I agree prefixes as a crutch for a table of contents like folder structure
is not working (does not scale).
I kind of wish we could remove prefixes since they do not add value (either
as a indication of technology or as indication of function). We would then
have the possibility for naming conflicts of course.
--
Jody Garnett
On Thu, 26 Jul 2018 at 05:47, Andrea Aime <[email protected]>
wrote:
> Hi,
> I see the discussion stopped, that's not a good sign.
> Look, I'm happy to pitch in provided things are done right, as I too agree
> the current situation is messy.
>
> If you want to keep the geo/ras/whatever prefixes, I'm happy to do the
> work to make deprecation more evident (adding warnings in the logs and
> visible remarks in the DescribeProcess output), provided others do the rest.
>
> If you instead you're happy going back to the old prefixes and deprecate
> ((first) and the remove the new ones, I'm asking nothing of you, I'll do it
> entirely on my own (but if people want to still help, they are more than
> welcomed!)
>
> Just let me know?
>
> Cheers
> Andrea
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 4:23 PM Andrea Aime <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi Jody,
>> so you're worried about people using process factories directly? I guess
>> that would do, but believe
>> it would be equally good to just write a WARN log with an indication of
>> what replaced the process.
>> Given the dynamic lookup in the middle indeed pure java deprecation won't
>> do.
>>
>> I was however worried about WPS users, check the documentation, there is
>> no trace of the new processes (or in other words, at least in the pages
>> I've looked at, the old names are being used, haven't found an example of
>> the new ones):
>> http://docs.geoserver.org/latest/en/user/services/wps/index.html
>>
>> So, if you want to proceed with the new naming, I believe it can be done
>> at a few conditions:
>>
>> - Update the documentation using only the new process names and leave
>> users at least one cycle to adapt (best two)
>> - Make it clear and visible that the processes are deprecated. Warn
>> when they are used in the logs, maybe also add an extra tagline in the
>> process description stating the process is deprecated, and what replaces
>> it, so that a simple user of the WPS can notice by looking at the
>> DescribeProcess and process builder
>> - Maybe keep it that way for a cycle, and then make the processes
>> disappear from the UI and capabilities, but allow direct usage of them for
>> a little while longer, and/or add a flag to allow their usage (can be a
>> system variable?)
>>
>> To be honest, I still don't like the new nomeclature, it's conflict
>> prone, different providers can offer the same process (e.g. buffer) with
>> differences in algorithm, speed, tolerance to topological issues and so on,
>> but with the current approach they would all end up in the geo family
>> (geo:buffer, geo:grass_buffer ?), or else, we'd have differences between
>> what is an inner process (classified by type) and one coming from an
>> external system, e.g., a grass:buffer one.
>> When evaluating a process knowing who's providing it (gdal, grass,
>> geotools) is imho more important than knowing from the prefix what are its
>> inputs.
>> Also working with custom processes so far it has seemed more natural to
>> put them in vendor own "namespace" rather than sliding them in the
>> geo/vec/ras familities ("but these are our processes" is the typical
>> comment).
>>
>> Also, from another angle... how would you classify the download processes
>> (community module soon to become supported)?
>> Right now they all fall in the "gs:" family, but if that gets removed,
>> where do they go? Download vector in vec, download raster in ras,
>> download large map and animation in ... what? Or should one create a
>> separate "dwn:" family? I'd go for the latter, the similar bits
>> in the processes there is the ability to call them asynchronously to
>> support a large download, it's not for example the cutting ability
>> that some have... but it feels overkill to me.
>>
>> Cheers
>> Andrea
>>
>> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 3:29 PM Jody Garnett <[email protected]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I would be happy to add an isDeprecated() flag to the API to make this
>>> something that can be discovered. The GeoServer security page then can then
>>> based the default "enabled" status on if the process factory is deprecated.
>>> --
>>> Jody Garnett
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, 24 Jul 2018 at 13:55, Andrea Aime <[email protected]>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> It is deprecated only if one checks process security though, I asked
>>>> before if it is documented too and/or visible in other ways too?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers
>>>> Andrea
>>>>
>>>> Il mar 24 lug 2018, 22:06 Jody Garnett <[email protected]> ha
>>>> scritto:
>>>>
>>>>> How about for this release we disable it by default, and it can still
>>>>> be there to enable (for any installations that need more time to migrate).
>>>>>
>>>>> It has been marked as deprecated for some time in the UI (the title is
>>>>> "Deprecated processes" in the user interface).
>>>>> --
>>>>> Jody Garnett
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, 24 Jul 2018 at 07:22, Simone Giannecchini <
>>>>> [email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Although I am always eager to remove deprecated stuff I send what
>>>>>> Andrea said, we should not break existing installations.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maybe in the future we will be wiser with deprecations...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>> Simone Giannecchini
>>>>>> ==
>>>>>> GeoServer Professional Services from the experts!
>>>>>> Visit http://goo.gl/it488V for more information.
>>>>>> ==
>>>>>> Ing. Simone Giannecchini
>>>>>> @simogeo
>>>>>> Founder/Director
>>>>>>
>>>>>> GeoSolutions S.A.S.
>>>>>> Via di Montramito 3/A
>>>>>> 55054 Massarosa (LU)
>>>>>> Italy
>>>>>> phone: +39 0584 962313
>>>>>> fax: +39 0584 1660272
>>>>>> mob: +39 333 8128928
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.geo-solutions.it
>>>>>> http://twitter.com/geosolutions_it
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>> Con riferimento alla normativa sul trattamento dei dati personali
>>>>>> (Reg. UE 2016/679 - Regolamento generale sulla protezione dei dati
>>>>>> “GDPR”), si precisa che ogni circostanza inerente alla presente email
>>>>>> (il suo contenuto, gli eventuali allegati, etc.) è un dato la cui
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>>>>>> scrivente. Se il messaggio Le è giunto per errore, è tenuta/o a
>>>>>> cancellarlo, ogni altra operazione è illecita. Le sarei comunque grato
>>>>>> se potesse darmene notizia.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This email is intended only for the person or entity to which it is
>>>>>> addressed and may contain information that is privileged, confidential
>>>>>> or otherwise protected from disclosure. We remind that - as provided
>>>>>> by European Regulation 2016/679 “GDPR” - copying, dissemination or use
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Jul 22, 2018 at 11:53 AM Andrea Aime
>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > (Writing from mobile) Personally I've never learned the new
>>>>>> prefixes, but agree the current situation is messy, so a tiepid +1.
>>>>>> > Were the old process names deprecated also documentations wise, and
>>>>>> examples using them removed?
>>>>>> > In other words, was warning given to users?
>>>>>> > I think we have kept using the old names in Geosolutions but I'm
>>>>>> not sure, hopefully some of my colleagues will chime in.
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Also, remember that ticket you opened about startup failures if a
>>>>>> process plugin gets removed? What happens on upgrade for existing
>>>>>> installations?
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Thinking out loud, would it make sense to stop advertising the old
>>>>>> process names, but still support them, and log a warning pointing at the
>>>>>> new name?
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Cheers
>>>>>> > Andrea
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
>>>>>> > Il dom 22 lug 2018, 09:49 Ian Turton <[email protected]> ha
>>>>>> scritto:
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> One thing I keep having to explain to users is the reason we have
>>>>>> so many duplicated processes in the WPS. Would it be a good idea to
>>>>>> remove
>>>>>> the deprecated ones before we release 2.14?
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> As I understand it, there will be no fewer actual processes just
>>>>>> fewer prefixes.
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> I'm happy to do the work if people are happy with the idea.
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> >> Ian
>>>>>> >>
>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>> >> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
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>>>>>> http://sdm.link/slashdot_______________________________________________
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>>>>>> >
>>>>>> >
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Regards, Andrea Aime == GeoServer Professional Services from the experts!
>> Visit http://goo.gl/it488V for more information. == Ing. Andrea Aime
>> @geowolf Technical Lead GeoSolutions S.A.S. Via di Montramito 3/A 55054
>> Massarosa (LU) phone: +39 0584 962313 fax: +39 0584 1660272 mob: +39 339
>> 8844549 http://www.geo-solutions.it http://twitter.com/geosolutions_it
>> ------------------------------------------------------- *Con riferimento
>> alla normativa sul trattamento dei dati personali (Reg. UE 2016/679 -
>> Regolamento generale sulla protezione dei dati “GDPR”), si precisa che ogni
>> circostanza inerente alla presente email (il suo contenuto, gli eventuali
>> allegati, etc.) è un dato la cui conoscenza è riservata al/i solo/i
>> destinatario/i indicati dallo scrivente. Se il messaggio Le è giunto per
>> errore, è tenuta/o a cancellarlo, ogni altra operazione è illecita. Le
>> sarei comunque grato se potesse darmene notizia. This email is intended
>> only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain
>> information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise protected from
>> disclosure. We remind that - as provided by European Regulation 2016/679
>> “GDPR” - copying, dissemination or use of this e-mail or the information
>> herein by anyone other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you
>> have received this email by mistake, please notify us immediately by
>> telephone or e-mail.*
>>
>
>
> --
>
> Regards, Andrea Aime == GeoServer Professional Services from the experts!
> Visit http://goo.gl/it488V for more information. == Ing. Andrea Aime
> @geowolf Technical Lead GeoSolutions S.A.S. Via di Montramito 3/A 55054
> Massarosa (LU) phone: +39 0584 962313 fax: +39 0584 1660272 mob: +39 339
> 8844549 http://www.geo-solutions.it http://twitter.com/geosolutions_it
> ------------------------------------------------------- *Con riferimento
> alla normativa sul trattamento dei dati personali (Reg. UE 2016/679 -
> Regolamento generale sulla protezione dei dati “GDPR”), si precisa che ogni
> circostanza inerente alla presente email (il suo contenuto, gli eventuali
> allegati, etc.) è un dato la cui conoscenza è riservata al/i solo/i
> destinatario/i indicati dallo scrivente. Se il messaggio Le è giunto per
> errore, è tenuta/o a cancellarlo, ogni altra operazione è illecita. Le
> sarei comunque grato se potesse darmene notizia. This email is intended
> only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain
> information that is privileged, confidential or otherwise protected from
> disclosure. We remind that - as provided by European Regulation 2016/679
> “GDPR” - copying, dissemination or use of this e-mail or the information
> herein by anyone other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you
> have received this email by mistake, please notify us immediately by
> telephone or e-mail.*
>
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