--- In [email protected], "curtisdeltablues" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In [email protected], "authfriend" <jstein@> wrote: > > > > --- In [email protected], "curtisdeltablues" > > <curtisdeltablues@> wrote: > > > > > > --- In [email protected], "authfriend" <jstein@> wrote: > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], boyboy_8 <no_reply@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I too am no expert in the vagueries of mantra meanings. The > > > > > point is that they are phrases...meaningless sounds whose > > > > > meaning is known? > > > > > > > > (Semantically) meaningless sounds whose *effects* > > > > are known. > > > > > > I'm not sure how anyone could know this Judy. > > > > I wasn't making a claim, Curtis, I was correcting > > what appeared to be boyboy's misunderstanding of > > MMY's definition of mantras (see above--he has > > "meaningless sounds whose meaning is known"). > > I figured that Judy. By now I am hip to your getting the > teaching straight first and then deciding how you relate to it > process. I was challenging Maharishi's claim. It just doesn't > seem as if it has any support other than faith. > > > I certainly don't "know" this myself, but then I > > don't have access to whatever materials there are > > about mantras in the Shankaracharya tradition. I > > don't think MMY invented the notion, however. > > It seems as it these claims might come from the Tantric texts > because I can't think of any of the Vedic texts that deal with > this level of precision. I hope one of our Tantric scripture > enthusiasts can help.
I wouldn't be surprised if they were from Tantra. <snip> > > I mean, we can probably > > > rule out a history of trying a bunch of different sounds > > > experimentally and watching some people have bad experiences or > > > have harm come to them right? > > > > On what basis can we rule it out? > > A lack of the knowledge of the scientific method? Well, sure. But lots of anecdotal accounts accumulated over time ain't always chopped liver. That's the basis of folk medicine, after all, and quite a few of its prescriptions have turned out to be effective when they were tested scientifically. And you might want to be *very* careful even testing a substance that folk medicine warns is harmful. On the other hand, you could just take "sounds whose effects are known" as referring to the bija mantras *as a whole*--i.e., they all have good effects. (From some of the insider stuff I've read, apparently MMY didn't get too worried if a teacher reported that s/he'd given someone the "wrong" mantra by mistake.) Who knows, maybe there are meaningless sounds that have even better effects. But somebody has to come up with them before we can try them. The bija mantras are what the Indian culture came up with, and they seemed to work pretty well, so that's what we've got. I'm happy with mine, at any rate.
