My primary interest in Guru Dev is in finding out the historical truth about his life and teachings. However, though it is not a part of my personal belief system, I am not closed to the possibility that Guru Dev operated on a plane that gave him support in a way we might term miraculous. That is the testomony of those around him, including MMY and other devotees. My query to off_world_beings has nothing to do with belief, but in determining the source of his statements about Guru Dev's funding and lifestyle, since they contradict published biography.
--- In [email protected], off_world_beings <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > So do you believe that the Jyotir Math seat was run on noting but > miracles from the ether? > > Do you really believe that the place where Guru Dev spent his last > 10+ years was built by the gods, maintained by the gods, and all the > work being done their by the servants (Maharishi included - 10 years > I believe), all that stuff grew on trees? Next you'll be saying that > Guru Dev fed the 5,000 with a loaf and 2 fishes. > > OffWorld > > > --- In [email protected], "Premanand Paul Mason" > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Guru Dev's lifestyle, organisation and methods of gaining welfare > as > > depicted in his published biographies (listed below), are at > variants > > with the descriptions recently offered by 'off_world_beings'. > > > > It is particularly interesting to note the stories of Guru Dev > > outrightly refusing material donations to his ashram. If fact he > > gained the title 'Ananta Shree Vibhushit' - Adorned with Limitless > > Wealth - because of the mysterious way his life appeared supported > in > > all respects. > > > > > > 'Shri Jyotishpeethaddharaka' > > by Shri Rameshwar Prasad Tiwari, 1965 > > - The lifestory of Shankaracharya Swami Brahmananda Saraswati in > Hindi > > > > 'The Whole Thing The Real Thing' by Prem C Pasricha, 1977 > > - English language 'transcreation' of Tiwari's Hindi biography > > > > 'Strange Facts About A Great Saint' by Raj R P Varma, 1980 > > - Personalised English language version of Tiwari's Hindi > biography > > of Shankaracharya Swami Brahmanand Saraswati, and quotations, > > translated extracts of 'Amrita-Kana' > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], off_world_beings > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > As far as I know, Guru Dev lived in a mansion in his retirement > > > called the Jyotir Math, with servants and massive donors from > the > > > Hindu community, as well as many volunteers (which included > > > Maharishi fro a decade or so). > > > > > > OffWorld > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], "Ingegerd" > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > This is my opinion too. His thinking was more in accordance > with > > > > Guru Dev. Not quite - as I read the quotes from Guru Dev, but > > more > > > > etichal than what he shows these days. I think the influence > of > > > Guru > > > > Dev faded more and more as he became The Big Guru. > > > > Ingegerd > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], "Premanand Paul Mason" > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > It sounds like in the early-early days Guru Dev's teaching > was > > > > still > > > > > fairly fresh in his awareness, but that the freshness > > diminished > > > > as > > > > > time passed, to the point where he now represents a teaching > > > quite > > > > > alien to that of Guru Dev's. > > > > > That is the corrupting force of materialism, which he > appears > > > not > > > > to > > > > > have been a match for. > > > > > Just my opinion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], "Ingegerd" > > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], TurquoiseB > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Contact MUM about the nearest World Peace Palace. > You > > > can > > > > > take > > > > > > > > > out a low-interest student loan to learn TM, and I > > would > > > > > > guess, > > > > > > > > > to learn an advanced technique as well... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ***************** > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The loan to learn TM is not low-interest (the Citibank > > > > > > Citiassist > > > > > > > > loan is prime rate plus points, instead of less than > > prime > > > > rate > > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > Stafford govt-guaranteed loans), because it is not a > > > > government- > > > > > > > > guaranteed/subsidized loan, but a private student loan > > > that > > > > > > either > > > > > > > > requires good credit or a co-signer -- it's the same > loan > > > > that > > > > > > MUM > > > > > > > > students in the Computer Professional program get: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.mum.edu/compro/citiassist.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > for MUM students who are foreign nationals, Iowa banks > > > give > > > > a > > > > > > loan > > > > > > > > (guaranteed by MUM itself): > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.mum.edu/compro/financial.html#cploan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think you people are missing the point, big-time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The very fact that someone should have to take out > > > > > > > a loan to learn to meditate is what's criminal. And > > > > > > > the organization that places the people of the world > > > > > > > in that position are the criminals. > > > > > > > > > > > > You are so right. MMY has changed his mind about loans. I > > > > remember > > > > > > in the early-early days that MMY said that we never should > > > take > > > > up > > > > > > loans, because it made a limit to our freedom. He said > that > > > the > > > > > > persons or banks that gave us loans, made us as slaves - > > > because > > > > > > they owned a part of us. I think that this was something > he > > > had > > > > > from > > > > > > Guru Dev. > > > > > > Ingegerd > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! 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