Thanks. To be fair, about half of it did come from the patent. If I did that all day, my ability to drool would be severely enhanced.
Reading several times? Ouch. I think I'd rather take your word for what it says. Then again, Einstein worked in a patent office. Maybe decoding gobbledygook is good mental exercise. > There seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding about how hurricanes form > and exist after formation that all of the authors of this and similar ideas > seem to not get< Could you point me to someplace where you've elaborated, please? On Jul 15, 3:02 pm, "Alvia Gaskill" <[email protected]> wrote: > Very good! The first time I read this, I thought it actually came from the > patent. Have you considered a career as a patent attorney? I hear the pay > is good, but afterwards, your ability to communicate in written form will be > severely diminished. I would recommend reading it several times. It does > become somewhat clearer with each iteration. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "dsw_s" <[email protected]> > To: "geoengineering" <[email protected]> > Sent: Wednesday, July 15, 2009 2:39 PM > Subject: [geo] Re: Hurricane Insurance > > In yet still another aspect, not meant to be limiting, an exemplary > embodiment of thermally-enhanced ambient gases previously utilized in > the provision of patent-related legal services regarding the methods > herein referenced, could be released in at one surface region distant > from at least one storm, altering global circulation patterns etc. > > Has anyone sorted through the gobbledygook to see what if anything the > patent application actually says? > > On Jul 15, 11:53 am, "Alvia Gaskill" <[email protected]> wrote: > > Since we had a lengthy discussion about hurricane suppression and their > > contribution to global heat transport recently, I thought this would be of > > interest, especially since at least 4 group members are listed on the > > patent application. I've already had discussions with some of the people > > involved in this, but will limit my comments to information in the patent > > application. > > > 1. The number of units (actually large floating rings with a plastic > > conduit extending below the surface) required to be effective is > > prohibitively large, just as in the case of the Atmocean and > > Lovelock/Rapley ideas, even though this one is based on a slightly > > different principle of getting denser deep water to mix with shallow > > surface water creating an equilibrium zone, thereby cooling the surface > > water and bringing up nutrient rich water into the photic zone. > > > 2. The plastic conduit is described as either flexible or inflexible. The > > "flexible" one used in Discovery Project Earth's "Hungry Ocean" was 1000 > > ft long, made of what looked like a garbage bag-like material and lasted > > all of 1 day before ocean currents took care of it. The sturdiness of this > > material would seem to be a weak link in the design as it would have to > > withstand a real pounding and the heavier the material, the more costly. > > > 3. Moving them around in anticipation of hurricanes or hurricane season > > would be equally prohibitively expensive or even impossible, although > > possibility is claimed in the patent (you can "claim" anything you want in > > a patent application). > > > 4. There seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding about how hurricanes > > form and exist after formation that all of the authors of this and similar > > ideas seem to not get or not want to get as that would spell the end of > > the idea and the flow of money from the financiers. I note that none of > > the names on the patent application are of hurricane experts. > > > 5. For hurricanes to form, the SST (sea surface temperature) has to be > > around 81 degrees F down to about 150 ft. Once formed, however, hurricanes > > can travel over much colder water without losing their integrity, although > > some decline in intensity is likely. This depends in part on how fast they > > are moving. > > > 6. Since one area of interest is the Gulf of Mexico (prime insurance > > territory I am told), I've included several figures showing the depth of > > water in the Gulf and Atlantic at different times of the year at which the > > temperature is 79 degrees F (the 81 degree figure is for formation, 79 is > > often reported as a temperature for continued existence without loss of > > energy). > > > 7. In May of this year, the 79F depth was more than 300 ft in the western > > Carribean and parts of the Gulf. In early September 2007, this 300 ft > > depth extended into the Gulf and was nearly 500 ft off the coast of > > Louisiana. The 79F depth of over 200 ft. was prevalent throughout the > > Caribbean and along the southeast coast of the U.S. > > > 8. These depth figures are important as the proposed device would extend > > downward 100 ft. For it to function as intended, it would have to draw up > > water from well below 100 ft that is much colder than 79F to create a > > hurricane unfriendly pool of water. It isn't at all clear that would be > > the case. It may just recycle one parcel of warm water with another one. > > > 9. Rather than waste resources on trying to cool off the entire Atlantic > > basin, a better use of this idea would be to position the wave pumps over > > the Loop Current, shown below. This is believed to be the source of the > > very warm water that caused Katrina and Rita to explode from Cat 1 to Cat > > 5 status in less than 48 hours. However, this current still covers a very > > large area and is more than 100 miles wide. > > > 10. Other uses of the device to provide nutrients to enhance phytoplankton > > growth, reduce atmospheric CO2 and increase fish populations seem equally > > speculative, given that no one has to date shown that other than temporary > > blooms from adding iron any of these are possible. The goal of increasing > > fish populations seems to overlook the fact that the baby fish have to > > grow up somewhere else and that ecosystem may be the determining factor, > > not artificially elevated nutrient levels in surface waters. > > > 11. It's good to see that Myhrvold and Gates through their Ventures group > > are looking at some of these ideas. I published an interview with M last > > year you may recall where he and Gates were confidently predicting they > > had solved global warming, hurricanes and other problems. Predictions, > > however are much easier than solutions, as Microsoft's Tuesday patch > > e-mails regularly demonstrate. At least no mosquitoes were harmed in this > > effort. > > > 12. Finally, Ken has served on a number of panels and given interviews > > where he has expressed skepticism and dismay over various OIF schemes. Now > > it seems, he is in the business himself. I guess it's hard to keep from > > biting the apples when your job is to inspect the orchard. > > >http://www.popsci.com/scitech/article/2009-07/bill-gates-files-patent... > > > Bored With PCs, Bill Gates Sets His Sights On Controlling the Weather > > Microsoft's chairman is part of a joint patent filing for using fleets of > > vessels to stop hurricanes via geoengineering > > By Jeremy Hsu Posted 07.10.2009 at 12:11 pm 18 Comments > > > Bill Gates' Plan to Stop Hurricanes: A diagram from one of the newly > > disclosed Gates and Myhrvold patent filings, depicting a deployment of > > hurricane-supression vessels in the Gulf of Mexico. via TechFlash > > Truly this is the age of Greenfinger: Billionaire Bill Gates has patented > > the idea to halt hurricanes by decreasing the surface temperature of the > > ocean. > > > The patent calls for a large fleet of specially equipped ships which would > > mix warm water from the ocean surface with colder water down below, > > according to five new patents that include Microsoft's chairman as a > > co-inventor. That could then reduce or perhaps eliminate the heat-driven > > condensation which hurricanes feed upon, thus significantly reducing their > > intensity. > > > Patent-watcher "theodp" first spotted the new patent filings, and told > > TechFlash that the scheme reminded him of something Mr. Burns might have > > concocted in "The Simpsons" -- if the fictional industrialist hadn't > > already blown his master plan on blocking out the sun. > > The hurricane-stopper plan apparently hatched from a meeting of > > Intellectual Ventures, a patent house which regularly gathers scientists > > and technologists to brainstorm together. TechFlash notes that the > > official filings came through an Intellectual Ventures affiliate, Searete > > LLC. > > > One of the five patents also suggests how to pay > > for the massive seagoing fleet, including selling insurance policies in > > hurricane-prone areas -- so much for the billionaire backer. > > > This represents just the latest in a long line of geoengineering proposals > > aimed at taming Mother Nature, whether aimed at climate change or > > hurricanes. Even the prestigious National Academy of Sciences held a > > workshop in June on geoengineering, although that ended with disagreements > > on whether the cure might be worse than the problem. > > > We previously looked at other plans regarding hurricanes, such as sending > > supersonic jets slicing into the eye of the giant storms. But for now, > > it's likely that coastal cities should at least invest in more grounded > > ideas to become hurricane-proof. > > >http://appft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO1&Sect2=HITOFF&d=P... > > > United States Patent Application 20090177569 > > Kind Code A1 > > Bowers; Jeffrey A. ; et al. July 9, 2009 > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Water alteration structure risk management or ecological alteration > > management systems and methods > > > Abstract > > A method of managing risk includes selling individual insurance policies > > regarding areas to be protected by storm suppression equipment. The method > > discussed also includes finding at least one of purchase, operation, or > > maintenance of the storm suppression equipment at least partially through > > premiums collected from the selling. > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Inventors: Bowers; Jeffrey A.; (Kirkland, WA) ; Caldeira; Kenneth G.; > > (Campbell, CA) ; Chan; Alistair K.; (Stillwater, MN) ; Gates, III; William > > H.; (Redmond, WA) ; Hyde; Roderick A.; (Redmond, WA) ; Ishikawa; Muriel > > Y.; (Livermore, CA) ; Kare; Jordin T.; (Seattle, WA) ; Latham; John; > > (Boulder, CO) ; Myhrvold; Nathan > > ... > > read more » --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "geoengineering" group. 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