> On 4 Sep 2019, at 15:52, Philip Thrift <cloudver...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > On Wednesday, September 4, 2019 at 2:37:52 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 3 Sep 2019, at 10:55, Philip Thrift <cloud...@gmail.com <>> wrote: >> >> >> ... Michael Forrest's paper [ >> https://www.researchgate.net/publication/294721340_God_is_a_Vacuum_Fluctuation >> >> <https://www.google.com/url?q=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.researchgate.net%2Fpublication%2F294721340_God_is_a_Vacuum_Fluctuation&sa=D&sntz=1&usg=AFQjCNHhm0WpNzkTvUK88_53m8kvdDlVuw> >> ] should have related something more naturally plausible: >> cosmopsychism >> - >> https://aeon.co/essays/cosmopsychism-explains-why-the-universe-is-fine-tuned-for-life >> >> <https://aeon.co/essays/cosmopsychism-explains-why-the-universe-is-fine-tuned-for-life> >> >> At least we know consciousness exists in at least one place >> (inside our skulls, though there are deniers) >> - https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/03/13/the-consciousness-deniers/ >> <https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/03/13/the-consciousness-deniers/> >> >> but no evidence of God has ever been observed. > > It does not make sense to say that my consciousness is located in my skull, > no more than to say that the number 2 is in my fridge, even if exactly two > bottles of fresh water is there. > > Then, how do you define God? I agree that there is no evidence for Santa > Klaus, but I would say that with the original conception of God given by > Plato (which is simply the fundamental truth, with the insight that it is > above us), there are some evidence, ...making it for me the second thing > close to the indubitable. > > Now, I do think that there are no evidences for a primary physical universe. > And there are evidence that it does not exist: mainly that it can be proven > that that it is incompatible with Mechanism, for which we do have evidences, > like the evidence for evolution, molecular biology, or the computability of > all known Lagrangian or Hamiltonian (quantum or not). > > Bruno > > > There is arguably arithmetical/mathematical language hidden in natural > things, but it is certainly in brains (as a human invention).
To explain the brain I need to assume at the least elementary arithmetic, and it happens that when I assume this, I get all universal machine/number, and an explanation of where the belief in brain comes from, and why that belief is phenomenologically correct, but ontologically … only in the head of the universal machines. Then, I claim only that science has not decided between Aristotle (what we see touch observe = reality) and Plato (what we see, touch, observe might be the shadow, or projection, or border, or symptom, … of something else). The Church-Turing thesis rehabilitates Pythagorus, as: - 1) all computations are emulated in arithmetic - 2) a physics is recovered by the internal statistics on those computations. So we can do the comparison. My main point is that we can have both primary-matter and mechanism, and that we can test this, and that quantum mechanics without collapse fits remarkably well with the prediction given by the universal machine/number in arithmetic. No doubt is put on the physical reality, nor on the interest and importance of physics. On the contrary, as physics becomes a theorem in a deeper yet simpler theory, it is made more solid than empirical extrapolation. In soccer term: Plato 1 Aristotle 0. I don’t claim this is the last match, obviously an infinity of work has to be done. We wil never known for sure. That is the price when doing science. We can only evaluate the plausibility. Bruno > > @philipthrift > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > <mailto:everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/31f585f0-4a3c-4ced-a05c-014286827c6e%40googlegroups.com > > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/31f585f0-4a3c-4ced-a05c-014286827c6e%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/0BEA48DA-3CBF-4017-9329-6268CD682D2B%40ulb.ac.be.
