Well, I'll be damned, I think derek and I agree on this. The install problem has got
to be addressed. I don't consider myself "stupid" (more importantly, I haven't been
accused of that by others). I've got almost 20 years working in the field. Granted
not a lot of Unix behind me, but a lot of VMS and DOS/Windows/Netware. I'm sorry, as
much fun as it can be to figure things out, installing a package isn't one of them. I
WANT to be a "next" clicker.
For the same reason I want to turn the key in my car and have it start each morning.
I wouldn't want to have to open the hood and figure out it its no spark or no fuel. I
grabbed some software off the net to do a job, and having it create yet another job is
not what I had in mind.
It's not so much the "next" thing as consistency. If every package adhered to some
kind of consistency, even command line, that would be great.
Sincerely,
Jim Ryan
-----Original Message-----
From: Derek Martin [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thu, 11 May 2000 04:11:13 -0400 (EDT)
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
CC: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: (no subject)
Yesterday, Randy Edwards gleaned this insight:
> > I think the real question that people are asking is " Are there any
> > *COMMERCIAL* applications for Linux?" The answer to that one is a little
> > less favorable for those who are looking for assurances, unfortunately.
>
> I think that's exactly the question for a lot of folks.
>
> Many people aren't comfortable with using the net for anything other than
> surfing aimlessly and for trading E-Mail forwards of jokes.
>
> Those people can't imagine that you can get any and every piece of
> software you want from net-based downloads; and even if they could imagine
> it, would they be able to install and configure these things? That can get
> messy and requires some commandline use; your typical Windows user isn't
> smart enough to do that, so they want shrinkwrap with mindless "Next"
> clicking.
I agree with you up to the point where you say the average windows user
isn't smart enough. Not true. It's more that they don't care to spend
the time. In most cases, all you have to do is read the directions, and
type exactly what they tell you to type. Again, in most cases, that
consists of
./configure
make
make install
Though certainly there are lots of exceptons.
While it's easy to label these people "stupid" in reality they just place
higher value on spending their time some other way, and rightfully so.
If everyone became expert sysadmins, we'd be pretty screwed, because the
roads would fall apart and we'd have no food to eat.
[Imagine that, me being sensitive... I'll have to rectify that!]
Admittedly not everyone falls into this category though. There are TONS
of stupid people. They're everywhere.
> No doubt this situation will improve. Redmond seems to be helping us in
> the idea that you can "buy" software from the net. Fine, that helps to
> tackles one issue. What's needed now are more ISVs and a standard package
> installation routine so that ISVs don't have to worry about the deb/rpm
> issue and other silliness.
We have a standard install routine for everyone:
tar xvf installfile.tar
Linux has autorun. all that ISVs need to do is write a shell script that
figures out what version of glibc is on the system, and then make a
directory on a fs that has enough space, and then untar the binaries for
the correct version. You pop in the CD, Linux autoruns the shell script.
It's not rocket science. Vendors who complain about deb vs. rpm are just
making excuses, and/or listening to Microsoft's FUD.
--
PGP/GPG Public key at http://cerberus.ne.mediaone.net/~derek/pubkey.txt
------------------------------------------------------
Derek D. Martin | Unix/Linux Geek
[EMAIL PROTECTED] | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------------------------------
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