Live, not "leave".
I have some jetlag from my almost 30 hours from Vancouver to Montevideo.
=D
as
On 6 Aug 2012, at 21:38, Arturo Servin wrote:
>
> I do. May be you do not leave far enough from IETF venues.
>
>
> Regards
> as
>
> On 6 Aug 2012, at 11:18, Dearlove, Christopher (UK) wrote:
>
>> I've never been to an IETF meeting where the plane fare has exceeded the
>> hotel cost for a week. Caveats to that are that I have mostly gone for IETF
>> recommended hotels, so may have missed particularly cheap hotels, and that I
>> have only been to North American and Europe (but that statistic includes
>> Vancouver and the even further away western US cities down to San Diego).
>> And of course I fly economy, and it's much cheaper including a Saturday
>> night in your trip, even at the cost of an extra night in a hotel (at least
>> it is from here). An almost exception was Paris this year where I was
>> staying fairly cheaply, but that was a cost-shared trip between me and my
>> employer, and I didn't fly (I went by train - though that's not cheaper,
>> just better). Paris has cheap(er) hotels and a metro I understand, so I felt
>> less location constrained.
>>
>> --
>> Christopher Dearlove
>> Senior Principal Engineer, Communications Group
>> Communications, Networks and Image Analysis Capability
>> BAE Systems Advanced Technology Centre
>> West Hanningfield Road, Great Baddow, Chelmsford, CM2 8HN, UK
>> Tel: +44 1245 242194 | Fax: +44 1245 242124
>> [email protected] | http://www.baesystems.com
>>
>> BAE Systems (Operations) Limited
>> Registered Office: Warwick House, PO Box 87, Farnborough Aerospace Centre,
>> Farnborough, Hants, GU14 6YU, UK
>> Registered in England & Wales No: 1996687
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Sprecher, Nurit (NSN - IL/Hod HaSharon)
>> [mailto:[email protected]]
>> Sent: 06 August 2012 15:07
>> To: Dearlove, Christopher (UK); Daniele Ceccarelli; Andrew Sullivan;
>> [email protected]
>> Subject: RE: So, where to repeat? (was:Re: management granularity)
>>
>> ----------------------! WARNING ! ----------------------
>> This message originates from outside our organisation,
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>> Keep this in mind if you answer this message.
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>> --------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> When you are not close (time), flight cost may become higher in the priority
>> (over hotem)....
>> Flying to Vancouver for me for example is the most expensive trip....even
>> though the city is amazing and the host was wonderful!
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of ext
>> Dearlove, Christopher (UK)
>> Sent: Monday, August 06, 2012 4:56 PM
>> To: Daniele Ceccarelli; Andrew Sullivan; [email protected]
>> Subject: RE: So, where to repeat? (was:Re: management granularity)
>>
>> Dublin's problem was that the venue was isolated from the city. This has
>> also been the case with e.g. San Diego. (I'm assuming no personal car.)
>> Contrast with Minneapolis (and several other places) where you were right in
>> the city. Being in a city is better for lunch and dinner options, taking a
>> break to go to a bookshop (or to buy something you forgot to bring) and so
>> on. (I'm deliberately not including tourism here.)
>>
>> However at the moment my priorities to make being able to attend possible
>> would be time (so the closer to me the better - I realise that's impossible
>> globally), cost (hotel first, flight second, rest is noise) and the ability
>> to plan ahead to only attend part of the week. This is the current economic
>> reality. Dublin actually scores quite well on those for me.
>>
>> --
>> Christopher Dearlove
>> Senior Principal Engineer, Communications Group
>> Communications, Networks and Image Analysis Capability
>> BAE Systems Advanced Technology Centre
>> West Hanningfield Road, Great Baddow, Chelmsford, CM2 8HN, UK
>> Tel: +44 1245 242194 | Fax: +44 1245 242124
>> [email protected] | http://www.baesystems.com
>>
>> BAE Systems (Operations) Limited
>> Registered Office: Warwick House, PO Box 87, Farnborough Aerospace Centre,
>> Farnborough, Hants, GU14 6YU, UK
>> Registered in England & Wales No: 1996687
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of
>> Daniele Ceccarelli
>> Sent: 06 August 2012 13:24
>> To: Andrew Sullivan; [email protected]
>> Subject: RE: So, where to repeat? (was:Re: management granularity)
>>
>> ----------------------! WARNING ! ----------------------
>> This message originates from outside our organisation,
>> either from an external partner or from the internet.
>> Keep this in mind if you answer this message.
>> Follow the 'Report Suspicious Emails' link on IT matters
>> for instructions on reporting suspicious email messages.
>> --------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Dublin panned? I thought it was one of the best venues and locations of the
>> last meetings.
>>
>> What about Italy or Spain? I've never heard about an IETF in Italy. I'm ok
>> with meetings outside Italy since i like traveling very much, but i was
>> wondering why it has never been taken into account in the past meetings. Is
>> it expensive? I think Italy and Spain are much cheaper than France, UK or
>> Sweden, aren't they?
>>
>> BR
>> Daniele
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
>>> Behalf Of Andrew Sullivan
>>> Sent: lunedì 6 agosto 2012 14.06
>>> To: [email protected]
>>> Subject: So, where to repeat? (was:Re: management granularity)
>>>
>>> On Sun, Aug 05, 2012 at 11:58:19AM -0700, Dave Crocker wrote:
>>>> enough merely to have excellent staff. We need to go back to the
>>>> better places and benefit from the learning curve. This
>>> doesn't mean
>>>> "no new venues" but it means fewer.
>>>
>>> As a practical matter, may I ask about which venues you want
>>> to return to? I get your argument in principle, but it seems
>>> to me that there has been quite a lot of complaining in the
>>> past. The one factor that seems to me most likely to reduce
>>> complaints -- weather -- is evidently beyond the Secretariat's
>>> or IAOC's control.
>>>
>>> People seem inclined to return to the Hyatt in Vancouver,
>>> elevators notwithstanding. We're going to do that. (I don't
>>> understand why the previous Vencouver venue was less desirable
>>> -- to me, these venues were very similar, and not very far
>>> apart. I note, however, that the previous two Vancouver
>>> visits were near the end of the year, when it rains all the
>>> time in Vancouver.)
>>>
>>> People complained at length about the venue in Paris, so I
>>> presume it's out.
>>>
>>> Some people complained about the hotel room prices and travel
>>> expense in Taipei, though I heard remarks that it was a good venue.
>>> Should we try to return there?
>>>
>>> People complained in advance about getting to Québec, although
>>> afterwards I heard lots of good noises about that venue. I
>>> note that the weather was great. Should we try to return?
>>>
>>> I don't recall much complaining about the Prague venue in
>>> 2011, which was striking to me because very little seemed
>>> different to me compared to our first visit there. Perhaps
>>> this is evidence of the "tuning"
>>> you suggest (ensuring the water bottles were plastic, for instance).
>>> But I note the weather was excellent.
>>>
>>> Beijing? I guess Maastricht is out. Anaheim (FWIW, I thought
>>> that was an example of a terrible location, but many people
>>> seemed happy with it)? Hiroshima? Stockholm? San Francisco
>>> (we thought the crime at Paris was bad, yet didn't complain
>>> about being smack up against the Tenderloin)? Or there's the
>>> old standby, Minneapolis; perhaps we could do it in March.
>>> The Dublin venue was panned by large numbers of people.
>>> Philadelphia, people complained about expense. Chicago, too
>>> (combined with hotel renovations).
>>>
>>> That gets us back through 2007. Which of the venues do you
>>> think we should return to, to which we already haven't
>>> returned or planned to return? And why?
>>>
>>> For what it's worth, I would not complain about returning to
>>> any of those venues; I personally had good meetings at all of
>>> them except Hiroshima, which I missed due to other
>>> commitments. That includes both Maastricht and Dublin, which
>>> were both apparently trials for large numbers of others.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>>
>>> A
>>>
>>> --
>>> Andrew Sullivan
>>> [email protected]
>>>
>>>
>>
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