--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "suziezuzie" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Spoke with a professional gardener and he told me that if I didn't want 
> worms in my apple tree, I would have to spray because the larva is 
> inside the apples. I asked him what the organic growers use and he 
> said, "they use the same spray as the non organic growers use, but 
> less, instead of spraying 12 times a year, maybe around 6 times a 
> year. "REALLY", I asked? "Yea", he said, "because there is no other way 
> to get rid of the worms". "WOW", I said, "You mean this whole organic 
> thing is a scam"? I asked. And he said, "yea, pretty much". "I bet 
> hardly anyone knows this, that they think organic means NO sprays at 
> all", I said, and he said, "Yea, that's right. Is he right? 
> Marcos Von Trumpeter
Its true. I know an organic apple grower, and she has to spray
occaisionally, and this IS ALLOWED under the Organic Standards,
because there is no other known way to get rid of these apple worms.
Actually, she "fumigates" same pesticide, I imagine.

Also, I grew tomatos and some vegs this year in a small new garden,
new place. VERY rocky soil. I took out many  > 12x12 rocks in the
small plot area. Though I then goosed it up with some organic
"fertilizing" /soil enhnacement materials.  Through the growing
season, the tomatoes were lagging some. No time for compost this year.
Thus I used some sparse (a tablesoon here, a table spoon
there)commercial fertilizers, NO PESCTICIDES, and the growth

I GET why large scale commercial farming heavy use of fertilizer
screws up the soil and water supply. But my sparse use of a few
tablespoons did not get into the water supply. Due to highly targeted
application, i am confident > 99% was sucked up by the plants. So
where is the "crime"  being a little bit not organic -- if you get
much healthier plants. (Though ideally, i would like to use ONLY lots
of compost from a large, year round pile.)

I am wondering about Organic Veg in FF (and elsewhere). The Organic
"network" Alex has referred to -- lots of home gardens as I envisioned
it. Are all contributors certified organic? (a seven year process, as
i understand, and involving lots of on going paperwork.) And if not
certified, do the local home gardeners use chemical fertilizers at
times? Beyond compost, and manures, etc.

Also, the Organic standards allow manures, and i think bone and blood
meal. Nothing more appetizing than throw dead cow blood and bone
materia, and pig shit on your "pristine" orgainic veggies.

Does FF have a veggie oriented organic "practice"  and exchange in place?

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