EV Digest 6642
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Intro
by "Dave Davidson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: EV APU (genset) emissions & FE
by John Fisher <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Preventing Motor Flash Over (was RE: KillaCycle Update)
by "Martin Klingensmith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Science Friday has an hour on plugin cars.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) RE: History Lesson?
by "David Hankins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: EV APU (genset) emissions & FE
by John Russell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Belktronix, was: History Lesson?
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Intro
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Intro
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) RE: Belktronix, was: History Lesson?
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) EVLN(Gizmo goes BugE)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) EVLN(Montana Gov zipped around the statehouse in an EV)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: EV APU (genset) emissions & FE
by John Fisher <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: EV APU (genset) emissions & FE
by "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: EV digest 6639
by "Andrew A." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Sherry Boschert you go girl. A whole lotta time on Science Friday.
by Nick Austin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) EVLN(maxwell.af using nEVs)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) EVLN(Santa Monica, CA EV & h2-hybrid fleet)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) EVLN(Kind to Man technology: 3Wheel Mahindra E-Bijlees)-long
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
One option you might want to consider is using a small pickup and 40 or so
T105s or equivalent. Look at the Ev album. The original longer range EV was
built on a Toyota pickup, but there have been several built on an S10
chassis. There are plenty of upgrades to handle the weight, and you can get
kit bodies to put on it. What you want is basically a huge battery pack
with wheels.
Dave
From: "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Intro
Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2007 12:53:58 -0400
----- Original Message -----
From: "Timothy Balcer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 10:57 AM
Subject: Intro
> Hey folks! I'm a new, budding EV enthusiast and I thought I would toss
> out a shout to the list. :)
>
> I live in Rockport, MA,
Hi Tim;
Welcome to the Wonderful World of EV's! Your right down the road from
Dave Robie's. Dave? Got yur ears on?There are other guyz in your area, if
not quite zip code. Now, other hat on, I'm Prez of the New England EAA, we
get together EVery second Sat of each month, at my place in Killingworth
CT,
an inconvenient, 2 hour or less, if ya miss the Casino Crowds(Here It's a
tax for the mathmatically Declined) Guys from up your way Prius Pool down.
Seems that most EVerybody around in to EV's are Prei fans.Seeya next week?
I don't wanna rain on yur parade, but Your wishes are, mostly, wishes;
Tall Order. Well, how deep are your pockets? Tough to do with common man
Led
Acids. I HAVE eeeked 100 miles out of my Rabbit, in IDEAL conditions, but
settle for 50-60 miles range or 20 when it's 10 degreez out. Led Acids
SUCK!
But the're almost the only game in town, right now. the occasional BB-600
or
a 123's. Do a Porsche 914 or better yet a 911? EVen an old Carman Ghia,
they
are light, and aero and are a nice car to bre scene in.
We have a gettogether at the club meetings and a few home made EV's show
up. You can look at some hardware, get a ride. Have ya your first EV Grin,
yet? We certainly don't want to see ya going alone on building a car.New
England 'aint exactly a hot bed of EV activity, but we are growing. Alot
since the WKtEC Movie. People are coming out of the woodwork, now. It's
great! In that you popped up on the List, you have come to the right
place.
We're World Wide as you will see, copying the mail on here.
One of our members, Dave Cover is doing BB-600's in a car. Thinking
BB-600's -ya got to hook up. Oh, the QUESTION. Can you plugitin at work?
That makes a BIG difference! I did a 50 mile RT, but I COULD plug in at
work. In a trainyard full of electric trains are they gunna yell at you?I
had enough juice to do the RT if I had to, but the batteries liked the
charge, and I could fly home in the left lane at 70mph! Happiness, is
coming
home with a happy, juicy, bubbling, battery pac!
Seeya?
Bob
and I've been voraciously researching the EV
> world for awhile now. I've tentatively decided to go with a 914 EV,
> hopefully with an AC drivetrain since range is my primary concern. My
> first EV conversion is going to be my daily commuter and it needs to
> be able to go 100+ miles in mixed conditions. I realize that is
> difficult to engineer unless you are using crazy expensive battery
> packs, but I'm open to flooded NiCads (found a couple of sources for
> surplus Marathon BB600s that might work). I'm a physics grad, and
> technically proficient. I'm currently an IT Manager for a R&D arm of a
> major telco.
>
> I'm still in discovery phase, though, so any and all comments are
> accepted :) I realize this has probably been said MANY times, but I'll
> just toss out my list of requirements:
>
> 1) Should look reasonably cool. If I'm going to be spending large
> amounts of time working on this thing, I'd like it to end up eye
> inspiring!
> 2) 100+ mile range
> 3) 2 seater, however a converted 4+ would be fine.. happy to eliminate
> the back seats for battery room and etc.
>
> So, again HELLO to list members! Be seeing you out there, and if there
> are MA enthusiasts who could toss me their info in email, I'd love to
> take a look at your projects over beers and pizza.
>
_________________________________________________________________
Get a FREE Web site, company branded e-mail and more from Microsoft Office
Live! http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Good for you David! And thanks for the research.
Here's where your assumptions don't apply ( to my project):
I am assuming a pluggable hybrid.
I am not burning gasoline in an unmodified genset.
I am not thinking of running the genset at full load 100% of the time.
I am aimed at a car lighter and slower than a OEM gas vehicle. It might
even have better aero one day.
You didn't account for the reduced power-plant emissions of reduced
electrical use ( granted, perhaps negligible in non-coal or nuclear states)
Gensets might be lighter than lead batteries, and no more difficult to
package. Certain the genset is not heavier anyway...
Further, you yourself suggested using a clean auto engine to make a
home-built genset, and re-tuning it to run at a constant low speed. I
might opt for a smaller MC engine with catalytic converter, since we
don't have micro-cars in our Super-sized country.
So I need to do some calcs based on the following assumptions:
1) genset starts running after batts drop to some adjustable level, say
40% of usable charge to start with.
2) genset runs at a high enough KW to limp home, but not maintain 30
mph. 5kw is what I was thinking...
Its a complicated prediction, so with my daily loop of 25 miles and no
re-charging en route, I'll start by guesstimating the genset runs 50% of
the time, subject to real-world experience. If we could scrounge up a
free circuit at work, I might even be able to do without the genset
altogether most days. But I think we are maxed. So at genset 50% of the
time the car returns home needing a full recharge.
All guesses to be sure. caveat emptor!
3) propane is the likely first power source instead of gasoline. My
research shows that it gives no advantage in greenhouse gases, but some
large but as yet unknown-to-me improvement in smog. I could always get a
small engine catalytic converter for it, assuming the chemistry is OK
with propane. Alas, H2 storage is probably a showstopper for now. Supply
and storage are just too darn expensive, even for the little motor.
Interestingly, a propane genset will probably convert to H2 or a number
of other fuel gases with ease, but thats OT too.
Others might want to look at bio-fuels in diesel gensets. That just
doesn't fit my profile right now for a bunch of OT reasons.
more later
John Fisher
David Roden wrote:
I've been taken to task for a somewhat dismissive response to a recent
question or comment about genset APUs. So I thought that I would amend that
response and provide some possibly useful information. Rather than
repeating what's available in the archives already, however, I thought it
might be worth adding some data to the discussion.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Why not just add a cryopump and condensor? 10^-5 torr
Seriously though, pressurized helium is better than trying to pull a vacuum.
--
Martin K
On 4/4/07, Dale Ulan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
The issue here is that you'd have to hold the pressure below
10millitorrs (one atmosphere is ~750 torr ) to make a difference, if
it goes above that you'll be worse off.
That's some serious vacuum. It will be impossible to seal that
kind of vacuum in a motor that size unless you are actively
pumping during your run.
I....
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This doesn't work
>
http://real.npr.org:8080/viewsource/template.html?nuyhtggaysz6BA9crfAzwBlgejtjn6pDafzguE2pz67vvuz6Csx7DflcDaE6cz2ym7ziDaE6ir7aE6gh3u5g5a67E6frqpxf8x97080g59E66ij3i9sE2xE7n5g2z8mb96E680xcz8lu2qy73dba57sb96E6a2u157
This does.
http://www.sciencefriday.com/pages/2007/Apr/hour2_040607.html
> Direct to the source of the second hour where the discussion was held.
Lawrence Rhodes.......
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Martin
That link is dead. It says server can't be found.
Thanks
David Hankins
-----Original Message-----
From: Martin Winlow [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 12:45 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: History Lesson?
>From what I've read so far it looks relatively straight forward to design
and build a controller (a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing in the
wrong hands). So what Am I missing? What makes them so expensive? Why
haven't any of the many bright, intelligent and knowledgeable people in this
group put something like this together?
Thanks
David Hankins
David,
Have a look at www.belktronics.com for a cheap EV conversion controller (and
associated gubbins).
Regards, Martin Winlow
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I've been toying with the idea of running one based on a small
constant speed diesel running on B100.
I am in the process of researching small 1 or 2 cylinder compact
diesels that can be modified to run like Bruce Crower's experimental
engine. The idea would to then put that engine under the hood of a
car running a generator to power an electric motor.
Bruce's motor: http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/
20060227/FREE/302270007/1023/THISWEEKSISSUE
Am I looney for thinking this is a workable option?
John Boy
On Apr 7, 2007, at 10:56 AM, John Fisher wrote:
Good for you David! And thanks for the research.
Here's where your assumptions don't apply ( to my project):
I am assuming a pluggable hybrid.
I am not burning gasoline in an unmodified genset.
I am not thinking of running the genset at full load 100% of the time.
I am aimed at a car lighter and slower than a OEM gas vehicle. It
might even have better aero one day.
You didn't account for the reduced power-plant emissions of reduced
electrical use ( granted, perhaps negligible in non-coal or nuclear
states)
Gensets might be lighter than lead batteries, and no more difficult
to package. Certain the genset is not heavier anyway...
Further, you yourself suggested using a clean auto engine to make a
home-built genset, and re-tuning it to run at a constant low speed.
I might opt for a smaller MC engine with catalytic converter, since
we don't have micro-cars in our Super-sized country.
So I need to do some calcs based on the following assumptions:
1) genset starts running after batts drop to some adjustable level,
say 40% of usable charge to start with.
2) genset runs at a high enough KW to limp home, but not maintain
30 mph. 5kw is what I was thinking...
Its a complicated prediction, so with my daily loop of 25 miles and
no re-charging en route, I'll start by guesstimating the genset
runs 50% of the time, subject to real-world experience. If we could
scrounge up a free circuit at work, I might even be able to do
without the genset altogether most days. But I think we are maxed.
So at genset 50% of the time the car returns home needing a full
recharge.
All guesses to be sure. caveat emptor!
3) propane is the likely first power source instead of gasoline. My
research shows that it gives no advantage in greenhouse gases, but
some large but as yet unknown-to-me improvement in smog. I could
always get a small engine catalytic converter for it, assuming the
chemistry is OK with propane. Alas, H2 storage is probably a
showstopper for now. Supply and storage are just too darn
expensive, even for the little motor. Interestingly, a propane
genset will probably convert to H2 or a number of other fuel gases
with ease, but thats OT too.
Others might want to look at bio-fuels in diesel gensets. That just
doesn't fit my profile right now for a bunch of OT reasons.
more later
John Fisher
David Roden wrote:
I've been taken to task for a somewhat dismissive response to a
recent question or comment about genset APUs. So I thought that I
would amend that response and provide some possibly useful
information. Rather than repeating what's available in the
archives already, however, I thought it might be worth adding some
data to the discussion.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.belktronix.com/
It looks to be a one-man show, but I have heard positive
responses from people on this list about the products.
They seem to be focused on 120V, 500A DC conversions
though the DC/DC can take a wider range.
My main gripe is with the pack voltage connections made with
fast-on plugs on the DC/DC, which have some protection against
slipping off but can wear out (fatigue) and easily be
yanked off, after which live pack voltages are only separated
from the car's sheet metal (and your hands) by the isolation
around the plugs - usually just a short piece of heatshrink
with exposed end of the plug. Not a very safe way to connect
in my opinion, I prefer a screw-on or click-and-latch style
connector which are abundantly available.
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of David Hankins
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 11:11 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: History Lesson?
Hello Martin
That link is dead. It says server can't be found.
Thanks
David Hankins
-----Original Message-----
From: Martin Winlow [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 12:45 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: History Lesson?
>From what I've read so far it looks relatively straight forward to
>design
and build a controller (a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing in the
wrong hands). So what Am I missing? What makes them so expensive? Why
haven't any of the many bright, intelligent and knowledgeable people in this
group put something like this together?
Thanks
David Hankins
David,
Have a look at www.belktronics.com for a cheap EV conversion controller (and
associated gubbins).
Regards, Martin Winlow
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Being a physics grad you will appreciate "The Math" (this is a review,
ignore if you already found this while lurking)
wh/mile
(Will the experianced ev'RS correct the detaisl here please)
Things like the EV1 got around 150Wh/mile.
Things like the RAV4 got about 250Wh/mile.
Most AC conversions are in this 250-300wh/m(Ac systems are
generally smaller and more optimized)
Most DC conversions are 300wh/mile +
I can't get better than 430wh/mile. This is caused by picking a
heavy donor car to begin with before I added 1000lbs of lead. And
probably dragging brakes and poor alignment.
I wanted the snap and didn't want the acid mess so I choose AGM's, Which
means even less range per lb of lead. But lets look at my pack.
24 exide orbitals for a 288V 50ah pack. But the 50 ah is at the 20 hour
rate, it is more like 34ah in the 1 hr rate, and the 288V is more like
260 average.
Useing more than 80% of the energy in the pack is detrimental to lead
acid, so...
so 260V*34ah*.8 = 7Kwh usable. 7000/430 = 16 miles, pathetic.
When the batteries were new and for some reason I got 350wh/mile I got
about 26 miles range with the math showing 20 to be safe.
If you use the bb600's (BTW, i would like some, Would you be willing to
share the source?)
lets say you go thru the trouble to get 240 cells wired together for
288V and a true 40ah capacity. You don't need to be as conservative on
the discharge capacity or cold weather with the nicads. They won't lose
as much capacity at higher discharge rates.
So lets say 270V @40ahand 90% discharge 9.7kwh usable and about the same
weight. Even on my beast that would be more like 22miles range.
Ok, Now you can play with the math 100mile range. Lets use a great donor
and assume 250wh/mile. And assume a 288V pack
100Miles * 250wh/mile = 25kwh pack
Lead:
25kwh usable *1.2 = 30kwh raw power, At the 1hr AGM rate that is
over 100ah, that is at least 2000lb of AGM's. To get 250Wh/mile we will
need to keep the total vehicle weight down, so this gets tough.
I will let the "Red Beasty" speak for useing floodies for long range.
Currently I have been looking at lifepo4 as a long term solution. I have
found 186550's at 1300mah and $4 each but they have very poor discharge
current capability. but looking at just capacity 88 in series and 77 in
parallel is 27,000 dollars! and 600lbs. The point is that 600lbs (at
least 700Lbs by the time you connect them and manage them) does the work
of 2000Lb of lead, Perhaps helping that wh/mile rateing. oh, and I
forgot the 80% max DOD
The A123's can dish out the amps but at $18/cell and no qty pricing
available yet. Only 45 in parallel to get the 30kwh pack for a 25kwh at
80% is gulp, $71K
I am gonna go for 55ah at 19.8 / module and 15 modules for a total 2160
cells for a 400-500 lb pack then work on the donor until I get to
150wh/mile.
I am thinking that a hybrid pack or even a hybrid module that has both
high power and high capacity lifepo4 cells in it may be the answer. I
think this can be a $15K-17K pack in a few years.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I had a thought once that may be a good compromise with available
components.
Buy a used honda insight with a bad motor(saw one on ebay for 4k last
month, 1800Lb curb weight). and rip out the gas motor and replace it
with 3 more sets of IMA rotors.(have seen them for $500 on ebay)
Buy about 6 used pruii batteries at 288V and 6ah and 60lb each.
This idea would hinge on a persons ability to hack the controllers or
replace them with new ones.
If you'll excuse me, I need to go buy a lottery ticket :-)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I don't recall hearing any results one way or the other on this list. I
remember a couple of people talking about placing orders. I do not recall
anyone that has received and installed a kit that has reported back.
If someone has please let us know what your experience has been so far.
thanks
damon
From: Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Belktronix, was: History Lesson?
Date: Sat, 7 Apr 2007 13:11:27 -0700
http://www.belktronix.com/
It looks to be a one-man show, but I have heard positive
responses from people on this list about the products.
They seem to be focused on 120V, 500A DC conversions
though the DC/DC can take a wider range.
My main gripe is with the pack voltage connections made with
fast-on plugs on the DC/DC, which have some protection against
slipping off but can wear out (fatigue) and easily be
yanked off, after which live pack voltages are only separated
from the car's sheet metal (and your hands) by the isolation
around the plugs - usually just a short piece of heatshrink
with exposed end of the plug. Not a very safe way to connect
in my opinion, I prefer a screw-on or click-and-latch style
connector which are abundantly available.
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of David Hankins
Sent: Saturday, April 07, 2007 11:11 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: History Lesson?
Hello Martin
That link is dead. It says server can't be found.
Thanks
David Hankins
-----Original Message-----
From: Martin Winlow [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 12:45 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: History Lesson?
>From what I've read so far it looks relatively straight forward to
>design
and build a controller (a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing in the
wrong hands). So what Am I missing? What makes them so expensive? Why
haven't any of the many bright, intelligent and knowledgeable people in
this
group put something like this together?
Thanks
David Hankins
David,
Have a look at www.belktronics.com for a cheap EV conversion controller
(and
associated gubbins).
Regards, Martin Winlow
_________________________________________________________________
Download Messenger. Join the im Initiative. Help make a difference today.
http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGHM_APR07
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Gizmo goes BugE)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.thecreswellchronicle.com/news/story.cfm?story_no=3929
Gizmo begets BugE By Helen Hollyer Published: March 21, 2007
[Photo Helen Hollyer
http://206.212.237.138/photos/upload/20070321110319.jpg
The BugE with its 10-year-old sibling, the Gizmo, a larger,
heavier and more complex vehicle.]
It's too rainy and windy for walking or riding a bicycle around
Creswell to return a video, mail a letter and pick up milk and
bread, yet the trip is too short to justify firing up your
fuel-devouring SUV how about using a BugE personal electric
vehicle?
Creswellians accustomed to seeing the Gizmo, Creswell resident
Mark Murphy's three-wheeled electric car, tooling sedately along
local roads, are beginning to report sightings of the Gizmo's
simplified sibling zipping around town.
Prior to shipping kits to purchasers for assembly, Murphy has
been test driving the BugE, a unique combination of comfortable
local transportation, economic practicality and environmental
responsibility.
The BugE has a semi-enclosed, fiberglass body riding on a frame
with three wheels (two in the front; one in the back) and an
aerodynamic front fairing that shields the occupant from wind,
rain and other vehicles' exhaust fumes.
Its other features include a single seat; halogen headlights;
handlebars with a hand throttle, brakes and turn signals;
aluminum mag wheels; rearview mirrors; an adjustable seat; and a
front storage compartment.
It will be licensed and insured as a three-wheel motorcycle, so
drivers will need an easily obtained motorcycle endorsement on
their driver's licenses. Murphy advises not exceeding 40 mph.
"It scoots along in traffic, but it's not freeway capable," he
said.
Murphy's build-it-yourself vehicle supports local businesses
because many of its components are manufactured in this area (the
body is produced by Tom Smith Fiberglass in Goshen and the power
system is manufactured by EV parts in Port Townsend, Wash.), and
the basic tools and supplies needed for assembly can be purchased
at local hardware and automotive stores.
Murphy expects each purchaser to start with the $3,200 basic
vehicle kit and customize his or her BugE, which can be assembled
without extensive prior experience and costs about one cent per
mile to operate.
Ed Gunderson, Murphy's friend and Webmaster for Murphy's company
Blue Sky Design, plans to build an open cockpit "roadster"
version.
Murphy estimates that the vehicle can be assembled in about 40
hours, but suspects that most people will putter around after
work and on weekends, taking a month or so to complete the
project.
Without taking into consideration the value of the assembler's
time, a completed vehicle will cost about $5,000. Fuel is easy to
come by, just plug the BugE's power cord into any standard
110-volt outlet.
Powered by a lead-acid battery, the BugE would go about 40 flat
miles on a single charge. Nickel metal hydride and lithium ion
batteries have larger capacities, but are relatively expensive.
"The vehicle isn't intended to go to Portland, so why use a
battery that can do that?" Murphy asked rhetorically.
Asked to compare the BugE and a golf cart, Murphy pointed out
that golf carts have 25-miles-per-hour speed limits and can be
operated only in cities having ordinances permitting their use.
Not only is the BugE relatively inexpensive to purchase and
operate, it produces zero hydrocarbon emissions at the tailpipe,
and does not contribute directly to global climate change,
although purists can argue that it still draws electricity from
the existing grid produced from wind, hydropower and other
non-polluting sources as well as coal and petroleum.
"The cost of energy is changing the dynamic of transportation
needs," Murphy said. "There are huge social implications of
increasing energy costs. We need diversity in transportation.
It's in the community's best interests to have less congestion
and less pollution. I consider the BugE to be between a bicycle
and a Buick.
"The Gizmo was about 10 years ahead of its time," Murphy said.
"It had to be assembled in a factory and we [Murphy and four
former business associates] couldn't generate enough investment
capital to produce one Gizmo per day, the critical level of
production."
The BugE's business model is completely different, Murphy said.
Commenting that assembly of BugEs could become a grass roots
industry, Murphy said, "There are already small family-owned
businesses that produce the major components of the BugE."
"We have had about 90 serious inquiries asking "When can I order
one?" Murphy said. "We have a zero advertising budget for the
BugE, which is a niche product. News of it is spreading via the
Internet and by word of mouth.
A graduate of the Art Center College of Design in Pasadena,
Calif. and an industrial designer since 1984, Murphy left a
career in Southern California working on luxury internal
combustion automobiles for such corporations as BMW, General
Motors and Chrysler to migrate to Eugene in 1992.
Since his Oregon move, his creative efforts have included
inventing the Aerocoupe Electrathon racer, an ultralight electric
car raced by high school students throughout the country;
redesigned Burley Design Cooperative's best-selling bicycle
trailer; designed the Gizmo and created the BugE.
About four years ago, his then soon-to-be wife Trish bought a
hundred-year-old house that the couple has been remodeling ever
since on N. Second Street in Creswell, adding a 10- x 20-foot
studio from which he operates his company, Blue Sky Design.
Murphy can be contacted through his Website,
www.blueskydysn.com.
Copyright 2005-2007 The Creswell Chronicle
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
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TV dinner still cooling?
Check out "Tonight's Picks" on Yahoo! TV.
http://tv.yahoo.com/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Montana Gov zipped around the statehouse in an EV)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.laureloutlook.com/articles/2007/03/21/news/08energy.txt
Governor touts incentives for 'clean, green' energy
By Dan Testa Community New Service UM School of Journalism
Wednesday, March 21, 2007 11:38 AM MDT
[
http://www.laureloutlook.com/content/articles/2007/03/21/news/08energy.jpg
Governor Brian Schweitzer checks out a high-mileage car Friday
after unveiling his clean and green energy legislation.]
Standing in front of a line of solar and battery-powered cars,
Gov. Brian Schweitzer unveiled the cornerstone of his clean and
green energy legislation Friday.
This will redefine Montana as a leader in energy, Schweitzer
said.
But as he zipped around the statehouse driveway in
smaller-than-subcompact electric vehicles, Republicans were
already questioning the governor's introduction of substantial
energy legislation on the 56th day of the 90-day session.
[...]
It's OK to lead once in a while, he says.
Copyright © 2007: All rights reserved. The Laurel Outlook.
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
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. EV List Editor & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
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It's here! Your new message!
Get new email alerts with the free Yahoo! Toolbar.
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/toolbar/features/mail/
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--- Begin Message ---
I think a central question in this genset-hybrid approach is the
efficiency of the genset. Is this guy's solution a good approach? What I
can't tell from looking at marine diesels for instance, is whether they
are really optimized for efficiency. I am guessing the answer is "no"
they are optimized for reliability, simplicity, and maintainability
under sea conditions. But I don't really know...
I saw this Crower motor before, but I guess only he knows how viable it
is. I just shot off my opinion on another post about tinkerers not be
able to compete with factory engineers. In this case a smart tinkerer
can compete if the factory isn't trying, i.e. if they aren't trying to
build an efficient motor. Lombardini makes small diesels, as well as
Kubota, and there are some in microcars in Europe, like the Smart. Maybe
there are some sources across the pond for small efficient diesels? I am
not personally convinced by B100 or even restaurant grease for greeness,
but we can take that OT. Not so bad I wouldn't run a diesel though, if
they weren't so expensive and heavy.
flash: the LSR guys might have somebody with a diesel record in small
displacement. There are some smart dudes building those...
John Russell wrote:
I've been toying with the idea of running one based on a small
constant speed diesel running on B100.
I am in the process of researching small 1 or 2 cylinder compact
diesels that can be modified to run like Bruce Crower's experimental
engine. The idea would to then put that engine under the hood of a car
running a generator to power an electric motor.
Bruce's motor:
http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060227/FREE/302270007/1023/THISWEEKSISSUE
Am I looney for thinking this is a workable option?
John Boy
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
From: John Fisher <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: EV APU (genset) emissions & FE
Date: Sat, 07 Apr 2007 14:13:03 -0700
I think a central question in this genset-hybrid approach is the efficiency
of the genset. Is this guy's solution a good approach?
The genset's efficiency is certainly important. But, just as important are
the efficiencies ( and, the losses) in the other parts of the power chain.
Compared to a conventional ICE vehicle, you would have these additional
losses:
Losses in the generator
Losses in the batteries
Losses in the controller and wiring
and, losses in the motor.
All of these have to be considered carefully.
Phil
What I can't tell from looking at marine diesels for instance, is whether
they are really optimized for efficiency. I am guessing the answer is "no"
they are optimized for reliability, simplicity, and maintainability under
sea conditions. But I don't really know...
I saw this Crower motor before, but I guess only he knows how viable it is.
I just shot off my opinion on another post about tinkerers not be able to
compete with factory engineers. In this case a smart tinkerer can compete
if the factory isn't trying, i.e. if they aren't trying to build an
efficient motor. Lombardini makes small diesels, as well as Kubota, and
there are some in microcars in Europe, like the Smart. Maybe there are some
sources across the pond for small efficient diesels? I am not personally
convinced by B100 or even restaurant grease for greeness, but we can take
that OT. Not so bad I wouldn't run a diesel though, if they weren't so
expensive and heavy.
flash: the LSR guys might have somebody with a diesel record in small
displacement. There are some smart dudes building those...
John Russell wrote:
I've been toying with the idea of running one based on a small constant
speed diesel running on B100.
I am in the process of researching small 1 or 2 cylinder compact diesels
that can be modified to run like Bruce Crower's experimental engine. The
idea would to then put that engine under the hood of a car running a
generator to power an electric motor.
Bruce's motor:
http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060227/FREE/302270007/1023/THISWEEKSISSUE
Am I looney for thinking this is a workable option?
John Boy
_________________________________________________________________
Exercise your brain! Try Flexicon.
http://games.msn.com/en/flexicon/default.htm?icid=flexicon_hmemailtaglineapril07
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks Bob. I'm hoping my 600 will have better luck
than yours. You never know.
Andrew
> > Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2007 17:57:09 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: Raptor 600 throttle sensor wiring
> To: [email protected]
>
> You are correct, Andrew, the bare braided wire
> _does_
> go to ground, and is shielding.
> On your green harness, there is a pin 4, 5, or 6, (I
> forget which), that goes to ground anyway, so I
> connected mine to that one.
>
> Best of success on the 600. Two of mine have died
> early deaths. I'm using a 1200 now.
>
> Your inductive throttle will induce noise in the
> stereo reception, so have your Ipod ready to plug
> in.
> Otherwise, you'll have a magnificent run!
> peace,
____________________________________________________________________________________
Don't pick lemons.
See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.
http://autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Fri, Apr 06, 2007 at 02:20:34PM -0700, Lawrence Rhodes wrote:
> The second hour of Science Friday was devoted to plugin vehicles, the x
> prize & the Chevy Volt.
<..snip..>
> This should be available on the web as they have an archeive/podcast......
http://www.sciencefriday.com/pages/2007/Apr/hour2_040607.html
Archived Audio:
GM's Chevy Volt
http://media.libsyn.com/media/sciencefriday/scifri-2007040623.mp3
green cars
http://media.libsyn.com/media/sciencefriday/scifri-2007040624.mp3
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(maxwell.af using nEVs)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070323/DISPATCH01/70323011/1115
March 23, 2007 MAXWELL/GUNTER NEWS
Fuel Management goes green
Jennifer Roberts Dispatch Staff Writer
[...]
Maxwell-Gunter uses [...] power vehicles, generators,
landscaping and building maintenance equipment, and the fleet
of ground equipment used on the [42nd Air Base Wing
http://www.maxwell.af.mil/42abw/ ] flight line.
Perhaps the most visible technique employed to meet [Bush's]
fuel reduction goal so far has been the gradual replacement of
many government vehicles used to conduct business on base with
small, electric-powered and gas-powered vehicles.
Maxwell-Gunter currently has about 100 small electric-powered
vehicles [...]. The electric vehicles are relatively small in
size and power, however, and therefore have limited hauling
capabilities.
[...]
Long term energy independence is what we get out of this, not
necessarily dollar savings, Mr. Gladman said. Our first
priorities are the [purchase and use of] low-speed and electric
vehicles, then hybrids, then alternative fuel vehicles. Our last
choice is the conventional vehicle.
To learn more about fuel conservation,, log on to
www.eere.energy.gov. Copyright © 1997- 2007 The Advertiser Co.
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
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. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
: MEPIS Linux & WiFi powered :
____________________________________________________________________________________
The fish are biting.
Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing.
http://searchmarketing.yahoo.com/arp/sponsoredsearch_v2.php
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Santa Monica, CA EV & h2-hybrid fleet)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.greenoptions.com/blog/2007/03/23/guest_post_santa_monica_a_southern_california_model_of_sustainability_part_2
Santa Monica: A Southern California Model of Sustainability
(Part 2) Mar 23, 2007 By Jeff McIntire-Strasburg
John Addison publishes the Clean Fleet Report
(www.cleanfleetreport.com) and is the author of the 2008 book
Save Gas, Save the Planet.
Santa Monica goes beyond clean electricity to be a city that
models clean transportation. Use of electric vehicles increases
every year. The city has over 30 electric vehicles including
battery-electric Toyota RAVs and light EV GEMs. The city is now
planning on two Phoenix sport utility trucks: one for the water
department and one for the library. The Phoenix trucks have an
impressive 130 mile range. Santa Monica will do a nightly trickle
recharge at 220 volts, rather than use Phoenixs fast recharge
option.
Rick Sikes, Fleet Superintendent, showed me a wide range of clean
vehicles.
[...]
5 of the citys fleet of Toyota Priuses were converted by Quantum
to run on pure hydrogen. The city has a Proton electrolyzer that
splits water (H2O) into hydrogen and oxygen. Because the city
buys renewable energy for the electricity that runs the
electrolyzer, resulting in the hydrogen Priuses producing no
green house gases, on a well to wheels basis.
[...]
Santa Monica has the potential to be a model of clean
transportation, energy efficiency and renewable energy for other
cities around the world. Each year, Santa Monica shares its
progress, demonstrates the latest vehicles, and showcases expert
speakers. Include October 20 and 21, 2007, in your calendar for
the Alt Car Expo. Some Rights Reserved Green Options LLC
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
: MEPIS Linux & WiFi powered :
____________________________________________________________________________________
Don't get soaked. Take a quick peek at the forecast
with the Yahoo! Search weather shortcut.
http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#loc_weather
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Kind to Man technology: 3Wheel Mahindra E-Bijlees)-long
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://news.moneycontrol.com/india/news/pressnews/thirunrangasamymahindrabijlees/puducherrycmhan/market/stocks/article/273169
Puducherry CM hands over 10 Bijlees to customers
The Honourable Chief Minister of Puducherry, Thiru N. Rangasamy
today handed over the keys of 10 Mahindra Bijlees to customers at
the Exhibition of Renewable Energy and Energy Conserving Devices,
today. The Bijlee, an innovative, first-of-its-kind electric
three wheeler, is Indias tried and tested battery operated
vehicle.
Apart from the Chief Minister, the function was attended by other
senior state and central government leaders and officials. Mr.
Vishnu K. Garg, Vice President, Operations and Business
Development, Mahindra & Mahindra was also present. The exhibition
has been organized by REAP (Renewable Energy Agency of
Pondicherry) at the initiative of Mrs. D. Selvi, Project
Director,
The Puducherry government has been promoting environment friendly
vehicles as part of its drive to conserve the Union territorys
pristine heritage. In line with its plan to encourage the use of
battery operated vehicles, it will be providing Puducherrys
customers with a second charging station, which would be
strategically located to facilitate transport.
Forty Mahindra Bijlees are currently running on Puducherry roads
and have been met with great enthusiasm by the environment
conscious customers of the Union territory.
[...]
He was speaking after inaugurating the Exhibition of Renewable
Energy and Energy Conserving Devices, which has been envisaged to
showcase the best in renewable energy technology.
[...]
Mrs. D. Selvi, Project Director, REAP, said, I welcome the
addition of more Bijlee vehicles on Puducherrys roads and the
customers choice of the Mahindra product. It is in perfect
harmony with Puducherrys drive to promote the use of cost
efficient and non-polluting energy sources.
Bijlee: Driven by Kind to Man technology
The Bijlee is an innovative Kind to Man technology initiative
from Mahindra & Mahindras alternate fuel programme. It is a zero
emission electrically powered vehicle that runs on a 72 volts DC
motor. The Bijlees 12 batteries allow the customer to do 80 km
at a speed of 35 km/hour. With a replacement battery on board the
vehicle can easily give 120 kms. The electric vehicle has
spacious interiors, with ample space for an entire family. It has
no engine, gearbox radiator and no silencer, which makes it a
virtually noise free vehicle. Bijlee gives quality output without
choking the environment and is favoured by governments and
institutions, which lay focus on conserving the environment.
Sourced From: Adfactors Public Relations Pvt Ltd
Copyright © e-Eighteen.com Ltd. All rights reserved.
===
http://automotive.mahindraworld.com/Mahindra_Bijlee.htm
[image http://automotive.mahindraworld.com/Bijlee.gif ]
Mahindra Bijlee
Salient Features :
Battery operated-zero pollution & practically noiseless.
Powerful Sepex Motor for trouble free operation.
Single Reduction Gear Box.
No clutch or gear shifting .
Spacious 10 seater.
Short turning circle radius of 3.6 mts.
Approx 90 km per charge under standard test cycle.
Low maintenance cost.
Good for gradients.
No permit fee.
Electrical Specifications :
Motor Type : 72V;DC;Regenerative Braking&Reversible Direction
Max Power kw/rpm : 5.8kw(S2Rating)/3900(~7.8HP/3900)
Electricals Controller : Electronic MOSFET Sepex controller
Battery Specifications :
Battery Make : Trojan 105
Battery Type Lead acid deep cycle battery
No of Batteries/vehicle 12-6V each
General Specifications :
Body : Steel With Soft Top
Transmission :
Ratio
Single Reduction Gear Box :
Fixed ratio 1:2.833 One gear only.
Front Axle : Single Wheel - yoke arrangement
Rear Axle Capacity : Full floating , spiral bevel gear 4.125:1
Steering Wheel diameter (mm) :
Ratio
380
20:1
Turning Circle radius : 3.6
Gradeability: 11.4%
Suspension :Front
:Rear
Independent Dual coil spring shock absorber mounted on fork
assembly.
Elliptical leaf springs with double acting hydraulic shock
absorbers.
Braking System Tradem master cylinder assisted hydraulic
internal expanding brake on front and rear wheels. Micro switch
activates regenerative braking.
Additional secondary Hand Brake Provided.
Tyres : 4.5 x 10-8 Diagonal Ply
Wheel Base 2315 mm
Overall Length : 3180 mm
Overall Width : 1500 mm
Overall Height: 1925 mm
Track : 1315 mm
Ground Clearance 140 mm
Seating Capacity 10 Persons (Including driver)
Kerb Weight 870 Kg.
GVB 1545 Kg.
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
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. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
: MEPIS Linux & WiFi powered :
____________________________________________________________________________________
Bored stiff? Loosen up...
Download and play hundreds of games for free on Yahoo! Games.
http://games.yahoo.com/games/front
--- End Message ---
