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The first line should of set with CACHE.
-------Original Message-------
Date: 12/24/05 06:18:11
Subject: RE: [Hardhats-members] VISTA- platforms -> name change
I tried to setup VISTA but had a communication error (I am using Mcafee-which can cause a problem). I don't want to work without a firewall or virus screen so i went the other route. I downloaded the GT-M version and it downloaded pretty fast (I have a 100M connection). After downloading it I tried to write it to CD but my Easy CD Creator wouldn't work with the ISO file and I don't have any other way to read the ISO file. So I have put it on the back-burner till after Christmas- I am working the Christmas weekend including the government holiday which itself is a mess with Monday as the legal holiday.
Time to get off my soapbox.
Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays
Ron
-------Original Message-------
Date: 12/23/05 10:35:46
Subject: RE: [Hardhats-members] VISTA- platforms -> name change
Though I don't want to turn this into a Cache/GT.M shootout, I find a
resonance in Greg's comments that deserves support. This comment should in
no way be taken as criticism of the dedicated members of this list who are
quick to lend a helping hand, regardless of platform, to the newbie or
people like me with experience in FileMan, though week in coding and
plumbing the depths of VistA. I don't mention names to avoid overlooking
important contributors - everyone here knows them.
In respect to Greg's comment - I find myself winnowing the VistA "specifics"
from the Linux/GT.M posts of this list. I had a go at Linux GT.M and decided
that my time may best be spent getting a grip on VistA in a relatively
familiar environment. I chose this route, correctly or not, over whole-cloth
conversion to Linux while still struggling with VistA.
I have spent a lot of time looking, in vain, for a solution and kept this
observation low-key, since I think raising a criticism without offering a
solution is counterproductive. I am no closer to the solution and only want
to voice the reminder that just becaue you don't hear it doesn't mean the
problem isn't there.
I haven't the wisdom to make a suggestion for change. What I have done is
frequently remind myself that's just the way it is. Noone's fault, noone to
blame, though for those limited to Win/Cache we need to be a little more
careful (efficient?) scanning our email.
Thanks,
thurman
> -----Original Message-----
> Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2005 3:59 PM
> Subject: Re: [Hardhats-members] VISTA
>
>
> > Greg --
> >
> > Normally, you are objective and reasoned.
>
> Thanks. I'll grant that you did catch me on a bad day.
>
> > On this post, however, I
> > regret that I have several bones to pick with you. See below.
> >
> > -- Bhaskar
> >
> > On Tue, 2005-12-20 at 13:14 -0600, Greg Woodhouse wrote:
> > > The list does seem to have a preponderance of GT.M users, but VOE
> > > runs
> >
> > [KSB] How I wish this were the case! Owing to the number of VA users
> > and the extensive use of non-GT.M implementations of MUMPS within the
> > VA, and owing to VOE, I think GT.M users are probably in a
> > non-trivial
> > minority.
>
> I'll grant you that VA personnel are not usually the ones to ask
> questions here, but that seems neither here nor there. True, VA medical
> centers do use Cache', but I don't know that I'd infer that new users
> are necessarily going to be adopters of one platform over the other. As
> an aside, I started to delete that sentence (twice), because I really
> do not means this to be a Cache' vs. GT.M or a Fidelity vs.
> InterSystems type message. Both products (and perhaps others) ought to
> have a place on this list.
>
> >
> > > on Cache' not GT.M. Ironically, I might be more ready to use GT.M
> > if
> > > the list didn't seem so lop-sided on the GT.M side. I don't have an
> >
> >
> > [KSB] It is probably a fair statement to say that there are more
> > newbie
> > users of VistA on GT.M on this forum (and of course newbie users need
> > more help and are more vocal than non-newbie users; besides people
> > ask
> > questions where they find their questions are answered).
>
> Yes. But isn't that what I was saying? That the focus of discussion
> here seems to be on GT.M. Maybe that's okay.
> >
> > > infinite amount of time, and certainly can't do everything I'd
> > like,
> > > but I think it would be very nice to see a portable implementation
> > > that
> > > could be distributed with VistA installed (even if not completely
> > > configured). I am not at all happy with the way Linux seems to be
> > the
> > > only OS that anyone wants to use for development. Again, I think I
> > > might be a bit more friendly to Linux if there were more of a
> > balance
> > > (and if the distribution weren't so "kute").
> >
> > [KSB] Since I don't have the right to distribute Windows, or OS X,
> > the
> > choice comes down to Linux and *BSD variants.
>
> But there is nothing to stop you from installing *.msi files (for
> Windows) or *.mpkg files (for OS X). Is it really necessary to
> distribute an entire OS to distribute VistA? If it is, I'd submit that
> we have some serious work to do, because that just shouldn't be.
>
> >
> I really don't have a
> > strong personal preference between them. However since (a) I already
> > had a GT.M on Linux, and (b) Linux live CDs came before *BSD live
> > CDs, I
> > chose to release VistA on Linux. I felt that it was better to do
> > what
> > little I could even if I couldn't do everything.
>
> I certainly don't fault you for focusing on Linux. That's not what
> bothers me, it's the absence of anything else.
>
> >
> > >...
>
> > [KSB] A minor point, but your post suggests that Linux is not a
> > commercial operating system. Open source free software like Linux
> > and
> > GT.M on Linux are very much commercial software. Only, the licensing
> > terms are different, and the GPL gives the licensee more Freedom than
> > traditional software licenses (see
> > the topic).
>
> I suppose I could have said "proprietary" rather than "commercial". Is
> that any better? I guess I tend to avoid terms like proprietary and
> closed source because they have derogatory overtones that I'd rather
> avoid.
> >
> > For the record, I feel strongly enough about the importance of VistA
> > that I have offered more than once at the VistA Community Meetings
> > and
> > the VistA Community Calls to teach anyone interested, including
> > InterSystems, how to create a live CD of VistA on Cache. The offer
> > still stands.
>
> Good for you. Hey, a live CD bailed me out last weekend when I trashed
> the boot block on a Windows system, and it was necessary to boot
> Knoppix to restore it.
> >
> > As President Kennedy said, "ask not what your country can do for you;
> > ask what you can do for your country." An old Chinese proverb says
> > that
> > it is better to light a candle than to curse the darkness.
>
> I think I heard that once. :-)
>
> I would like to think that I do some good, but I don't have an infinite
> amount of time or energy. I can't do everything I'd like to, and there
> seems little point in embarking on a project such as this without at
> least a little "buy in".
>
> Why get
> > on a
> > soapbox about what other people are doing when they have done you no
> > harm?
>
> That's a fair point. There have been more than a couple of times that
> I've considered unsubscribing from Hardhats because I feel like it no
> longer fits my interests or goals, but I guess I feel strongly about
> VistA, too.
>
> > If you feel strongly about VistA on FreeBSD, why not turn your
> > energies to do something positive?
>
> How do you know that I am not? I thought of posting some of my work on
> fMUMPS, but so far as I know, only one other member of this list has
> expressed any interest in it. I've been putting a fair amount of work
> into interpreting imperative languages using something like
> Peyton-Jones' G-machine. I've been exploring the use of virtual
> machines in MUMPS for portability. Things I'd like to do, but for which
> I've had no time include tightening up Fileman and Kernel, perhaps
> incorporating them into a language library. I would love to see an
> embedded VistA, a device people could simply turn on. And you probably
> have no idea how much time I spend off list just answering questions. I
> hardly think it fair to say I am not doing anything!
>
> > I will gladly render what
> > assistance
> > I can for you to get VistA running on a FreeBSD live CD.
> >
>
> I may take you up on that, but I think I have a ways to go before I
> reach that point.
>
> ===
> "Interaction is the mind-body problem of computing."
> --Philip L. Wadler
>
>
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