Peter Donald wrote:
On Tue, 22 Oct 2002 08:49, Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote:
I remember that I had a discussion with Peter on this one ;-) since I had vetoed something I hadn't worked on and it got Peter upset...
I didn't get upset - however others were calling for your blood ;)
Well you should have been ;-)
For the others, I haven't heard anything from them (unfortunately), but I remember you mentioning it 8-S
When someone has put in a lot of work to get something somewhere and then without participating or even knowledge of what they are doing you try to block them... Well you are bound to ruffle more than a few feathers. You want to change the way things work? Then you better be willing to put in some work to change them. If you just want to lord it from on high ... well I am not sure that fits in with Apaches idea of meritocracy.
Yes, in fact it was not my intention to block anyone, I made a mistake in vetoing something when effectively I just wanted to say my opinion.
If they would had just told me "why are you blocking me if you don't collaborate" I would have corrected my stand immediately, but luckily enough you told me ;-)
Personally I think that each committer has the same rights on all code, but I'd like to hear different opinions from others too...
Until relatively recently I thought much the same though in the last year or so I have changed my mind. I remember at one stage me and Sam were trying to convince Jon that we should flatten CVS permissions - didn't fly though as he pointed out you occasionally get problem committers.
You have seen the problems that occured in avalon when egos get power that they dont deserve. And it is all but impossible to remove a committer once in position and there is no process in place to stop them doing fucked up things.
Yes.
But I'd like to point out, without offense, that what you think is fucking up things the other thinks is the right thing, and viceversa.
This of course doesn't say that blocking others without contributing is right, because it's wrong wrong wrong.
But I honestly am not sure that this can be made into a rule, because sometimes involvement in other parts of the code can make one block something in another part...
What I'm trying to say is that probably if I had worked *heavily* in the Framework and Excalibur codebases, which is not the case since I just did minor contributions and fixes on the code, I would have probably been heard on Phoenix too, and with right.
But still Phoenix is effectively a separate project, and so I sould not have been able to veto it anyway.
Probably splitting Avalon in smaller projects will make this problem go away, dunno.
Then again it also can also cause some significant harm. ie Sam or Stefan get irritated when they can't go in and fix up gump problems directly when they should be able to. You have also seen Paul go through the whole Avalon codebase and fix up all our build scripts.
Anyhow you may notice that I have been confusing voting and commit privlidges. It was kinda deliberate. Most people confuse them.
You mean that there is a rule about separation of these privileges? Hmmm...
Personally I think that voting privlidges are something that are given by the developers of the component. That ensures that a certain level of cooperation and direction is built into the community. However it also does not stop people who want to go through and fix spelling mistakes, build file errors and whatnot.
IMHO voting privileges are not given by the developer of the component. I regard this as very wrong (but probably you meant it as a "moral" rule)
We are doing projects, not components.
The first thing Stefano did when I came in was to change the tyle of my code and do minor modifications.
Did I get upset? Yes.
Was I right? No.
But he was active on it. Not blocking.
I see that you have your point, but I don't really like the conclusion you come to...
I see mine, but am aware that without proper respect they can create distorsions...
Hmmm...
--
Nicola Ken Barozzi [EMAIL PROTECTED]
- verba volant, scripta manent -
(discussions get forgotten, just code remains)
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