My proposal was not to establish political institutions and agreements, but to aim for establishment of norms.
For example, countries could be encouraged at this time to make public statements like: *If things every got so bad that we felt compelled to deploy a solar geoengineering system, we will, before deployment, stop building devices that use the atmosphere as a waste dump.* * * Even absent enforcement mechanisms, propagation of this norm could prove powerful. _______________ Ken Caldeira Carnegie Institution for Science Dept of Global Ecology 260 Panama Street, Stanford, CA 94305 USA +1 650 704 7212 [email protected] http://dge.stanford.edu/labs/caldeiralab @kencaldeira On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 2:07 PM, Philip M. Macnaghten < [email protected]> wrote: > Ken > > You make a good point (on which I agree in principle). > > However, if you think this through, you need to imagine what kind of > political institutions and agreements need to be in place to 'police' all > nation-states to ensure that 'no-one builds new CO2-emitting devices' > (cars, power stations, infrastructure etc.). And whether this is in any way > plausible in current circumstances. > > The wider point is that in a number of respects (including for the reason > you suggest below) it is implausible to imagine how SRM can be compatible > with current, liberal, democratic institutions. I suggest that the > 'political' challenges posed by SRM need further consideration in groups > such as this one. > > We have developed a paper on this point which I will be happy to share > with the group when an on-line version is available (hopefully in the next > month or so). > > Phil > > Visiting Professor**** > > Department of Science and Technology Policy**** > > Institute of Geosciences**** > > P.O. Box 6152**** > > State University of Campinas – UNICAMP**** > > 13083-970, Campinas, SP, Brazil**** > > > > Professor of Geography**** > > Department of Geography**** > > Science Laboratories**** > > Durham University**** > > South Road**** > > Durham, DH1 3LE, UK > > > > From: Ken Caldeira <[email protected]> > Reply-To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > Date: Wednesday, 11 September 2013 14:51 > To: Andrew Lockley <[email protected]> > Cc: geoengineering <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [geo] Linking solar geoengineering and emissions reduction > > Note that I did not require decarbonization of the economy as a > pre-requisite for deployment as my proposal allows existing CO2-emitting > devices to continue being used. I merely required that we stop building > new CO2-emitting devices. > > My point is that if climate change is enough of an emergency to require > rapid deployment of solar geoengineering then it is also enough of an > emergency to stop building devices that will exacerbate that emergency. > > If we are doing solar geoengineering at the same time as we are building > new fossil-fueled power plants that use the atmosphere as a waste dump, how > do you assure that the solar geoengineering system does not facilitate > continued production of those devices? > > > _______________ > Ken Caldeira > > Carnegie Institution for Science > Dept of Global Ecology > 260 Panama Street, Stanford, CA 94305 USA > +1 650 704 7212 [email protected] > http://dge.stanford.edu/labs/caldeiralab @kencaldeira > > > > > On Wed, Sep 11, 2013 at 1:25 PM, Andrew Lockley > <[email protected]>wrote: > >> Ken >> >> We need to control temperatures far more quickly than we can hope to >> decarbonise the economy. >> >> Are you seriously trying to argue that every car factory in the world >> needs to close before we can do any SRM at all? That seems entirely >> implausible. >> >> Perhaps more sensible to suggest that emissions growth be capped >> (possibly at zero) before geoengineering starts. >> >> As I see it the 'buy time' argument for SRM is a strong one. We need to >> stop temperatures increasing *whilst * we decarbonise. >> >> A >> On Sep 11, 2013 5:36 PM, "Ken Caldeira" <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >>> We do not want to be in a situation where a solar geoengineering system >>> is used to enable continued increases in CO2 emissions. >>> >>> Therefore, a reasonable demand is that no new smokestacks or tailpipes >>> be built after a solar geoengineering system is deployed. >>> >>> Another way of phrasing this is to demand that new construction of all >>> new CO2-emitting devices cease prior to any solar geoengineering system >>> deployment. >>> >>> This would help address the concern that solar geoengineering could >>> provide cover for continued expansion of CO2-emitting industries. >>> >>> Norms that would prevent simultaneous solar geoengineering deployment >>> and increasing CO2 emissions would help diminish the likelihood of bad >>> outcomes and could help broaden political support for solar geoengineering >>> research. >>> >>> -- >>> >>> This would limit deployment of solar geoengineering systems to the case >>> of "catastrophic" outcomes and would not permit use of solar geoengineering >>> for "peak shaving" amid promises of future reductions in CO2 emissions. >>> Thus, this proposal does have a substantive implications for "peak >>> shaving" strategies. >>> >>> -- >>> >>> *I am floating this idea without being certain that the formulation >>> presented here is the best possible formulation.* >>> >>> _______________ >>> Ken Caldeira >>> >>> Carnegie Institution for Science >>> Dept of Global Ecology >>> 260 Panama Street, Stanford, CA 94305 USA >>> +1 650 704 7212 [email protected] >>> http://dge.stanford.edu/labs/caldeiralab @kencaldeira >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "geoengineering" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/geoengineering. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "geoengineering" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/geoengineering. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "geoengineering" group. 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