Thank you. I get the feeling from the illustrations I have seen in manuscript illuminations and such that the medieval gurdy was likely a smaller instrument than the modern vielle, and probably the sound box was similar in size to citole or crwth (not tiny, but relatively compact). I will probably stay right around the 345mm string length, that doesn't have to make a terribly large instrument. And I think that a 14-15 cm wheel will be maximum, I will probably make a baltic birch wheel and band and face it with holly (I want an instrument that has the playing characteristics of a period instrument, not necessarily the maintenance nightmares.
I think I am going to build the axle turned down from 1/2 inch silver steel, with a square boss and larger shoulder milled into it for the wheel (using a pin to hold the wheel to the axle, and a solid fit of a square boss and square hole to maintain true running. Bearings will probably be of lignum vitae (I have some small pieces from an old steamship propeller shaft bearing in my shop, they are compressed and oily and baked hard from use, toughest and most stable wood I have ever seen. I have a 14 ounce claw hammer head made out of one quarter of the bearing, it is every bit as strong as my steel hammer heads, I had to machine it on the metal lathe and mill instead of using my regular woodworking machines). I will proably forge the crank of iron, and do a little silver wire inlay in it (scandinavian style). I have pretty much convinced myself that this instrument, if it was made in 1350, would have been flat topped. I haven't seen anything showing me that the technology of the arched top was in place at that time. I would be glad for some example of other instruments from that period that would show otherwise, as that would be both a neat construction point as well as a neat discussion point, and it would improve the sound. I am going to start doing some drawings, and when I get a few variations done I will post them on my website. I would appreciate anyone who is interested in them giving them a look with a critical eye. My goal for this project is to build both a functional 5 string instrument (yes, I know, probably should only have 1 chanter, but I really like the sound of 2) as well as one that is really appealing visually, while being 'different' in appearance than the commonly found forms today (if possible, even more of a conversation starter than a modern vielle). I appreciate all the help everyone is giving, I think I am going to have to contact the cathedral themselves and see if they have a picture of that angel that is without glare and of reasonable contrast. Next big decision is wood choice. I have access to 16/4 lumber, 12-14 inches wide and at least 36 inches long, air dried, in walnut, maple, cherry, pecan. Chris *********** REPLY SEPARATOR *********** On 2/23/2007 at 8:23 PM [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'm not Vlad, but another list member of Ukrainian heritage. Yes, its true, that the Ukrainian style lira was often carved out. This technique was (and still is, though to a lesser extent) common for just about all stringed instruments in Ukraine, many of which were made not by professional luthiers with specialized shops at their disposal but sometimes by the musicians themselves or by enterprising peasants whose tools and materials were limited. Some instruments being made today by members of the Kobzarsky Tsekh (traditional musician's guild http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kobzars'kyj_Tsekh) using traditional methods also exhibit the carved construction (http://fire.prohosting.com/khaykhay/photographs.html). I have not noticed a marked difference in sound between carved out, or piece built versions. Obviously, the lira does sound different than a vielle, and that is partly due to the generally small size among many other factors. Perhaps it is also true that the small body lends itself more easily to "trough carving". I think if it's skillfully done, the body can be carved to quite thin tolerances and besides, I wonder how much the back resonates when damped by the lap of the player. Orest -- Arle Lommel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Chris, There is no reason you can't use a "trough-carved" body like you propose. One of the types of Ukrainian lira is made in this manner and it seems to work fine (although I don't know how the sound would compare since it's been over a year since I heard one in a recording). I have tried to find an image for you (I've seen a number in the past) but I can't find one at the moment. Instead I keep finding the other type which has sides made from separate pieces inserted into braces. Vlad, a list member who is of Ukrainian heritage and who also builds instruments, may know more, but his wife recently gave birth and I don't know how much he is paying attention to the list at the moment. By the way, the following image may give you some ideas: http://www.stefciu.com/stefciulira_files/image005.jpg I don't know the source of the image, but there are a number of HG forms on it that I don't recognize right away. -Arle On Feb 23, 2007, at 9:46 AM, Chris Nogy wrote: I have made several hollowed bodied instruments www.nogy.net, look at the rebec or the crwth or the citole or the lyre pages. But this instrument, the citole from the Cantigas, is one of the design starting points I am trying to explore, as well as King David's Crwth, the gittern from the British Museum, etc... These instruments were popular and common body shapes, I assume that it would not be out fo the question to build a gurdy with a shape similar to other instruments that were being built. I am just really curious to know if this method has any specific design characteristics that would make it unsuitable for a gurdy (a medieval gurdy, not a modern one). I have wood in sufficient dimension and am experienced in making a jointed body in his style as well. I know that if it had to be a jointed carved body, then it would have to be jointed in 3 sections so that the axle would have the full support fo the center. But for a smaller gurdy, which most of the medieval illustrations I have seen seem to imply, there are lots of species of hardwood that grow large enough and can be seasoned well enough to do this job. Chris
