Hi JC, This scientific study should be very easy! YOU CAN DESIGN THE STUDY to prove the accusations you and other are making! And you know that not all of the anti-casteists are making the same accusations - that is of course if you-guys know the exact allegations or indictment and not some nebulous statement. You can do the study in Goa's villages. By for crying-out-loud, shouldn't we have some basis to make claims and not some anecdotal stories of mozem mauxi munta... ani tuzem samumai sangta.... :=)) For those not familiar with Konkani it's "My grandmother tells this ... and ... your mother-in-law says that..."
Plz tell Cornell that nearly all sasumais speak ill of their daughter-in-laws irrespective of caste.:=)) It would be better that Goans designed the study and steps for the solution, rather than some outsider trying to fake a sociological / anthropological paper 'at our expense'. I can see your point about not needing posters on this thread to post their caste. Frankly the smart anti-casteists and others who are NOT OF THE UPPER CASTE and who have made it; should be proud to post their social order. What and why should they be ashamed? By trying to be coy about it, they are sending a totally wrong message to members of the same background that they also should not be proud of their lineage. This is the humor of Cornell's 'High Society English' post. Goans as a whole appear to be ashamed of their caste....and .... embarrassed of their language... and mortified of identifying with other Goans. In Portugal and America some posts tell us how they 'pass themselves off' as Portuguese. In fact in India one wrote how he mastered a few Indian and foreign languages but not a word about Konkani. So what's all this talk about pride in our society, heritage and lineage? Is Cornel going to say, "I do not want to be buried next to my father and grandfather because then people will know my caste?" By proudly stating their 'lower caste' (whatever that means, Pl ask Cornel), they would remove the social stigma, but more important they would be role-models to members of their social group. Thus they would show how to overcome 'historical baggage' and be very successful; without blaming others. In fact, Arthur Ashe (NYC Tennis stadium named after him) and Tiger Woods are proudly admired precisely because they are black. Why is my e-mail box full of 'Indians that made it big' in India, USA and the world? Are the Bamons silencing the lower caste in cyber-Goa in the 21st century? Or is 'the class' silencing themselves again? Ami Goenkars munnhon, we need to BLAME SOMEONE FOR WHAT WE FAIL TO DO. Regards, GL jose colaco: In a very curious way, this brings up the point Gilbert often makes about research. When "researchers" do their spiel, should we merely accept what they say without a murmur? or should we ask them about their study design, material & methods, how they have tried to eliminate or minimize bias, data analysis techniques etc (Like Gilbert himself is expected answer when he presents his papers to the scientific community) True that the historical "researchers" look at documents to which we mortal humans don't normally have access, or are able to decipher (because of our own linguistic deficiences) BUT: Is there undocumented stuff? For instance: 1. Do we know the exact number of Goans who were murdered by the fiery Inquisition? 2. Do we know the exact number of Goan widows who mudered by the fiery Sati? 3. WHAT happened to their property? Now Teotonio de Souza writes:<Janet Rubinoff refers in her thesis that the *bhangi* caste became superfluous in Goa with the extensive use of pigs.> jc's response:-> I'd forgive Janet Rubinoff if she did not know that the HWTs (human waste transporters) of India were NOT a part of the Apartheid Caste System. They were not even considered human beings. She just may not have known this. And nobody perhaps bothered to advise her either. However, what might be of interest is to know the Study Design Janet Rubinoff utilised to come to the above quoted (by TRS) conclusion in her thesis. What was the "p" value of that study? and.......What, for instance, is the reason that HWTs are no longer used in cities like Poona(Pune) and London? I hope no "researcher" comes up with a godshem "thesis" which indicates that HWTs became superfluous in London because of London Underground. That will really be cute. On another but related matter "Teotonio R. de Souza" wrote: <Could each one writing on the theme indicate what caste he belongs to?> Mario Goveia: "No Dice" Jose Colaco: NO "caste", as is a Kunbi (way BELOW the foot of the wretched "caste" system) Teotonio de Souza: It is not very difficult though to find it out with some effort and time that any research usually requires. George Pinto: I have no caste. If anyone tries to assign one to me, I categorically reject it. I identify with the most discriminated group - the Dalits. Teotonio de Souza writes: I respect the blunt or polite refusal by those who do not wish to reveal the caste label they have inherited. Jose Colaco's response: Nonsense. THIS Goan Catholic has INHERITED zero apartheid label. Now, if the good research historian Teotonio de Souza wishes to advise us that he IS a member of (BELONGS TO) this or that "caste", he should feel absolutely free to do the honours. Unless of course ....he is NOT an "anti-caster". In that event, his silence on this question will be understood for what it is worth. jc http://www.colaco.net _________________________________________________________________ On the road to retirement? Check out MSN Life Events for advice on how to get there! http://lifeevents.msn.com/category.aspx?cid=Retirement ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Ever feel sad or cry for no reason at all? Depression. Narrated by Kate Hudson. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Ntf6vA/esnJAA/d1hLAA/E5z3lB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Goa-Goans/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! 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