EV Digest 6928

Topics covered in this issue include:

  1) Re: Improving hillclimbing without mudering the pack?
        by Markus Lorch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  2) 24-volt Electric Utility Cart Motor Question
        by Chip Gribben <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  3) "simple" balancer for NiMH NiCD, Li Ion Pack
        by Steve Powers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  4) Re: Rolling Resistance - how to measure
        by "Rob Hogenmiller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  5) Re: Motor speed
        by "Rob Hogenmiller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  6) Re: Improving hillclimbing without mudering the pack?
        by "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  7) Re: 24-volt Electric Utility Cart Motor Question
        by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  8) Interna Resistance? 
        by Joseph Tahbaz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  9) Anoher thought, quarter mile
        by Dan Frederiksen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 10) RE: Anoher thought, quarter mile
        by Joseph Tahbaz <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 11) Re: DCDC converter
        by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 12) Boost type controller  - curtis vs. zilla?
        by Markus Lorch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 13) Re: Google presses for 100 MPG vehicle
        by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 14) Re: Anoher thought, quarter mile
        by "TrotFox Greyfoot" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 15) Re: Boost type controller  - curtis vs. zilla?
        by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 16) RE: Google presses for 100 MPG vehicle
        by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 17) Re: Siamese 8 Lives Again...Seattle here we come!
        by Jim Husted <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 18) Re: Boost type controller - curtis vs. zilla?
        by "Peter Gabrielsson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
 19) Electric transmission computer
        by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 20) Re: Slightly OT: Painting your EV for less than $100
        by Rich Long <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Jeff,

thanks for the reply. I wonder if a higher voltage will lead to higher amps and thus higher torque. It is my understanding that a series wound motor will not run faster due to higher voltage as the field strength increases as well. Am I wrong?

OTOH, if I would add a controller like the Zilla, would that help me keep the battery amps down if I have higher voltage but not deliver it to the motor as e.g. I would be running at only 50% duty cycle instead of 80% duty cycle.

Markus

Jeff Shanab schrieb:
Sounds like you are on the right track. The only way to get more power
out of a given motor at a fixed amp is to spin it faster and let the
gears translate that added rpm into added torque. The only way to spin a
given motor faster is to raise the voltage.

I believe you have two other options
    1) get a second motor and do the series parallel switch. This is
like an electric transmission. Double the torque at half the max RPM,
but that may make a particular gear possible. But only if the motor is
the limit.
    2) I think Lee mentioned once on this list how to use a curtis on a
higher system voltage thru a retactor circuit. I'd say check the
archives, But I couldn't find it. Going to a higher system voltage and
keeping the controller this way and using the lower gear sounds like a
good idea.

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- A few years ago I inherited a lime green pretty cool looking 24-volt 3 wheel Utility Cart with a diamond plate flat bed, but it doesn't run. It's the size of a 3-wheel golf cart, maybe a tad smaller and it was probably made in the far east. The back wheels are actually automotive style 4-bolt wheels. It has hydraulic brakes and looks pretty well made. The person who owned it before used it on his island (he actually owns an island) but it broke so he brought it home and left it sitting out in the rain before I got it so the handlebars and steering column are rusted pretty bad.

It's been in my backyard under a tarp for a few years with some other junk but my neighborhood nazi neighbor complained and the HOA sent a threatening letter and I have 30 days to remove it. I won't say what's going through my mind about my neighbor and the HOA right now. The same neighbor already gave me a hard time about my sailboat (only 15 feet long for crying out loud) so I had to move that to my parents house. What a jerk.

Anyway, I tried to get it moving today so I could at least get it rolling under it's own power to get it into the garage where there is absolutely no room for it with the other EV projects that are in progress . . . but with no luck.

The motor is directly mounted to the front wheel. This is a brush motor and there are three 1/0 cables going to it, white, red, and black. That's what has me confused - the three same size 1/0 wires going to a brushed motor. The motor does actually work. When I hook up a 12 volt battery to the red and black leads on the motor it does run but only in reverse. Even when I switch polarity it still runs in reverse. I tried wiring up the battery to the white wire but just got a spark at the battery terminal and the wheel didn't spin. Weird. I'm obviously missing something here. I really need to troubleshoot from the controller and relays on back first I suppose.

The motor has an extended shaft and there is a cap with a planetary gear that attaches to it but that was all taken apart when I got it. I still have all the pieces. The cap says 24 volts and there is a small insulated wire going to it. I think it is some type of electrical clutch or brake. Maybe an electric prawn of some sort.

The cart does have two rather large relays which don't look anything like an Albright Contactor. One could be a forward relay and the other could be reverse. I noticed the white wire from one relay is going to the motor. And the black and red wires also look like they are coming from the relays to the motor. I haven't really had much time to reverse engineer it. I'm not even sure if the controller works. It looks similar to a Curtis but its all silver colored. The pot box looks like it could be a Curtis though.

The batteries in the cart are flat completely dead. There are 4 batteries that slide out on a tray so it must be a parallel arrangement for the 24 volt system

If anyone has any ideas on how this thing might be set up I'd appreciate it. Having the motor directly mounted to the front wheel is a unique feature but it seems complex with the three wires and this prawn/clutch or brake thing on the end. If I can at least get that figured out it would be a help. I'd hate to haul it away to the dump but may end up doing that if I can't get it running.

What I did today was get rid of all the junk and moved the cart closer to the back of the house and covered it neatly with a tarp and planted grass seed where all the junk was. If they see it neatened up a little that may hold them off.

But if anyone in the DC, MD area is interested in it you can have it for free if you can haul it away. I don't have any pictures of it yet. Still need to get my digital camera software loaded on the computer first.


Chip








--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This only works for vehicles with dual battery packs. 
And, maybe you won't think it is all this simple.

When under load, both packs are in parallel.  You do
need some type of current limiter between them to
limit runaway situations if one module in one pack
dies.

When not under load (or only under light load),
disconnect pack #1 from pack #2.  Disconnect all of
the modules in Pack #2.  Put all the modules in pack
#2 in parallel.  This equalizes pack #2.  Then,
disconnect pack #1, and do the same.  Eventually, if
you repeat this algorithm at the right frequency and
for the right duration, your batteries will all be
equalized.

It can work well for all types of batteries.  It is
safest on lead / lead systems.  Something like dial
strings of small Lead Acid batteries.  If you use Lead
/ NiMH, you have to limit the current in / out of each
NiMH module when they are in parallel mode. 
Polyswitches as the devices that puts them in
parallel.  If you use Li Ion, you also need
overvoltage protection (at a minimum some type of
shunt regulator) on each cell.  This is in addition to
the overvoltage protection.

Steve


       
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- I didn't have my terminology right. I'm trying to figure out how much total resistance my car is at 55mph.

God bless


----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 10:26 AM
Subject: RE: Rolling Resistance - how to measure





From: "Rob Hogenmiller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: "EV Discussion" <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Rolling Resistance
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2007 08:30:04 -0500

This morning I did a test for rolling resistance.

I was traveling at 60mph on flat ground in my car on a non windy day.
It took me 7 seconds to slow 0.1 Miles (on the odometer)
My speed at the distance of 0.1 Miles was 55mph at the 7second mark.

What would be my rolling resistance in this range 55-60mph?

God bless



Rob -

Because of the wind drag at highway speeds, you can't deduce rolling resistance very well from this particular test. The wind drag would swamp the tire drag.

But, it could work very well if you do it at slower speeds. You might try timing the car from , for example, 15 MPH to 5 MPH. A those speeds, the air drag is fairly small and won't drastically affect your resutls.

Make sure the car is out of gear, and the road is VERY level. Doing the same test in both directions - and averaging the results - would help account for any slight grade of the road.

Here is how you would do the calculation:

1.  Calculate your decelleration:

First, convert your speeds to FPS ( feet/second ) by multiplying by 1.47. For example, 15 MPH is 22 FPS, and 5 MPH is 7.35 FPS.

Now, divide the change in speed by the slow-down time to get decelleration in feet per second squared:
( let's use 40 seconds as an example)

Decelleration = (22 FPS - 7.35 FPS) / 40 S = 0.367 feet/sec/sec

2. To get the RR factor, divide this decelleration by the acceleration of gravity **( 32.2 FPS):

RR = 0.367/ 32.2 = 0.011 = 1.1 %

So, in this case your calculated rolling resistance coefficient would be 1.1 %.

The difficult part might be to determine exactly when you reach the final speed.

Or, you could use 0 MPH ( dead stop) as your final speed - the calculation is even simpler.


Good luck. Let us know what you measure ( and what tires and tire pressure you are using)



Phil Marino


** Rolling resistance is the ratio of drag to car weight. By taking the ratio of decelleration ( proportional to tire drag) to the acceleration of gravity ( proportional to car weight) you get the same value.

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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thank you for all the help, it's much clearer now.

God bless

----- Original Message ----- From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 8:50 AM
Subject: Re: Motor speed


Think of a bicycle wheel.
If you measure it near the hub, 1 rpm of the bicycle wheel will still be 1
rpm if you measure it at the tube-valve-stem.
Its 1 trip around, that you're measuring and counting.

What you may be thinking of is distance traveled (the hub -sensor travels
less, while the valve stem distance traveled measures 2*Pi*R).

Think of it this way....
Imagine all the spokes are clean, and 1 spoke has a straw on it.
The portion of the straw near the center of the wheel travels less, but it
makes 1 revolution around the hub at the same time that the outer portion
(near the rim) of the straw.

A device measuring "revolutions" would be accurate either at the rim or at
the hub.

When Rob measures his rpm at the flywheel (whether or not its near the
rim), because its locked onto the motor shaft - (via taper lock, or some
other method) he receives the same rpm measurement there that he'd receive
if he used a magnet on the shaft itself.


Ed





"Rob Hogenmiller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
06/21/2007 09:06
Please respond to
ev@listproc.sjsu.edu


To
<ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
cc

Subject
Re: Motor speed






How can that be?

If you measure the rpms at 3500 on a 1inch shaft motor.
And you now put a 2 inch shaft on the same motor still turning at the same

speed, the revolutions per minute will have changed because where your
measuring now takes it twice as to make one revolution.

So unless I'm incorrect it does make a difference where it's measured.

God bless


----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Marino" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 7:10 AM
Subject: Re: Motor speed



Rob - If I understand your question, you're asking - where in the motor
should the RPM be  3500?

The answer is - everywhere.  RPM is short for revolutions per minute.
Since the shaft/armature of the motor is a single rigid assembly, it
doesn't matter where you measure it.  All parts of it are rotating at
the
same speed. ( rotational speed, not linear speed)

Often RPM is measured at the motor shaft ( usually the non-drive end)
but
some people measure it with a device which "sees" the fan blades go by.
They will all give the same result.  It's a matter of convenience of
installation.

I measure motor RPM with a hall-effect sensor that looks at a notch in
the
flywheel.  Since the flywheel is keyed to the motor shaft, it gives the
right result.  For me, that was a convenient way to do it.

Phil Marino

From: "Rob Hogenmiller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Motor speed
Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2007 22:57:16 -0500

When you type 3500rpm for an electric motor, where is that determined
at?

By/at the shaft circumference point, inside the motor, or some other
location?

God bless


----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Willmon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 10:21 PM
Subject: RE: Motor speed


Storm,
My WarP9 finds its sweet spot around 3500 RPM, which in 2nd gear
happens
to be 35 mph. at 37mph I can feel acceleration start to
taper and seems the perfect shift point to 3rd gear.

Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Jim Husted
Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 6:01 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Motor speed


Hey Storm

Actually you don't want to lug the motor and you have
plenty of room and would say it'd be happier at the
3000 to 4000 rpms, you got lots more rpm to play with
8^)

Hope this helps
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric


--- Storm Connors <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I got the tachometer installed, now the big
> question.
> What is the best speed to aim for with my ADC 9"
> motor
> pushing almost 3500 pounds? I have been keeping it
> between 2000 and 2500 RPM generally. My thinking is
> that  if the revs are too low  under load, there is
> the potential of overheating. I have red lined it at
> 5000 so as not to break the motor.
>
> What do you think? I have been treating it like an
> ICE
> but don't know if that is right.
>
>




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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Markus

I may have missed the original question. But, if it was " how do I draw less battery amps going up a hill" ,(without changing the battery pack voltage) the only real answer is to go slower.

If you are lugging the motor ( too slow RPM) very badly, then downshifting to keep the motor in an efficient RPM range may help a bit, but probably not significantly.


There is no way to beat the system. Climbing a hill takes power, and climbing a hill faster takes more power. Since your battery voltage is (about) constant, that means you need more battery amps.

Changing controllers won't help. You would still have to draw the same amps from the battery, since all controllers have about the same efficiency.

The only solution would be more batteries (so as to increase the pack voltage and decrease the required current), or, reduce the weight of the car, somehow.


Phil Marino


From: Markus Lorch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Improving hillclimbing without mudering the pack?
Date: Fri, 22 Jun 2007 00:34:18 +0200

Hi Jeff,

thanks for the reply. I wonder if a higher voltage will lead to higher amps and thus higher torque. It is my understanding that a series wound motor will not run faster due to higher voltage as the field strength increases as well. Am I wrong?

OTOH, if I would add a controller like the Zilla, would that help me keep the battery amps down if I have higher voltage but not deliver it to the motor as e.g. I would be running at only 50% duty cycle instead of 80% duty cycle.

Markus

Jeff Shanab schrieb:
Sounds like you are on the right track. The only way to get more power
out of a given motor at a fixed amp is to spin it faster and let the
gears translate that added rpm into added torque. The only way to spin a
given motor faster is to raise the voltage.

I believe you have two other options
    1) get a second motor and do the series parallel switch. This is
like an electric transmission. Double the torque at half the max RPM,
but that may make a particular gear possible. But only if the motor is
the limit.
    2) I think Lee mentioned once on this list how to use a curtis on a
higher system voltage thru a retactor circuit. I'd say check the
archives, But I couldn't find it. Going to a higher system voltage and
keeping the controller this way and using the lower gear sounds like a
good idea.


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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Chip

Lansing makes a three cabled motor where they use two
field leads and one armature lead.  The motor is wound
where the coils have both polarities and use a common
connection at the non-armature brush lead junction. 
Anyway you always leave a batt connection on the
armature cable and just switch between the two field
cables for direction (neat idea, crappy motor though,
lol)  Anyway this is the only thng that came to mind. 
 didn't read that you had tred all combo's just
swappng out 1 pair.  If you connected the two field
leads together you'd get the spark you got.

I'd suggest putting an ohmmeter to it and see where
you get continuity, that'll tell us something anyway
as to what and how it might need to be hooked up.
Hope this helps
Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric



      
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I'm sure this has been tried but what was the outcome.

since the quarter mile is about power and not range, it should be possible to make a capacitor based EV with hideous power. has this been done and what kind of times does it give?

is this something for you to try Wayland? : )

Dan

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When reading the archives and other info on the web I find
it several times mentioned that the Zilla controller can
lower my battery amps. (e.g. here http://www.mail-archive.com/ev@listproc.sjsu.edu/msg07672.html)

I am running a curtis 1221 right now. I wonder if another controller
can do significantly better in reducing battery amps than the Curtis
if I have no problem with the power limitations of the Curtis.
I.e. does the Zilla work differently than the Curtis. It is my understanding that the Curtis is a similar type of controller and
also reduces battery amps. Hence buying a Zilla would not give me
an advantage unless I would step to a higher voltage pack.

Am I right?

Markus

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--- Begin Message ---
It's been hashed out several times here on the list.  It has been done
but it's not a faster system than battery powered draggers.  The issue
lies with the discharge curve of a capacitor bank which leaves you
wanting for power at the end of the track.

Great launch, wimpy finish.  Have a look in the archives for more info.

See guys?  I pay attention.  } ; ]

Trot, the attentive, fox...

--
|  /\_/\       TrotFox         \ Always remember,
| ( o o ) AKA Landon Solomon \ "There is a
|  >\_/<       [EMAIL PROTECTED]       \ third alternative."

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I don't know how the Curtis works, but the Zilla increases the motor amps 
and motor voltages, while the battery amps is reduce.  I never paid 
attention to this very much any long, because I been driving my EV now for 
34 years, and it now becomes very ho-hum to me any more.

So with all this talk of hill climbing, only staying in 2nd gear or starting 
in 2nd gear, voltage sag and weight, so today I started to look at the motor 
ampere, motor voltage, battery ampere, battery voltage and motor rpm which 
drives a 11.5 inch GE with 180 volt 260 AH battery pack that is going for 6 
years now.

I always start out in 1st gear and accelerated normally up to speed drawing 
200 motor amperes at 50 motor volts, while the battery is at about 50 amps 
at 188 volts to 25 mph at 5000 rpm.

To see if I can draw 300 battery amp, I shift into 2nd gear and press the 
accelerator to the floor, the motor amps only went to 600 amps reaching 45 
mph and then it started to drop.  The battery ampere peak at 175 amps and 
only sag to about 175 volts at 5000 rpm.

Shifting into 3rd gear at 5000 rpm, the rpm drop to about 2700 rpm the motor 
amps drop to 230 amps while the battery amp drops to 120 amps. Accelerating 
up to 60 mph, the motor ampere increase to 270 amps while the battery amps 
is at 260 amps.

My 3rd gear overall ratio is larger than a lot of the EV'ers on this list. 
What you need is the gear ratios to keep the battery ampere lower at speed 
or climbing a hill.

The only thing is that you have to what your motor ampere very closely using 
a Zilla.  I have a large motor amp meter next to my tach, which I think is 
the two most important instruments to have.

Roland.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Markus Lorch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 6:23 PM
Subject: Boost type controller - curtis vs. zilla?


> When reading the archives and other info on the web I find
> it several times mentioned that the Zilla controller can
> lower my battery amps. (e.g. here
> http://www.mail-archive.com/ev@listproc.sjsu.edu/msg07672.html)
>
> I am running a curtis 1221 right now. I wonder if another controller
> can do significantly better in reducing battery amps than the Curtis
> if I have no problem with the power limitations of the Curtis.
> I.e. does the Zilla work differently than the Curtis. It is my
> understanding that the Curtis is a similar type of controller and
> also reduces battery amps. Hence buying a Zilla would not give me
> an advantage unless I would step to a higher voltage pack.
>
> Am I right?
>
> Markus
>
> 

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Lee,
No - it is not just you, there are many others who find the
connection with nature and conservation of energy more important
than the satisfaction of their comfort alone.

Personally, I think it is also a matter of expectation and
feeling in control: "see how the sun is scorching hot outside
and still we have the technology and luxury to offer you a
guaranteed-non-sweat hotel suite already cooled to 60 deg F
when you check in." 
Ouch! I become instantly sick when experiencing that 50 deg
temp difference, so the first thing I do when entering a
hotel room is to switch the Airco off.

Same with my car - even though it is not too comfortable to
drive around in 110 deg F, the number of times that such temps
are present caused me to not even bother to get the Airco
refilled after I fixed it on my Prius, in fact I have never
owned a car with a working Airco.

I do like to ride my bicycle and my wife likes to walk for
about an hour every day, both activities bring us in direct
contact with nature, replace a (costly, indoor) gym subscription
and allow us to feel more healty while avoiding the bill
associated with Airco.
We do have 4 electric fans at strategic locations in the house
and in the car I open the window to let the wind in...

Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]    Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water     IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225    VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675    eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Second Life: www.secondlife.com/?u=3b42cb3f4ae249319edb487991c30acb

Lee Hart wrote:
From: Brian Pikkula
> I don't mean to be argumentative about A/C issue. Spend a summer in 
> Houston without A/C in your car: you end up not wanting to leave the 
> house.

I know; I've lived in similar climates!

But, I also know that if I live in an air-conditioned house, and work at an
air-conditioned job, and shop in air-conditioned stores, and drive to/from
them in an air-conditiond car, I am living in a isolated man-made
environment completely out of touch with nature. My body never acclimates to
the real climate, and I am trapped indoors.

I found that if I can raise the thermostat, go outside more often, and adapt
myself to the climate, I actually feel better and get more done. But that's
just me.

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--- John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Hello to All,
> 
> Before getting into my post here, I want to publicly
> thank my friend Jim 
> Husted for his heroic effort in rebuilding &
> improving the Siamese 8 
> these past weeks! 

Hey John

Well you're very welcome 8^)  FWIW you swing the door
back this way EVery chance you get supplying me all
those NEDRA raffle motor cores not to menton fighting
to get my name in car and driver so I guess that's got
to count for something 8^)

I will say you'd better make it last at least a few
races though 8^P

> I 
> had the motor in the back of my work service truck
> yesterday in all its 
> purple glory, and the 'wows' it got from all those
> who had the pleasure 
> of seeing it, told it all. Thank you, Jim!

That's always the fun part, but as you and I both know
that motor s still sitting in the back of your service
truck not to mention it's second trip over the
mountain today!  Now we may be friends but I'm getting
pretty damn tired of working my fingers to the bones
rushing to get you your motors and they either sit in
your garage for two years or in the back of your truck
for days on end!  Hell you even have a forklift to
unload it with, so you got NO excuses, for shame!
LMAO!  Anyway just an observation.

> Marko Mongillo's fun little Baby Blue Datsun
> minitruck has an ADC 9 inch 
> with a dash mounted pull-type cable that he uses to
> advance his motor 
> timing. Jim Husted built the timing system in that
> motor, and it works 
> wonderfully.

You know I need to stop in and see Marko and give the
motor another look see, make sure he ain't cranked the
advancement back up 8^o  Do you know if he EVer got hs
Emeter working?  I'd like to get some data on what the
current is doing when he cranks it way over.
 
> If
> anyone could come up 
> with a mechanical system to accomplish this, it's
> Father Time. Anyone 
> who's seen what mechanical marvels this guy can make
> with his hands, 
> knows what I'm talking about!

I'd like to get FT back down to the shop, had fun last
time.  I like that FT's got a "little hack" in him
where it's kinda like "hey, this is what we got to
work with let's make it work" kinda skills.  I'd like
to see him get his Bug racer fnished, but then I'd
have to build up that other 13" monster.  Hey, let's
just paint yours FT's color since it would get used
that way! 8^o  Hell you haven't EVen built Purple
Phase yet, and it's a damn antique already, LMAO!!!   
 
> On the other hand, we've had pretty good success
> with the Siamese 8 
> without any sort of adjustable advance system.
> Consistent low 12's 
> bordering on the 11s aint all that bad. 

You know John, it's sure funner than the forklift
motors and what's funny, it's lasted longer than many
a lift motor built around that same time frame! 
Pretty sck actually!


> I
> decided to have Jim 
> to mods to give another 5 degrees of advance. This
> is a pretty big jump 
> in timing that will definitely have a noticeable
> effect. It 'should' 
> chase away the fireball monster while at the same
> time, give a 
> considerable hp boost at the higher rpms we run at
> the far end of the 
> track. 

I'm feeling really good about the advancement
actually.  Knowing more from Marko's motor or EVen Jay
Donnaways Gamera9 motor would help us to plot what
this will do better, but hey you go with what you got
8^)

It may take away some from the car's
> outrageous launch...maybe 
> not, but we'll soon find out as we are heading back
> to PIR next Friday, 
> June 29th, weather permitting. We had planned on
> going tomorrow but the 
> weather forecast changed from what was predicted to
> be mid 70's and 
> sunshine, to colder and wet. Calls were made and
> travel arrangements 
> changed for the Wall Street Journal guy as we now
> look to next weekend 
> to try for the 11s again.

As always I'll be mother henning myself sick for you,
Okay fine, for my motor 8^P

> 
> I've been pretty focused the past couple of years in
> the way I've run 
> our racing strategy. I don't make multiple changes,
> and instead, try to 
> do one change at a time. 

I'm doing the same thing on motors.  Make to many
changes and you lose data.  I still remember Rich
Rudmans telling me "You don't all out attack a record
you sneak up on it"  Anyway just something that stuck
and which I plot my course on.

I've got to keep in mind that the BIG EVent,
> the Wayland 
> Invitational III, is  less than a month away, and we
> need to keep the 
> car running and in good shape for that.

Yeah you better!

> 
> The July races will be very exciting. Will Bill and
> his devoted team 
> become the first EVers to run in the 7s in the 1/4
> mile? Will White 
> Zombie lightened from 2580 lbs. down to under 1900
> lbs., fitted with 
> taller 3:70 gears, wheelie bars, and an A123 lithium
> pack outputting 
> 1400+ amps, run low 11s - high 10s?

Ohh God the ulcers 8^o
 
> 
> Tonight, after I return from yet another 320 mile
> round trip to Central 
> Oregon and back (7 trips in less than 4 weeks now),
> Tim Brehm and I will 
> meet up at my house at 6:00 pm or so to re-install
> the Siamese 8 in 
> White Zombie. 

Guess that didn't happen huh?  Cart my motor across
the freaking state, twice! 8^p

Then, after a quick spin around the
> neighborhood and a 
> recharge to make sure all is well again, the car
> gets loaded up on the 
> trailer behind Tim's diesel Dodge. Tomorrow, Friday,
> I get to have a fun 
> 85+ mpg run to Seattle in my Honda Insight with its
> hi pro sound system 
> while Tim will leave later in the early evening to
> bring the car up. 
> We've meet up with the SEVA gang early Saturday
> morning to be part of 
> the 2007 'Gasless on Greenwood' car show where
> 15,000 car fans will clog 
> Greenwood Avenue to see a huge array of hotrods and
> of course, electric 
> cars!

John shot me an invite to shoot up there this weekend
but I have no babysitter options and have to pass on
the fun 8^(  Besides I'm behind and really should work
anyway, Freaking motor guys never get to play any
reigndeer games! 8^(  You know, now that I think about
it, I bet that wasn't EVen Otmar that came over that
weekend but just some guy in a lizard suit needing a
ride, 8^o  LMAO! 

As always, best of luck John!  Go break something,
just not the motor okay?  PLease!

Had fun

Jim Husted
Hi-Torque Electric


      
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The zilla and curtis essentially do the same thing. Power out always
equal power in (minus some heat losses). So if the motor is drawing
100A with 50V across it, power out equals 100*50 = 5kW. Lets say your
battery voltage is 100V the battery current will therefore be 5kW/100V
= 50A

The advantage the zilla gives you is that you can program it to limit
battery current at a specific value. When the curtis goes to full
throttle the battery current can be the same as the motor current.



On 6/21/07, Markus Lorch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
When reading the archives and other info on the web I find
it several times mentioned that the Zilla controller can
lower my battery amps. (e.g. here
http://www.mail-archive.com/ev@listproc.sjsu.edu/msg07672.html)

I am running a curtis 1221 right now. I wonder if another controller
can do significantly better in reducing battery amps than the Curtis
if I have no problem with the power limitations of the Curtis.
I.e. does the Zilla work differently than the Curtis. It is my
understanding that the Curtis is a similar type of controller and
also reduces battery amps. Hence buying a Zilla would not give me
an advantage unless I would step to a higher voltage pack.

Am I right?

Markus




--
www.electric-lemon.com

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--- Begin Message ---
Hello EVerybody, I have a question someone might be able to answer, 
can you use a ele. transmission computer from a chevy or ford to make 
a EV controller?. Could & would it work?  thanks Jack

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Dense foam roller, thinned out Rustoleum, lots of coats.  It worked for
me where I filled some holes in my white Karmann Ghia.

Rich










On Thu, 2007-06-21 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Pikkula wrote:
> Since the majority of our EVs are > 10 years old, the paint on them
> isn't like it used to be.  However, I have a hard time justifying
> spending $2k for something that will not propel my EV.
> 
> I have some time on my hands while saving up for my next big purchase
> ( a 9" ADC), so I am considering painting the car myself using a
> roller.  The kicker is that it costs < $100 to do it (not including
> the random orbit polisher).  I'll also be able to bondo the dents,
> too.  There are several sites that explain this and show their
> results.  Has anyone tried this before?  Results?
> 
> http://rollyourcar.com/default.aspx
> 
> http://carpainting.wetpaint.com/page/Rollering+Interlux+Brightside+Polyurethane+Paint?t=anon
> 
> The original thread that introduced the roll on method to the masses:
> (30+ pages)
> http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=2331682&page=0&fpart=1&vc=1%3Cbr%20/%3E
> 
> Thanks,
> Brian
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/960
> 
> 

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