I haven't read all the responses so this may have already been covered. However, I was told that the correct placement will change from day to day based on the sail material, cut, wind velocity, etc. There are various dockside tidbits you get from rusty sailors. 1. The best way to set up the sail for max power is to have as much of the sail is driving up and down the . As you change the car position you are adjusting how much you pull down on the leech or how much you pull out on the foot. If you pull out more you flatten the bottom of the sail and allow the top to get baggy and twist off. Alterantively, you can pull down more than out by moving the car foward. This will result in a fatter foot and tighter leech (less twist). Both of which should give you more drive. But that doesn't mean forward car positions are faster and back is always slower (Although, you can find people that will tell you so). With that basic background, how do you set up you jib/genoa. I was told that you can tell if you have the twist right by tacking back and forth. You want all of your leech telltails (assuming you have leech telltails. If not you should get some on there) to "break" at the same time. If the top tails break first and the bottom ones last, you are too twisted. You should move your cars forward. If the bottom tails break first, you are under twisted and you need to move the cars back to loosen the leech. If they all seem to break at about the same time, you are set up about right for that sail with the wind velocity at that time. What does this give you? The highest power setting for that sail, with that wind velocity, etc. The next question is do you want the highest power setting? Well it depends. People argue over this, but I was told for low wind velocities, you may want to tighten the foot (although you twist off the leech) because at low velocities the wind can't stay attached long enough to create enought lift if you have a fuller foot. On the other end of the spectrum, if you have too much wind and/or too much sail up, you are just converting that power into tipping the boat over on its side. To keep the boat on its feet (and actually go faster), you may have to depower the sail. How do you do that? Flatten the foot and twist off the leach . . .And, how do you do that? jib cars back. So this is an interesting paradox. Low wind. cars back from your peak power setting. Middle wind . . back to peak power. And, high wind, start pulling the cars back again. 2. a variation on the above, is that if you happened to do this to the point you think you have an "average" setting. You can now move off of your average settings. Forward or back based on the fullness of the foot and the twist you want. 3. If you aren't that competitive, you can use some of those tips. a. set the jib cars so that they divide the clew in half b. set the cars so that they are perpendicular with the forstay c. or some ratio thereof (40%, etc.) 4. Say to hell with it. Set your sails and go enjoy yourself.
--- On Mon, 7/20/09, Judith Blumhorst, DC <[email protected]> wrote: From: Judith Blumhorst, DC <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [IC27A] Location of Jib Sheet lead To: [email protected] Date: Monday, July 20, 2009, 3:26 PM Hi again, Here's what the Glen-L boat design website says about fairlead location: http://tinyurl. com/lt5u4x . For a starting point, put the fairlead on the line that is defined by the clew and a point 40% of luff up from the tack of the sail. They sail that's a "rule of thumb" for small boats. I've also asked NorthSails online. They should post an answer in a day or two. Here's a link to the question: http://tinyurl. com/ko7wzk Fair winds, Judy B 1977 C27 #3459 Tall Rig, "Bijou" http://www.blumhors t.com ____________ _________ _________ __ From: "Judith Blumhorst, DC" <drju...@blumhorst. com> To: ic...@yahoogroups. com Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 11:33:58 AM Subject: Re: [IC27A] Re: First Sail on The C27 - have a few questions Hi Bob, You might be correct... I'm not really sure about it. I know that the you're supposed to locate a fixed-position jib fairlead along the LP line if the sail is on a roller furler, but I'm not sure that's optimal for tracks. I'll ask the experts at North Sails and get back to the list. They explained it all to me once, but I've forgotten. Judy ____________ _________ _________ __ From: Bob <kniggit713@ yahoo. com> To: ic...@yahoogroups. com Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 10:58:45 AM Subject: [IC27A] Re: First Sail on The C27 - have a few questions Hi Judy, It seems we have given Derek similar but different advice on his jib car placement... . It was my understanding that our imaginary line should bisect the leech/foot angle, thereby pulling the foot and leech equally. Is this correct? Bob Stockley Sundance #2436 --- In ic...@yahoogroups. com, "Judith Blumhorst, DC" <drju...@... > wrote: > > Ditto what Jack says.... and I'd like to add some.... > > As Jack says, the "right" spot for the sheet blocks depends on the position > of the tracks, the height of the clew on the 150, and conditions. But a good > approximate location can be found using the following method: > > On a windless day at the dock or on a mooring, with the bow pointing into the > wind, raise the genny. Pull the jibsheet aft tightly and down the trak for > the blocks, so that the sheet forms an imaginary line that's PERPENDICULAR to > the forestay. Mark that spot on the track. That's where a good sailmaker > expects the sheet block to be in "average" conditions. > > The following info comes from an article I wrote a decade ago. It's > specifically written about a Potter 19, with a fractional rig, but the same > general concepts apply to a masthead rig. > > Ideally, on a sloop rig, you want the curve in the leech of the jib to match > the shape of the *draft* of the mainsail. Then the airflow over the two > sails is smooth, without turbulence. (BTW, the is no airflow "through" the > slot. That's a misconception that modern sail theory has thoroughly > discredited) > > The full article can be found on my website at http://tinyurl. com/maj6p7: > > > (This is a very simplified explanation. You can read more in Maloney's > Chapman Piloting, 62nd edition, page 228-235; and Rousmaniere' s Annapolis > Book of Seamanship, 2nd edition, starting on page 70. Illustration by Mark > Smith, from The Annapolis Book of Seamanship) > > > FIGURE 1: > Left: The lead is too far aft. The top of the jib stalls easily (the top > telltale lifts first when you sheet in). The leech is too loose and the foot > is too tight. > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > From: "johnr...@.. ." <johnr...@.. .> > To: ic...@yahoogroups. com > Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 8:42:54 AM > Subject: Re: [IC27A] First Sail on The C27 - have a few questions > > > > > There is no THE position for the genny cars.? It depends upon wind conditions > and your particular sail.? The simple answer is that your tell tales should > be breaking evenly from top to bottom.? To accomplish this in different wind > conditions one moves the cars back and forward until good sail shape is > achieved.? Many genny's have a line of reinforcing stitching at the clew that > one can use as a guide.? This is true of my Air Force sails.? When the sheet > is pulling in line with this stitching, the car is usually properly set for > the conditions.? Generally, one will have the cars further forward in light > air and further back in heavy air.? The? "proper" set for the car on one side > may not be the same as for the other side as wind and wave conditions may > dictate different settings.? Usually, this difference would only be one hole > further forward or aft.? Irregularities in tune might also show up as a need > for different car settings.? I assume you are not > racing, but it is nice to sail efficiently even when cruising. > > I have both the center fixed topping lift, useful at mooring (it has a clip > that closes and ensures it will not jump off), and a topping lift that allows > free movement of the boom with the main up.? It can be very dangerous to have > your boom held fixed in position with the main up.? Best rig a topping lift > that will allow the boom to swing unless you want to give the boat and > yourself a good bath.? Blood in the water is not recommended. > > John McLaughlin > SR #1994 > Shambhala > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Derek Atkin <atkin...@yahoo. com> > > To: ic...@yahoogroups. com > > Sent: Mon, Jul 20, 2009 11:08 am > > Subject: Re: [IC27A] First Sail on The C27 - have a few questions > > My halyards are external. original wire/rope. I will take some more detailed > shots of what is there. I don't really plan on using the spinnaker any time > soon - but don't want to remove the hardware just yet. > > The boat does have a topping lift. I have been using that cable as a > secondary limiter on the end of the boom when the boat is at rest. > > Derek.- > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > > From: "Sneddon, Keith - ES/IS" <keith.sneddon@ itt.com> > > To: "ic...@yahoogroups. com" <ic...@yahoogroups. com> > > Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 10:22:20 AM > > Subject: RE: [IC27A] First Sail on The C27 - have a few questions > > I agree. It's not really a topping lift. I have one, but only use it at the > dock. > > Keith Sneddon > > #4760, "Are We There Yet?" > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > > From: ic...@yahoogroups. com [mailto:IC27A@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of > John Guttridge > > Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 10:18 AM > > To: ic...@yahoogroups. com > > Subject: RE: [IC27A] First Sail on The C27 - have a few questions > > That little pigtail on the backstay is a poor excuse for a topping lift. > > I had it shake out and drop the boom on someone's head while dropping > > the main in heavy winds. I would recommend rigging a real topping lift > > that allows the boom to swing freely and can't shake out. > > From: ic...@yahoogroups. com<mailto:IC27A% 40yahoogroups. com> [mailto:IC27A@ > yahoogroups. com<mailto:IC27A% 40yahoogroups. com>] On Behalf Of > > David Savlin > > Sent: Monday, July 20, 2009 10:12 AM > > To: ic...@yahoogroups. com<mailto:IC27A% 40yahoogroups. com> > > Subject: Re: [IC27A] First Sail on The C27 - have a few questions > > Hi Derek, welcome to IC27A ! I'll join Brian in answering with the > > caveat > > that every boat can be different and yours is older than mine. > > 1. Headsail (and mains'l) halyards -- we don't have any cable on our > > '88. > > It's rope line all the way. The only rope-and-cable rigging we have is > > for > > our topping lift. Do your halyards all run inside or outside your mast? > > If > > inside I'd look at the sheaves (the rollers) and see if they are > > cable-sized > > or rope-sized. I don't see any deck organizers near the base of your > > mast, > > whereas we've normally got 4 lines that are run all the way to the > > cockpit's > > forward edge for halyards. > > 2. We have a 150 jenny too, we keep our rail cars a little forward of > > yours > > -- roughly even with the cabin entryway. We only ever move them if we're > > flying a spinnaker. > > 3. Yeah, that does look like your topping lift. > > 4. This is normal on every Catalina my family has ever owned (30, 42, > > and > > this 27). > > 5. That's a good question. See point #1 above ... can't really tell. > > I'm no expert so take my comments as that of a lazy day sailor. Fair > > winds > > to you! > > David > > On Mon, Jul 20, 2009 at 7:02 AM, Derek Atkin <atkin...@yahoo. > com<mailto:atkin11j % 40yahoo.com> > > <mailto:atkin11j% 40yahoo.com> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Yesterday was the first time I was able to get out and get the sails > > up > > > after 10 months of work on my 79 C27. I have a few questions about the > > rig - > > > and posted a few pics here: > > > > > > http://www.opus45. com/c27rig/ > > > > > > 1. I might have some issues with halyard length. The headsail halyard > > seems > > > to be to long - by the time I get it down to the winch I am on steel, > > no > > > rope left. Does the headsail halyard run through a block on the deck > > first? > > > > > > 2. Any guidance on placement of the genoa sheet cars on the track? The > > sail > > > is a 150. > > > > > > 3. What is the steel cable with the clasp dangling from the backstay? > > > > > > 4. I assume that its normal that the genoa hits the front pulpit a > > bit? > > > > > > 5. Is it the Spinnaker halyard that runs through the block on the base > > of > > > the mast and back to the cockpit? or is that the link for the > > spinnaker > > > pole? > > > > > > Thanks for the info. > > > > > > Derek A. > > > #4297 > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > > This e-mail and any files transmitted with it may be proprietary and are > intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are > addressed. If you have received this e-mail in error please notify the sender. > > Please note that any views or opinions presented in this e-mail are solely > those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of ITT > Corporation. The recipient should check this e-mail and any attachments for > the presence of viruses. ITT accepts no liability for any damage caused by > any virus transmitted by this e-mail. > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
