Russell  wrote:

*One of the reasons for studying AL is to get a better handle on what
we mean by "life". Obviously it has something to do with information
processing, emergent phenomena, complex systems and evolution, so all
these topics come under scrutiny.

I don't think it is as quite a hopeless question as what is
consciousness (or even what is pornography!), but it is still a
difficult beast, and one that will take a few generations more of
scientists before there can be some agreement.*
*
*
I tried to cut out the *sequence*: "first make it artificial THEN get a
handle of what it is". The 'artificial' thought product may not represent
the unknown original.

Then again *'information'* needs better "information" about its meaning and
in my vocabulary 'emergent' means something apparent without our knwoledge
HOW it came about. Once we learned the circumstances of occurrence it is no
'emergent'  anymore: it is a product.

*Evolution* is misunderstood in my agnostic view: if it DOES aim at some
state it is teleological and leads to a God Almighty, the 'know-all
creator' letting the system play astray-mutations to get there. *Complex
'systems'* is an oxymoron, if it is 'complex' it is not a 'system' (=fixed
inventory and processing) - it may be an open, unlimited
organization/network.
I agree with your 'scrutiny' for all the topics. Hence my question.

*Conciousness* is different: I found quite different aspects (contents?) to
handle the term according to the 'scientist' using it. I boiled it down to
SOME process, (1992) and identify it as 'response to relations' in the most
general sense <everything list>..
(Pornography is different: it is a purely(?) human artifact.)
Finally: I would not leave such questions in the hands of (conventional?)
scientists, they are bound to yesterday's knowledge base.

Thanks for reflecting

John M














(










On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 8:19 PM, Russell Standish <li...@hpcoders.com.au>wrote:

> On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 05:42:45PM -0400, John Mikes wrote:
> > Dear Russell,
> > based on my 2-decade long reading of your posts I have a question, if you
> > don't mind:
> > I guess you are still interested in AL, so "L" is includable.
> > What is " L I F E " in your view?
>
> One of the reasons for studying AL is to get a better handle on what
> we mean by "life". Obviously it has something to do with information
> processing, emergent phenomena, complex systems and evolution, so all
> these topics come under scrutiny.
>
> I don't think it is as quite a hopeless question as what is
> consciousness (or even what is pornography!), but it is still a
> difficult beast, and one that will take a few generations more of
> scientists before there can be some agreement.
>
> > you said: biocomplexity,
>
>
> This doesn't sound like me... :( Context?
>
> what raises the
> > question in my mind: wat is that "bio" we know so little about, but speak
> > so much about? I am all for complexity -  the infinite one beyond our
> > 'model' we live in and by, of which we have but precious little
> information
> > beyond that model.
> > So do you have a restriction of complexities we should call life?
> > (Then we may try to identify how to reproduce such artificially. Maybe a
> > lot more difficult than identifying AI without a clear definition of
> "I").
> >
> > John Mikes
> >
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> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Prof Russell Standish                  Phone 0425 253119 (mobile)
> Principal, High Performance Coders
> Visiting Professor of Mathematics      hpco...@hpcoders.com.au
> University of New South Wales          http://www.hpcoders.com.au
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