--The bottom like is what is the "meaning" of redemption, of the purported substitionary death? I haven't seen any difference in the karma of fundie Christians and others. They seem to pay karmically just as others; if so, then the payoff could be after death? This is speculative. Personally, any allusion to redemption independent of Enlightenment is off the mark. Since E. is not incorporated into orthodox Monotheistic religions, these religions are a partial mismatch between claims (salvation,etc...) and the nondualist goal. But OTOH, the concept of Resurrection differs from E anyway. Resurrection refers to physically dead people, who will (supposedly, through Divine intervention) have their physical molecules reassembled into a "perfect" incorruptible body. (Cf. the words of St. Paul). In the Rapture theory, physically alive people are translated into a Heavenly state, vanishing from the earth. In the Jehovah's Witness concept of the future, physically alive people are awarded perfect physical bodies and remain on an earthly Paradise, (if they are not among the 144,000). There's no evidence of Jesus going to India. The monotheistic concepts of Resurrection and Rapture are markedly different from what's involved in non-dualist Hindu/Buddhist/Gnostic Sadhanas.
- In [email protected], [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > > In a message dated 9/4/07 11:50:47 A.M. Central Daylight Time, > [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > > In [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[email protected]) , > MDixon6569@, MDi > > > > > > In a message dated 9/4/07 10:19:12 A.M. Central Daylight Time, > > MDixon6569@ MDixon6569@ > > > > > > In _FairfieldLife@ In _FairfieldLife@<W > (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > (mailto:[email protected]) ) , > > MDixon6569@, M > > <snip> > > [quoting Isaiah] > > And because of what > > > he has experienced, my righteous servant will make it possible > for > > > many to be counted righteous, for he will bear all their sins. I > > > will give him the honors of one who is mighty and great, because > he > > > exposed himself to death. He was counted among those who were > > > sinners. He bore the sins of many and interceded for sinners. > > > > Nothing about this servant's being the only-begotten > > Son of God, though, is there? "Mighty and great," but > > nothing about being divine. > > > > There are approximately 127 prophesies in the Old Testament, might > > be a few more, none give all the information. However, Isaiah 53- 2 > > My servant grew up in the Lord's presence like a tender green > > shoot, sprouting from a dry root in dry and sterile ground. I > > believe is referring to the virgin birth. > > Maybe (although it could be a reference to a previously > barren woman suddenly being able to conceive by normal > human means). But it's not explicitly about the servant > being the only-begotten Son of God. > > It was > > John the Baptist who said that when he baptized Jesus, he heard > the voice of > > God say "This is my beloved son in whom I am well pleased." > > But that's in the Christian Scriptures, it isn't a > prophecy from the Hebrew Scriptures. > > The prophecy > > does say he is without sin and the Bible does say that no man > > since Adam has come into this world without sin. Just how > > *mighty and great* would one have to be to take on the sins of > > the world. Be exposed to death, to rise and have a multitude of > > Children and heirs and have kings stand before him speechless, > > clearly a reference to his Divine reign as King of Kings. > > Sorry, but it's not an explicit characterization of > the servant as the only-begotten Son of God. > > > One last thing to ad here is that Isaiah also said the suffering > > servant did no wrong and deceived no one and if indeed this > > prophecy is about Jesus, Jesus always referred to God as "my > > Father". Only once does he call Him God and that is when he had > > became the embodiment of sin on the cross and said "my > > God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me". Of course there are many > > other examples of Jesus referring to himself as the Son of God and > > the Son of man. > > Son of Man, yes, a common expression referring to human > beings. But none to being the only-begotten Son of God. > > Referring to God as "Father" is, of course, standard in > Judaism, so that's no indication of anything. > > My point is that the Hebrew Scripture prophecies refer > to an extraordinary human being who is obviously favored > by God but do not indicate that he is to be of uniquely > divine origin or status. That was an invention of > Christianity that isn't found in the Hebrew Scriptures, > and it's why Jews do not accept Jesus as their Messiah. > > > > > John 10, 32-38 Jesus said , "at my Father's direction I have done many > things to help the people. For which one of these good deeds are you killing me?"< > They replied,"not for good work,but for blasphemy, because you , a mere man > have made yourself God."< Jesus replied, "It is written in your own law that > God said to certain leaders of the people, 'I say, you are gods!' And you > know that the scriptures cannot be altered. So if those people, who received > God's message, were called 'gods' why do you call it blasphemy when the Holly > One who was sent into the world by the Father says, 'I am the Son of God'? Don't > believe me unless I carry out my Father's work. But if I do his work, > believe in what I have done, even if you don't believe in me. Then you will realize > that the father is in me and I am in the Father." See Psalms 82:6 I say, You > are gods and children of the most High. Jesus claim was not so foreign to > Hebrew scripture. > > > > ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all- new AOL at > http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour >
