> I do not deny you your belief that the sages of old > whom you revere had everything sussed out. It's just > that I prefer to believe that they were ordinary > human beings trying to figure things out, just as > we are. Their scribblings are no more definitive > than our own. Mystery remains intact.
The whole post was excellent but this paragraph really stands out. Being absolutely sure about how the world works is a powerful seductive drug. I am just really glad I got that needle out of my arm. --- In [email protected], TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In [email protected], bob_brigante <no_reply@> wrote: > > > > --- In [email protected], TurquoiseB <no_reply@> wrote: > > > > > > I'm sorry to be so negative here, but I'm still reeling > > > from Bob Brigante blaming the floods on "wrongdoers" in > > > the affected communities. That's as insane as Christians > > > blaming 9/11 on gays and lesbians and liberals, and > > > someone should say so. > > > > ******** > > > > I'm sorry to have tempted you to be so negative here, ... > > LOL. Thanks...I needed that. :-) > > > ...but I should > > point out that I did say that poor planning was responsible for > > much of the damage seen currently in Iowa (although being stupid > > more or less amounts to wrongdoing because every human should > > develop his full mental potential and not be a burden on the > > earth): > > "Should?" > > Isn't that a tad...uh...presumptuous? That you know > fersure what every human being "should" be doing? > > I'm asking because you honestly come across as if > you know fersure. I'm curious as to how you know. > > > from post 180033: > > > > "...for instance, Cedar Rapids had the hubris to put its city hall, > > courthouse and jail on a small island in the center of the river: > > > > http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/13/us/13flood.html > > > > Those who decline to appreciate the holistic nature of the universe > > are certainly entitled to think whatever they want, but it's a very > > limited understanding of the world-as-it-is. > > "Limited?" > > And your understanding is not? > > Again, I'm asking because you seem so *sure*, man. > I'm curious as to how you know this. > > > Nature reacts to man's doing, good or bad, and every sage there > > ever was has said so ... > > Is *this* how you know fersure? Sages said so? > > > ... -- the universe is a machine that sends impulses of > > correction when humans go out of balance (or support when people > > do the right thing), just like good parents do when their kids > > go wrong. > > Dude, do you realize how many "fersures" there were > in this sentence? > > First, fersure that what these sages said was true. > Second, that there is such a thing as "balance" that > is NOT present at every moment. Third, that humans > should not "go out of" this theoretical state of > balance. Fourth, that "Nature" or the universe feels > it has a parental relationship with its "kids" and > reserves the right to whup their asses when the kids > get out of line. > > I don't know about where you live, but where I live > if some guy who called himself "Nature" took it upon > himself to spank his kids with the occasional earth- > quake or flood or pandemic, Child Services would be > all over his ass in a heartbeat. > > > If you want to put your faith in some science guys in lab coats > > who pooh-pooh any such holistic notions, that's fine with me, > > but that is a religion of scientism ... > > As opposed to a religion of sage-ism, right? > > > ...that is much more primitive and illogical > > than you imagine holistic thinking to be. > > I guess I'm suggesting, Bob, that your "holistic > thinking" feels a tad dogmatic and authoritarian to > me. Essentially you seem to be saying 1) that good > and bad exist, 2) that sages in the past knew which > was which, and 3) that Nature is in such agreement > with what these sages wrote that it's prepared to > smite those who don't live the way that the sages > said they "should" with floods. > > > To blame 9/11 only on gays and lesbians and liberals is an > > attempt to scapegoat, and I am certainly not doing that in > > saying that natural disasters are the reaction of Nature to > > wrongdoing. > > We're going to have to agree to disagree about this. > > > When the majority > > of people in society engage in behavior that causes unhappiness, > > nature reacts. You don't buy that, fine, but life will continue to > > operate on that basis regardless of anybody's recognition or not. > > Or not. > > My bet is that life will continue to operate in the > same mysterious way it has operated for eternity, > and that no one -- neither the sages of the past nor > those who follow their holy words in the present -- > has ever or will ever have a definitive clue about > How It All Works, much less Why. > > I do not deny you your belief that the sages of old > whom you revere had everything sussed out. It's just > that I prefer to believe that they were ordinary > human beings trying to figure things out, just as > we are. Their scribblings are no more definitive > than our own. Mystery remains intact. >
