I'm more persuaded by what those closest to him observed, like the skinboys, one of whom I spoke with the other night for a while - besides, anyone that wants to can speak directly to Mother Divine - since we are all part of Divine Energy, all of us can connect - that's no big deal.
________________________________ From: "doctordumb...@rocketmail.com" <doctordumb...@rocketmail.com> To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2013 9:21 AM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: THIS is how spirituality should be done IMO Maharishi spoke directly to Mother Divine. Will that work for you? Some teachers and enlightened individuals make a big deal of it, others not so much. The determination of a person's enlightenment can easily be determined by someone genuinely living that state of consciousness - no need for "signs" and what not. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ravi Chivukula wrote: > > *"But I do question his (Adyashanti's) purported Enlightenment."* > > Let me clarify further in saying that Adyashanti hasn't had a mystical > experience based upon what I saw and read. This is certainly the problem > with most on batgap - their so-called enlightenment seems to be nothing but > projected states of mind based upon the concepts of nothingness if Buddhist > Zen types or Maharishi's descriptions if TM types. The neo-advaitins are > the most horrible ones. > > What I need is some example like Amma who went through actual, demonstrable > mystical experiences though she ultimately deceived herself by trying to > frame it in a medieval goddess possession context of her village and posing > as an infallible divine mother, avatar type figure and creating a > destructive cult. > > Even based upon what you - Barry - have commented on Rama/Lenz - he may > have had mystical experiences yet deceived again. I have seen nothing on > Maharishi. Osho seems to have had mystical experiences though once again > creating a destructive cult. > > Anyway - this is what I look for - an actual altered state of consciousness > because of a mystical experience and then followed by an intellectual > discovery, reconciliation. Not these projected states of mind, calmness > because of life-numbing practices, repression and/or perversion like > Gandhi, Teresa types, the myriad Hindu, Zen Gurus, teachers, avatars - all > kinds of frauds and consters. > > The only authentic ones I have found so far are Ramana Maharishi, > Krishnamurti - they seem to have been devoid of all medieval mumbo-jumbo, > an actual intellectual reconciliation of mystical energies into leading > meaningful, authentic lives. > > People like Maharishi, Ammachi aka Amma - frauds & consters- even if > ultimately people benefited from them - I certainly am an example of > someone benefiting from cult and fraud Gurus. > > On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 12:27 AM, Ravi Chivukula > wrote: > > > No worries Barry - I thought you had forgotten about the video and your > > comments on the video. I remembered it and searched for it so you would > > know and I added my comments as well. Certainly - a good thing to have a > > clean approach regardless of you like him or not - at least he doesn't > > claim to be an infallible Guru, an avatar and/or Divine Mother/Father. But > > I do question his purported Enlightenment. > > > > > > On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 12:10 AM, turquoiseb wrote: > > > >> ** > >> > >> > >> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ravi Chivukula wrote: > >> > > >> > Barry on Adyashanti - > >> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/288636 > >> > - very spot on, serious, joyless. > >> > > >> > He is just a good speaker - nothing less, nothing more. > >> > >> For the record, Ravi, all I was speaking about in my > >> praise of this website was its/his "way of doing busi- > >> ness." That struck me at the time (and still does) as > >> a very CLEAN approach to teaching spiritual subjects > >> in a very DIRTY smorgasbord of lazy, unscrupulous, > >> and money-grubbing dilettantes. The book itself is > >> free, or sold for the cost of printing. The teachers > >> "invited" to teach the same approach are clearly named, > >> and just as clearly it is stated that anyone else who > >> might be hosting discussion groups is On Their Own, > >> and that they do not necessarily reflect Adya himself > >> or his teachings. Having seen so much of the opposite, > >> I liked the CLEAN approach. > >> > >> That said, a quick glance through the first few chap- > >> ters of this freebie book reminded me of the humorless- > >> ness and seriousness that I first detected in the > >> video I commented on earlier. I would not be tempted > >> to "study with" Adya, although I'd be open to seeing > >> him sometime if he were ever in my area, largely > >> because of that overly Serious vibe I get from him > >> that I also get from so many Zennists or former > >> Zennists. Not my cuppa tea. > >> > >> Nor is his choice of language. I find it imprecise > >> and overly project-my-experience-onto-everyone-else's- > >> experience, especially his overuse of a word I don't > >> like at all, and don't believe in even the concept > >> of, Truth. Just because he experienced it don't make > >> it Truth, and just because he experienced it don't > >> mean that he can guide others to experiencing it also, > >> let alone that it would be Truth for them. > >> > >> I'd love to hear how he deals with students who attain > >> his level of supposed "Truth" but then find it either > >> lacking in satisfaction and move on to something > >> further, or just "move on" naturally, as the result > >> of continual spiritual growth. I would think that the > >> test of his rap would be how he'd handle that in one > >> or more of his students. > >> > >> That said, it *was* a pleasure to encounter someone > >> who has seemingly witnessed most of the things that > >> can possibly go WRONG with spiritual teaching, and who > >> has developed a teaching model that seeks to avoid > >> as many of these traps and pitfalls as possible. The > >> CLEAN nature of his presentation and the way he handles > >> the *business* of teaching is impressive, and I commend > >> him for that. The "Way" that he teaches, I have no > >> comments on, because I'm not in the market for one, > >> except my own. > >> > >> > On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 11:59 AM, turquoiseb wrote: > >> > > >> > > ** > >> > >> > > Haven't read it, don't know much about the guy, but > >> > > I like the way he does things. > >> > > > >> > > http://www.adyashanti.org/index.php?file=productdetail&iprod_id=533 > >> > > > >> > > *The Way of Liberation* > >> > >> > > A Practical Guide to Spiritual Enlightenment > >> > > by Adyashanti > >> > > > >> > > Printed copy: $10.00 > >> > > Downloadable PDF: Free > >> > > > >> > > Even if you aren't interested in the free PDF, you might > >> > > want to click the here link > >> > > and read more about his > >> > > organization and how it operates. I can only hope that > >> > > it is as clean as it sounds, because that would be unique > >> > > in the smorgasbord of things that people call spiritual. > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> > >> > > > > >
