--- In [email protected], "BillyG." <wg...@...> wrote: > > --- In [email protected], Vaj <vajradhatu@> wrote: > > > > > > On May 13, 2009, at 11:43 AM, grate.swan wrote: > > > > >> It's given me choices about how to interact with "creation" or the > > >> mandala of life, it makes life easier and freer from obstructions. > > >> For example, a friend dying of cancer or AIDS, I may decide to do a > > >> retreat to parlay some iota of assistance from a certain devata. In > > >> many cases we'll get groups of yogis to help friends in need of some > > >> sort or another. > > >> > > > > > > Looking at it ecumenically, most religious people would say similar > > > -- "we prayed to Jesus, Allah, etc we asked for healing (particular > > > aspects) of his fullenss to heal our friend." An most would cite > > > personal evidence that "the lord was with us" and brought comfort, > > > healing, etc. > > > > > > What would distinguish devata from those practices and efforts? > > > > > > Is it that the effects of the mantra is known with more precisions > > > and thus more focused results can be obtained? > > > > > > In this particular case I'm speaking of terma, yogic textual/sadhana > > realizations which include certain practices for certain diseases. > > Terma, being "fresh" revelations tend to bear siddhis very quickly > > for one and two they're by their very nature intended for the > > suffering of a specific age, era or time. This is part and parcel of > > the compassionate display of wisdom that comes from such treasure > > bearers (tertons). A good example would be Padma-25, a medical > > formulation, which has been successfully used in shrinking some > > tumors. Also the sadhanas themselves are often very precise. > > > > In general, initiation into a certain devata may include the root > > mantra, and after it's accomplishment, a host of "action mantras" for > > specific functions. Once accomplishment has dawned, one has a host of > > practices for modifying their environment. > > Sounds a lot like what MMY said in his talk on the Vedas: > > "....through Vedic hymns, it is possible for those expert in chanting those > hymns to produce certain effects here, there or there. The universe is vast, > so many worlds and all that. We do something here according to Vedic rites; > particular, specific chanting to produce an effect in some other world, draw > the attention of those higher beings or gods living there." > > "The entire knowledge of the mantras or hymns of the Vedas is devoted to > man's connection, to man's communication with the higher beings in different > strata of creation." MMY The Vedas page three. >
If devata or hymns have a specific, predicable, repeatable effect, then is it religious? Being a name of a god seems a weak link to religion -- though obviously some will differ on that. Some isolated tribesmen may feel penicillin, when introduced to the tribe, is a god. They may say penicillin with great reverence and treat it as a holy god because it has tribe members from what before was sure death. Hail Penicillin, All Glory be thy name ... Does Penicillin become a religion in that context?
