Hi George,

I see your point. Brandon Carter expressed recently the same idea, it seams, when noting that Quantum Mechanics suggests to him that "objective reality is NOT a realistic objective". Perhaps, but that hardly implies that "subjective reality" is any more realistic as an scientific objective, I am afraid! If the "I" maps the world than it is also likely to map the quantum quandary, don't you think? Subjectivity and mentality are surely much bigger scientific problems
than all of the paradoxes of QM and GR can even hope to compare!

I also have some trouble with the idea that we "share an I", as you put it, as I don't know to what extent I do share mine with anyone! My notion is, instead, that the "I" is exactly what we DO NOT SHARE, what makes us different, while Reality is all the rest: what we DO share in a very obvious sense. Otherwise, why would we disagree? Do we slice
the Plenitude in parallel?

I also do not join you and Bruno in that eagerness for a "self-centered science" as the solution to everything. Maybe it is an unfair comparison but isn't that, the demand for a science that caters to ones believes and feelings, what the Kansas Board of "Education" is about to enshrine in its classrooms with the whole notion of parity between Evolution and "Intelligent Design"? Don't tax payers have the right to science that caters to their beliefs and biases, a school that, instead of teaching their children, reinforces their conviction that they already know what's true?

Please tell me I am wrong.

Only half joking,

Godfrey Kurtz
(New Brunswick, NJ)

-----Original Message-----
From: George Levy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Hi Bruno and Lee,
I would invert Dennett's point to increase its emphasis: "we need to develop some first person discourses on the third person discourse." In other words, I believe that the foundation is first person, and that third person is a consequence of anthropically determined constraints that we must share. I have been quiet recently in part because of the sheer volume of this list. As you know Bruno I am an extreme believer in first person. I have acquired this position mainly by looking at two seemingly opposite trends in science. Scientific theories have become less and less anthropocentric removing the earth and man as the center of the universe. (Copernicus, Galileo, Newton, Michelson-Morley). The Earth does not occupy a priviledged position. There is no Ether. There is no absolute. Paradoxically, the observer has acquired greater importance through the work (Relativity Theory, Quantum Theory with the MWI, Shannon's communication theory). Relativity of the observer seems to be pervasive, not just with regards "Relativity Theory" but also with regards Quantum Theroy. It is not a coincidence that Everett called his paper "Relative State Formulation of Quantum Mechanics." Everything is relative to the observer. So why not go all the way.... and take the first person as the base. This approach tackles the Mind-Body problem up-front rather than after the fact. "I" becomes fundamental: the starting assumption as well as an observable fact. "I" exists in the Plenitude and is constrained to see a slice of the Plenitude - the world it sees - by Anthropic constraints. Thus "I" and the world it sees share the same structure and logic whatever that logic may be. There are probably more than one I's/worlds/logics that satisfy this requirement. Bruno, you are the expert in logic. Subjective reality is fundamental. Objective reality arises because we share the same "I" and therefore the same world (slice view of the plenitude).


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