I would definetly vote to add "moderate the first post" for advanced groups like flexcomponents to deal with the issues Doug brought up. I believe that would make lists better for everyone. Sincerely Anatole
On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 1:54 PM, Anatole Tartakovsky < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Doug, > flexcomponents is not moderated in conventional sense. The name of the > group is confusing for new users. Very few people have a sense what the > group is for. I am more concerned that the messages that do not belong to > flexcomponents stay there. Crossposting has to be moderated and discouraged. > Ban them first time for some time, permanently if needed. > > You can try weborb or flexjobs as examples of clearly distinct and > moderated entries. > > I am getting few emails a week from people asking me to help them to write > "hello worlld" type application in Flex - or help them with blog or book > code - to find that they do not know they need a server. We created this > culture with free products and support - and there are people who would take > advantage. > > Regards, > Anatole > > On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 12:03 PM, Doug McCune <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > >> Out of the last 100 threads on flexcomponents 22 were cross posted to >> flexcoders. Almost every one (I think with one exception) was >> cross-posted by the original author immediately to both lists >> (sometimes as many as 5 lists! flexcoders, flex_india, flexcomponents, >> ria-india). One of them was pretty much spam, and one of them was a >> job post (which shouldn't have been posted to flexcoders or >> flexcomponents, but only flexjobs). >> >> If we look at flexcomponents as a microcosm, then we have: 22% >> crossposting (1% legitimate cross-posting) and 2% spam. >> >> Yeah, this isn't a scientific survey (although I do hope to get real >> results comparing the full traffic of both lists soon). But I just >> thought it was interesting. >> >> Doug >> >> >> On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 8:44 AM, Anatole Tartakovsky >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <anatole.tartakovsky%40gmail.com>> wrote: >> > Hello Tom, >> > >> >>>How is >1 list simpler than 1 list ?<< >> > >> > The same way "threads by the topic" are simplier then unsorted >> individual >> > email - you read only the ones you need and fold the rest. While you can >> > argue that you can sort and fold messages with some client email >> > customization, it is not a trivial task unless your server or client >> > supports it. >> > >> > Basically weborb is 10 messages a day, apollo is 1 and flexcomponents >> are 2 >> > - I can manage that in my daily emails. Imagine that we separated the >> main >> > list in subtopics and one of them would be "dashboards, charts and BI" - >> > getting 5-10 messages a day - would you rather moderate that or whole >> > list? Would it get up in your inbox? What are the chances that a single >> > mail would get missed by specialist? What about the quality of the >> answer? >> > Visibility of all questions and answers on the topic? Am I the only one >> who >> > thinks that libraries place books by category for convenience and access >> > simplicity? >> > >> > There is nothing simple about fishing in 100+ items. Tom, as BI >> specialist >> > you know firsthand that sorting data in the beginning eliminates order >> of >> > magnitude processing later. Let us apply it to our daily life. >> > >> >>> But if there are too many they'll just post to them all. << >> > >> > There are 2 types of crossposting people - the ones who did not receive >> the >> > answer in the previous forum and the ones who cross post from the get >> go. >> > The first type is OK - moderator or users can point them to a different >> > forum. There are periods in flexcomponents that every second message >> gets >> > "RTFM" or "go to flexcoders" responses. The second type needs some >> > discipline. Here is what moderators and users do - saying this is not >> > appropriate forum, remove the message to make life easier for the rest, >> > giving warning bans for a day - however harsh it sounds, it works. The >> goal >> > is to service the community - not to do somebodies homework. If the >> forums >> > are speedy and high quality the crossposting ceases. >> > >> > I have seen heavily moderated product forums on compuserve (yes, before >> > Internet) 15 years ago. You had less then one hour response (datetime >> > US) time on 90+% of the questions. The volume was about 500 messages >> across >> > 20 forums. "General" list was getting about 100 threads, the rest were >> much >> > smaller, The answers would be actually correct ones. Vendors would have >> team >> > of community moderators that would answer 50%+ of the questions in their >> > domain - with multiple moderators per topic. There was very little >> > repetition of the questions as people could search much better. >> > >> > Things come in cycles. Please consider this as "best practices" from the >> > historical point. >> > >> > Now for the next cycle - can single list be better then multiple lists - >> the >> > answer is yes, but not now >> > The only way I can see single as an alternative to multiple list is to >> > enforce tagging of the questions. That in turn means next generation of >> > email clients or forcing everybody to use RSS type readers instead of >> email. >> > We will get to it in a few years, its requires serious update to the >> email >> > system. Next generations of email that are to be spam proof can make >> > topics/tagging exchange a part of handshake protocol. Till then there is >> no >> > enforceable way to sort the messages on the senders end. >> > >> > >> > Sincerely, >> > Anatole Tartakovsky >> > >> > >> > On Wed, Jun 18, 2008 at 5:02 AM, Tom Chiverton >> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <tom.chiverton%40halliwells.com>> wrote: >> >> >> >> On Tuesday 17 Jun 2008, Anatole Tartakovsky wrote: >> >> > Multiple lists enforce thinking if it is appropriate before posting. >> >> >> >> Maybe. But if there are too many they'll just post to them all. >> >> >> >> > Moderators can ban/redirect unappropriate message. Flexcomponents >> often >> >> > redirect new users to flexcoders if the question is not about >> >> > components. >> >> > You almost never see questions on UI design in weborb. >> >> >> >> See what I and Matt said - I think we're on the same page here. >> >> >> >> > All in all - let us have the simplest thing possible - multiple list >> - w >> >> >> >> How is >1 list simpler than 1 list ? >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Tom Chiverton >> >> >> >> **************************************************** >> >> >> >> This email is sent for and on behalf of Halliwells LLP. >> >> >> >> Halliwells LLP is a limited liability partnership registered in England >> >> and Wales under registered number OC307980 whose registered office >> address >> >> is at Halliwells LLP, 3 Hardman Square, Spinningfields, Manchester, M3 >> 3EB. >> >> A list of members is available for inspection at the registered office. >> Any >> >> reference to a partner in relation to Halliwells LLP means a member of >> >> Halliwells LLP. 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