Maybe it's better to say "Post-Newtonian science thinks rather in terms of the emergence of possibility."
Merle On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 9:46 PM, Nicholas Thompson < [email protected]> wrote: > “ Science really doesn't think in terms of causes.”**** > > ** ** > > Really, Russ? That’s quite a sweeper, isn’t it? **** > > ** ** > > Nick **** > > ** ** > > *From:* Friam [mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *Russ > Abbott > *Sent:* Monday, March 25, 2013 4:45 PM > *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group > *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] beyond reductionism twice**** > > ** ** > > It seems strange to me that Kauffman would focus on cause. (I'll admit > that I got that from just looking at the start of the paper. Perhaps he > goes in a different direction.) Science really doesn't think in terms of > causes. As I understand it science thinks in terms of forces, particles, > etc., and equations that relate them, but not causes. This is especially > noticeable when considering that the equations work forwards and backwards. > If one wants to think in terms of a "forward" (in time) cause that implies > a parallel "backward" (in time) cause, which makes the whole cause notion > much less useful. **** > > ** ** > > Steve, you mentioned Lamarkian evolution. I'd be very interested to find > out more about some of your daughter's examples. **** > > **** > > **** > > *-- Russ Abbott* > *_____________________________________________***** > > * Professor, Computer Science* > * California State University, Los Angeles***** > > ** ** > > * My paper on how the Fed can fix the economy: ssrn.com/abstract=1977688* > * Google voice: 747-999-5105***** > > Google+: plus.google.com/114865618166480775623/**** > > * vita: > **sites.google.com/site/russabbott/*<http://sites.google.com/site/russabbott/> > **** > > CS Wiki <http://cs.calstatela.edu/wiki/> and the courses I teach > *_____________________________________________* **** > > ** ** > > On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 3:42 PM, Steve Smith <[email protected]> wrote:**** > > Gary/Pamela/(Stephen, Carl, Eric, ...) - > > I know several (many?) on this list know Stu better than I... so I > apologize if I sounded overly critical. I prefer Pamela's description of > him being *careless* with references as opposed to my own use of the > *honest*. I also admit that I do not know if he sees himself as a > rock-star... that is perhaps the default category I put people in who are > simultaneously *good*, *self-possessed* and *charismatic*. I actually > *like* most rock stars (within reason) even if I might not care for their > music. > > As an aside... does anyone remember Chris Langton appearing in Rolling > Stone (CA 1990?)... I searched their archives and did not find any > references (nor on the internet at large?). I remember the article > including a sexed-up spread of him in front of a Connection Machine? I > suppose I could be hallucinating or have come from an alternate history? > > I also smiled at your term "demigod" as I often use "Titans" to describe > the pantheon of my wife's sibling group... she is oldest of 8 *mostly* > high functioning, *very* charismatic, *definitely* self-possessed siblings. > They all revered their father who was a humble but charismatic physics > professor. None of them took up science per se, though one has a PhD in > psychology. I would not use *rock star* to describe any of their > self-image, though there is one who insists he *is* Elvis... and sometimes > we are tempted to believe him. There are definitely characters right out > of Greek, Roman, Norse, even Hindu mythology in her family... My wife is > Kali *and* Loki rolled into one I think. > > I have always been inspired by Kauffman's ideas as best I could understand > them, which has been highly variable, depending on the circumstance. This > says more about me than about Stu. I read his lecture notes in the > late-nineties... the ones which ultimately became the core of > _Investigations_ (or so it seemed to me). I had read _OofO_ and _At Home > in the Universe_ previously. It may have been coincidence or something > stronger like kismet that I read Investigations interleaved with my reading > of Christopher Alexander's (Pattern Language fame) _Notes on the Synthesis > of Form_ with D'Arcy Thompson's _On Growth and Form_ as backup reference. > I was traveling lightly in New Zealand at the time with none of my usual > distractions nagging me. It was a month of deep thought informed by > Alexander and Kauffman equally. > > My nature is to be guarded around people with significant charisma (and me > married into aforementioned pantheon!). I appreciate the need for and the > value of the persuasive and the self-confident, even in the realm of > science where ideas *by definition* must stand on their own. There is > value for those who can bring us to *want* to believe enough to put in the > hard work to believe things on their own merits. Unfortunately that might > be the dividing line between science and Science(tm). I suppose I > mistrust those who appear to be trying to corner the franchise on > Science(tm) in their neighborhood. > > Nevertheless, I am *more* interested in Kauffman's ideas here and hope > that we will discuss them a bit? > > - Steve**** > > > > > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com**** > > ** ** > > [image: Image removed by sender.][image: Image removed by sender.]**** > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > -- Merle Lefkoff, Ph.D. President, Center for Emergent Diplomacy Santa Fe, New Mexico, USA [email protected] mobile: (303) 859-5609 skype: merlelefkoff
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