> There are also another much less studied sink under our feet: the cold soils > and > bedrocks, warming ice on glaciers and ice sheets, melting of marine and > terrestrial > ice. The ever increasing break-up of ever larger and ever more frequent ice > shelves > into sea water also mops up huge amounts of heat.
I would call those reservoirs, rather than sinks. It lets the point be summed up with a contrast of just two words. On May 1, 5:01 am, Albert Kallio <[email protected]> wrote: > Dear Eugen (?), > > "While a higher concentration of CO2 in the atmosphere should increase > average surface temperature through what is improperly called the greenhouse > effect, the average surface temperature would be increasing in any case > independent of anthropogenic emissions." > > I totally repudiate this statement that it is "improper" to call CO2 as > greenhouse effectant. If carbon dioxide did not produce heat trapping our > planet would be just a cold snowball. > > If there are a natural climatic forcing from chemicals called greenhouse > gases that trap the heat, surely there will be also for the anthropogenic > sources that have been added into air. > > This seems argument similar to Holocaust deniers. If greenhouse gases are > added, more climatic warming forcing is added, if greenhouse gases are > deducted climatic forcing reduces. What one might debate, is how much is the > underlying forcing in relation to variability. Even this question setting is > highly dubious due to risen GHG concentrations and the added heat flows into > the polar regions being absorved by melting ice and cold grounds. > > All too often the meteorologists look to the sky and space beyond as the sink > of the heat. There are also another much less studied sink under our feet: > the cold soils and bedrocks, warming ice on glaciers and ice sheets, melting > of marine and terrestrial ice. The ever increasing break-up of ever larger > and ever more frequent ice shelves into sea water also mops up huge amounts > of heat. > > Let us only await when the Antarctic Penisular ice shelve breakups extend to > Ronne and Ross and once these have their spectacular break-ups, we see a > sudden the "latest Dryas" in parts of the world where these ice masses > dissolve and melt into sea water. > > I am also surprised of the surface temperature increasing over long-term > context, could you please explain this as most people think the opposite that > it is decreasing as without addition of greenhouse gas effectants the > Milankovits' orbital forcing tends towards cooling. > > I am here assuming the prevailing assumption that the orbital changes > originated the ice age(s) rather then my own thesis of geothermal > fluctuations from the Mid-Atlantic ridge inducing large scale warming of the > North Atlantic Ocean leading to percipitations that rapidly built up the > Laurentide Ice sheet on the north of the North American continent as the > complainant nations behind UNGA 101292 say to the United Nations General > Assembly. If you take Milutin Milankovits away, then you are free to say > anything you like. But I just can't take geothermal heat fluctuations and > large scale volcanic seabed eruptions around Icelandic seas to take away any > argument for us from constraining from CO2 emissions. > > So where you get your idea that we are heading towards warming, do you mean > sun is turning now into supergiant phase, that heat output increas will occur > over billions of years, not even during millions of years this is yet to be > seen and well below solar radiation variability. In fact, the sun is now > cooling down rather than hotting up and lacks sunspots. > > With kind regards, > > Veli Albert Kallio > > The climatic > > > > > From: [email protected] > > To: [email protected]; [email protected] > > CC: [email protected] > > Subject: [geo] Re: Televised debate > > Date: Thu, 30 Apr 2009 17:16:52 -0400 > > > I keep saying it but you all seem to either disagree, but say nothing, or do > > not understand. While a higher concentration of CO2 in the atmosphere should > > increase average surface temperature through what is improperly called the > > greenhouse effect, the average surface temperature would be increasing in > > any case independent of anthropogenic emissions. It is what the Earth has > > done many times in the past and is doing again quite independent of AGW. So > > even if we stopped all anthropogenic greenhouse gas emissions tomorrow, the > > Earth would continue to warm; albeit more slowly and not monotonically; but > > warm it will. Ultimately geoengineering will be needed independent of > > whether we cease the AGW component or not. Don't view geoengineering as a > > stopgap until we can get out act together. It will prove to be essential. > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [email protected] > > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] > > Sent: Thursday, April 30, 2009 4:15 PM > > To: [email protected] > > Cc: geoengineering > > Subject: [geo] Re: Televised debate > > > Are you crazy? This is not the question. No-one on the geoeng "side" > > is suggesting we give up on mitigation. We MUST MUST MUST do this. > > Geoeng will (in my view) probably needed as well. > > > Please see my paper on Combined Mitigation and Geoeng in Science a couple of > > years ago. > > > Tom. > > > ++++++++++++++++++ > > > > Dear all, > > > > We at One Planet Pictures are interested in setting up a televised > > > debate on geoengineering. Something on the lines of: "This house > > > believes we should give up trying to reduce emissions and concentrate > > > instead on finding a technofix". > > > > Can anyone suggest any companies or institutions that might be > > > interested in sponsoring such a debate? > > > > Many thanks > > > > Gus > > _________________________________________________________________ > Share your photos with Windows Live Photos – > Free.http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/ --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "geoengineering" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/geoengineering?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
