No Peri they are missing something and you are completely correct IMO

Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 23, 2016, at 10:27 AM, Peri Hartman via EV <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> I'll throw in a wet towel. It is very exciting to see support for more 
> charging stations and, in general, I support that. But I think this will be 
> the wrong technology.
> 
> 200+ mile EVs are coming and with that the next wave of (semi) early 
> adopters. The build out needs to support them. I strongly believe those 
> people will expect to use their EVs for long road trips and be able to charge 
> when it's convenient for them, and not necessarily at home. Many will not 
> have a place to charge at home.
> 
> In order to support these people, we need ESVEs which can deliver something 
> at 100kw or better. Only Tesla is doing this today. As best as I can tell, 
> the proposal is to install a mix of facilities with 253 "fast charge 
> stations" with power output similiar to what's available today: around 
> 40-50kw. While the chademo spec allows much higher power, this doc indicates 
> the status quo (page 5):
> 
> http://www.energy.ca.gov/renewables/tracking_progress/documents/electric_vehicle.pdf
> 
> For level 2 stations, why should the utility be installing them? Such 
> facilities would most likely be located at businesses and other 
> public-accessible places where people are willing to spend an hour or more 
> waiting for a charge. Wouldn't it be better to provide a government based 
> incentive for the businesses to install them?
> 
> Maybe I'm completely missing something. Speak up :)
> 
> Peri
> 
> ------ Original Message ------
> From: "brucedp5 via EV" <[email protected]>
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: 23-Aug-16 1:43:01 AM
> Subject: [EVDL] turn sez utility PG&E's EV charging station plan would co$t 
> all ratepayers
> 
>> 
>> 
>> % What turn sez below may sound good for the consumer, but IMO one needs to
>> take turn.org with (a ton of) salt, because not only was turn against the
>> CARB mandate and EVs in general back in the 1990's-on, their staff does not
>> speak with one voice, nor is it stated where turn gets its funding. Clearly
>> they are speaking for who is funding them (today). %
>> 
>> 'Utilities can afford to dream big on their customers’ dime'
>> 
>> http://www.sacbee.com/opinion/op-ed/soapbox/article96490842.html
>> PG&E’s EV charging station plan would cost all ratepayers
>> AUGUST 18, 2016  [Elise Torres is an energy attorney at The Utility Reform
>> Network (TURN). etorres @turn.org. Eric Borden is an energy analyst at TURN,
>> a nonprofit that represents California consumers. eborden @turn.org]
>> 
>> In California, cars are as ubiquitous as sunshine. That’s one reason more
>> than one-third of the emissions in our state’s air come from the
>> transportation sector. So there’s no doubt we need to get gas-guzzling cars
>> off the road.
>> 
>> One attractive solution is the electric vehicle. Powered by an electric
>> battery that has to be charged periodically, these vehicles represent a
>> potential shift toward a cleaner, greener energy future.
>> 
>> However, PG&E’s plan to take advantage of the interest in EVs and expand its
>> business to include EV charging stations isn’t about a cleaner, greener
>> future. It’s about using customers’ money to muscle its way into the new
>> market from its advantageous position as a monopoly with a guaranteed income
>> and profit stream: us.
>> 
>> PG&E proposes a whopping 7,600 charging stations for electric vehicles,
>> without any data or analysis to support that there is a need for them.
>> Customers, whether they own an EV or not, would pay the $160 million-plus in
>> estimated project costs.
>> 
>> Utilities can afford to dream big on their customers’ dime. But after
>> winning limits on overly expensive charging experiments in Southern
>> California, The Utility Reform Network knows PG&E can limit the risk to
>> customers by starting smaller. That will give PG&E and regulators a chance
>> to see if PG&E can be more successful in this new venture than in some
>> previous ones.
>> 
>> Not only should PG&E’s program be smaller, it should plan for the future.
>> For example, declining battery prices and improved technology will lead to
>> increased EV range (miles per full battery charge) in coming years. This
>> makes it even more likely that consumers will primarily charge their
>> vehicles at home, not in the mostly public and workplace locations P&GE is
>> proposing. There is already a robust private market for workplace and public
>> charging, one that is seriously threatened by PG&E’s proposal.
>> 
>> In addition, PG&E’s proposal does nothing to address the massive barriers to
>> EV adoption outside of the availability of charging stations. Access to
>> public charging infrastructure is not a magic wand that will solve other
>> barriers to consumer adoption of electric vehicles, which include the high
>> purchase price of EVs and the impact of low gas prices.
>> 
>> PG&E’s stated commitment to provide charging stations to low-income
>> communities sounds good in theory. But when TURN investigated that claim, we
>> found the locations PG&E has targeted as “disadvantaged” include the Google
>> and LinkedIn campuses, Twitter’s headquarters and the Transamerica Building
>> – wealthy workplaces that do not need ratepayer subsidy to install charging
>> stations.
>> 
>> TURN instead urges that infrastructure be targeted to apartment buildings in
>> low-income communities, and consumers that qualify for the CARE program (for
>> low-income households in California) should receive an upfront rebate from
>> existing low-carbon credit funds if they purchase or lease an EV.
>> 
>> California is truly a world leader when it comes to transforming its energy
>> sector and achieving ambitious greenhouse gas reductions. But our progress
>> will be impeded, at a cost to the environment and utility ratepayers, if
>> wasteful and bloated utility programs are approved in lieu of smart,
>> cost-effective solutions.
>> 
>> Regulators should not let the attraction of EVs blind them to the wasteful
>> and self-serving nature of PG&E’s proposal. Proposals claiming to “save” the
>> environment should actually help decrease state emissions, not just add to
>> utility bottom lines.
>> [© sacbee.com]
>> ...
>> http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/take+with+a+grain+of+salt
>> Grain of salt
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grain_of_salt
>> ...
>> http://www.turn.org/tag/electric-vehicles/
>> The Utility Reform Network
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TURN_(The_Utility_Reform_Network)
>> http://charityreports.bbb.org//oakland/human-services/utility-reform-network-in-43558
>> http://consumerfdn.org/about-us/grantees/the-utility-reform-network-turn/
>> ...
>> https://www.sdge.com/sites/default/files/documents/461232896/VGI%20FD.PDF?nid=17366
>> 'arguments of TURN against SDG&E EVSE program'
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> For EVLN EV-newswire posts use:
>> http://evdl.org/evln/
>> 
>> 
>> {brucedp.0catch.com}
>> 
>> --
>> View this message in context: 
>> http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/turn-sez-utility-PG-E-s-EV-charging-station-plan-would-co-t-all-ratepayers-tp4683435.html
>> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at 
>> Nabble.com.
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> 
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