On 12/11/2013 4:14 PM, LizR wrote:
On 12 December 2013 11:49, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net <mailto:meeke...@verizon.net>> wrote:


    On 12/11/2013 1:32 PM, Alberto G. Corona wrote:

        Whit episodic periods of massacres, genocides and other massive
        crimes, he would have added. I recommend you to add this to your
        mantra.


    Yes, religious wars and genocides based on theology.  That's why Dacey 
referred to
    "post-Christian" europe.


I think it's fair to describe both Nazism and Stalinism as forms of theology (with my usual apologies to Godwin's law). Or at least as secular ideologies which hooked into much of the usual underpinning of religions (leader worship and a coming golden age, for example).

They were theologies in Bruno's sense of addressing the fundamental questions about how to live and how to order society. The Wermacht belt buckles had "Gott Mit Uns" embossed on them and Hitler wrapped his policies in Christianity:

"The party as such represents the point of view of a positive
Christianity without binding itself to any one particular
confession."
         ---- Adolf Hitler, in the Nazi manifesto:

łWe were convinced that the people need and require this faith. We have therefore undertaken the fight against the atheistic movement, and that not merely with a few theoretical declarations: we have stamped it out.˛
    ---Adolf Hitler, in a speech in Berlin on 24 Oct. 1933

"We tolerate no one in our ranks who attacks the ideas of Christianity, in fact our movement is Christian." ---Adolf Hitler, in a speech in Passau, 27 October 1928, Bundesarchiv Berlin-Zehlendorf, [cited from Richard Steigmann-Galląs The Holy Reich]

"Christ was the greatest early fighter in the battle against the
world enemy -- the Jews. The work that Christ started but did not
finish, I, Adolf Hitler, will conclude."
   --- "The Book of Political Quotes," London: Angus & Robertson
Publishers, 1982, p. 195)

The Pope recognized Adolf's birthday every year and prayed for him. He was never excommunicated, but Goebbels was - for marrying a jew.

Stalin seems less mystic and ideological. He studied in a seminary but I don't know whether he ever took either Christianity or Marxism as more than tools of power.

Brent
"What shall we do with...the Jews?...set fire to their
synagogues or schools and bury and cover with dirt whatever
will not burn, so that no man will ever again see a stone or
cinder of them."
        ---Martin Luther

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