Dear Evgenii,
On 26 Apr 2015, at 22:01, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote:
Dear Brent,
I would agree that it is unclear what conscious agents introduced in
the paper have to do with human consciousness.
For me it was interesting to see that the cognitive science is close
to Kantian revolution (space and time are created by the mind) and
that Berkeley's "to be is to be perceived" (esse est percipi) is
still actual.
I can appreciate this conclusion, although if that is true, that does
not yet make mind into the fundamental thing, as it can emerge from a
neutral ontology, like arithmetic.
The next natural step for the cognitive science would be radical
constructivism.
That would be like focusing on the first person, or the third
hypostases. But theology, and theoretical computer science, and
general mathematics, contains necessarily non-constructive
propositions, and radical constructivism would eliminate them. Radical
constructivism put the others, and the unknown, under the rug, I would
say.
Bruno
Evgenii
Am 26.04.2015 um 21:35 schrieb meekerdb:
I think the authors are more interested in being provocative than in
being clear. For example:
/The interface theory entails that these first two steps were mere
warm up. The next step in the intellectual history of H. sapiens is a
big one. We must recognize that all of our perceptions of space, time
and objects no more reflect reality than does our perception of a
flat earth. It's not just this or that aspect of our perceptions that
must be corrected, it is the entire framework of a space-time
containing objects, the fundamental organization of our perceptual
systems, that must be recognized as a mere species-specific mode of
perception rather than an insight into objective reality./ / //By
this time it should be clear that, if the arguments given here are
sound, then the current Bayesian models of object perception need
more than tinkering around the edges, they need fundamental
transformation. And this transformation will necessarily have
ramifications for scientific questions well-beyond the confines of
computational models of object perception./
There's no justification for the "mere". Our perception has gone
well beyond what biology provided. Nor is there any reason to
suppose that the transformation they propose will be THE OBJECTIVE
TRUTH either. / //Similarly, most of my mental processes are not
directly conscious to me, but that does not entail that they are
unconscious./
This just seems to make of muddle of what is meant by "conscious".
Anyway, I'll finish reading it. I think an explanation of
consciousness based on evolution is one useful approach.
Brent
On 4/26/2015 1:22 AM, Evgenii Rudnyi wrote:
Enjoy. Evgenii
Donald David Hoffman, Chetan Prakash, Objects of consciousness,
Frontiers in Psychology, v. 5, N 00577, 2014.
http://journal.frontiersin.org/article/10.3389/fpsyg.2014.00577/full
“We develop the dynamics of interacting conscious agents, and study
how the perception of objects and space-time can emerge from such
dynamics. We show that one particular object, the quantum free
particle, has a wave function that is identical in form to the
harmonic functions that characterize the asymptotic dynamics of
conscious agents; particles are vibrations not of strings but of
interacting conscious agents. This allows us to reinterpret
physical properties such as position, momentum, and energy as
properties of interacting conscious agents, rather than as
preexisting physical truths.”
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