-- keith Pope <mute.p...@googlemail.com> wrote (on Friday, 30 October 2009, 04:02 PM +0000): > 2009/10/30 Ralph Schindler <ralph.schind...@zend.com> : > > > Time to go back to using Doctrine then :( bye bye nice models..... > > > > > > Do you think it would be a good idea to update the Quickstart guide > > > now to not use the Data Mapper pattern and use doctrine instead? > > > > I would strongly disagree with that move. I think ZF has always offered 2 > > solid solutions to modeling: use our Data classes (Table Row, etc) to build > > out a proper model, OR use a 3rd Party ORM framework- like Doctrine. > > > > At ZendCon, i've heard more than one person say "This is the way modeling > > should be done" after seeing matthew's talk on > > > > http://www.slideshare.net/weierophinney/architecting-your-models > > > > If a project doesn't have the resources to model their data like that, or > > they need to leverage the Doctrine ecosystem to get a project done in time. > > But in the most ideal world (where resources are not an issue), I too > > think that this presentation shows how things should be done. > > > > That said, I think the quickstart should show both options, but focus on the > > Data Mapper, Service Layer stuff. > > I agree that the data mapper is a good way to do Models etc but I > think the basic mapper shown in the quickstart does lead people into > trouble. If a newcomer follows the quickstart they soon find out that > modeling relations is very hard and they need an ORM...If we had > Doctrine 2 integration we can then show the data mapper pattern at its > best IMO. > > I have had this concern with the quickstart for a while :)
I think we can show the current data mapper still, but then have a note detailing ORMs and when you need to start using one (vs. a simple hand-written data mapper). > Also will we be deprecating Zend_Db as if we have tight Doctrine > integration is there any reason to keep Zend_Db? There are plenty of reasons to keep Zend_Db. Not everyone will be using Doctrine, and for many one-off types of applications (single tables, or multiple tables with no relations, etc.), having Zend_Db around will continue to be essential. Additionally, one aspect I'd like to explore with the Doctrine folks is potentially allowing Zend_Db adapters as Doctrine RDBMS adapters; this would provide some very interesting integration points. -- Matthew Weier O'Phinney Project Lead | matt...@zend.com Zend Framework | http://framework.zend.com/
