On 6/3/2025 11:40 PM, Alan Grayson wrote:
On Wednesday, June 4, 2025 at 12:17:40 AM UTC-6 Brent Meeker wrote:
On 6/3/2025 11:00 PM, Alan Grayson wrote:
On Tuesday, June 3, 2025 at 11:33:26 PM UTC-6 Brent Meeker wrote:
On 6/3/2025 10:05 PM, Alan Grayson wrote:
On Tuesday, June 3, 2025 at 10:46:58 PM UTC-6 Brent Meeker
wrote:
On 6/3/2025 8:53 PM, Alan Grayson wrote:
On Tuesday, June 3, 2025 at 9:42:30 PM UTC-6 Brent
Meeker wrote:
On 6/3/2025 3:25 PM, Alan Grayson wrote:
*OK, let's split hairs. If "assumed" means zero
evidence for a muon's clock, then "inferred" is
better IF you believe a muon has some structure
for defining a clock. OTOH, if a muon has no such
structure, then it's OK to "assume" the existence
of the clock. *
*IF* you *assume* a clock requires some internal
structure.
*But instead of splitting hairs, how about a
description of the structure of a muon's clock? *
So you want to /*assume*/ that the muon can't keep
time just by moving thru spacetime, but requires
some structure. Do you have a proof or is this
mere surmise?
*It's a surmise, not a mere surmise, based on clocks I
am familiar with. You're the relativity expert. You
teach the masses. What's your concept of time keeping
by a muon? AG*
*And if that clock shows no time dilation within
the muon's frame of reference, how would that FACT
effect its half-life? AG*
I guess that would show that it wasn't /*the*/
clock that determines the muon's decay.
*So what clock does it, if any? AG
*
*I don't know. But it must that something to do with
the mass of the muon, the electron, and neutrino and the
coupling of the neutrino, muon, and electron fields
since a muon decays into and electron and a anti-neutrino.
Brent*
*I don't see how those factors would effect the muon's
half-life. I appreciate your honesty. I suspect the issue I
have raised is unsolved, and this is what troubles me about
Relativity. AG*
*Why are you troubled by lack of a model. Inertia is a farm
more common phenomenon, but you're untroubled by it. Why...I
suspect because you have lots of experience of inertia. Well
scientists, particularly particle physicists have lots of
experience of relativistic time dilation.
Brent*
*
*
*Why should I be troubled by inertia? It's easily understood. *
Then perhaps you can explain why a muon has about 200x the inertia
of an electron? And why inertia and gravity are always proportional?
Brent
*It's caused by its larger mass, about 200x, compared to the electron. *
That's just saying the same thing in different words. In the context of
decay you're demanding a mechanism. What's the mechanism for resisting
acceleration? Saying it's "mass" is just giving it a name.
*The statement of Inertia, what it is, is easy to grasp. However, many
experimental findings of physics are not physically grounded, that is,
understood, so why do you expect me to answer your questions? In
physics, there's too much bluster about what is known, and too little
is grounded in physical reality. AG*
*You're the one who's blustering about what's known. I'm pointing out
that "known" can mean different things. Physic students soon realize
that "known" means we know how to predict its behavior. Sometimes this
is based on the "known" behavior of subsystems. But this kind of
reductionism has to stop at some level where we just know how to predict
behavior but not based on some deeper or more general level.
Engineering is even more this way. What is known about materials is
often just tables of empirical data. If I want to know the yield
strength of 17-40 steel I look it up in a table based on testing many
samples. I know it's made of atoms of iron and carbon and nickel and
chromium, but it would be foolish to try to calculate the yield strength
from that. So what do you think we "know" about the strength of steel?
Is it unknown? Am I sweeping an issue under the rug?
Brent*
**
*But the change in half-life of muons is hardly understood, and I
am not going off on some wrong track here. You think it's OK to
shut up and calculate, and sweep the real issue under the
proverbial rug. AG*
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"Everything List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email
to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion visit
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/a6dec69b-ae79-42bc-a264-b6edd3d6a800%40gmail.com.
