>Well there is a problem with that, most of the people who have >experienced the mites, cleaned everything and don't have them anymore. >And i'm telling you through the awful experience i went through myself, >these things do kill, they suck the blood out of the animals, all of the >blood, so that there is literally nothing left but skin and bones and >internal organs. Plus my gerbils were very healthy before these things >came, so it is not because they are sick. And i think that it is not >right for you to say that we are wrong when you never saw what these >things did. I tried saving my gerbil from these things for 4 hours and >she still died, the other one was dead that morning. Try picking up a >gerbil that you spent four hours trying to save, rubbing it and then it >die in your hand, then tell me that these mites do not kill. Lillian Your gerbils get ill, and quit eating and quit drinking. You don't notice for a day or two, then the animal goes 'down' and stays there. When you pick it up, it is light and bony...because it has dehydrated and lost all it's reserves, which a gerbil does not have much of. If you were to actually try to draw blood from a deep vein or slash the animal that just died; you would find that it still has blood; plenty enough that it would not die of acute external anemia. I have done this. As part of the 'what did this animal have and I need to know because I have two hundred some more that I need to worry about' I know the animal had expired, also, because it had done the last urine void, and the body goes from limp to a certain stiffness. Do you die from giving blood? Not usually. The gerbil that is infested, does lose what seems like a lot of blood, if you multiply the apparent hordes of gorged mites that come off an infested animal that is dying or dead. However, it is merely a contributing factor to the failing of the animal. It is NOT the primary cause. I have spent many a night nursing animals from fall trauma, stroke, colds, diahrrea, bites, vicious attacks (loss of eyes, limbs, bad gashes, etc); and things that were not easily identified. I have even performed a C-section on a dwarf campbell that died in my hand trying to give birth...I did rescue three of six babies, but the fostering attempt did not succeed..the foster mother rejected them. I have had animals die before my eyes. Is the animal I found alive or dead? I have had animals I thought were dead, that I started last ditch efforts on anyway, that came around. But expired anyway (most of the time). I have had mite infestations a few times. That is just a complication or contributing factor; but has never been the main cause of death when dealing with a 'down' animal. Please, let us not go any further. I sympathize, as when you've fretted for hours and hours and your beloved little one expires despite everything you've tried to do; and you can't seem to find the exact reason why this happened at all. I have just made sure that no death is in vain. No matter what, I try to learn from each one, so that I will know more the next time; and be able to react that much faster, or do this or that differently the next time...although I try my best to make sure there isn't a next time. If there is anything that I have learned, that might be of use to someone else on this forum, I will and do share it. There is some opinion and personal prejudice, sure, but. It is also hard won and hard learned experience. Unless you have clinical proof that the mites did kill your animals; and can present it, then I differ. So far, along with others that have also gone this path; have found no proof that mites kill directly. They can cause an animal's degradation to accelerate; but they are not the primary factor that caused the expiration. What you described for the state of your animals other than the heavy infestation; is typical for an animal that has quit eating and drinking because of another health reason. Hamsters and gerbils both will stop eating and drinking when they are ill, and the dehydration is usually what kills first. If you were to stop eating and drinking ANYTHING for three days, you would not be in very good shape either, and lose some weight rapidly...this would be very noticeable if you are at the bottom end of acceptable weight for your height and frame. Because of a gerbil's small size, they do not have many reserves, of stored energy (fat) or fluid in the tissues. When I find an animal down, the first thing I have to do is address rehydration and body temperature. If I can get the animal to rehydrate, as it does so, it usually comes out of it's torpor; and then I can begin to feed it. If the cause of the going down is diahrrea, this will usually begin again; and drag the animal down again; but can be treated then. IF I can stay ahead of the diahrrea and keep enough fluid in the animal, it will come out of it. If an animal goes down the cycle is usually: Stops eating and drinking. May be active yet (gets up and moves around cage) for 8-24 hours more; and keeper will not really notice that food and water is not being touched. The next period (about 8-12 hours) the animal is 'sleepy' and wants to stay curled up in the nest. It may stick it's head up and even take a few steps over something (you sticking your hand in the cage, offering food, etc) but will stay in the nest. Next period (another 8-12 hours) animal is failing. It stays heavily asleep. It may seem unnaturally still, and if touched, won't respond much if at all, and is cold and found to be barely breathing. At this point, is when things are often discovered. The animal is within hours of death, if not minutes. If the animal has mites, the third stage is when they will be really seen in the fur/on the animal. It has not been grooming and keeping the numbers of infestating critters under control since during the first stage, and any other mites that are around the cage start converging on the easy meal in the corner. They are gathering during stage two, and feeding. So during stage three, when found, the animal is heavily covered and the mites are looking for a new host as they can tell that this one is on the way out..... After the animal expires or gets to a certain temperature; the mites are eager to bail in search of a new warmer host, and will be seen in the outer edges of the fur, and trying to jump off. Deb Rebel's Rodent Ranch
