I was going around youtube and i saw this video [1] (Sugar Labs Vision 2016 proposal Hangout). I think towards the technical aspect of Sugar Labs, this video explains everything walter was trying to point out.
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENLWvPV8jrI&t=10s Samson On Wed, Apr 12, 2017 at 8:09 AM, Tony Anderson <[email protected]> wrote: > I am extremely disappointed with the direction this thread is taking. > Based on our experience with the 2016 goals, this emphasis on starting over > will lead to a restatement of the 2017 goals which at the end of the year > will be as close to reality as they are today. > > The heart of Walter's document is: > > "We have several near-term opportunities that we should leverage: > > - Raspian: The Raspberry Pi 3 is more than adequate to run Sugar—the > experience rivals or exceeds that of the OLPC XO-4 hardware, though not the > OLPC NL3 hardware. While Raspberry Pi is not the only platform we should be > targeting, it does have broad penetration into the Maker community, which > shares a synergy with our emphasis on “doing”. It is low-hanging fruit. > With a little polish we could have an image available for download from the > Raspberry Pi website. > - Trisquel: We have the potential for better leveraging the Free > Software Foundation as a vehicle for promoting Sugar. Their distro of > choice is Trisquel and the maintainer does a great job of keep the Sugar > packages up to date. > - Sugarizer: The advantage of Sugarizer is that it has the potential > of reaching orders of magnitude more users since it is web-based and runs > in Android and iOS. There is some work to be done to make the experience > palatable on small screens and the current development environment is—at > least my opinion—not scalable or maintainable. The former is a formidable > problem. The latter quite easy to address. > - Stand-alone projects such as Music Blocks have merit as long as they > maintain both a degree of connection with Sugar and promote the values of > the community. It is not certain that these projects will lead users > towards Sugar, but they do promote FOSS and Constructionist principles. And > they have attracted new developers to the Sugar community." > > Lionel Laske offered this response: > "Thanks a lot for this long proposal. Great to hear you on that. > I think that it's more a Sugar history than a goal/vision but it's good to > read it from a guy that was the major contributor of the history. > > BTW I'm not agree with your goals. > My view is that it's not a good idea to limit Sugar/SugarLabs to makers. > We can't target a so small market: > - RaspberryPI ? RPI is a great tool. I personally used 2 RPI weekly for my > personal usage. But it's a tool for geeks not for learners. It could be a > good device as server (we're using it in classroom in France and in > Madagascar and it's good for XSCE too) but it's a very poor tools for > children: no screen, no keyboard, no mouse, not even a power adapter. It's > just a board ! So I don't see the interest of Sugar on it. > - Trisquel ? Probably a nice Linux distribution but how many users ? Not > at all a largely distributed distribution like Fedora or Ubuntu. Why doing > effort on it ? > > I can't understand you even mention Windows support in your goals: just > 99,9% of the PC market ! So if you're a Windows user you can't be a target > for SugarLabs ? Plus, regarding devices: we should be better on touch > devices because tablets is the favorite learning tools in classroom today, > not PC. It's why Android (80% of the tablet market) and iOS are so > important in my mind. We should go where users - children/teachers - are ! > > We can't target makers just because Sugar has synergy with them and > because we hope they help us to spread the world tomorrow. > Our goals should be to deploy Sugar as a mainstream solution for everyone > not a solution for a bunch of geeks. It's the only way to expand the Sugar > community. You told about OLPC: the goal of One Laptop Per Child was to > give a laptop to EVERY child, our goal should be to give Sugar to EVERY > child too. The marketing effort should be in that way, no need to do > marketing for makers, I'm sure they found us themselves. > > Lionel. > > P.S.: Regarding Sugarizer maintainability, it's just your opinion. Not > sure it's the opinion for 20 others Sugarizer contributors. I don't think > you could judge Sugarizer maintainability only because you've not > successfully updated TurtleJS activity inside. I don't have success running > TurtleJS on my side and had a very bad experience when trying to Sugarize > it, it's not a reason for me to give a judgement about TurtleJS > maintainability. " > > Regarding Raspberry Pi, while of the millions in the wild certainly only a > small minority are used for education of primary school aged children, the > same is true for the number used to drive 3d printers. There are computer > labs in operation based on Raspbery Pi with hand-me-down peripherals. Kids > on Computers in Mexico supports several using XSCE as the school server > (the KoC team never even considered Sugar as an option for the clients). > There is a specific opportunity in Kenya where desktops are being used with > hand-me-down peripherals. These desktops could be replaced by RPi3 saving > the difficulty in maintaining old ATX boxes (and making use of the > peripherals where the desktop is not working). > > Lionel expresses concern that Trisquel is not well known in our community. > However, the newbies to Sugar are unlikely to have a clue about the > difference between Trisquel, Ubuntu, Debian or Fedora (let alone Arch or > Gentoo or OpenBSD). What is critical is that it be dead simple to download > and install Sugar and that Sugar works reliably. > > The maker community has MakerFaires. These are very effective > opportunities to show what makers can do and to invite visitors to make > something on the spot. Adam Holt and the XSCE team have demonstrated Sugar > at several. The idea is that the exhibitor offers an opportunity for > visitors to 'make' - something we can do easily with Sugar. Typical > visitors are school-age children. > > > I think our single goal is to escape the perception that Sugar is tied to > the XO and establish the perception that Sugar is a viable learning > platform available to the mainstream user. Continuing to tie Sugar to NL3, > Infinity or Positivo (Rwanda) is wrong. We need to make Sugar a platform > available independent of particular suppliers (the Achilles heal of OLPC). > > I think it is easy to understand what is needed to move toward this goal: > > Provide an image for the RPi3 which can be downloaded, copied to an SD > microchip, and booted on an RPi3 configuration with an HDMI screen, usb > keyboard and mouse. Sebastian Silva has offered some technical ideas on how > to implement this. The XSCE team is very familiar with this process in > connection with XSCE. > > Currently on the website we mention Fedora, Debian, and Ubuntu. At > http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Downloads#Do_you_use_GNU.2FLinux we mention > a potpourri of options including Trisquel. We need to have one. If there is > disagreement with Walter's choice of Trisquel, let's have that discussion. > In the meantime let's release a supported version of Sugar and document it > as the choice on our website. > > Sugarizer. We need to work out with Lionel Laske if Sugarizer is an > alternative to Sugar or is Sugar for mobile devices or is the successor to > Sugar. Sugarizer has a unique advantage in that it does not need to be > installed. However, Sugar offers a rich library of activities that will not > be available to Sugarizer without a major investment in developer time. > > It is possible that Turtle Blocks is a standalone project but it is also a > Sugar activity. Making Music Blocks a Sugar activity should not be > difficult. The important aspect is that both add to the educational > benefits offered by the Sugar platform. > > I would only add to Walter's document two observations. > > One, to attract potential new users and deployers of Sugar, we must remake > the website so that it is easy for the curious to see what Sugar is and how > to bring it to their own computer. To accomplish this, it must be possible > to obtain the current release directly from our website. We need a user > forum and a means for users to report problems similar to other open source > projects. > > Second, we need a version for Windows. This is the most likely place > potential deployers will stumble upon Sugar (remember, Negroponte's > encounter). If possible it should be a Windows 10 application. Samuel > Greenfeld suggests Sugarizer as the version for Windows. Sugarizer can be > experienced by anyone with a browser and internet access - including, of > course, Windows users. This user experience of Sugar can be featured > immediately on our site. > > This thread needs to become a discussion of how our goals can be reached > in 2017 and the pragmatic steps needed to get there. > > Tony > > P.S. What is the role of SOAS? > > On 04/12/2017 07:22 AM, Mariah Noelle Villarreal wrote: > > Hey everyone, > > As promised, I've started the wiki based on the conversation that's been > happening on the thread. I hope this helps out. I haven't had time to go > through the 2016 Goals or to add all of the information that was presented > yet. Any help would be much appreciated! > > https://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/2017_Goals > > - Mariah Noelle > > On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 10:34 AM, Mariah Noelle Villarreal < > <[email protected]>[email protected]> wrote: > >> I will take time this afternoon to combine all of what is being said in >> the thread at wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/2017_Goals >> >> This way we can move over to the wiki and add our particular goals, >> objectives, and actions in one place. >> >> Also, I would really appreciate the bickering and insults on this thread >> to come to an end. This is an international volunteer community. We should >> be mindful of language barriers and cultural differences between us. >> >> I've followed this thread for years and don't jump in often because of >> the constant bickering. The time is better spent formulating these ideas, >> documenting them and then actually doing them. >> >> Look out this afternoon for updates on the wiki a the address I mentioned >> above. >> >> >> Best, >> Mariah >> >> >> On Apr 11, 2017 9:51 AM, "Caryl Bigenho" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> Hi Folks, >> >> >> First, thanks go to Walter for the very comprehensive review of Sugar >> Labs and what has been done and is currently being done. It is very >> helpful. However, it, in no sense of the words, represents goals and >> objectives for SL going forward. >> >> >> I know Sameer really does want to share more with us to assist in >> developing a viable list of goals and objectives, but I also know he is >> very busy with his teaching job. So, I have taken the time to find a >> couple of resources from education that show what goals and objectives >> really are and how the activities we choose to undertake are related. These >> resources are attached. >> >> >> The next thing that needs to be done is to go through Walter's fine >> document and identify all the specific areas Sugar Labs works with and >> write one goal for each. Don't do anything else until these goals are >> written. These should be done in a sharable online document. Everyone who >> wants to participate should be encouraged to do so. There should be no >> special priority attached to any of these goals. At this point they would >> be of equal value. >> >> >> There should be one goal for each area... I suggest we start with these 4 >> broad areas: >> >> >> >> 1. Sugar >> 2. Sugarizer >> 3. Stand Alone Projects >> 4. School Server >> >> >> Each goal should be concise and precise. *Preferably one sentence.* >> Under each goal go objectives. There can be *more than one* objective >> per goal. >> >> >> An objective should follow the form of *Who* is going to do *What* by >> *When* and *How* will success be measured. >> >> >> A goal can have several objectives under it... for example, the >> objectives for Sugar could have objectives addressing both Raspian and >> Trisquel (two separate categories). >> >> >> Once the objectives are filled in, it will be time to start working on >> activities. These will include actual activities like producing a new >> version of Sugarizer, conducting a Music Blocks workshop, showing Sugar >> Labs "products" and recruiting users and volunteers at Linux conferences >> and educational conferences, etc. >> >> >> After this every project proposed can be analyzed with the question in >> mind, "How does this project help Sugar Labs achieve its stated objectives >> (and thus its goals as well). >> >> >> Please! Someone start a doc for this to all happen. Begin with just the 4 >> (or 5 if you want to separate Raspian and Trisquel). Make a simple goal for >> each. Then collaborate on getting the goals "just right" before moving on >> to objectives. >> >> >> Then do the same thing for objectives. >> >> >> This may seem like a lot of "busy work." But, trust me it isn't. It will >> give Sugar Labs a strong platform to work from, enabling the best use of >> limited time and resources. >> >> >> Caryl >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> *From:* IAEP < <[email protected]>[email protected] >> .org> on behalf of Laura Vargas < <[email protected]> >> [email protected]> >> *Sent:* Monday, April 10, 2017 7:31:18 AM >> *To:* Samson Goddy >> *Cc:* SLOBs; iaep; sugar-devel; Dave Crossland >> *Subject:* Re: [IAEP] [Sugar-devel] 2017 Goals for Sugar Labs >> >> Thank you Samson >> >> >> Then I guess the email format is not the best choice. Could you please >> document it on a wiki page at the Sugar Labs wiki? >> >> Blessings and a nice week to all >> >> Laura Victoria >> >> >> >> 2017-04-10 8:25 GMT-05:00 Samson Goddy < <[email protected]> >> [email protected]>: >> >>> If i am wrong, walter made it clear earlier that this is a "draft >>> proposal" meaning you can input. >>> >>> Samson >>> >>> On Apr 10, 2017 2:15 PM, "Laura Vargas" < <[email protected]> >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> 2017-04-09 19:03 GMT-05:00 Walter Bender < <[email protected]> >>> [email protected]>: >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Sun, Apr 9, 2017 at 7:56 PM, Dave Crossland < <[email protected]> >>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi >>>>> >>>>> Thanks Walter. I'd like to better understand some additional context >>>>> before diving in :) >>>>> >>>>> Does this mean Sameer you have stopped the project planning process >>>>> you started, and we should not expect you to restart it again? >>>>> >>>> >>>> At the most recent SLOB meeting Samson brought up the fact that we were >>>> still waiting and so I volunteered to write something up to get the >>>> conversation going again. >>>> >>> >>> Thanks for doing this Walter, >>> >>> After a quick read, I have to confess I feel sad and excluded because >>> none of the projects I have worked on [1] is mentioned on your view of >>> Sugar's history. >>> >>> >>> Regards and blessings, >>> >>> Laura V >>> >>> [1] <http://pe.sugarlabs.org/i>http://pe.sugarlabs.org/ir/Proyectos >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Walter, are these the goals for this year, or are they your proposal >>>>> for the goals for this year? >>>>> >>>> >>>> Not sure I understand what you are asking. I wrote up a draft of goals >>>> but they are not "the goals" until we agree to them. >>>> >>>> regards. >>>> >>>> -walter >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Apr 9, 2017 3:31 PM, "Walter Bender" < <[email protected]> >>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> As per the discussion in the last Suagr Labs Oversight Board Meeting, >>>>>> I had agreed to write a draft statement of goals for 2017. The document >>>>>> below includes feedback from Samson G. I hope this document can serve to >>>>>> revitalize our discussion from 2016 that never reached resolution. >>>>>> >>>>>> Sugar Labs Plans, Goals, Aspirations >>>>>> >>>>>> What is Sugar Labs? >>>>>> >>>>>> Sugar Labs creates, distributes, and maintains learning software for >>>>>> children. Our approach to learning is grounded in Constructionism, a >>>>>> pedagogy developed by Seymour Papert and his colleagues in the 1960s and >>>>>> 70s at MIT. Papert pioneered the use of the computer by children to help >>>>>> engage them in the “construction of knowledge.” His long-time colleague >>>>>> Cynthia Solomon expanded up his ideas by introducing the concept of >>>>>> engaging children in debugging as a pathway into problem-solving. Their >>>>>> 1971 paper, “Twenty things to do with a computer”, is arguably the >>>>>> genesis >>>>>> of contemporary movements such as the Maker Movement and Hour of Code. >>>>>> >>>>>> At the core of Constructionism is “learning through doing.” If you >>>>>> want more learning, you want more doing. At Sugar Labs we provide tools >>>>>> to >>>>>> promote doing. (We focus almost exclusively on tools, not instructional >>>>>> materials.) However, we go beyond “doing” by incorporating critical >>>>>> dialog >>>>>> and reflection into the Sugar learning environment, through mechanisms >>>>>> for >>>>>> collaboration, journaling, and portfolio. >>>>>> >>>>>> Sugar Labs is a spinoff of the One Laptop per Child (OLPC) project >>>>>> and consequently it has inherited many of its goals from that project. >>>>>> The >>>>>> goal of OLPC is to bring the ideas of Constructionism to scale in order >>>>>> to >>>>>> reach more children. A particular focus is on children in the developing >>>>>> world. In order to meet that goal, Sugar, which was originally developed >>>>>> for OLPC, was by necessity a small-footprint solution that required few >>>>>> resources in terms of CPU, memory, storage, or network connectivity. The >>>>>> major change on focus from the OLPC project is that Sugar Labs strives to >>>>>> make the Sugar desktop available to multiple platforms, not just the OLPC >>>>>> XO hardware. >>>>>> >>>>>> Who develops Sugar? >>>>>> >>>>>> Sugar Labs is a 100% volunteer effort (although we do occasionally >>>>>> raise money for paid student internships). Sugar development and >>>>>> maintenance is incumbent upon volunteers and hence we strive to provide >>>>>> as >>>>>> much control as possible to our community members, including our >>>>>> end-users. >>>>>> (In fact, one of our assertions is that by enabling our users to >>>>>> participate in the development of the tools that they use will lead to >>>>>> deeper engagement in their own learning.) Towards these ends, we chose >>>>>> the >>>>>> GPL as our primary license. It has been said of the GPL that it >>>>>> “restricts >>>>>> my right [as a developer] to restrict yours [as a user and potential >>>>>> developer]”, which seems ideal for a project that wants to engage a broad >>>>>> and diverse set of learners. But at Sugar Labs we go beyond the usual >>>>>> goals >>>>>> of FOSS: a license to make changes to the code is not enough to ensure >>>>>> that >>>>>> users make changes. We also strive to provide the means to make changes. >>>>>> Our success in this goal is best reflected in the number of patches we >>>>>> receive from our community. (We achieve this goal through providing >>>>>> access >>>>>> to source code and development tools within Sugar itself. We also >>>>>> actively >>>>>> participate in workshops and internship programs such as Google Summer of >>>>>> Code, Outreaching, and Google Code-In.) >>>>>> >>>>>> Who uses Sugar? >>>>>> >>>>>> Ultimately, our goal is to reach learners (and educators) with >>>>>> powerful tools and engage them in Constructionist learning. Currently we >>>>>> reach them in many ways: the majority of our users get the Sugar desktop >>>>>> preinstalled on OLPC XO hardware. We have a more modest set of users who >>>>>> get Sugar packaged in Fedora, Trisquel, Debian, Ubuntu, or other >>>>>> GNU/Linux >>>>>> platforms. Some users get Sugar on Live Media (i.e., Sugar on a Stick). >>>>>> Recently Sugarizer, a repackaging of some of the core Sugar ideas for the >>>>>> browser, has been finding its way to some users. There are also a number >>>>>> of >>>>>> Sugar activities that are popular outside of the context Sugar itself, >>>>>> for >>>>>> example, Turtle Blocks, which has wide-spread use in India. Harder to >>>>>> measure is the extent to which Sugar has influenced other providers of >>>>>> “educational” software. If the Sugar pedagogy is incorporated by others, >>>>>> that advances our goal. >>>>>> >>>>>> Who supports Sugar? >>>>>> >>>>>> When we first created Sugar Labs, we envisioned “Local Labs”—hence >>>>>> the name “Sugar Labs”, plural—that would provide local support in terms >>>>>> of >>>>>> local-language support, training, curriculum development, and >>>>>> customizations. This model has not ever gained the scale and depth >>>>>> envisioned (we can debate the reasons why), although there are still some >>>>>> active local communities (e.g., Educa Paraguay) that continue to work >>>>>> closely with the broader community. There are also individual volunteers, >>>>>> such as Tony Anderson and T.K. Kang, who help support individual schools >>>>>> in >>>>>> Rwanda, Malaysia, et al. An open question is how do we support our users >>>>>> over the long term? >>>>>> >>>>>> What is next for Sugar? >>>>>> >>>>>> We face several challenges at Sugar Labs. With the ebb of OLPC, we >>>>>> have a contracting user base and the number of professional developers >>>>>> associated with the project is greatly diminished. How can we expand our >>>>>> user base? How can we attract more experienced developers? Why would they >>>>>> want to work on Sugar as opposed to some other project? The meta issue is >>>>>> how do we keep Sugar relevant in a world of Apps and small, hand-held >>>>>> devices? Can we meet the expectations of learners living in a world of >>>>>> fast-paced, colorful interfaces? How do we ensure that it is fulfilling >>>>>> its >>>>>> potential as a learning environment and that our users, potential users, >>>>>> and imitators are learning about and learning from Sugar. Some of this >>>>>> is a >>>>>> matter of marketing; some of this is a matter of staying focused on our >>>>>> core pedagogy; some of this a matter of finding strategic partners with >>>>>> whom we can work. >>>>>> >>>>>> We have several near-term opportunities that we should leverage: >>>>>> * Raspian: The Raspberry PI 3.0 is more than adequate to run >>>>>> Sugar—the experience rivals or exceeds that of the OLPC XO 4.0 hardware. >>>>>> While RPi is not the only platform we should be targeting, it does has >>>>>> broad penetration into the Maker community, which shares a synergy with >>>>>> our >>>>>> emphasis on “doing”. It is low-hanging fruit. With a little polish we >>>>>> could >>>>>> have an image available for download from the RPi website. >>>>>> * Trisquel: We have the potential for better leveraging the Free >>>>>> Software Foundation as a vehicle for promoting Sugar. Their distro of >>>>>> choice is Trisquel and the maintainer does a great job of keep the Sugar >>>>>> packages up to date. >>>>>> * Sugarizer: The advantage of Sugarizer is that it has the potential >>>>>> of reaching orders of magnitude more users since it is web-based and runs >>>>>> in Android and iOS. There is some work to be done to make the experience >>>>>> palatable on small screens and the current development environment is—at >>>>>> least my opinion—not scalable or maintainable. The former is a formidable >>>>>> problem. The latter quite easy to address. >>>>>> * Stand-alone projects such as Music Blocks have merit as long as >>>>>> they maintain both a degree of connection with Sugar and promote the >>>>>> values >>>>>> of the community. It is not certain that these projects will lead users >>>>>> towards Sugar, but they do promote FOSS and Constructionist principles. >>>>>> And >>>>>> they have attracted new developers to the Sugar community. >>>>>> * School-server: The combination of the School Server and Sugar >>>>>> desktop is a technical solution to problems facing small and remote >>>>>> communities. We should continue to support and promote this combination. >>>>>> >>>>>> Specific actions: After last year’s Libre Planet conference, several >>>>>> community members discussed a marketing strategy for Sugar. We thought >>>>>> that >>>>>> if we could reach influencers, we might be able to greatly amplify our >>>>>> efforts. There are several prominent bloggers and pundits in the >>>>>> education >>>>>> arena who are widely read and who might be receptive to what we are >>>>>> doing. >>>>>> One significant challenge is that GNU/Linux remains on the far periphery >>>>>> of >>>>>> the Ed Tech world. Although the “love affair” with all things Apple seems >>>>>> to be over, the new elephant in the room—Chromebooks and Google Docs—is >>>>>> equally difficult to co-exist with. Personally, I see the most potential >>>>>> synergy with the Maker movement, which is building up momentum in >>>>>> extra-curricular programs, where FOSS and GNU-Linux are welcome (hence my >>>>>> earlier focus on RPi). (There are even some schools that are building >>>>>> their >>>>>> entire curriculum around PBL.) We can and should develop and run some >>>>>> workshops that can introduce Sugar within the context of the Maker >>>>>> movement. (Toward that end, I have been working with some teachers on how >>>>>> to leverage, for example, Turtle Blocks for 3D printing.) It is very >>>>>> much a >>>>>> tool-oriented community with little overall discussion of architectural >>>>>> frameworks, so we have some work to do. But there is lots of low-hanging >>>>>> fruit there. >>>>>> >>>>>> regards. >>>>>> >>>>>> -walter >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Walter Bender >>>>>> Sugar Labs >>>>>> <http://www.sugarlabs.org>http://www.sugarlabs.org >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) >>>>>> <[email protected]>[email protected] >>>>>> <http://lists.sugarlabs.org/lis>http://lists.sugarlabs.org/lis >>>>>> tinfo/iaep >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Walter Bender >>>> Sugar Labs >>>> <http://www.sugarlabs.org>http://www.sugarlabs.org >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) >>>> <[email protected]>[email protected] >>>> <http://lists.sugarlabs.org/lis>http://lists.sugarlabs.org/lis >>>> tinfo/iaep >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Laura V. >>> *I&D SomosAZUCAR.Org* >>> >>> “No paradox, no progress.” >>> ~ Niels Bohr >>> >>> Happy Learning! >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sugar-devel mailing list >>> <[email protected]>[email protected] >>> <http://lists.sugarlabs.org/lis>http://lists.sugarlabs.org/lis >>> tinfo/sugar-devel >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Laura V. >> *I&D SomosAZUCAR.Org* >> >> “No paradox, no progress.” >> ~ Niels Bohr >> >> Happy Learning! >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) >> [email protected] >> http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep >> >> >> > > > -- > Mariah Noelle > > >
_______________________________________________ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) [email protected] http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
