparks are
from motors and my crappy attempts at keeping them at
bay 8^)
Hell before we know it we just might see you becoming
a NEDRA memeber again 8^) What can I say I'm a
hopeless romantic!
As Doc Holiday said to Ringo "say when" Then again I
like the phrase "I'm your Huckelberry" LMAO!
Cya
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
____________________________________________________________________________________
8:00? 8:25? 8:40? Find a flick in no time
with the Yahoo! Search movie showtime shortcut.
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--- Begin Message ---
Hi Tim,
Below is a section of "Basic Motor Theroy" which I copied from a Reliance
Motor web site. I can no longer find it, the site has changed. It is rather
technical and I cannot include the diagrams which are helpful. I notice that
Jim Husted has given his take, which is pretty good from the working man's
standpoint.
quote---
Brush Shifting
One method of reducing the arcing due to non-linear commutation is to shift the
brushes away from the geometrical neutral position. Then commutation will occur
when the applicable coil is under the influence of a weak magnetic field that
will generate a voltage in the coil, which opposes the induced voltage due to
current change. Therefore, this new voltage will assist rather than hinder the
current reversal. In a generator, it is necessary to shift the brushes forward
in the direction of rotation for good commutation. This is true because the
current flow through the conductors is in the same direction as the voltage
and, it commutation is delayed until the coil sides are under the next pole, it
will be assisted by the current reversing voltage. In a motor, it is necessary
to shift the brushes against the direction of rotation because current flow is
in opposition to the induced voltage. The amount of shift necessary depends on
the load so a given shift will not be
satisfactory for all loads. One effect of shifting brushes is that a
demagnetization component of armature reaction is introduced. In other words,
when the brushes are shifted, the armature reaction will not only distort the
main field flux but it will also directly oppose the main field. This will
result in a reduction of the field flux. Another effect is that if the brushes
are shifted far enough, it is possible to reduce the number of effective turns
because there will be voltages in opposition to each other between two brushes.
In generators the demagnetization component of armature reaction would be
detrimental because there will be a decrease in generated voltage with increase
in load. However, in a motor, the effect would be beneficial because the speed
would tend to remain constant.
end quote----
Hope this helps and hope the copywrite police don't find me.
Jeff
Tim Gamber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I've been on the list a while now and have heard alot, but i still don't
understand what advancing a brush on a motor does for you?
_________________________________________________________________
http://local.live.com/?mkt=en-ca/?v=2&cid=A6D6BDB4586E357F!420
---------------------------------
8:00? 8:25? 8:40? Find a flick in no time
with theYahoo! Search movie showtime shortcut.
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--- Begin Message ---
Hello !
Is there any ev clubs, groups in the UK.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hello!
I live right next door in Highlands Ranch and I have been a members of the
local EV club which is now part of the Electric Auto Association organization
at the national level. The name of the club is the DEVC Denver Electric
Vehicle Council and which has been in continuous operation since 1974.
Most meetings are in the Denver/Boulder area and we have one about every
month on an irregular schedule. You just missed the last meeting on solar power
in agriculture was a tour of Longs Gardens a working commercial farm in North
Boulder that uses solar PV panes to power tools like an electric riding lawn
mower (Elec Trak), normal walk behind electric mower, and a walk behind
field plow. The general meeting included discussion of advanced battery
progress
over the past 6 months.
You will find information about joining ($15 per year) at
_http://www.devc.info/join.html_ (http://www.devc.info/join.html)
More information about my EV here _http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/748_
(http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/748) and here
_http://electricmotorcycles.net/modules/xcgal/index.php?cat=10009_
(http://electricmotorcycles.net/modules/xcgal/index.php?cat=10009)
Send me an email off list to introduce yourself, provide some contact
information and I'll make sure that you get an invite to the next meeting at no
cost or obligation.
I have been active in the club for the past 5 years and ride my EV
frequently, so look at the pictures and wave next time you see me on the road.
Mike Bachand
Denver Electric Vehicle Council (DEVC) - Colorado Chapter of the EAA
1994 Kawasaki Ninja EV
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED])
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
As long a we're talking Powerwheels, does anyone have a suggestion to replace
the full-on contactor accelerator. My kids get whiplash everytime they push
it. Any cheap resistor setups anyone knows of?
Thanks
Carl Clifford
Denver
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In a message dated 3/29/07 6:30:17 AM Pacific Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Re: Advanced brushes
Date: 3/29/07 6:30:17 AM Pacific Standard Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jim Husted)
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Hey Dennis
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> In a perfect world I'd love to see a little servo
> motor being able to time it kind of like an ICE
> engine
> is timed on the fly.
> *** I do have a servo motor on my brush rack in the
> Current Eliminator
> Dragster and yes Jim the motor will put out a lot
> more torque when aligned close to
> neutral.In the CE its worth .4 seconds in the 1st 60
> feet.I will show you the
> setup if we ever meet. Dennis Berube
Love the input! I'd also love to take you up on that
offer. I know you've got insight into making some
nice motor mods and would love to talk shop with you
anytime! If nothing else I hope my efforts and
passion is looked at as something that helps bond and
reunite the comrodery and unity that was once "what"
it was all about.
Like I am so quick to point out it is by standing on
the shoulders of great men that I am able to do what
little I've been able to achieve.
In pay it forward attitude I'm as open as I can be and
do my best to pass on what I've learned to all who are
intrested 8^)
I look forward to holding you to your word 8^P
Now we need to see if we can talk you into coming up
for the Wayland invitaional where people could get to
see John, Bill, (not to leave out all the other Amp
Heads) and you racing side by side. For me this is my
ultimate goal of a community united where fast times
and good friends are at hand and the only sparks are
from motors and my crappy attempts at keeping them at
bay 8^)
Hell before we know it we just might see you becoming
a NEDRA memeber again 8^) What can I say I'm a
hopeless romantic!
As Doc Holiday said to Ringo "say when" Then again I
like the phrase "I'm your Huckelberry" LMAO!
Cya
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
>>
I am a nedra member again.My S10 truck will be aiming at the Zombie pro
record so your 2 motors will be competing against my 1 motor street truck.As
far as
arcing is concerned I try to let no arcing at all happen accept a fine white
line on the trailing edge of the brushes.With any more than that you are
losing shaft hp. Dennis Berube </HTML>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Use two swithces set it up like a double barrel shotgun with two triggers.
one to supply 12v and the other to connect another in series.
From: Carl Clifford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Powerwheels Accelerator
Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 07:52:17 -0700 (PDT)
As long a we're talking Powerwheels, does anyone have a suggestion to
replace the full-on contactor accelerator. My kids get whiplash everytime
they push it. Any cheap resistor setups anyone knows of?
Thanks
Carl Clifford
Denver
_________________________________________________________________
ItÂ’s tax season, make sure to follow these few simple tips
http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Taxes/PreparationTips/PreparationTips.aspx?icid=HMMartagline
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--- Begin Message ---
Hey all
As a quick summery here on the Car and Driver thing.
I ran all over Redmond looking for a copy yesterday
without any luck 8^(
I'm so glad I got an online sneak peek as I'd probably
be really bummed out right now. I'm thinking that
they won't hit the stores till next month so I'll have
to wait to buy my 5 copies for my mother 8^)
I told John we ought to autograph some copies and put
them on Ebay, LMAO. Okay maybe I have a "little"
illusions of grandure 8^P
Cya
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric
____________________________________________________________________________________
TV dinner still cooling?
Check out "Tonight's Picks" on Yahoo! TV.
http://tv.yahoo.com/
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--- Begin Message ---
If both you and John autograph a copy with a personal humorous note to Hump...
I'll give you ten bux plus postage.
--
Stay Charged!
Hump
I-5, Blossvale NY
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Jim Husted
> Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2007 11:08 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: RE: May C&D Article on White Zombie (none yet in Redmond)
>
> Hey all
>
> As a quick summery here on the Car and Driver thing.
> I ran all over Redmond looking for a copy yesterday
> without any luck 8^(
>
> I'm so glad I got an online sneak peek as I'd probably
> be really bummed out right now. I'm thinking that
> they won't hit the stores till next month so I'll have
> to wait to buy my 5 copies for my mother 8^)
>
> I told John we ought to autograph some copies and put
> them on Ebay, LMAO. Okay maybe I have a "little"
> illusions of grandure 8^P
>
> Cya
> Jim Husted
> Hi-Torque Electric
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________
> ________
> TV dinner still cooling?
> Check out "Tonight's Picks" on Yahoo! TV.
> http://tv.yahoo.com/
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--- Begin Message ---
Hey Mark,
You could just use a resistor to drop 4 or 5 volts. It would reduce current
from the batteries and slow the motor speed, reducing motor heat. Yea, I know
it is inefficient. And resistor will get hot. But if it accomplishes your
goal within your budget and gives acceptable battery range, what the heck? I'd
look at one of those edgewound braking resistors and start reducing the number
of coils in series with the motor until you get the proper motor voltage. Then
cut it down and do a permanent mount. You could also put a by-pass contactor
across the resistor for a power boost when you hit high/wet grass.
Just a thought. Grass is starting to grow.
Jeff
Mark Hastings <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I am still looking for a cheap 24v controller to slow
it down. I have two 12v batterie sand found 12v cuts
far too slow so I need something in between. I'm
interested in building a PWM controller myself with a
few speeds but actually haven't had much luck finding
any decent plans.
---------------------------------
The fish are biting.
Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing.
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--- Begin Message ---
This is why I'm so eager to get data on some of my
ajustable brush rings. Marko loves his set "way"
advanced while Jeff Shanab would prefer a little less.
In a perfect world I'd love to see a little servo
motor being able to time it kind of like an ICE engine
is timed on the fly.
It's done all the time on brushless DC motors - only software!
Advancing the timing helps counteract the inductance of the
motor winding, bringing the torque producing current (Iq) 90
degrees from the field current. As the motor speed increases, the
current lags the voltage. Advancing the brushes (or commutation
angle if your commutator is made of silicon) counteracts this - it
advances the voltage applied to the winding slightly (ie applies
voltage to a new part of the armature a bit earlier) to bring
the current in that winding to 90 degrees with respect to the
field - that is the goal of the commutation system. How you
phase this is pretty clear on a permanent-magnet motor (brushed
or brushless), and a bit more fuzzy on a series-wound.
-Dale
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--- Begin Message ---
Based on questions that I have seen on the list lately and Mark's comments
I'll expand a little on my previous post.
Rumors of the demise of the DEVC persist, however our membership is steady
at ~130 strong. There are little factions, those interested in PHEVs,
electrathon style racing, electric motorcycles, drag racing and on the road hwy
speed
EV cars etc. There are at least 5 DEVC members that are active at the
national level of the EAA because I see them in places in the odd places that
I
travel to like Joliet and Palo Alto.
I'm not sure where the rumors of the club's demise keep coming from, but it
is certainly not from the members. So there is nothing to revive Mark. Our
web site was stolen (we lost all our content and our domain name) and held
hostage (we were asked to pay to get back our old domain name from some Russian
porn outfit in New York City, said with the appropriate inflection) a couple of
years ago. We now have a new web site and all of the past newsletters are
available for DEVC members to access electronically. Almost all of our members
receive the newsletter via email. We have 3 members in Canada, one in Japan,
one in Great Briton, and one in Chile.
We count as members in good standing two of the principals in Hybrids Plus
(Carl and Davide, PHEV mods to Ford and Toyota hybrids), and Bill Dube of
Killacycle drag racing fame. In fact I was over at Bill's garage just 2 weeks
ago
oohing and aaahing over the recent changes to the drag bike and the advanced
Lithium battery pack. Bill was gracious enough to coach me about how to pump
up my Optimas to a completely full state.
A month ago found my wife and I in the chemistry lab at the University of
Colorado making my own quart jar of bio diesel. I met the CU Biodiesel
Community Outreach folks at last years EV and Alternative Vehicles show at the
college when their table was set up next to our members tent at the show and
shine
of EV Cars and Cycles. Last weekend I drove an electric farm tractor. Last
fall my bike and I participated in a 3 way electric motorcycle drag race
across
the parking lot at another show and shine EVent in Longmont Colorado. Two
years ago my wife and rode in the Pike's Peak race car from Monument and
hosted
a Jr Dragster racer (Brent Singleton and his dad Kent) from Utah in their
bid to show folks at Bandimere dragway what EVs are capable of. My heart is
still pounding in my chest from the incredible torque of the Pikes Peak Racer,
it was better than any E-Ticket ride at Disney. My wife was grinning like a
school girl and may already be infected with the EV bug.
If this sounds like fun to you and you are not a member of your local EV
club then your weekends must be pretty boring. The EV tide has turned. Time to
get out there and catch a wave or watch from the beach. Be careful before you
take to the water though. It can be infectious.
My 21 year old daughter spent last Sunday piling miles on the electric
motorcycle (she wants to take it back to school). My 24 year old son rides an
electric bike at least 5 times a week (acquired from Bird RV another DEVC
sponsor) to save money.
Although the web site is a work in progress I invite you all to visit our
site at _http://www.devc.info_ (http://www.devc.info)
For more about Hybrids Plus Inc and their government projects go here
_http://www.hybrids-plus.com/ht/about.html_
(http://www.hybrids-plus.com/ht/about.html) and here _http://_
(http://hybrids-plus.com/pdf/EscapeSpecSheet.pdf)
hybrids-plus.com/pdf/EscapeSpecSheet.pdf
. Many of the members of the DEVC are corporate sponsor level members. Need
a good local battery company talk to Mark at Hennesey in Denver. Need someone
to convert a vehicle to an EV for you try Bill at Slipstream in Boulder.
All members of the DEVC/EAA (you will find links to these companies and more
on
the DEVC web site). I rest my case.
Enjoy
Mike Bachand
Denver Electric Vehicle Council (DEVC) - Colorado Chapter of the EAA
1994 Kawasaki Ninja EV
************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
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--- Begin Message ---
> > The trick is to balance this suspicion with hope, and I'm not
> > sure how well we do this.
>
>
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070323/AUTO01/703230
356&theme=Autos-Green-tech-hybrids
>
> GM themselves are already backing away from the Volt...
>
That's not how I read that article at all... but then again, I started
my career in Detroit and am used to parsing the news to get to the
nuggets of truth buried in automaker double-speak and filtered through
the press' agenda.
The headline says: GM tries to unplug Volt hype (and there is plenty of
discussion ABOUT General Motors from the outside that follows, but
precious little from within). Buried down at the bottom, the salient
quote *from* GM says: "Vice Chairman Bob Lutz said this week that GM's
strategy is to let people know about any problems early so they don't
feel duped should the Volt not succeed, a risk he estimates to be about
10 percent. 'Having said that,' he wrote in an e-mail, 'I am growingly
convinced that we will pull it off.'"
Google into Sharon Terlep, of the Detroit News, and make your own
assessment as to her slant.
> There's a lot of hope for Jerry and Lee, I'm hoping you guys can pull
it off.
I agree with this, as well -- I'm rooting for immediate payoff from the
little guys, but I am also simultaneously hoping for support from the
larger manufacturers who can deliver truly large-scale numbers.
Randii
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--- Begin Message ---
Peter Gabrielsson wrote:
I need some help finding a suitable threaded bulkhead mounted power
terminal that can handle 100 amp continous, 300A for 10s. It should
also be sealed.
Essentially what I'm looking for is something like a motor terminal,
so if anyone know of a manufacturer who makes a suitable line of
terminals I'd be most grateful.
Try Waytek Inc <www.waytekwire.com>. I think what you want is what they
call a "stud type junction block", stock# 47210, 47211, 47212, or 47213.
3/8" bolt, black or red plastic body that mounts to bulkhead, rated
250 amps continuous.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jeff Shanab wrote:
Where I can find a chart on sizing copper interconnects?
Bussbar ampacity tables assume continuous 60hz duty.
I want to find information more like the way we derate
fuses and breakers... 10 second, 30 second, 60 second rating?
The current rating is highly situation dependent, so you won't find any
charts that are any more than vague inaccurate generalities.
To establish the current rating, you have to know:
1. What is your definition of "failure"?
- bussbar melts?
- terminals it is connected to melt?
- whatever insulation you put on the bussbar melts?
2. Does some other condition limit you before "failure"?
- excessive voltage drop
- loss of efficiency
- mechanical strength
- heat from bussbar melts something nearby (battery case etc.)
3. What is carrying away the heat produced by the bussbar?
- still air
- moving air (fan?)
- bussbar is bolted to some large metal object that
acts as a heatsink to cool it
Ultimately, you won't know the answers to these questions in sufficient
detail to calculate an actual limit. So, your best bet is to experiment
-- try something, and measure how well it works.
Bare buss bars run a lot cooler than an insulated wire of the same cross
section, so they can carry a lot more current. But, they will generate
heat and cause a voltage drop -- one of these factors will probably
define your maximum current before the bussbar itself fails.
Airflow makes a drastic difference in how hot a bussbar gets. It can
easily carry many times more current in moving air.
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Peter VanDerWal wrote:
Oh come on Lee, the guy was asking about a relay to connect the test
leads of a multimeter. Unless he is using it to directly measure current
(which I'm pretty sure he is NOT doing), he isn't going to draw anywhere
near enough current to cause arcs or corona effects.
A multimeter typically has an input impedance of 10 megohms. If your
relay's off-state contact has 1000 megohms of leakage, the meter will
read 1 volt for every 100v of pack voltage, just from off-state leakage.
With dozens of batteries, you have dozens of relays, each contributing
this kind of leakage current. The leakage currents tend to add up,
causing larger errors.
Arcing won't occur at microamp currents, but corona will. All you need
is a sharp edge or point! You'd be surprised how easy it is to get
corona to produce microamp leakage current in a small relay at high voltage.
Another problem with small relays and close contact spacings are leakage
currents due to water, dust, bugs, and other contamination. A strand of
spiderweb on a humid day is all it takes to get 1 microamp of leakage
current! But you can deal with this by sealing everything up.
Reed relays are nice for this kind of switching because their contacts
are sealed, with high-pressure gas inside to suppress arcing and corona.
And, they intrinsically have very large spacings between contacts
(opposite ends of a glass tube).
--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Deanne, I think you are starting a trend. I just melted off my
battery post yesterday.
http://tinyurl.com/yv56fa
I called around to every battery place here in Sacramento and nobody is
willing to recast one back on. Guess I'm buying a new battery...
Good luck.
John
Deanne Said:
Went to water my batteries this morning, and found a real mess:
http://www4.ncsu.edu/~dmott/MeltedBattery2.jpg
http://www4.ncsu.edu/~dmott/MeltedBattery1.jpg
Car details: http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1020
Batteries are Trojan T125's, I believe about 7-8 months old. I've been
driving it about 3 months. This battery actually reads 6.47V measured
from
the terminals of its adjacent batteries, but I know that's at best an
intermittant situation. The car has been running fine, in fact I was
just
feeling like I was getting the hang of things. And a *serious* bummer
to be
off the road in prime convertible weather :-( Here's a start on the
many
questions I have:
1. How do I safely clean up this mess of lead?
2. Is this battery toast, or can/should it be repaired?
3. How could this have happened?
4. How can I prevent it from happening again?
5. Could any of the other batteries be damaged by this incident?
6. Could this have started a fire inside the battery box?
thanks very much - De
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