True. I was referring to an interview with the actual company.
--- John Von Essen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Wait a minute, a recruitor that can read source > code? Most of recruitors I > have dealt with can barely read my resume... > > -jve > > On Wed, 24 Mar 2004, Anthony Ettinger wrote: > > > References are total bs way of determining > anything > > anyway, obviously you're going to talk with the > > reference ahead of time to make sure they say the > > right stuff. > > > > Typically recruiters ask for references so they > can > > pitch their firm's services to your references. > > > > If they want to know how well you program, show > them > > the source code. They can get a good idea about > your > > character in the face-to-face interview. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Terrence Brannon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > This message is a cleaner re-write of an earlier > > > assault on the > > > irksome convention of some employers requiring > > > references as part of > > > the interview process. > > > > > > URL to previous discussion thread: > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/msg00433.html > > > > > > WHY REFERENCES SUCK IN GENERAL > > > > > > 1/ They require the time of the reference. 15 > > > minutes per reference > > > phone call means 2-3 hours out of each > references > > > work week during a > > > typical job search. Your reference (and his > boss) > > > will love you for > > > taking up his time. > > > > > > 2/ The reference and/or his company can get in > legal > > > trouble. Oracle, > > > for example, has a policy that its employees > will > > > not give references > > > to former employees. The extent of referent > > > information is manager > > > name and time and location of employment. I > worked > > > at Oracle. I can't get > > > a character or technical reference from them. I > love > > > the skeptical looks I > > > get when I try to explain this to people. > > > > > > 3/ They allow a bad boss one more shot at > tyranny. > > > If you worked for a > > > jerk, then what? As an extreme example, assume > that > > > Martin Luther King > > > worked for 3 closet white supremacists. Would he > > > ever get a good > > > reference? Probably not. But that doesn't mean > that > > > he is a bad > > > person. > > > > > > 4/ People move, retire, die, or go belly up: I > > > worked during the dot-com > > > era. That's 3 years worth of references that I > will > > > never be able to > > > resource because all of those people have bitten > the > > > dust. I guess > > > that makes me a bad person. > > > > > > WHY TECHNICAL REFERENCES SUCK > > > > > > 1/ If you want to know how good I am > technically, > > > break out the > > > appropriate technical test. > > > > > > WHY CHARACTER REFERENCES SUCK > > > > > > 1/ Let's assume that a character reference is a > good > > > way of knowing > > > how good person X is. If this is true, then you > > > really must have > > > references for the references of person X before > you > > > can trust the > > > references of person X. And you must have > references > > > for the > > > references of the references of the references > of > > > person X before you > > > can know how good the references for person X > are. > > > > > > Logically: > > > > > > X good => (references for X good) > > > (references for X good) => (references for > > > (references for X) good) > > > (references for (references for X) good) => > > > (references for (references for > (references > > > for X)) good) > > > > > > So we see that we have a recursive and > > > non-terminating algorithm for > > > determining if X is good. > > > > > > The self-referential unsolvable nature of the > > > character reference > > > proof system shows its fallibility. > > > > > > > > > ===== > > Anthony Ettinger > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > http://www.apwebdesign.com > > Instant Messengers: > > 1) yahoo im: apwebdesign 2) aol im: > apwebdesignxl > > 3) msn im: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) icq im: > 659139 > > > > __________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on > time. > > http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html > > ===== Anthony Ettinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.apwebdesign.com Instant Messengers: 1) yahoo im: apwebdesign 2) aol im: apwebdesignxl 3) msn im: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 4) icq im: 659139 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
