On Friday, March 2, 2018 at 6:16:56 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: > > > > On 3/2/2018 2:36 PM, Dirk Van Niekerk wrote: > > It looks as if individual neurons keep firing and small local (< 4mm) > neural networks remain intact during general anesthesia (at least due to > propofol). However, large scale network integration is lost. So I don't > think general anesthesia is very similar to death at the neural level at > all.- http://www.pnas.org/content/109/49/E3377?etoc= > > *It does show that time must be a trivial property of the universe if shutting down consciousness (presumably a small percentage of neurons needed to create it), totally wipes out the passage of time upon awakening. AG *
> > On a different note. I have read some of the discussion and literature > about computation and consciousness on various fora. There is a school of > thought that matter does not actually exist and that everything can be > explained by the existence of natural numbers and computations related to > operators acting on these. > > > Yes, that's Bruno Marchal's theory that he holds forth on in the > Everything list, everyth...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. It's an > interesting idea and I post there as does Lawrence, but it requires > reifying all computation in the abstract "Turing machine" sense. And it > "predicts" things like indeterminancy and maybe linear superposition, but I > can't see that it predicts anything surprising. > > Brent > > Direct correlates between measurable brain function and reported > subjective consciousness seems difficult to reconcile with this strictly > computational interpretation. Also, the computational approach seems to > suffer from the same problems as many "theories of everything" including > religious ones in that they explain everything but cannot make any > predictions because that cannot predict which events will NOT happen. > > Dirk > > On Thursday, March 1, 2018 at 4:50:52 PM UTC-8, meekerdb wrote: >> >> >> >> On 3/1/2018 2:03 PM, spinozalens via Free Thinkers Physics Discussion >> Group wrote: >> >> Anesthetic is as close to death you can get without doing the dying. >> >> >> I don't think so. Under anesthetic there is still plenty of blood flow >> to your brain and no reason for neurons to shut down to conserve >> resources. In fact many neurons continue to fire; but I don't know which >> ones or what their function is. >> >> You get a lot closer to dying if your heart stops for a few minutes, >> which the Annals of Neurology paper says causes all the neurons to shut >> down, but notes that: "...this shouldn’t be used as an end-all marker of >> death. Past research has shown that if blood and oxygen return to the brain >> quickly enough after the spreading wave, the neurons resume activity and >> recover their chemical charge. It takes several minutes for the depolarized >> neurons, sitting in this chemical cocktail, to reach a “commitment point” >> beyond which they cannot restart their function." >> >> To your question I think it depends what you die of. Feynman on his death >> bed remarked that dying was boring >> >> >> The one time I thought I would die I just felt a kind of curiosity...like >> "So this it?" >> >> Brent >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Free Thinkers Physics Discussion Group" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to atvoid-2+u...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. > To post to this group, send email to atvo...@googlegroups.com > <javascript:>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/atvoid-2/309f3295-be52-41ff-8450-68dbc1b6e542%40googlegroups.com > > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/atvoid-2/309f3295-be52-41ff-8450-68dbc1b6e542%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
