The pipeline is rated for 1400psi. We need 400psi, but might load 700psi tops at times.
On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 11:33 AM Marcus Daniels <[email protected]> wrote: > How does the volume and available pressure compare to subterranean storage > of compressed air? > > > > *From:* Friam <[email protected]> *On Behalf Of *Michael Orshan > *Sent:* Monday, February 7, 2022 9:59 AM > *To:* The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group < > [email protected]> > *Subject:* Re: [FRIAM] Another Stunning Hydrogen Development - Retake Our > Democracy > > > > Hi. I'm a reader more than a contributor, but the Hydrogen discussion is > close to my day to day. > > > > Many of us in renewables think Hydrogen might mostly be kick the can as > Steve mentioned. It is something that might be economically feasible in > the 2030s and so the length of time oil companies sell oil increases. > Having said that, there are a number of very pricey Hydrogen projects > getting funded. That might be showing how profitable the O&G industry is. > > > > I'm working with a company we call Breeze > <http://www.breezesqueeze.com%20>. It uses compressed air in pipelines > to move turbines at power plants. Without fossil fuels or using water this > is getting a lot of attention. There are many advantages such as cold air > where compressed air is released that can be used by data centers. 25% of > all GHGs come from generating electricity. 45% of all water used in the US > is used to create electricity. > > > > We see this as a better option than Hydrogen. We do think Hydrogen fuel > cells are a solution for mobile applications. > > > > Mike Orshan > > > > On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 10:27 AM Steve Smith <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > On 2/6/22 8:31 PM, Marcus Daniels wrote: > > > https://thebulletin.org/2022/01/whether-green-blue-or-turquoise-hydrogen-needs-to-be-clean-and-cheap/ > > *Low-cost fossil fuel resources are finite. Someday it will simply > not be possible to burn oil, natural gas, and coal for the affordable heat, > electricity, and motive power humans need to power their prosperous > societies. * > > Must we always begin with the assumption that growth in terms of > geographical/geometric, material and energy consumption/appropriation are > requisite to continuing/growing a "prosperous society"? Tangentially (or > not), if "green" hydrogen implies a 2:1 ratio of CO2 production to H2 but > often begins with fossil fuels, it is obviously yet another "kick the can > down the road" solution. Harvesting solar and direct-solar/lunar-derived > energy (including wind, tidal) and channeling it through our living > (including technological infrastructure and agri-industry) systems to yield > high-entropy "waste heat" seems to be orders of magnitude more sustainable > (if still questionable on some very long time-scale limited by a > Dyson-Sphere-like-limit). If the H2 is created by cracking H20 (and > capturing both to be recombined later to release energy) using solar (and > other renewables) energy it is a *closed cycle*. One would presume the > total amount of H2 we would have stored/ > > From ecology there comes the observed phenomena of "island syndrome" which > can include island dwarfism and poikilothermy which are both driven by > reducing the demand on finite resources without giving up function or > complexity. > > From Alexander Payne comes the absurdist SciFi flick Downsizing > <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Downsizing_(film)#Plot> which postulates > by shrinking humans by ???-fold (5 inches tall ~= 12:1 in 1 dimension, > 144:1 in cross section and 1728:1 in volume/mass... ) the movie implies no > change in metabolic rates which would nominally speed up with "shrinkage", > yielding (also) shorter lifespans. Oh well.. Fiction. But the point > would seem well taken... Gaia would get a 2000:1 reprieve from our > *current* energy/mass burden on her systems. > > I'm not promoting shrinking people as-such, just noting that our 0th order > instinct is growth, and supralinear if at all possible, up to and likely > achieving Kurzweillian asymptotic resource consumption. > > On that note, I believe that the myriad technological singularity concepts > all point toward increased complexity and downscaling to extend the use of > material and energy, driving up the effective collective metabolism of "the > system" and paradoxically *increasing* the rate at which we approach any of > the jillion ecophagic gray-goo <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gray_goo>-like > scenarios neo-luddites like me might contrive. > > I assume (but have not yet poked around for) that Alifers have already > studied the multi-scale *structure* of negative entropy profiles in complex > systems-of-systems. I think Glen has his ear closer to that rail than > some here? EricS? ??? I'm still fascinated in the topic but gave up my > little-toenail-purchase in the community in the early 2000s - Symbiotic > Intelligence ALifeVI > <https://cseweb.ucsd.edu/~rik/alife6/papers/SY51.html>. This reads so > naive yet (mildly) prophetic now... > > All is lost! Flee the solar system! > > > > > > On Feb 6, 2022, at 7:20 PM, [email protected] wrote: > > > > Grey hydrogen? > > > https://retakeourdemocracy.org/2022/02/06/another-stunning-hydrogen-development/ > > > .-- .- -. - / .- -.-. - .. --- -. ..--.. / -.-. --- -. .--- ..- --. .- - . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn UTC-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam > un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: > 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ > 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ > > > > .-- .- -. - / .- -.-. - .. --- -. ..--.. / -.-. --- -. .--- ..- --. .- - . > > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > > Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn UTC-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam > <http://bit.ly/virtualfriamun/subscribe> > > un/subscribe <http://bit.ly/virtualfriamun/subscribe> > http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > > archives: > > 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ > > 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ > > > .-- .- -. - / .- -.-. - .. --- -. ..--.. / -.-. --- -. .--- ..- --. .- - . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn UTC-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam > un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: > 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ > 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ > > > .-- .- -. - / .- -.-. - .. --- -. ..--.. / -.-. --- -. .--- ..- --. .- - . > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Zoom Fridays 9:30a-12p Mtn UTC-6 bit.ly/virtualfriam > un/subscribe http://redfish.com/mailman/listinfo/friam_redfish.com > FRIAM-COMIC http://friam-comic.blogspot.com/ > archives: > 5/2017 thru present https://redfish.com/pipermail/friam_redfish.com/ > 1/2003 thru 6/2021 http://friam.383.s1.nabble.com/ >
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