Good thought, but best energy is exhaust heat Sent from my Virgin Mobile phone.
Art Krenzel <[email protected]> wrote: >I have been following this discussion waiting for someone to chime in the >obvious but so far.... In general terms, an engine utilizes only about >25-30% of the total energy as work. The remainder of the energy (70-75%) is >releases about equally between the exhaust and the engine cooling system. So >why not use the air from the engine cooling system and divert that cooling >airflow into the dryer. Now you do not have any of the dew point issues, >sparks, etc such as when using exhaust gases for drying energy. The engine >cooling system would use ambient air from the room and blow it into dryer with >virtually no potential to cause fires or overheating of any sort. The engine >usually has a fan already in place so no new parts would be required. Or you >could use both sources of heat energy to dry the wet feedstock. > >Just a thought...... >Art Krenzel > > >________________________________________ >From: Gasification <[email protected]> on behalf >of DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES <[email protected]> >Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 12:01 PM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust > >Dear Leland >the dryer will be for corn and/or cotton stalk chips of up to 80mm in >length. > >Best Regards >Dimitris > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: [email protected] >Sent: Monday, March 28, 2016 9:00 PM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 7 > >Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >[email protected] > >To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >[email protected] > >You can reach the person managing the list at >[email protected] > >When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." > > >Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust ([email protected]) > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >Message: 1 >Date: Sun, 27 Mar 2016 16:08:21 -0400 >From: [email protected] >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >Message-ID: <[email protected]> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > >Do you want to dry sewage, manure, pomace, DDG's or other biomass feedstock? > > >Sincerely, > >Leland T. "Tom" Taylor >Thermogenics Inc. > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES <[email protected]> >To: gasification <[email protected]> >Sent: Sun, Mar 27, 2016 12:00 pm >Subject: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust > > >Thank you all for your replies and help. >Andrew,Besides Dr Reed's handbook, Dr Mukunda from IISC India states the >same in a paper of his. >So I guess it is a rather safe assumption to say that you can dry wet >biomass using the syngas genset's exhaust. >If I find any experimental data, I will post them here. >This is a very interesting topic for engineers (besides gasification >itself). >Best Regards to all >Dimitris > > > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: [email protected] >Sent: Friday, March 25, 2016 8:00 PM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 5 > >Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >[email protected] > >To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >[email protected] > >You can reach the person managing the list at >[email protected] > >When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." > > >Today's Topics: > > 1. Reply to 'Mitris' Question (andrew schofield) > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >Message: 1 >Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2016 14:52:17 +0000 >From: andrew schofield <[email protected]> >To: "[email protected]" ><[email protected]> >Subject: [Gasification] Reply to 'Mitris' Question >Message-ID: ><blupr16mb0323334d9316845bca9c3a55a8...@blupr16mb0323.namprd16.prod.outlook.com> > >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > >Dear Dimitris, > >In Dr Reed's and Agua Das' handbook; illustrates a wet gas recycle plant for >drying green (wet) biomass. This is a direct-contact heat-exchanger; where >the engine-exhaust goes through the bed of fuel-particles. A high >temperature fan with a sealed shaft-gland forces convection of gasses from >the colder outlet to mix with the inlet engine-exhaust gas. > >There is much potential energy in Otto cycle engine exhaust; about a third >of the total chemical energy in the engine's fuel. To capture this energy >and heat a cartridge full of freshly cut, green hack-wood is the best use >for this normally wasted heat. The cartridge full of very hot wood is then >lifted out of the chamber, and quickly emptied into the gasifier. > >My own design makes an excess of dried wood, beginning at about the moisture >of growing hardwood; In excess of gasifier/engine requirement at about 30 KW >load to fuel 5.0 L eight cylinder Otto-cycle engine. Heavier engine loads >are the only regime where the heat required is adequate. I measured about >800 degrees Farenheight when the throttle-plate is operating more towards >open continually > >Operator care must be excercised, because the wood will catch on fire, if >allowed to cook beyond bone dry and golden brown. He watches the outlet >temperature which should not exceed about 300 degrees Farenheight. Using >wet-gas recycle, the whole batch-charge temperature rises at once, instead >of burning only the wood at the inlet location, while wood particles at the >outlet remains at the dew point as our friend Toby described. The wet-gas >recycle fan is a very special machine, and is one of the kind. > >In order to fund more research; I am offering a used system. What are your >requirement? > >Andrew Schofield >Renewable Fuel Systems > > > >________________________________________ >From: Gasification <[email protected]> on behalf >of [email protected] ><[email protected]> >Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2016 2:00:01 PM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 4 > >Send Gasification mailing list submissions to > [email protected] > >To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > [email protected] > >You can reach the person managing the list at > [email protected] > >When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." > > >Today's Topics: > > 1. Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >(DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES) > 2. Re: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 3 (Toby Seiler) > 3. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Nicol? Cerni) > 4. Re: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 > ([email protected]) > 5. Re: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 (Mark Elliott Ludlow) > 6. Re: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 (Tom Miles) > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >Message: 1 >Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 21:01:23 +0200 >From: "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> >To: <[email protected]> >Subject: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >Message-ID: <F7E6F49C13B64CADB81BE96C4ABEAE2D@DimitrisPC> >Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; > reply-type=original > >Hi Nicolo. >Thank you (but I believe that giving me an offer is irrelevant to the >purpose of this list, isn't it?) >Now to the point: >According to my calulations, if we consider that a saturated genset exhaust >stream is @ 415 oC with absolute humidity of 800 gr/kgr (stream A, this is >what I ask - if its humidity is correct) and we mix it 50%-50% with ambient >air of 25 oC with 50% relative humidity(stream B), the resulting stream will >be a mixture of about 220 oC with an absolute humidity ~400 gr/kgr(stream >C). >This mixture stream C has a drying potential, but I do not know if the >assumption on stream A is correct. >Any ideas? >Best Regards >Dimitris > > > > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: [email protected] >Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2016 8:00 PM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 3 > >Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >[email protected] > >To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >[email protected] > >You can reach the person managing the list at >[email protected] > >When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." > > >Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 > (Dimitris Tzagkas - KOKARAS AND ASSOCIATES) > 2. Re: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 (Nicol? Cerni) > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >Message: 1 >Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 19:38:12 +0200 >From: Dimitris Tzagkas - KOKARAS AND ASSOCIATES <[email protected]> >To: [email protected] >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 >Message-ID: <[email protected]> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > >Dear Rolf,Leland,Nicolo >thank you for your replies, >but still I got no clue what "saturated" genset exhaust looks like from >physics point of view... >Anybody? >Best Regards >Dimitris > >On 22/3/2016 8:00 ??, [email protected] wrote: >> Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >> [email protected] >> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> [email protected] >> >> You can reach the person managing the list at >> [email protected] >> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." >> >> >> Today's Topics: >> >> 1. Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >> (DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES) >> 2. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Energies Naturals C.B.) >> 3. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust ([email protected]) >> 4. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Nicol? Cerni) >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Message: 1 >> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >> From: "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Subject: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >> Message-ID: <42F812A1CF574A238B33CED7CDEFE230@DimitrisPC> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> Hello all. >> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven genset >> in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or absolute >> humidity (gr/kgr)? >> >> Best Regards >> Dimitris >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: >> <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160321/bf5a7819/attachment-0001.html> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 2 >> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 21:59:08 +0100 >> From: "Energies Naturals C.B." <[email protected]> >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >> Message-ID: <[email protected]> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >> >> >> Hallo Dimitris, >> >> no idea if syngas exhaust behaves differently from diesel exhaust, but the >> latter comes out at around 400 ?C and can be very well used to dry wet >> biomass. It should be mixed with ambient air so as not to pyrolize or even >> ignite the biomass. >> I once spoke to people from Central America who had a very simple setup: >> A sort of tower where the raw biomass is filled in at the top and the >> exhaust/air comes from below in counterflow. >> They said that the humidity was driven off to the top and dry stuff could >> be taken out below. >> Seems simple... >> >> best regards >> >> Rolf >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >> "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Hello all. >>> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven genset >>> in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>> >>> Best Regards >>> Dimitris >> > >-- >??????, > >???????? ??????? >????.???????????? ????????? - MSc >_______________________________________ >??????? & ?????????? >?????????? 12 >?????? >?.?. 41222 >???./FAX:2410256400 >www.kokaras.gr >_______________________________________ > > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 2 >Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 18:48:27 +0100 >From: Nicol? Cerni <[email protected]> >To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification ><[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 >Message-ID: ><caa0zrvchr-am70arizwritoso8ikm+gjwysp89mg8iej1b_...@mail.gmail.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > >hello >we know we must offer our system >is it ok? > > >2016-03-23 18:38 GMT+01:00 Dimitris Tzagkas - KOKARAS AND ASSOCIATES < >[email protected]>: > >> Dear Rolf,Leland,Nicolo >> thank you for your replies, >> but still I got no clue what "saturated" genset exhaust looks like from >> physics point of view... >> Anybody? >> Best Regards >> Dimitris >> >> On 22/3/2016 8:00 ??, [email protected] wrote: >> > Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >> > [email protected] >> > >> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> > >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >> > >> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> > [email protected] >> > >> > You can reach the person managing the list at >> > [email protected] >> > >> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> > than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." >> > >> > >> > Today's Topics: >> > >> > 1. Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >> > (DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES) >> > 2. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Energies Naturals C.B.) >> > 3. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust ([email protected]) >> > 4. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Nicol? Cerni) >> > >> > >> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > >> > Message: 1 >> > Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >> > From: "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> >> > To: <[email protected]> >> > Subject: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >> > Message-ID: <42F812A1CF574A238B33CED7CDEFE230@DimitrisPC> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> > >> > Hello all. >> > Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven >> genset in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >> > I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >> > What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >> > >> > Best Regards >> > Dimitris >> > -------------- next part -------------- >> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> > URL: < >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160321/bf5a7819/attachment-0001.html >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 2 >> > Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 21:59:08 +0100 >> > From: "Energies Naturals C.B." <[email protected]> >> > To: [email protected] >> > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >> > Message-ID: <[email protected]> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >> > >> > >> > Hallo Dimitris, >> > >> > no idea if syngas exhaust behaves differently from diesel exhaust, but >> the latter comes out at around 400 ?C and can be very well used to dry wet >> biomass. It should be mixed with ambient air so as not to pyrolize or even >> ignite the biomass. >> > I once spoke to people from Central America who had a very simple setup: >> > A sort of tower where the raw biomass is filled in at the top and the >> exhaust/air comes from below in counterflow. >> > They said that the humidity was driven off to the top and dry stuff >> could be taken out below. >> > Seems simple... >> > >> > best regards >> > >> > Rolf >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >> > "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >> >> Hello all. >> >> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven >> genset in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >> >> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >> >> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >> >> >> >> Best Regards >> >> Dimitris >> > >> >> -- >> ??????, >> >> ???????? ??????? >> ????.???????????? ????????? - MSc >> _______________________________________ >> ??????? & ?????????? >> ?????????? 12 >> ?????? >> ?.?. 41222 >> ???./FAX:2410256400 >> www.kokaras.gr >> _______________________________________ >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Gasification mailing list >> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >> [email protected] >> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >> >> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >> > > > >-- > >*gradite i nostri piu' distinti saluti, Atentamente,best regards, >freundliche Gr??e *?????????? ??????????? > >*Nicolo Cerni , * >*N C A* (N)ico (C)erni (A)ssociates >www.nico-cerni.com , marketing industriale, [email protected] > >*Customers only * >*+39 340 830.67.97 - Home office +39 045 69.32.996 ( 24 hours voice >recorder )* > > > >*Europa HQ Deutschland Hr/ Mr Wilhelm Doenne* > >Telefon *+49. 5141.219.83.72 / ( 09:30 / 17:oo)* - 5141 980 912 >fx ( DDU Celle ) >Mobil +49.152 028 05119 ( *Wilhelm Doenne* ) >Funk +49 176 457 38 790 .( *Nico Cerni *) > > >*EPC department - European and international contractors * > > >*GENERAL CONTRACTOR company AES gmbh , Akazienweg, 16, D 15834 Rangsdorf ( >Berlin Brandenburg www.altair-pyro.com <http://www.altair-pyro.com> , >** Electrical >contractors* Esiet Office (24h) +39.02.97.37.58.01 - ask reception >for Mr Maurizio Andreoli ( 09:oo-18: 3o ) - *Skype : nico_cerni * > > >*THIS E MAIL IS CONFIDENTIAL OUR CONFIDENTIALITY AND NON DISCLOSURE >AGREEMENT APPLIES - DIESE NACHRICHT IST VERTRAULICH, ES GILT UNSERE >VERSCHWIEGENHEITSVEREINBARUNG* >-------------- next part -------------- >An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >URL: ><http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160323/f0db76a2/attachment-0001.html> > >------------------------------ > >Subject: Digest Footer > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > >------------------------------ > >End of Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 3 >******************************************* > > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 2 >Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 19:11:49 +0000 (UTC) >From: Toby Seiler <[email protected]> >To: "[email protected]" > <[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 3 >Message-ID: > <[email protected]> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > >Saturated means the gas contains all the water that it can hold and when it >is put in contact with your wood, will condense into liquid water and give >up 970 btu per pound of water that condenses. ? ? > > On Wednesday, March 23, 2016 2:00 PM, >"[email protected]" ><[email protected]> wrote: > > >----- Forwarded Message ----- > >Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >??? [email protected] > >To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >??? >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >??? [email protected] > >You can reach the person managing the list at >??? [email protected] > >When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." > >Today's Topics: > >? 1. Re: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 >? ? ? (Dimitris Tzagkas - KOKARAS AND ASSOCIATES) >? 2. Re: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 (Nicol? Cerni) >Dear Rolf,Leland,Nicolo >thank you for your replies, >but still I got no clue what "saturated" genset exhaust looks like from >physics point of view... >Anybody? >Best Regards >Dimitris > >On 22/3/2016 8:00 ??, [email protected] wrote: >> Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >> ??? [email protected] >> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> ??? >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> ??? [email protected] >> >> You can reach the person managing the list at >> ??? [email protected] >> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." >> >> >> Today's Topics: >> >>? ? 1. Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>? ? ? (DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES) >>? ? 2. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Energies Naturals C.B.) >>? ? 3. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust ([email protected]) >>? ? 4. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Nicol? Cerni) >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Message: 1 >> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >> From: "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Subject: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >> Message-ID: <42F812A1CF574A238B33CED7CDEFE230@DimitrisPC> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> Hello all. >> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven genset >> in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or absolute >> humidity (gr/kgr)? >> >> Best Regards >> Dimitris >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: >> <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160321/bf5a7819/attachment-0001.html> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 2 >> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 21:59:08 +0100 >> From: "Energies Naturals C.B." <[email protected]> >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >> Message-ID: <[email protected]> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >> >> >> Hallo Dimitris, >> >> no idea if syngas exhaust behaves differently from diesel exhaust, but the >> latter comes out at around 400 ?C and can be very well used to dry wet >> biomass. It should be mixed with ambient air so as not to pyrolize or even >> ignite the biomass. >> I once spoke to people from Central America who had a very simple setup: >> A sort of tower where the raw biomass is filled in at the top and the >> exhaust/air comes from below in counterflow. >> They said that the humidity was driven off to the top and dry stuff could >> be taken out below. >> Seems simple... >> >> best regards >> >> Rolf >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >> "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Hello all. >>> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven genset >>> in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>> >>> Best Regards >>> Dimitris >> > >-- >??????, > >???????? ??????? >????.???????????? ????????? - MSc >_______________________________________ >??????? & ?????????? >?????????? 12 >?????? >?.?. 41222 >???./FAX:2410256400 >www.kokaras.gr >_______________________________________ > > > > >hello >we know we must offer our system >is it ok? > > >2016-03-23 18:38 GMT+01:00 Dimitris Tzagkas - KOKARAS AND ASSOCIATES ><[email protected]>: > >Dear Rolf,Leland,Nicolo >thank you for your replies, >but still I got no clue what "saturated" genset exhaust looks like from >physics point of view... >Anybody? >Best Regards >Dimitris > >On 22/3/2016 8:00 ??, [email protected] wrote: >> Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >>? ? ? [email protected] >> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >>? ? ? >>?http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >>? ? ? [email protected] >> >> You can reach the person managing the list at >>? ? ? [email protected] >> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." >> >> >> Today's Topics: >> >>? ? 1. Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>? ? ? ?(DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES) >>? ? 2. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Energies Naturals C.B.) >>? ? 3. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust ([email protected]) >>? ? 4. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Nicol? Cerni) >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Message: 1 >> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >> From: "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Subject: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >> Message-ID: <42F812A1CF574A238B33CED7CDEFE230@DimitrisPC> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> Hello all. >> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven genset >> in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or absolute >> humidity (gr/kgr)? >> >> Best Regards >> Dimitris >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: >> <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160321/bf5a7819/attachment-0001.html> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 2 >> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 21:59:08 +0100 >> From: "Energies Naturals C.B." <[email protected]> >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >> Message-ID: <[email protected]> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >> >> >> Hallo Dimitris, >> >> no idea if syngas exhaust behaves differently from diesel exhaust, but the >> latter comes out at around 400 ?C and can be very well used to dry wet >> biomass. It should be mixed with ambient air so as not to pyrolize or even >> ignite the biomass. >> I once spoke to people from Central America who had a very simple setup: >> A sort of tower where the raw biomass is filled in at the top and the >> exhaust/air comes from below in counterflow. >> They said that the humidity was driven off to the top and dry stuff could >> be taken out below. >> Seems simple... >> >> best regards >> >> Rolf >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >> "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Hello all. >>> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven genset >>> in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>> >>> Best Regards >>> Dimitris >> > >-- >??????, > >???????? ??????? >????.???????????? ????????? - MSc >_______________________________________ >??????? & ?????????? >?????????? 12 >?????? >?.?. 41222 >???./FAX:2410256400 >www.kokaras.gr >_______________________________________ > > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers,? News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > > >-- >gradite i nostri? piu' distinti saluti, Atentamente, >best regards, ? ?freundliche Gr??e ???????????? ??????????? > >Nicolo Cerni ,?N?C?A?(N)ico (C)erni (A)ssociateswww.nico-cerni.com?, >marketing industriale,[email protected] >Customers only?+39 340 830.67.97 - >Home office ???? +39 045?69.32.996 ( 24 hours voice recorder ) > >? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? >? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? >Europa HQ Deutschland Hr/? Mr Wilhelm Doenne > >Telefon ? ? ? ? +49. 5141.219.83.72 / ( 09:30 / 17:oo) - 5141 980 912 fx?( >DDU Celle ) Mobil ? ? ? ? ? ?+49.152 028 05119 ???(?Wilhelm? Doenne?)? ? ? >?Funk ? ? ? ? ? ? +49 176 457 38 790 ?.(?Nico Cerni?) > > >EPC? department - European and international contractors? > > >GENERAL CONTRACTOR company AES gmbh , Akazienweg, 16, D 15834 Rangsdorf ( >Berlin Brandenburg www.altair-pyro.com ,??Electrical? contractors? ? ??Esiet >Office (24h) +39.02.97.37.58.01 - ?ask reception for Mr Maurizio Andreoli >?( 09:oo-18: 3o ) - ? Skype : nico_cerni? > >THIS E MAIL IS CONFIDENTIAL OUR CONFIDENTIALITY AND NON DISCLOSURE AGREEMENT >APPLIES - ?DIESE NACHRICHT IST VERTRAULICH, ES GILT ?UNSERE >VERSCHWIEGENHEITSVEREINBARUNG > > > > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers,? News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > > >-------------- next part -------------- >An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >URL: ><http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160323/f638275b/attachment-0001.html> > >------------------------------ > >Message: 3 >Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 20:39:49 +0100 >From: Nicol? Cerni <[email protected]> >To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > <[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >Message-ID: > <caa0zrvctk5xqkea3wgwzb55-9pjn36df+orccnw27ic8m4a...@mail.gmail.com> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > >Hello > >sorry I ll be back Monday > >regards > > >2016-03-23 20:01 GMT+01:00 DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES < >[email protected]>: > >> Hi Nicolo. >> Thank you (but I believe that giving me an offer is irrelevant to the >> purpose of this list, isn't it?) >> Now to the point: >> According to my calulations, if we consider that a saturated genset >> exhaust stream is @ 415 oC with absolute humidity of 800 gr/kgr (stream A, >> this is what I ask - if its humidity is correct) and we mix it 50%-50% >> with >> ambient air of 25 oC with 50% relative humidity(stream B), the resulting >> stream will be a mixture of about 220 oC with an absolute humidity ~400 >> gr/kgr(stream C). >> This mixture stream C has a drying potential, but I do not know if the >> assumption on stream A is correct. >> Any ideas? >> Best Regards >> Dimitris >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- From: >> [email protected] >> Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2016 8:00 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 3 >> >> Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >> [email protected] >> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> [email protected] >> >> You can reach the person managing the list at >> [email protected] >> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." >> >> >> Today's Topics: >> >> 1. Re: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 >> (Dimitris Tzagkas - KOKARAS AND ASSOCIATES) >> 2. Re: Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 (Nicol? Cerni) >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Message: 1 >> Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 19:38:12 +0200 >> From: Dimitris Tzagkas - KOKARAS AND ASSOCIATES <[email protected]> >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 >> Message-ID: <[email protected]> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >> >> Dear Rolf,Leland,Nicolo >> thank you for your replies, >> but still I got no clue what "saturated" genset exhaust looks like from >> physics point of view... >> Anybody? >> Best Regards >> Dimitris >> >> On 22/3/2016 8:00 ??, [email protected] wrote: >> >>> Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >>> [email protected] >>> >>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >>> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >>> >>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >>> [email protected] >>> >>> You can reach the person managing the list at >>> [email protected] >>> >>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >>> than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." >>> >>> >>> Today's Topics: >>> >>> 1. Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> (DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES) >>> 2. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Energies Naturals C.B.) >>> 3. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust ([email protected]) >>> 4. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Nicol? Cerni) >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> Message: 1 >>> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >>> From: "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> >>> To: <[email protected]> >>> Subject: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> Message-ID: <42F812A1CF574A238B33CED7CDEFE230@DimitrisPC> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >>> >>> Hello all. >>> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven genset >>> in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>> >>> Best Regards >>> Dimitris >>> -------------- next part -------------- >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >>> URL: < >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160321/bf5a7819/attachment-0001.html >>> > >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 2 >>> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 21:59:08 +0100 >>> From: "Energies Naturals C.B." <[email protected]> >>> To: [email protected] >>> Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> Message-ID: <[email protected]> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >>> >>> >>> Hallo Dimitris, >>> >>> no idea if syngas exhaust behaves differently from diesel exhaust, but >>> the latter comes out at around 400 ?C and can be very well used to dry >>> wet >>> biomass. It should be mixed with ambient air so as not to pyrolize or >>> even >>> ignite the biomass. >>> I once spoke to people from Central America who had a very simple setup: >>> A sort of tower where the raw biomass is filled in at the top and the >>> exhaust/air comes from below in counterflow. >>> They said that the humidity was driven off to the top and dry stuff could >>> be taken out below. >>> Seems simple... >>> >>> best regards >>> >>> Rolf >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >>> "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> Hello all. >>>> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven >>>> genset in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>>> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>>> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>>> >>>> Best Regards >>>> Dimitris >>>> >>> >>> >> -- >> ??????, >> >> ???????? ??????? >> ????.???????????? ????????? - MSc >> _______________________________________ >> ??????? & ?????????? >> ?????????? 12 >> ?????? >> ?.?. 41222 >> ???./FAX:2410256400 >> www.kokaras.gr >> _______________________________________ >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 2 >> Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 18:48:27 +0100 >> From: Nicol? Cerni <[email protected]> >> To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification >> <[email protected]> >> Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 >> Message-ID: >> <caa0zrvchr-am70arizwritoso8ikm+gjwysp89mg8iej1b_...@mail.gmail.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> hello >> we know we must offer our system >> is it ok? >> >> >> 2016-03-23 18:38 GMT+01:00 Dimitris Tzagkas - KOKARAS AND ASSOCIATES < >> [email protected]>: >> >> Dear Rolf,Leland,Nicolo >>> thank you for your replies, >>> but still I got no clue what "saturated" genset exhaust looks like from >>> physics point of view... >>> Anybody? >>> Best Regards >>> Dimitris >>> >>> On 22/3/2016 8:00 ??, [email protected] >>> wrote: >>> > Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >>> > [email protected] >>> > >>> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >>> > >>> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >>> > >>> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >>> > [email protected] >>> > >>> > You can reach the person managing the list at >>> > [email protected] >>> > >>> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >>> > than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." >>> > >>> > >>> > Today's Topics: >>> > >>> > 1. Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> > (DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES) >>> > 2. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Energies Naturals C.B.) >>> > 3. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust ([email protected]) >>> > 4. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Nicol? Cerni) >>> > >>> > >>> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> > >>> > Message: 1 >>> > Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >>> > From: "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> >>> > To: <[email protected]> >>> > Subject: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> > Message-ID: <42F812A1CF574A238B33CED7CDEFE230@DimitrisPC> >>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >>> > >>> > Hello all. >>> > Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven >>> genset in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>> > I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>> > What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>> > >>> > Best Regards >>> > Dimitris >>> > -------------- next part -------------- >>> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >>> > URL: < >>> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160321/bf5a7819/attachment-0001.html >>> > >>> > >>> > ------------------------------ >>> > >>> > Message: 2 >>> > Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 21:59:08 +0100 >>> > From: "Energies Naturals C.B." <[email protected]> >>> > To: [email protected] >>> > Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> > Message-ID: <[email protected]> >>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >>> > >>> > >>> > Hallo Dimitris, >>> > >>> > no idea if syngas exhaust behaves differently from diesel exhaust, but >>> the latter comes out at around 400 ?C and can be very well used to dry >>> wet >>> biomass. It should be mixed with ambient air so as not to pyrolize or >>> even >>> ignite the biomass. >>> > I once spoke to people from Central America who had a very simple >>> > setup: >>> > A sort of tower where the raw biomass is filled in at the top and the >>> exhaust/air comes from below in counterflow. >>> > They said that the humidity was driven off to the top and dry stuff >>> could be taken out below. >>> > Seems simple... >>> > >>> > best regards >>> > >>> > Rolf >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >>> > "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> wrote: >>> > >>> >> Hello all. >>> >> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven >>> genset in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>> >> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>> >> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>> >> >>> >> Best Regards >>> >> Dimitris >>> > >>> >>> -- >>> ??????, >>> >>> ???????? ??????? >>> ????.???????????? ????????? - MSc >>> _______________________________________ >>> ??????? & ?????????? >>> ?????????? 12 >>> ?????? >>> ?.?. 41222 >>> ???./FAX:2410256400 >>> www.kokaras.gr >>> _______________________________________ >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Gasification mailing list >>> >>> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >>> [email protected] >>> >>> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >>> >>> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >>> >>> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >>> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> >> *gradite i nostri piu' distinti saluti, Atentamente,best regards, >> freundliche Gr??e *?????????? ??????????? >> >> *Nicolo Cerni , * >> *N C A* (N)ico (C)erni (A)ssociates >> www.nico-cerni.com , marketing industriale, [email protected] >> >> *Customers only * >> *+39 340 830.67.97 - Home office +39 045 69.32.996 ( 24 hours voice >> recorder )* >> >> >> >> *Europa HQ Deutschland Hr/ Mr Wilhelm Doenne* >> >> Telefon *+49. 5141.219.83.72 / ( 09:30 / 17:oo)* - 5141 980 912 >> fx ( DDU Celle ) >> Mobil +49.152 028 05119 ( *Wilhelm Doenne* ) >> Funk +49 176 457 38 790 .( *Nico Cerni *) >> >> >> *EPC department - European and international contractors * >> >> >> *GENERAL CONTRACTOR company AES gmbh , Akazienweg, 16, D 15834 Rangsdorf ( >> Berlin Brandenburg www.altair-pyro.com <http://www.altair-pyro.com> , >> ** Electrical >> contractors* Esiet Office (24h) +39.02.97.37.58.01 - ask reception >> for Mr Maurizio Andreoli ( 09:oo-18: 3o ) - *Skype : nico_cerni * >> >> >> *THIS E MAIL IS CONFIDENTIAL OUR CONFIDENTIALITY AND NON DISCLOSURE >> AGREEMENT APPLIES - DIESE NACHRICHT IST VERTRAULICH, ES GILT UNSERE >> VERSCHWIEGENHEITSVEREINBARUNG* >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: < >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160323/f0db76a2/attachment-0001.html >> > >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Subject: Digest Footer >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Gasification mailing list >> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >> [email protected] >> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >> >> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> End of Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 3 >> ******************************************* >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Gasification mailing list >> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >> [email protected] >> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >> >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >> >> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ >> > > > >-- > >*gradite i nostri piu' distinti saluti, Atentamente,best regards, >freundliche Gr??e *?????????? ??????????? > >*Nicolo Cerni , * >*N C A* (N)ico (C)erni (A)ssociates >www.nico-cerni.com , marketing industriale, [email protected] > >*Customers only * >*+39 340 830.67.97 - Home office +39 045 69.32.996 ( 24 hours voice >recorder )* > > > >*Europa HQ Deutschland Hr/ Mr Wilhelm Doenne* > >Telefon *+49. 5141.219.83.72 / ( 09:30 / 17:oo)* - 5141 980 912 >fx ( DDU Celle ) >Mobil +49.152 028 05119 ( *Wilhelm Doenne* ) >Funk +49 176 457 38 790 .( *Nico Cerni *) > > >*EPC department - European and international contractors * > > >*GENERAL CONTRACTOR company AES gmbh , Akazienweg, 16, D 15834 Rangsdorf ( >Berlin Brandenburg www.altair-pyro.com <http://www.altair-pyro.com> , >** Electrical >contractors* Esiet Office (24h) +39.02.97.37.58.01 - ask reception >for Mr Maurizio Andreoli ( 09:oo-18: 3o ) - *Skype : nico_cerni * > > >*THIS E MAIL IS CONFIDENTIAL OUR CONFIDENTIALITY AND NON DISCLOSURE >AGREEMENT APPLIES - DIESE NACHRICHT IST VERTRAULICH, ES GILT UNSERE >VERSCHWIEGENHEITSVEREINBARUNG* >-------------- next part -------------- >An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >URL: ><http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160323/ae16fea9/attachment-0001.html> > >------------------------------ > >Message: 4 >Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2016 08:26:06 +0530 >From: [email protected] >To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification > <[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 >Message-ID: <[email protected]> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed > >Hi Dimitris, > >Engine exhaust cannot be saturated because it is over 100 Deg C. Only >pure steam can be considered saturated at 100 deg c and 1 atm. > >Engine exhaust will have a saturation temperature that is decided by the >molar% of H2O in the exhaust. > >This is typically around 55 Deg C. > >Regards > >Shivanand > > > >On 2016-03-23 23:08, Dimitris Tzagkas - KOKARAS AND ASSOCIATES wrote: >> Dear Rolf,Leland,Nicolo >> thank you for your replies, >> but still I got no clue what "saturated" genset exhaust looks like from >> physics point of view... >> Anybody? >> Best Regards >> Dimitris >> >> On 22/3/2016 8:00 ??, [email protected] >> wrote: >>> Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >>> [email protected] >>> >>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >>> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >>> >>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >>> [email protected] >>> >>> You can reach the person managing the list at >>> [email protected] >>> >>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >>> than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." >>> >>> >>> Today's Topics: >>> >>> 1. Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> (DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES) >>> 2. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Energies Naturals >>> C.B.) >>> 3. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust ([email protected]) >>> 4. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Nicol? Cerni) >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> Message: 1 >>> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >>> From: "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> >>> To: <[email protected]> >>> Subject: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> Message-ID: <42F812A1CF574A238B33CED7CDEFE230@DimitrisPC> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >>> >>> Hello all. >>> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven >>> genset in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>> >>> Best Regards >>> Dimitris >>> -------------- next part -------------- >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >>> URL: >>> <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160321/bf5a7819/attachment-0001.html> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 2 >>> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 21:59:08 +0100 >>> From: "Energies Naturals C.B." <[email protected]> >>> To: [email protected] >>> Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> Message-ID: <[email protected]> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >>> >>> >>> Hallo Dimitris, >>> >>> no idea if syngas exhaust behaves differently from diesel exhaust, but >>> the latter comes out at around 400 ?C and can be very well used to dry >>> wet biomass. It should be mixed with ambient air so as not to pyrolize >>> or even ignite the biomass. >>> I once spoke to people from Central America who had a very simple >>> setup: >>> A sort of tower where the raw biomass is filled in at the top and the >>> exhaust/air comes from below in counterflow. >>> They said that the humidity was driven off to the top and dry stuff >>> could be taken out below. >>> Seems simple... >>> >>> best regards >>> >>> Rolf >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >>> "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Hello all. >>>> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven >>>> genset in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>>> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>>> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>>> >>>> Best Regards >>>> Dimitris >>> >> >> -- >> ??????, >> >> ???????? ??????? >> ????.???????????? ????????? - MSc >> _______________________________________ >> ??????? & ?????????? >> ?????????? 12 >> ?????? >> ?.?. 41222 >> ???./FAX:2410256400 >> www.kokaras.gr >> _______________________________________ >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Gasification mailing list >> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >> [email protected] >> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org >> >> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 5 >Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2016 20:33:53 -0700 >From: "Mark Elliott Ludlow" <[email protected]> >To: "'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification'" > <[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 >Message-ID: <[email protected]> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > >...however, it's temperature quickly falls! Automotive exhaust systems rust >away primarily because of condensation of moisture in the exhaust stream. > >Others have pointed-out that condensation is a very effective way to >transfer thermal energy, which drives moisture from the interior of fuel >particles. This is phenomenon is effectively used in very many counter-flow >drying apparati. > >Mark > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gasification [mailto:[email protected]] On >Behalf Of [email protected] >Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2016 7:56 PM >To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification ><[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 > >Hi Dimitris, > >Engine exhaust cannot be saturated because it is over 100 Deg C. Only pure >steam can be considered saturated at 100 deg c and 1 atm. > >Engine exhaust will have a saturation temperature that is decided by the >molar% of H2O in the exhaust. > >This is typically around 55 Deg C. > >Regards > >Shivanand > > > >On 2016-03-23 23:08, Dimitris Tzagkas - KOKARAS AND ASSOCIATES wrote: >> Dear Rolf,Leland,Nicolo >> thank you for your replies, >> but still I got no clue what "saturated" genset exhaust looks like >> from physics point of view... >> Anybody? >> Best Regards >> Dimitris >> >> On 22/3/2016 8:00 ??, [email protected] >> wrote: >>> Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >>> [email protected] >>> >>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >>> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.b >>> ioenergylists.org >>> >>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >>> [email protected] >>> >>> You can reach the person managing the list at >>> [email protected] >>> >>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >>> than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." >>> >>> >>> Today's Topics: >>> >>> 1. Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> (DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES) >>> 2. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Energies Naturals >>> C.B.) >>> 3. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust ([email protected]) >>> 4. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Nicol? Cerni) >>> >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> - >>> >>> Message: 1 >>> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >>> From: "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> >>> To: <[email protected]> >>> Subject: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> Message-ID: <42F812A1CF574A238B33CED7CDEFE230@DimitrisPC> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >>> >>> Hello all. >>> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven >>> genset in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>> >>> Best Regards >>> Dimitris >>> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was >>> scrubbed... >>> URL: >>> <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioener >>> gylists.org/attachments/20160321/bf5a7819/attachment-0001.html> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 2 >>> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 21:59:08 +0100 >>> From: "Energies Naturals C.B." <[email protected]> >>> To: [email protected] >>> Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> Message-ID: <[email protected]> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >>> >>> >>> Hallo Dimitris, >>> >>> no idea if syngas exhaust behaves differently from diesel exhaust, >>> but the latter comes out at around 400 ?C and can be very well used >>> to dry wet biomass. It should be mixed with ambient air so as not to >>> pyrolize or even ignite the biomass. >>> I once spoke to people from Central America who had a very simple >>> setup: >>> A sort of tower where the raw biomass is filled in at the top and the >>> exhaust/air comes from below in counterflow. >>> They said that the humidity was driven off to the top and dry stuff >>> could be taken out below. >>> Seems simple... >>> >>> best regards >>> >>> Rolf >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >>> "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Hello all. >>>> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven >>>> genset in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>>> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>>> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>>> >>>> Best Regards >>>> Dimitris >>> >> >> -- >> ??????, >> >> ???????? ??????? >> ????.???????????? ????????? - MSc >> _______________________________________ >> ??????? & ?????????? >> ?????????? 12 >> ?????? >> ?.?. 41222 >> ???./FAX:2410256400 >> www.kokaras.gr >> _______________________________________ >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Gasification mailing list >> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >> [email protected] >> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bi >> oenergylists.org >> >> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > > >------------------------------ > >Message: 6 >Date: Thu, 24 Mar 2016 07:52:05 -0700 >From: "Tom Miles" <[email protected]> >To: <[email protected]>, "'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and > gasification'" <[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 >Message-ID: <[email protected]> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > >Both direct and indirect methods are used. Sometimes heat from the engine >exhaust is transferred to drying air, or directly to the fuel, using a heat >exchanger. The temperature of the moisture laden exhaust exiting from the >dried material must be above the dew point of the gas. By the time you >dilute the engine exhaust to a temperature suitable for drying the fuel >without cooking it - usually 50C-120C/120F-250 F - the dew point is pretty >low so you need to dry in a thin layer, like on a belt, or blow the gas >through the fuel with enough velocity, and with enough time, to let the >condensation layer work up through the pile of fuel. In a thick bed or bin >the moisture condenses in a layer in the fuel until it gets hot enough to >evaporate. > >Tom > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gasification [mailto:[email protected]] On >Behalf Of Mark Elliott Ludlow >Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2016 8:34 PM >To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification' ><[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 > >...however, it's temperature quickly falls! Automotive exhaust systems rust >away primarily because of condensation of moisture in the exhaust stream. > >Others have pointed-out that condensation is a very effective way to >transfer thermal energy, which drives moisture from the interior of fuel >particles. This is phenomenon is effectively used in very many counter-flow >drying apparati. > >Mark > >-----Original Message----- >From: Gasification [mailto:[email protected]] On >Behalf Of [email protected] >Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2016 7:56 PM >To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification ><[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 2 > >Hi Dimitris, > >Engine exhaust cannot be saturated because it is over 100 Deg C. Only pure >steam can be considered saturated at 100 deg c and 1 atm. > >Engine exhaust will have a saturation temperature that is decided by the >molar% of H2O in the exhaust. > >This is typically around 55 Deg C. > >Regards > >Shivanand > > > >On 2016-03-23 23:08, Dimitris Tzagkas - KOKARAS AND ASSOCIATES wrote: >> Dear Rolf,Leland,Nicolo >> thank you for your replies, >> but still I got no clue what "saturated" genset exhaust looks like >> from physics point of view... >> Anybody? >> Best Regards >> Dimitris >> >> On 22/3/2016 8:00 ??, [email protected] >> wrote: >>> Send Gasification mailing list submissions to >>> [email protected] >>> >>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >>> >>> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.b >>> ioenergylists.org >>> >>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >>> [email protected] >>> >>> You can reach the person managing the list at >>> [email protected] >>> >>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >>> than "Re: Contents of Gasification digest..." >>> >>> >>> Today's Topics: >>> >>> 1. Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> (DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES) >>> 2. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Energies Naturals >>> C.B.) >>> 3. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust ([email protected]) >>> 4. Re: Drying using a syngas genset exhaust (Nicol? Cerni) >>> >>> >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> - >>> >>> Message: 1 >>> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >>> From: "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> >>> To: <[email protected]> >>> Subject: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> Message-ID: <42F812A1CF574A238B33CED7CDEFE230@DimitrisPC> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >>> >>> Hello all. >>> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven >>> genset in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>> >>> Best Regards >>> Dimitris >>> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was >>> scrubbed... >>> URL: >>> <http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioener >>> gylists.org/attachments/20160321/bf5a7819/attachment-0001.html> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 2 >>> Date: Mon, 21 Mar 2016 21:59:08 +0100 >>> From: "Energies Naturals C.B." <[email protected]> >>> To: [email protected] >>> Subject: Re: [Gasification] Drying using a syngas genset exhaust >>> Message-ID: <[email protected]> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >>> >>> >>> Hallo Dimitris, >>> >>> no idea if syngas exhaust behaves differently from diesel exhaust, >>> but the latter comes out at around 400 ?C and can be very well used >>> to dry wet biomass. It should be mixed with ambient air so as not to >>> pyrolize or even ignite the biomass. >>> I once spoke to people from Central America who had a very simple >>> setup: >>> A sort of tower where the raw biomass is filled in at the top and the >>> exhaust/air comes from below in counterflow. >>> They said that the humidity was driven off to the top and dry stuff >>> could be taken out below. >>> Seems simple... >>> >>> best regards >>> >>> Rolf >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Mon, 21 Mar 2016 20:50:01 +0200 >>> "DIMITRIS TZAGKAS-KOKARAS & ASSOCIATES" <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> Hello all. >>>> Has anyone ever tried to use the genset exhaust of a syngas driven >>>> genset in order to use it in a biomass dryer(rotary or something)? >>>> I can read in the literature that the syngas engine?s exhaust is >>>> saturated, but I cannot find experimental data anywhere. >>>> What does ?saturated? mean in numbers of relative humidity (%) or >>>> absolute humidity (gr/kgr)? >>>> >>>> Best Regards >>>> Dimitris >>> >> >> -- >> ??????, >> >> ???????? ??????? >> ????.???????????? ????????? - MSc >> _______________________________________ >> ??????? & ?????????? >> ?????????? 12 >> ?????? >> ?.?. 41222 >> ???./FAX:2410256400 >> www.kokaras.gr >> _______________________________________ >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Gasification mailing list >> >> to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >> [email protected] >> >> to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >> http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bi >> oenergylists.org >> >> for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >> http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > > >------------------------------ > >Subject: Digest Footer > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > >------------------------------ > >End of Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 4 >******************************************* > > > >------------------------------ > >Subject: Digest Footer > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > >------------------------------ > >End of Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 5 >******************************************* > > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > >-------------- next part -------------- >An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >URL: ><http://lists.bioenergylists.org/pipermail/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org/attachments/20160327/606229cc/attachment-0001.html> > >------------------------------ > >Subject: Digest Footer > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > > > >------------------------------ > >End of Gasification Digest, Vol 67, Issue 7 >******************************************* > > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ > >_______________________________________________ >Gasification mailing list > >to Send a Message to the list, use the email address >[email protected] > >to UNSUBSCRIBE or Change your List Settings use the web page >http://lists.bioenergylists.org/mailman/listinfo/gasification_lists.bioenergylists.org > >for more Gasifiers, News and Information see our web site: >http://gasifiers.bioenergylists.org/ _______________________________________________ Gasification mailing list to Send a Message to the list, use the email address [email 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