Carol, sorry to see your email took two days to get here. These sorts of list delays can be a bit confusing when reading through a thread. (Hint to list admin.)
I would be against setting up Wikimedia secret 'black ops' teams. It's actually been done before, and it's not good for the people involved. Black ops people may have fun playing amateur detective, but they tend to disappear down the rabbit hole along with their target. It's also really bad news for people that get targeted with false or mistaken allegations as it's rarely the case that targets of black ops get to examine evidence, or the opportunity to review possible Joe-job attacks. However, it would be good if the WMF were to /positively/ cooperate on assembling evidence to support victims who go to the police with harassment complaints. When I went to the police, the WMF pass over no data without a subpoena, and frankly the London met police have enough problems with resources to follow-up on knife attacks, and have absolutely no capacity to deal with international subpoena requests for data unless it's as serious as a potential terrorist attack or realistic death threats from a stalker. Add to this that the victim must officially request the data via a U.S. court within the 90 days before the WMF permanently deletes it, and the system is crazily biased towards protecting the anonymity of harassers and trolls. Similarly, it would be nice if a volunteer team, who are not selected because they are Wikipedia admins or checkusers, were available to help long term targets of harassment with better management of their social profile, as well as helping to collect evidence of a harasser misusing external social networks so that the victim can make sensible and well informed complaints to the service providers. However volunteer teams would need specialist training, as part of their role will always be to act as a sounding board rather than simply taking or advising on action. There are some dedicated WMF resources, but many victims would be more comfortable discussing cases with independent people who are not obligated to keep internal WMF records. Fae On 7 February 2017 at 16:52, Carol Moore dc <carolmoor...@verizon.net> wrote: > Hopefully having a metric will make it easier to stop obvious harassment > within Wikipedia. I complained for a year to several admins and in at least > one ANI on a related topic about the one male ideologue who followed me to > many and then eventually most articles to criticize, insult and revert me. > But it wasn't til a male editor noticed and complained to ANI about an > obviously biased revert being part of a pattern of his harassing me that an > admin - and eventually Arbitators- finally sanctioned him with one way > interaction band. > > I agree defacto therapy is a good way to deal with guys who psychologically > can't handle having women criticizing and reverting them. It won't stop > committed ideologues like the above, but at least it will slow them down and > discourage them. > > As for the offline harassers, I had my problems in 2011 when Wikimedia > Foundation was pretty slow to respond even though they'd dealt with aserial > harasser of men and women who was kicked off wikipedia years go. He just > decided to pick on me over some issue he disagreed with, including a 1000 > odd death threats delivered via email through the wikifoundation email > system. It took several months after my complaints to them before it stopped > and I don't know if foundation stopped it. A year or so later I got a short > string of threats. (Since he was on other side of country and known for this > I didn't contact police cause who needs feds rummaging around their > computer? If he was in neighborhood I might have.) > > Re: other harassment in multiple forums. One thing they could use the money > for is a couple internet detectives who could identify the harasser's > various handles and get them kicked off forums where they are harassing > (twitter/FB/etc.). Even get them kicked off their internet provider if > possible. Of course, there'd have to be some adjustment of the outing > policy. Like, it's OK for the foundation to do it if it's a serious > problem? Or is that the policy now? > > CM > > > > On 2/7/2017 5:09 AM, Fæ wrote: >> >> I find it depressing that the only actually *planned* way that this >> money is going be spent is on developing reports and tools to hunt >> down apparent harassers so that they can be blocked. Meh. >> >> For those of us that have experienced obsessive harassment, we know >> that this is not a cure. When the harassment continues off-wiki, >> sometimes for years, the only advice from the WMF or on-wiki groups is >> for the *victim* to vanish, meaning that those that were outed have to >> close down their Facebook, LinkedIn, etc. accounts with all the >> associated damage that comes with being forced to take a paranoid >> path; not even mentioning how the rest of the Wiki-community is >> affected by seeing how trolling does not stop until the target >> vanishes or goes in to hiding for a few years. A better use of this >> money would be to try new methods of engaging with the apparent >> harasser and consider ways of encouraging them to change their >> behaviour. >> >> I doubt that many of the trolls that post misogynistic, racist or >> homophobic rubbish believe in these views, they are seeking attention, >> for personal reasons they may not even understand themselves. An >> approach to harassment that offers experienced counselling and support >> to both victim and attacker has a much better chance of being both an >> effective and long-term solution. >> >> Based on the related email discussion, the WMF seem to think that >> long-term solutions are a community problem, so that's not something >> they have any plans to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on. I'd >> much rather see the smaller part of the money spent on more software >> development, and the majority spent setting up support services that >> handle alleged harassment in a more mature way, even if the people who >> are doing the real support work end up being us volunteers. >> >> Fae >> >> On 27 January 2017 at 20:16, Carol Moore dc <carolmoor...@verizon.net> >> wrote: >>> >>> >>> http://www.ctvnews.ca/sci-tech/craigslist-founder-donates-500k-to-curb-wikipedia-trolls-1.3259781 >>> >>> Wow! When I think of the 2 plus hrs a week x 385 odd weeks of hours I >>> spent >>> dealing with guys who just didn't like the idea that a "female" dared to >>> edit - or worse, change their edit - I still tear my hair out. >>> >>> I just hope it helps!! >>> >>> I'd like to go back in a few years when hopefully have accomplished other >>> goals. Or ENCOURAGE women to edit, as opposed to now having to warn them >>> all >>> the time about what they have to do to edit safely! >>> >>> CM >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Gendergap mailing list >>> Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org >>> To manage your subscription preferences, including unsubscribing, please >>> visit: >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap >> >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Gendergap mailing list > Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org > To manage your subscription preferences, including unsubscribing, please > visit: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap -- fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote. _______________________________________________ Gendergap mailing list Gendergap@lists.wikimedia.org To manage your subscription preferences, including unsubscribing, please visit: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/gendergap
