On Tue, Dec 22, 2020 at 11:09 AM Martin Hanson <greencopperm...@yandex.com> wrote:
> It's a matter of understanding why generics was left out of Go from the > start, like classes was left out of Go. If we start adding stuff that > the original developers of Go left out by purpose That is some serious revisionism of the facts. Ian (who is spear-heading the generics effort) is one of (if not *the*) first person to join Go's development. And it has *always* been the communicated stance of the Go team (including the original three people who've been there before him) that generics would be nice to have, if they can figure out a way to fit them in. I'm as skeptical about generics as the next guy. But this denial of historical fact doesn't help anybody. Neither is exclusionary language like talking about "true Gophers". Go is an inclusive project and wants everyone to feel welcome - *obviously* that includes people who want generics in the language. Please read - and keep to - the Go community Code of Conduct: https://golang.org/conduct > we're not understanding the design choices that went into Go, which is > exactly > what makes Go unique! > Go is not a religion. Go is not something that was prophetized on stone tablets and handed down from mysterious, otherworldly gods. It's a programming language and a software project. The people who came up with it and designed it are alive and well and they explain their decisions regularly and patiently. One of those people is Ian. I am comparatively late to the party with adopting Go, but even I feel comfortable saying I understand the design choices that went into Go. > If you want to add generics to Go, if you want to change how errors are > handled, if you want X, Y or Z feature that Java, C++, or some other > complex language has got, then go use that language! Why are you even > here!? > I said so above but it benefits from repitition: If you are someone who wants the language to change, if you want generics, if you feel error handling could be improved, "if you want X, Y or Z feature that Java, C++, or some other complex language has got", you are welcome in our community. Your viewpoint is valued. Your, Martin, viewpoint that generics *shouldn't* be added to Go is valued as well. What isn't welcome is your attempt of alienating people with a different viewpoint from yours and make them feel unwelcome. And if you continue to insist on doing that, the community *will* ask you to leave. the people who designed Go, and we all know who they are No offense, but I do get the impression that you actually don't. > If generics gets added to Go, we're opening a very dangerous door, and > it will be the downfall of Go because - and Robert Griesemer this is > especially addressed to you - what's next then? Just to be clear: On the one hand, you are trying to make an argument that the original designers of Go are impossible to understand, their competency transcends reason and they should be trusted to come up with the best design for a language. And on the other hand, you are trying to explain one of those original designers, who is currently working on adding generics, that what they are doing is "the downfall of Go"? Think about it. That should really cause you some cognitive dissonance. > If generics gets added to Go, we're a big enough part of the community, > that passionately hate that, that we can manage to fork Go - which I > strongly believe will then be the right thing to do! > I can say, I would genuinely be happy if a fork of Go without generics will be made and if people who feel they can't live with a language containing them migrate to that fork. Just as I was genuinely happy about Devuan being created by people who feel they can't live with an operating system using systemd. The Debian project became better by that fork existing and I suspect, the Go project would be better with such a fork. Because it would give relentlessly negative people a place to be in peace, somewhere else. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "golang-nuts" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to golang-nuts+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/golang-nuts/5029411608631693%40iva7-919bb0034794.qloud-c.yandex.net > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "golang-nuts" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to golang-nuts+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/golang-nuts/CAEkBMfE9nH1SaGUUrTUZwVR4ivYOcn3-5xGhS7WH3L1VRd7ENQ%40mail.gmail.com.
