I personally don't relate tangible, physical objects to mathematical ones because you get into Hywel(RIP) territory. "If you measure it carefully enough it's not a right triangle. There are no right triangles".
----------------------------------- Frank Wimberly My memoir: https://www.amazon.com/author/frankwimberly My scientific publications: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Frank_Wimberly2 Phone (505) 670-9918 On Sat, Mar 9, 2019, 12:07 AM Nick Thompson <[email protected]> wrote: > So a shroud is a manifold but not all manifolds are shrouds? > > > > N > > > > Nicholas S. Thompson > > Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology > > Clark University > > http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/ > > > > *From:* Friam [mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *Frank > Wimberly > *Sent:* Friday, March 08, 2019 8:54 PM > *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group < > [email protected]> > *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] excess meaning alert? (was, Re: are we how we > behave?) > > > > It's something you can move around on in a continuous way? > > ----------------------------------- > Frank Wimberly > > My memoir: > https://www.amazon.com/author/frankwimberly > > My scientific publications: > https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Frank_Wimberly2 > > Phone (505) 670-9918 > > > > On Fri, Mar 8, 2019, 8:52 PM Nick Thompson <[email protected]> > wrote: > > I am sure it helps a lot of people; just not me. > > > > I need a metaphor. > > > > Nick > > > > Nicholas S. Thompson > > Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology > > Clark University > > http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/ > > > > *From:* Friam [mailto:[email protected]] *On Behalf Of *Frank > Wimberly > *Sent:* Friday, March 08, 2019 8:43 PM > *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group < > [email protected]> > *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] excess meaning alert? (was, Re: are we how we > behave?) > > > > Succinctly, and I may leave something out, a manifold is a topological > space for which there is a homeomorphism between every open set and an open > set in Rn for some n. More concretely, lines and surfaces are manifolds > but things get complicated in higher dimensions. That probably doesn't > help. > > ----------------------------------- > Frank Wimberly > > My memoir: > https://www.amazon.com/author/frankwimberly > > My scientific publications: > https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Frank_Wimberly2 > > Phone (505) 670-9918 > > > > On Fri, Mar 8, 2019, 8:27 PM Nick Thompson <[email protected]> > wrote: > > Lee, > > Just to bend the thread a bit further, is "excess meaning" a term of art > for > you? It seems very close to the term "surplus meaning" which was used in a > famous article assigned to all Psychology graduate students in the sixties > on the distinction between hypothetical constructs and intervening > variables. Wondering if your term has the same meaning and if it has a > life somewhere. > > As to the convex hull I went from there to the overturned boat in NCIS and > thence to "manifold" which, when the term is deployed by mathematicians I > always think of a shroud, like a blanket dropped over some lumpy thing to > contain it, roughly. Which, now that I mention it, makes me want to > explain > wtf you mathematicians mean when you use the word manifold. > > If that's not a thoroughly bent thread I don't know what is. > > Nick > > Nicholas S. Thompson > Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Biology > Clark University > http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/ > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Friam [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of > [email protected] > Sent: Friday, March 08, 2019 7:04 PM > To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[email protected]> > Subject: [FRIAM] excess meaning alert? (was, Re: are we how we behave?) > > Steve writes in relevant part: > > > My position is that I favor each and every one of us taking whatever > > responsibility for understanding our own "convex hull" of > > capability/knowledge/intuition as we are capable of and "managing" it > > to the best of our ability. > > The quotation marks around the phrase 'convex hull' and the word 'managing' > presumably signal that they are being used non-literally, and (I guess) > metaphorically. I would particularly like Steve, if he is willing, to > delve > into the intended metaphor in the first case. On the one hand, lots of my > work uses more or less geometry; on the other, in lots of my other work I > use metaphor; and I even think and write about metaphor. So it's likely > that I'm taking the metaphor more seriously than intended. > > With that disclaimer: in the technical contexts I'm familiar with, to pass > from something X to the convex hull of X has the effect of (1) 'filling in > holes in X', in a well-defined manner that is (2) as economical as possible > and (3) (therefore) unique. Which (if any) of those properties are > reflected, and how, in the case that X is our > "capability/knowledge/intuition"? ... I could ramble on a lot more but > will > start with that. > > > > > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe > http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove > > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove >
============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College to unsubscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com archives back to 2003: http://friam.471366.n2.nabble.com/ FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ by Dr. Strangelove
